PB question

[Prysus]

Greetings and salutations. If you have the Palladium Fantasy (PF) Second Edition main book, I suggest looking at page 16. It actually gives numbers with references. If you have the book, the first to bold faced sections are called "What's a low attribute?" and then "What's an average attribute?" It gives examples which you might like (at least by Palladium terms. I'm figuring someone will come in here a bit later and post the actual statistics to what is the most commonly rolled). I don't know if it's printed in any other book, and I don't know if it's allowed for me to post that information here since it's from a book (though I don't think it's anything major). By the way, 14 shouldn't be a model (attractive, yes, but not a model). This is just a case of a picture not matching the stats (sorry to burst your bubble).

[Blue Eyes]

actually the only possible answer is 9, humans roll 3d6, 9 is average

BE

[Guest]

actually the only possible answer is 9, humans roll 3d6, 9 is average

BE

Actually, it's 10.66, not 9.

[jedi078]

For humans, what is "average"?

Depends on what the GM has the PC's roll for atts.

The "average" will go up if he/she has the PC's roll 4d6 and re-roll ones, or 3d8's or 3d6 and re-roll ones.

[shiiv-a]

i hate to bring a touch of game to this conversation ... but i do believe that the current average PB is in the 20-24 range

it seems that the PC's i've seen [and yes i have some that have PB's rolled up by GM's at times that ended up in the 20's or higher - due to elf race char] EVERY female char just has to be super ungodly gorgeous ...

its gotten to the point that i've chosen to take points OFF my char's PB stat to stick on something more fitting to the class. so now .. about half the chars now, have PB's in the 10-14 range .. and yeah .. its nicer ... lots easier to 'blend in the background' and do ... the unpleasant work you just gotta do ... while the bombshells giggle and pose for hte public ...

public dont like the average schmoe looking hero ... they all flock to the 'barbie doll type' .. which is fine by me .... more loot to gather while THEY"RE busy ...

so ... PB is actually rather useless as a stat .. cause NO ONE suffers from having a high one ... like they should

[shiiv-a]

... NOT what i meant ... and you know it .. ya gooseberry

[DhAkael]

LOL..actualy..hero's are supposed to be beautiful (Unless you're Large Marv from Sin-City).
And I actulay do have negatives to extra high PB's... one term that strikes horror in all hero's in any dimension;
The Fan-Boy / Girl

[Natalya]

actually the only possible answer is 9, humans roll 3d6, 9 is average

BE

Actually, it's 10.66, not 9.

10.66? I thought it was 10.5 (3.5 * 3), leaving 10-11 to be average for all human stats.

[shiiv-a]

oooo ......

you were talking Dyce averages? ....oh my. i was thinking like how people have their character PB's.
most female characters have HIGH PB's ... have NO braincells .. and react with their hormones.
at least from what i've seen. such as, luring a godling on with hints and comments that lead to the classic *fade to black* scenes. then doing the sudden turn about and the perverbial bucket of cold water down the trunks .. just to get a magic item from the godling.

sadly .. THIS is the way the games go on the chats. especially when the person in question is of the belief that ANYTHING is possible if you can come up with a good reason for it.
this is the same person, who's characters seem to be on first name basis with EVERY deity in the many pantheons. must be because they are about 3 generations away from the god/mortal infatuation. it got boring real fast. i'm sure SOME of you know the kind of player i'm refering to? .. if not? .. watch a few online games while pretending to be a newbie .. and you might learn something.

[Guest]

actually the only possible answer is 9, humans roll 3d6, 9 is average

BE

Actually, it's 10.66, not 9.

10.66? I thought it was 10.5 (3.5 * 3), leaving 10-11 to be average for all human stats.

10.5 is the average for 3D6, Palladium has 3D6, plus 1D6 if the result is 16, 17, or 18, which ups it, the average for games where a 6 is rolled on the additional D6 moves the average up to 10.69 or so.

[Natalya]

actually the only possible answer is 9, humans roll 3d6, 9 is average

BE

Actually, it's 10.66, not 9.

10.66? I thought it was 10.5 (3.5 * 3), leaving 10-11 to be average for all human stats.

