Anvil Galaxy and The First question

DtMK · Unread post by **DtMK** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 2:48 pm

I haven't bought any new Dimension books in a while, and recently have had some ideas about Phase World and the First race. I was wondering if Anvil Galaxy, since it's covering the Cosmic Forge and that the Forge was supposedly created by the First race, make any mentions or give more rumors or info about them?

Carl Gleba · Unread post by **Carl Gleba** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 7:18 pm

Well yes and no. There is very little on the First ones in the book. There is a whole lot on the various "religions" behind the Cosmic Forge. Its an all right book IMO. Not my favorite in that line.

Carl

KLM · Unread post by **KLM** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:25 pm

Besides the First are gone, and not even the Forge could
bring them back. End of story.

But Anvil Galaxy is a great book. You won't find any gadgets, guns,
toys in it, just tons of info and ideas, and a few RCCs.

Adios
KLM

Braden Campbell · Sat Mar 11, 2006 10:52 am

Agreed. Anvil Galaxy is a great book.

As for the Cosmic Forge, the overall impression that everyone has is that, somehow, you can actualy find the Forge and carry it around with you... which is a total joke. The Cosmic Forge is the God of the Three Galaxies... no one will find it.

Not to say you can't have fun trying.

Also, I love the idea of religious fanatics running around in starships trying to convert everyone to their line of thinking (gaming imitates life, you know). I quote from "The Tough Guide to the Known Galaxy":

THEOCRATIC NEOMEDIEVALISTS: A moderately common type of society throughout the KNOWN GALAXY. This society, usually confined to one PLANET, is full of religious fundamentalists. They usually have a pretty low TECHLEVEL, presumably because technical knowledge and frequent contact with other Planets might open the way to heretical ideas. Because of the general backwardness, most of the population are more-or-less peasants who live in terror of their ill-tempered God and even more of their clerical rulers.

On some occasions, though, Theocratic Neomedievalists may have a fairly high Techlevel, or at least access to high-Techlevel military stuff. In this case they will make life miserable for their neighbors, either by conducting jihads or by signing up as MERCS, in which role they are exceptionally nasty. Some people, nevertheless, find Theocratic Neomedievalists oddly admirable because of their sincerity and dedication to their own harsh code. Not me. So far as I'm concerned, SLAG 'em!

maasenstodt · Unread post by **maasenstodt** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:05 am

gadrin wrote:
Braden, GMPhD wrote:Agreed. Anvil Galaxy is a great book.

Thirded, I've read that one and Rifts Dim Book 2, cover-to-cover, twice (although it's been a few years).

Fourthed. Bill Coffin's work in Anvil Galaxy is as good as gaming material gets - I might go so as to say that it's the best book Palladium has ever released. Anyone with any interest in the Three Galaxies needs this book.

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:41 am

You all are gonna make Carl feel bad.

Braden Campbell · Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:34 am

Three Galaxies has a ton of adventure hooks, don't get me wrong. Just that, in my personal campaign right now, I'm using a lot of what Bill Coffin put forth...

But I will be using the Demon Star ships very soon. Those things are wicked!

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 6:31 pm

gadrin wrote:did CJ and Bill Coffin collaborate ?

I only see Bill's name on the book, but was any of it leftovers after CJ was gone, and Bill was "next in line" ?

While no one short of Kev, Maryann, Alex, or CJ or Bill could say for certain....I'd be shocked if Coffin used any old forgotten notes from Carella. The books and ideas within really felt distinct from each other. (CJ's book and Coffin's book. Same with Carl's book)

Gomen_Nagai · Unread post by **Gomen_Nagai** » Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:44 pm

Bill Coffin turned Anvil Galaxy into Star wars... and MAnhunter at the same time, he stole material all over the place. I am not a fan Of Bill Coffin..

where as the three galaxies book was more in line with how I viewed Phaseworld.. and not a hodgephodge of nutso stuff that didn't really belong in Phaseworld..
That came out in anvil galaxy.

Gomen_Nagai · Unread post by **Gomen_Nagai** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 7:50 am

when I mean Star wars... I mean the rpg. Alot of the material I saw in there I saw in the rpg. ... and other rpgs as well. BC is a huge Fraud.

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 6:41 pm

darkmax wrote:
Gomen_Nagai wrote:Bill Coffin turned Anvil Galaxy into Star wars... and MAnhunter at the same time, he stole material all over the place. I am not a fan Of Bill Coffin..

where as the three galaxies book was more in line with how I viewed Phaseworld.. and not a hodgephodge of nutso stuff that didn't really belong in Phaseworld..
That came out in anvil galaxy.

Star Wars does not even come close depth of the material in the book. Star Wars is just a "blink-blink" movie series, probably written by George when he was 17 years old. There is little depth in the series, the length of each of the 6 films are attributed to the extended amount of special effects. When one strips each film down, you will probably get 15-30 minutes of story.

Which is the whole point...It wasn't supposed to be a thought provoking statement on social orders or any of the other stuff people seem to expect it to be. It was a very simple and classic story template made big and bright with some good special effects and music. Complaining about that is like complaining about Schindler's List for not having enough hot sex scenes. The movie is what it is, and just because people make it out to be more than that isn't the fault of the movie - it's the fault of the people.

Gomen_Nagai · Unread post by **Gomen_Nagai** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:26 pm

we're not arguing about using FTL Terminolgy. We're arguing about stealing outright Aliens and Races and Themes from Other Scifi Games And sticking it under a rifts book (which also has the most munchkin things in Rifts outside of manhunter)..