10.5 is the average for 3D6, Palladium has 3D6, plus 1D6 if the result is 16, 17, or 18, which ups it, the average for games where a 6 is rolled on the additional D6 moves the average up to 10.69 or so.

Oh, okay, kinda makes sense.

Guess I should have paid more attention in algebra.

[Guest]

Oh, okay, kinda makes sense.

Guess I should have paid more attention in algebra.

Naw, I was lazy and had Erick Wujcik run the numbers for the extra die.

[Blue Eyes]

well could you explain the math to me then, i am quite convinced it is 9

BE

[Guest]

well could you explain the math to me then, i am quite convinced it is 9

BE

Right. To reiterate; I'm not asking about the average range. This discussion assumes you already know what the mean average attribute would be. The book average has been (to date) based on solely the roll of 3D6 for attributes. Even if this doesn't apply to the non-PC and NPC types, their attribute determination would still factor into raising the mean average for that race. (In other words, I'm not interested in what the books say...I want hard, calculated numbers.)

10.662037037037

That should be the exact, hard, calculated average attribute, based on rolling 3D6, and adding 1D6 to any 16, 17 or 18 roll.

A couple of tables:

Chances of each result on a Regular 3D6 Roll
1 out of 216 to get a 3
3 out of 216 to get a 4
6 out of 216 to get a 5
10 out of 216 to get a 6
15 out of 216 to get a 7
21 out of 216 to get a 8
25 out of 216 to get a 9
27 out of 216 to get a 10
27 out of 216 to get a 11
25 out of 216 to get a 12
21 out of 216 to get a 13
15 out of 216 to get a 14
10 out of 216 to get a 15
6 out of 216 to get a 16
3 out of 216 to get a 17
1 out of 216 to get a 18

Total up all the numbers (1 times 3, plus 3 times 4, plus 6 times 5, plus 10 times 6... plus 3 times 17, plus 1 times 18), and then divide by 216 to get the average result (10.5).

[B[Chances of each result on a 3D6, where a 1D6 is added if the first roll is 16 or greater[/B]
1 out of 216 to get a 3
3 out of 216 to get a 4
6 out of 216 to get a 5
10 out of 216 to get a 6
15 out of 216 to get a 7
21 out of 216 to get a 8
25 out of 216 to get a 9
27 out of 216 to get a 10
27 out of 216 to get a 11
25 out of 216 to get a 12
21 out of 216 to get a 13
15 out of 216 to get a 14
10 out of 216 to get a 15
0 out of 216 to get a 16 (*)
6/6 out of 216 to get a 17
9/6 out of 216 to get a 18
10/6 out of 216 to get a 19
10/6 out of 216 to get a 20
10/6 out of 216 to get a 21
10/6 out of 216 to get a 22
4/6 out of 216 to get a 23
1/6 out of 216 to get a 24

Warning! If you try doing the usual (adding 1 times 3, plus 3 times 4... plus 4/6 times 23, plus 1/6 times 24), make sure that your calculator isn't introducing rounding errors. I kept getting bizarre, non-intuitive results, before I did some pencil work to figure the total chances of results 17 through 24 should be 200 exactly, not some odd fraction.

Anyway, thanks for the math exercise! I haven't worked on this problem since the first Mechanoid system was designed...

Erick

* That's right, there's a zero chance of rolling a 16, since you have to add at least one to any 16 you roll.

[Reddenedone]

I had always thought of it as this: 3 is the lowest possible number you can have and 18 is the highest (minus the additional hit die for exceptional attributes.) 3+18=21 21/2= 10.5 .... or 11 if you round up.

[Prysus]

Greetings and salutations. If you have the Palladium Fantasy (PF) Second Edition main book, I suggest looking at page 16. It actually gives numbers with references. If you have the book, the first to bold faced sections are called "What's a low attribute?" and then "What's an average attribute?" It gives examples which you might like (at least by Palladium terms. I'm figuring someone will come in here a bit later and post the actual statistics to what is the most commonly rolled). I don't know if it's printed in any other book, and I don't know if it's allowed for me to post that information here since it's from a book (though I don't think it's anything major). By the way, 14 shouldn't be a model (attractive, yes, but not a model). This is just a case of a picture not matching the stats (sorry to burst your bubble).