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:32 pm

Gomen_Nagai wrote:we're not arguing about using FTL Terminolgy. We're arguing about stealing outright Aliens and Races and Themes from Other Scifi Games And sticking it under a rifts book (which also has the most munchkin things in Rifts outside of manhunter)..

Hrm, maybe I haven't looked at it in a while but I seem to recall most of the races being lifted from Palladium Fantasy, not Star Wars.

Braden Campbell · Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:59 pm

Everything is ripped off from something else.

Please read The Zap Gun by Philip K. D ick, and move along...

Gomen_Nagai · Unread post by **Gomen_Nagai** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:47 am

Marrowlight wrote:
Gomen_Nagai wrote:we're not arguing about using FTL Terminolgy. We're arguing about stealing outright Aliens and Races and Themes from Other Scifi Games And sticking it under a rifts book (which also has the most munchkin things in Rifts outside of manhunter)..

Hrm, maybe I haven't looked at it in a while but I seem to recall most of the races being lifted from Palladium Fantasy, not Star Wars.

the Zebuloids, golgans, and so on are almost straight out of Star wars and other old scifi

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 11:48 am

Gomen_Nagai wrote:
Marrowlight wrote:
Gomen_Nagai wrote:we're not arguing about using FTL Terminolgy. We're arguing about stealing outright Aliens and Races and Themes from Other Scifi Games And sticking it under a rifts book (which also has the most munchkin things in Rifts outside of manhunter)..

Hrm, maybe I haven't looked at it in a while but I seem to recall most of the races being lifted from Palladium Fantasy, not Star Wars.

the Zebuloids, golgans, and so on are almost straight out of Star wars and other old scifi

Hrm, just for the sake of fun, who were they? (not who they are but who were they from)

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 12:17 pm

darkmax wrote:Well, dwelling further into this point, won't you say that all epic medieval-based RPGs are lifted out of the works of J.R.R. Tolkien and C.S. Lewis?

Nope. I'd say a fair number would also be lifted from Howard's Conan works.

Of course, since he built his world as a twisted reflection of our own, just as Tolkien lifted some of his races from Norse Myth and Lewis drew on all sorts of inspiration for his own world as well.....then I'd say they were all thieves as well.

Fiction has been borrowing from fiction has been borrowing from fiction for as long as there's been fiction. There's no real solid starting point because history is too broken to know how it all began....so I personally say screw it and enjoy it. It won't matter who borrowed from who when we're all dead and gone anyway, so why let it trouble us now.

Gomen_Nagai · Unread post by **Gomen_Nagai** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 1:55 pm

Marrowlight wrote:
Gomen_Nagai wrote:
Marrowlight wrote:
Gomen_Nagai wrote:we're not arguing about using FTL Terminolgy. We're arguing about stealing outright Aliens and Races and Themes from Other Scifi Games And sticking it under a rifts book (which also has the most munchkin things in Rifts outside of manhunter)..

Hrm, maybe I haven't looked at it in a while but I seem to recall most of the races being lifted from Palladium Fantasy, not Star Wars.

the Zebuloids, golgans, and so on are almost straight out of Star wars and other old scifi

Hrm, just for the sake of fun, who were they? (not who they are but who were they from)

a majority of them were taken from The Encyclopedia of Aliens based on those written by scifi authors of the times.

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 2:08 pm

darkmax wrote:Yes, there's Howard Conan before those two greats. I like your screw-it attitude towards this.

I figure if no one is filing a lawsuit about it, it isn't important enough for them to care - so why should it be important enough for us?

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Tue Mar 14, 2006 2:19 pm

darkmax wrote:
Marrowlight wrote:I figure if no one is filing a lawsuit about it, it isn't important enough for them to care - so why should it be important enough for us?

It's not, but they are the ones just about everyone else has ripped off and made "historical" RPGs, movies and TV series......

Just another way to learn from history, else we forget it. Better to rip off Tiamat than let her be forgotten forever.

Marrowlight · Unread post by **Marrowlight** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 11:35 am

darkmax wrote:
Marrowlight wrote:Just another way to learn from history, else we forget it. Better to rip off Tiamat than let her be forgotten forever.

I think it is better to share great ideas and creations than to monopolised for the sake of profitability, but that is capatalism.

Well, there's no law saying only one person can use a particular old entity. Thirty thousand different RPGs all have their slice on the Greek Gods for example.

DtMK · Unread post by **DtMK** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 11:25 am

Let's see...Anvil Galaxy, check...First race, check...hmm, I missed the part where I wrote in, turning this into a creative fantasy/religious diatribe. Not that I'm knocking anyone's input on a topic I asked for, mind you. But it does make me wonder...if players of RPG's like this one are so full of great ideas and discussions, when was the last time you had a chance to address such topics in game, given this is a game board?

Raiden · Unread post by **Raiden** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 11:46 pm

Unfortunately, I have to agree on the point that PW is much like Star Wars.

Phase World itself = Coruscant (Albeit, Phase World isn't a planet spanning city, but it still the central hub of the 3 Galaxies society)
Necrons = Yuuzan Vong (I know I got the spelling wrong on that one)
Cosmo Knights = Jedi Knights
TGE = Galactic Empire
FWC = Rebel Alliance
Master Fesh = Boba Fett

But you know what, that doesn't stop me from picking up the Phase World books, and enjoying them immensely, much like I watch every SW movie, and read many of the books over and over.

I enjoy Carl's work, much like I enjoy CJ's work, much like I love Bill Coffin's work. Seeing things in one book that are similar to something else isn't going to stop the enjoyment level I reach any time I pick up my Phase World books.

And thus, my ramble ends.