The bit about art being off is a cop out. They get the editors stamp of approval as being what they are labeled as in the books.

And please don't be condescending (the "burst your bubble" crap), there is no need for it.

Actually, you might be right about 14 not being model material. It's probably too high.

Most models are scrawny. Most super hot women couldn't be models because designers and advertisers want bags of bones, not seductive curves.

That was my fault for using that term.

I did ask what the books call average, and I guess you answered that. And it also told me that the books are off. 10 and 11 are average (put the matrix together in excel and you can see it clearly - I just did it). If you widen it, you *could* call it 9 - 12. But in truth, 12 is a little above and 9 is a little below.

That would make 14 well above. With the right outfit, easily magazine cover material, or even centerfold material. (maybe not the BEST centerfold, but more than "good enough" to qualify)

So it ended up being a double question and I didn't realize it. lol But they both got answered.

*Sigh.* Well, Greetings and Salutations again. First, I'd like to comment that despite however it was worded, I didn't mean to come off condescending, though it appears I come off that way most of the time anyways. I would have responded sooner, but I check the forums only infrequently. Okay, and now to address each of the comments you replied to me one at a time.

You want to call saying art being off is a cop out, that is your right. But there are several instances of art being off. I mean, there are pictures of a werewolf in a half-wolf, half-man form in the same book that says they only have human and the animal form (no in between) which I actually got into a conversation about prior. Artists, in my experience, are going to draw the individual as some hot character on a general rule. If that same character had a PB of 8, would that mean that 8 is now beyond super model status? Yes, they have editors, but the books also have a lot of mistakes, missing information, contradicting comments, etc. Saying an editor stamped it and approved it doesn't mean it's perfect. The picture was drawn, not necessarily for that character. Sure, someone put the two together, but that doesn't mean they took everything into consideration or even cared (I find in real life most don't, but maybe I've just had bad experiences).

Next, to the condescending comment, well, it was just the way the comment came off. I didn't intend it to be condescending. For that much I can at least apologize for. That's not what I intended.

As for 14 being higher than a model, well, I can't really understand why you're so determined to try and prove the point, but I really don't personally care that much. So I have a question: If a 14 is higher than a model, then is a 7 even lower than a grotesquely disfigured individual? 12 or 13, by your figures, means models because they're just slightly higher than average. In reverse, 9 and 8 would be very ugly already. *Shrugs.* Just something to consider.

Of course, what one calls a model, what one calls super hot, what one calls ugly are all really subjective. What is attractive to one person isn't necessarily attractive to the next. Ultimately a PB can be described as just about anything. I know, I know, I'm sure someone out there is thinking it's a "cop out" statement. *Shrugs.* It doesn't change the validity of the statement.

Okay, well, I'm at least I did help find you a book reference. I will add that I find it interesting that you will call the text off rather than the picture, but to each his or her own. And yes, that may have come off as condescending, but wasn't really meant it. I find it interesting, not my personal choice, but I'm not here to force my beliefs on you either. Whatever works best for you is your call.

Personally, I don't consider 14 well above 11, especially when you take into consideration it can go up to 30 (or higher with possible bonuses).

Okay, I suppose that's all I really had to respond to. I probably wouldn't have replied at all, but since you said I was just taking a cop out in the first paragraph, I felt I had to respond to that as I don't believe it is. It may not be an answer you like, but sometimes it is just the case. You don't have to agree, that is fine. And the fact you didn't want an "art can be wrong" answer is kind of where the "burst your bubble" line came from. It wasn't meant to be condescending, so I did want to at least apologize for that as well if it came off that way (apologizing for it coming off wrong, not for seeing it differently than you). You don't have to agree with me, that is fine. Anyways, farewell and safe journeys to all.

[shiiv-a]

yup ... thus the plethora of beauties, on the female side i mean, with their PB stat in the 20+ area ARE freaks of nature.

if they are the offspring of gods, maybe ... or of 'another worldly type of beauty [elves and other 5d6 types] also a maybe. but seriously ... when all HUMAN female chars have a20+ on the PB .. race about in rune bikini's .. and other things that set of the insanely high PB, and NOT raise the jealous nature of a 'random goddess of beauty' .. something is so unbalanced there its not even funny.

yes high PB's mean something .... the guy running the female char or the gal in some cases, is one that wants to shag or be shagged by anything that moves? ... kinda icky if you ask me.

My thoughts, while off the wall for most people here, come from the simple belief that the 'prettier a person is on the outside, the shallower they are on the inside'. to date, i still believe that. after all, how many of you grew up hearing 'oh you're so cute' from the opposite gender? .. bet it went to the head, didn't it? ... me being on the solid side didn't hear that at all. in fact, it was the 'skinnies' that got all the attention. mainly cause they looked like the various models or TV hotties.

[shiiv-a]

you know, this is interesting. i'm usually the one getting ignored. but its cool. like i said, its really hard towant to 'game' with some people online. i don't live in a huge community. mine numbers about 2700. the pickings are really slim for gaming groups here.

that being said, the average male PB i've seen is about a 15-18 ... its like they want to be seen and having a really pretty piece of arm candy? ... but who really knows. i think it would be interesting to actually see people play with realistic PB's myself.
heh .. that being stated, is proud to have at least 3 chars with PB's of 14 and under .... one's even a 10. and that one is not at all interested in people, she's more interested in the toys she builds. an analytical genius.

[Greyaxe]

Fighting has such a low PB

i put you each at about a 6 or 7.

(Just havin some fun boys)

[shiiv-a]

*stabs random posters then tosses the messy tool away*

anyways ... PB should be removed from the stat listings if you ask. but that comment is because of all the bad press and bad examples of whatever flavored bovine fecal matter of hte month club.

yeah .. a PB of 14 is a tad above average ... BUT its should be taken along with a grain of salt. its the MA that should be associated with the PB. so .. all in all. think about it as the PB + MA out of a 1d100 ... and MAYBE you'll get a real response ...
thus
IF they make it .. cool ... if they miss by .. [say 10 points] .. people are kinda cool towards the PC .. and if its higher than a 10 point failure .. the more 'hostile' the interacting will be

oh wait .. then you'll still have uber high stats for those two rolls ... darn. thought i had it figured out ... guess not. *goes off to think it over again*

[Guest]

You know, I think I'm just going to replace PB's attribute number with the following table:
1. Grotesque
2. Hideous
3. Disgusting
4. Repugnant
5. Repulsive
6. Revolting
7. Homely
8. Ill-favored
9. Unattractive
10. Unimpressive
11. Plain
12. Fair
13. Comely
14. Cute
15. Pretty
16. Attractive
17. Lovely
18. Beautiful
19. Gorgeous/Handsome
20. Breathtaking

Yes, that's the whole table, nothing else, no penalties or bonuses, just an adjective.

[9voltkilowatt]

Nice and easy way to fix the whole god-like beauty thing ...here ya go...

A 10 is average by human standards, if everyone is an absolute knockout by our real world standards, then drop those stat whores P.B. back to 10.

Why?

Because their not exeptional, they are average.

[Mack]

I never said I didn't like to argue - or more importantly, that I wouldn't argue with people making incorrect absolute statements like you.

You do love the cop outs though. Nothing you said here has any substance at all. Just stating the obvious as though it meant something, and not geting anywhere near what's actually being talked about. lol

You're so full of bovine excrement here. But whatever. I notice those who disagree with you are wrong, argumentative, use cop outs, and incorrect universal rules.

If that makes you feel better, by all means, beleive it. But if the truth matters, it's only people who use cop outs and flat out incorrect yet make absolute statements. .... like you. lol

(if you took the time to read for comprehension you would find that there have been a number of people who disagreed and a civil and reasonable exchange of ideas took place - but they never behaved like you, which means everything.)

Knock it off.

[Mack]

average for Humans in any attribute is 8-12 with the median being 10.
i have sat down and through math averaged out attribute die rolls from1D6 to 8D6.

The average of 1D6 is 3.5 (sum 1 through 6 and divide by 6, or add 1 and 6 then divide by 2). For the average of several D6's just multiply 3.5 by the number of dice.
The average of 3D6 is 10.5.
The average attribute (3D6, +1D6 if it's 16 or higher) is 10.66.
The odds of an attribute falling in the exceptional range (16 or higher) is 4.63%.

(I play with Excel too much.)

[Mack]

Didn't Koosy post all kinds of statistics about this already?

But I added the 4.63% line. (Which, by the way, means that only 1 out of every 21.6 attributes should be above 16. So roughly every third character should have a single exceptional attribute.)

And here's some more fun: Some folks have a rule that if you earn the bonus die, and if you roll a 6 on it, then you get to roll an additional 1D6 (for a possible max score of 30). With this method...
The average leaps to 10.69 (up from 10.66).
The odds of a score being 16+ remain at 4.63% (still 1 in 21.6 attributes).
The odds of a score being 25+ are 0.58% (1 in 172.8 attributes, or 1 in every 21.6 people!)

[Guest]

Didn't Koosy post all kinds of statistics about this already?

But I added the 4.63% line. (Which, by the way, means that only 1 out of every 21.6 attributes should be above 16. So roughly every third character should have a single exceptional attribute.)

And here's some more fun: Some folks have a rule that if you earn the bonus die, and if you roll a 6 on it, then you get to roll an additional 1D6 (for a possible max score of 30). With this method...
The average leaps to 10.69 (up from 10.66).
The odds of a score being 16+ remain at 4.63% (still 1 in 21.6 attributes).
The odds of a score being 25+ are 0.58% (1 in 172.8 attributes, or 1 in every 21.6 people!)

How you you get a .6 person?

I think those are called "dwarves."

[Guest]

How you you get a .6 person?

I think those are called "dwarves."

No, those are bearded people. Even, and especially the women.

"What you need is a good dwarven woman... with a beard you CAN HANG ON TOO! AHAHAH! "

[Mack]

How you you get a .6 person?

Well, you start with keg of beer and a nice sharp axe...

[demos606]

And here's some more fun: Some folks have a rule that if you earn the bonus die, and if you roll a 6 on it, then you get to roll an additional 1D6 (for a possible max score of 30).

For even more fun, Splicers (p169), BtS2(iirc) and R:UE (p279) made this 5th die official if a 6 is rolled on the first bonus die.

[Guest]

And here's some more fun: Some folks have a rule that if you earn the bonus die, and if you roll a 6 on it, then you get to roll an additional 1D6 (for a possible max score of 30).

For even more fun, Splicers (p169), BtS2(iirc) and R:UE (p279) made this 5th die official if a 6 is rolled on the first bonus die.

Ah, but only for those games.

[Mack]

And here's some more fun: Some folks have a rule that if you earn the bonus die, and if you roll a 6 on it, then you get to roll an additional 1D6 (for a possible max score of 30).

For even more fun, Splicers (p169), BtS2(iirc) and R:UE (p279) made this 5th die official if a 6 is rolled on the first bonus die.

Huh. Had no idea it was in R:UE.

Thanks,
Mack

[shiiv-a]

*looks about ..

i didn't see a soap box. did anyone else? ...

[KillWatch]

Soooo this reminds me of a conversation I JUST had with my friend regarding Palladium stats and real life. My point was that einstein apparently wouldn't get a skill bonus because he wasn't smart enough (his IQ was never really measured but estimated to be between 140-180), his was that yes eisntein was stupid because he got that reletivity thing wrong and it just degenerated from there as I gave him a look of incredulity and called him some choice names.

[KillWatch]

so they would suffer a penalty while the brunettes would then get a bonus

[shiiv-a]

about time us non-blondes got something for not being brain-dead ...

and no offense was meant if i offended any blondes out there

[Northern Ranger]

Redheads are hot!!! too

Yup, I'd have to agree with you there, DF.

Okay, so somewhere back in the beginning of this thread (is it really six pages? Wow!), someone was talking about super-high PB's not getting too many negatives. Okay, this might not make sense to some of you, but it's the way I run this particular rule in my game. My wife has an elven archer whose PB is ungodly high (not her fault, she rolled it that way and the bonuses from the skills she selected helped, she really didn't want a goddess, but that's what she got). Then she wound up catching the eye of Cirga the Bowman (a member of Rurga's Pantheon in PF) and he seduced her. To make a long story longer, the god was so impressed with this woman that he wanted to give her something, and he made her PB supernatural. (In my games, this gives an Awe Factor, which is the opposite of a Horror Factor, which is what a character in my games would get for a low Supernatural PB.) Anyway, she was already one of the prettiest mortals on the planet, and now she's gorgeous enough to make just about any goddess jealous and any god... uhm... let's say stimulated. She now finds herself the center of attention wherever she goes, which makes it very hard to sneak into town unnoticed, or do just about anything else unnoticed. I should probably also mention that this poor woman has been raped more times than she can count. This character is one of my favorites, because my wife plays her to a tee and has taken all of this in stride, just building on her character's personality with all the adversity. Anyways, the point I'm trying to make here is that a super high PB does in fact have a down side, and a smart GM would make sure the "barbie'd up" characters knew it.

Okay, 'nuff said. Ciao.

[cyber-yukongil v2.5]

Redheads are hot!!! too

Yup, I'd have to agree with you there, DF.

Okay, so somewhere back in the beginning of this thread (is it really six pages? Wow!), someone was talking about super-high PB's not getting too many negatives. Okay, this might not make sense to some of you, but it's the way I run this particular rule in my game. My wife has an elven archer whose PB is ungodly high (not her fault, she rolled it that way and the bonuses from the skills she selected helped, she really didn't want a goddess, but that's what she got). Then she wound up catching the eye of Cirga the Bowman (a member of Rurga's Pantheon in PF) and he seduced her. To make a long story longer, the god was so impressed with this woman that he wanted to give her something, and he made her PB supernatural. (In my games, this gives an Awe Factor, which is the opposite of a Horror Factor, which is what a character in my games would get for a low Supernatural PB.) Anyway, she was already one of the prettiest mortals on the planet, and now she's gorgeous enough to make just about any goddess jealous and any god... uhm... let's say stimulated. She now finds herself the center of attention wherever she goes, which makes it very hard to sneak into town unnoticed, or do just about anything else unnoticed. I should probably also mention that this poor woman has been raped more times than she can count. This character is one of my favorites, because my wife plays her to a tee and has taken all of this in stride, just building on her character's personality with all the adversity. Anyways, the point I'm trying to make here is that a super high PB does in fact have a down side, and a smart GM would make sure the "barbie'd up" characters knew it.

Okay, 'nuff said. Ciao.

interesting point, but I find the inclusion of rape count to high to number, to be a tad disturbing, but whatever floats your boat

[Northern Ranger]

interesting point, but I find the inclusion of rape count to high to number, to be a tad disturbing, but whatever floats your boat

Okay, I may have overstated that. Probably trying to hard to drive home a point. (I was also very tired when I wrote that post! lol)

[Northern Ranger]

*ahem* that girl needs more combat skills, pure and simple.

Being abused like that should cause her to be properly bloodthirsty--it would make perfect sense for her to seek out someone (in the group or otherwise) to teach her martial arts or a(nother?) weapons proficiency.

Maybe a goddess could take pity on her, and give her a rune chastity belt that shoots crotch-level lightning bolts or something

Just to lay this line of conversation to rest (i really didn't intend it to get so out of hand) she did in fact get more combat skills. In fact, a lot more. Her parents were clergy of the Sect of Rurga, and the Goddess herself took an interest in the character. Now she is not only a Longbowman but is considered an honorary Palladin as well. No one lays a hand on her anymore without her say so.

[DhAkael]

Well, in canon (R:UE at least), exceptionaly high PB's give massive negatives to prowl. This is in the case of urban settings mind you; where someone gets a glimpse of 6-pack abbs (on male) or great legs / -ahem- "tracts of land" on the fems and just can't stop starring..and will even piint out said god(dess) to others.

Then there is the T.F.O.S. rule; "When one has a higher than average attractiveness, they are prone to fan boys / girls hounding them where ever they go, up to and including in the washroom"

[DhAkael]

Well, in canon (R:UE at least), exceptionaly high PB's give massive negatives to prowl.

I never understood that rule. Either you see the person or you don't.

Hey.. I don't even begin to state I understand the rule, I'm just playing devils advocate here.
Guess Kevin Siembiada's thinking (hehehehe I know; oxymoron there), is that prowl has two applications; one is for "losing your self in a crowd " and the other for "move like shadow / ninja"
-meh- it's all a moot point to me anyhoo.. I really don't care what any of you think on this point

[shiiv-a]

hmm .. i think that we can term it up as the following *refers to the uber high PB factor and the prowling ... not the insults flying about so stop it and start thinking ... =p *

think of the HOTTEST artist or movie star you know of. and then think of how you would react once you see them. MOST would be 'oh my god .. its ... *insert name here* .. hey i LOVED your *talent/song/movie*. can i have your autograph? .. HEY why are you walking away? .. *NAME yelled out and points* ' ...

end result? .. NO privacy for said person. THAT is the point of the negatives to prowl that is being brought up. me? .. i sincerely doubt that i'ld bat an eye if i ran into one of the current/hot stars ... why? .. i'm not uber involved in another's life and what they do. i like movies cause of the name or what its about .. i like songs not artists .. etc. thats me, and i'm NOT the average person

but the thing is .. high PB's will cause negative reactions ... think of the spurned fan above. that 'awe' factor and 'heart throb' has just become 'horror factor' and 'utterly hated' ...

nuff said now?

[asajosh]

PB can definately have a negative impact. People will tend to remember you, word spreads of your deeds faster when your exceptionally pretty or ugly.
A gunslinger in my campaign (who expired in today's festivities), has the problem of high PB and gets noticed on the street because of it ("hey its that pretty man with the fast draw, look out!") Just depends on how your GM wants to role play it I suppose.

Side note: The slinger's eyes are now in a jar of formaldehide, a trophy of the NPC organizatoin that killed him. Ain't pretty no more!

[shiiv-a]

oh man .. too funny

[shiiv-a]

i had this HORRIBLE and utterly downright nasty thought

what IF ...

a good sized acid balloon in the face will cure that. -10 to PB from the scarring and discoloring and the burns and holes in the face .. in the first melee .. an additional -1 for ever melee action after that IF the 'washes face' or 'neutralizes the acid' doesn't happen. and we're not even talking about the pain factor from the sudden attack or from the fact you feel it burning and melting off ...

my my my .. what would the pretty barbie dolls think then? ... it could happen. oh .. i guess that would cause an insanity of some sort as well ... wouldn't it? now what would the damage of that be? would it be by the ounce? .. or the gallon? .. *is now curious and heads of in search of hte answer someplace

[Northern Ranger]

I could search for this, but I'm lazy.....Does anyone know if PB turns to awe or horror factor at some point. I assume awe/horror factor is all outer apperance since you need to save at the sight of the being. PB is also outer apperances. It makes seems to me super-high PB would have an awe factor, and super-low would have a horror factor.

Can you guys answer this?

I don't know if there's anything in canon about it, but I've always used a house rule that if the PB in question is Supernatural then it gives a Horror or Awe Factor. (High PB is awe, Low is horror, of course.) It seems to make sense to me, since most of the beings listed as having such factors are considered supernatural. (Demons and angels for example.)

[Northern Ranger]

I think you're on to something there Haley. In fact, I would say that a character with a low PB (i.e. Ogres and Trolls) whose PB goes supernatural could in fact double their HF. I don't know what the rule would be for Awe Factor, but I've always ruled in game that Supernatural PB 16 starts with Awe Factor 7 and gets a +1 AF point every three points of PB thereafter. It seems to work for me.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Well, an ogre has an average PB of 7 and a horror factor of 10, with nothing supernatural going on there. A troll has an average PB of 7.5 and a horror factor of 12, with the only differance being size.

So, I think you could work out a formula with PB and size giving you a horror/awe factor.

What do you think?

not really. PB has nothing to do with horror factor, it's the monsterousness of a being that determines it. you can be butt-ass ugly and not give anyone serious pause in a life-and-death situation (troll), or be sublimely beautiful and still be frightening (Dragon)