unfair removel? or just a rant?

[goodhometownboy]

Ok well guess this has been long coming but you know how it is you sit and dwell on something untill you can't take it anymore.. so here it is.. at one point my group had 2 gms one gm'd one bob weekend and the next the next weekend fred.. everything was fine as far as we knew.. i know that before i joined bob's group he just kicked out a group member. well i learned that when he kicked her out he just decided that on his own and never consoleted the other members of the group. i was like oh well he must have his reasons and i didn't know her. well we would always drive up to bobs house that was about an hour for all of us but he would never drive down to our places where there was much more room. we all understood his car condition but when he got a new car still no... also bob would cancel all the time again we understood cause he has a fam and all but when we canceld he got all butt hurt. so as i was on the forums here the girl he kicked out contacted me and ended up joining our fred game. well as we gamed with her we began to like her both as a player and a gm. back at bob's weekend we tried to give the guy a break on gming he didn't seem to like that very much so he went back to gming and his games went down hill. well our group is volcol and we let him know what we liked and disliked. well we took two weeks off for x-mas and new years so when the new year came around and we were all ready to start gaming again no call from bob, no email, no nothing, not even a call to his friend of 15 years who is also in our group. this friend i know for a fact was deeply hurt by this.. well come to find out that he decided to boot the whole group never tell us just ignore us and start a new group.

ok ok i know i just ranted but it has been bugging me.. do i have a right to be slightly eirked on just being dropped just like the girl did..

also i want to know if this has ever happend to you before

[csyphrett]

Do you really need Bob to play? Get someone else to GM.
CES

[Dog_O_War]

Edited for F in M disease.

[goodhometownboy]

i appreciate your honest duck foot

[GreenGhost]

First of all I should introduce myself. I'm GM Bob. I've explained all of this to Goodhometownboy when it all went down last February, but considering the fact that it's been brought up in here I'll explain myself once again.

It's true what he said about having 2 seperate GMs. We gamed at my place every other Saturday & on the off Saturdays GM Fred (Goodhometownboy) ran what we called the "Denver Game" (we live in CO). As he stated, all was good with that schedule.

Before Goodhometownboy joined our group, last October, I did remove a female player from the group.She came to my place every other Saturday. I drove to Denver to play in a PF game that she GMed as well. I want to say that this was about 1 1/2 years ago & the gas, while still high, was cheaper. Well, as it turned out, the woman who I later removed was an extremely bias GM & player. She had her "favorites" when it came to other players & she made this obvious. This caused a lot of tension between the players that she favored & those that she didn't. I talked to both, her & the other players about this & told them that if things don't change she would be dropped. After another month (2 of my games & 2 of hers) of the same problems I was true to my word & dropped her from the group.

Next, as for the group coming to my place for the games that I GMed, this was how it's been since I started GMing Palladium games almost 20 years ago. I explained to the group that I didn't want to drive to Denver to game & if they didn't want to make the drive to my place I'd understand, but everyone continued to want to drive to my place. As for the transportation issue... at that time I did have a truck, which was on it's last leg, but let everyone know that it wasn't the transportation that was the issue. My wife & I pay between $400-$450 a month in gas. So, once I replaced the dying truck, gas was still an issue. For those of you who don't know (I Know you're aware of this Misfit ), I've been married for 16 years & have a 10 year old daughter & a 16 year old son. We budget our income & unfortunately the extra cost of me driving to Denver for gaming wasn't in the budget. Anyone out there with a family &/or children know the importance of budgeting & those who don't yet will find out later. I had & still appreciate the fact that all the players, Goodhometownboy & his wife included, drove to my place for the games. At this time 3 of my players were college students (at least I'm pretty sure all 3 were) & received financial help from family, one who has been identified as the "friend of 15 years" (which is actually 10 year. We met in '98) had a very good & lucrative job (he made some great decisions getting himself in that position) & Goodhometownboy & his wife were living at his parent's house so that they could save money to buy a home. There's nothing negative with how any of them lived their lives. I'm simply stating that I had a lot more expenses & therefore didn't have the budget that they did.

As for cancelling games; true I've cancelled some games, who doesn't? My son was a Sophomore in High School & in Marching band at the time. At that time my son's school made it to the State Semi-Finals & then Finals & since several (I believe it was 3) of their competitions landed on a couple game days I cancelled. I wanted to support my son. There's nothing wrong with that. My father came up fro a visit from TX twice. I might add that he has cancer & is doing fine right now, but at the time he had changed treatments & wasn't taking well with it. These reasons for cancelling were explained to the group before & all seemed fine with it. I was told by the "friend of 15 (10) years," "You have a family man... do what you have to do." As for me being "****hurt" about them cancelling... sure I was disappointed, as I'm sure they were when I did, but I wasn't mad at anyone (even when they generally cancelled as much as 2 hours after the game was supposed to start).

Giving me a break GMing was a cool idea. It wasn't my idea, but Goodhometownboy (GM Fred) really wanted to GM a HU game & when I thought about it, a break from GMing & actually playing would be cool. I decided to play a Super Soldier from HU Powers Unlimited 2, but when I showed the character to the GM it was completely redone to what he wanted me to play. I didn't want it, but I decided to give it a shot anyways. As it turned out I was dictated, by the GM, how to play the character from what weapon to use at any given time to how the character should react in certain situations. I didn't control the character. It was more like another of the GM's NPCs.

Goodhometownboy is right about the games going downhill. Like I said before, I've GMed Palladium for almost 20 years (GMed Rifts for about 18 years). During those years, like most GMs, I've developed some House Rules. The House Rules have stayed in effect for years. Goodhometownboy & I had communicated through email before he even moved to CO (if I remember right he was in CA) & I explained the House Rules to him so that he knew what they were before we ever gamed so that there would be no surprise & if he didn't like something we could try to work something out, but he said everything was cool. Everything was fine, but went downhill when he simply "disregarded" the House Rules & started contesting them with the Rift GM Guide. I explained to him that I knew what the book said, but these House Rules had been explained to him & he agreed to them. Not to mention we had gamed with the House Rules for almost 2 months before then. I, once again, mentioned that we could go over the House Rules & see what the players didn't like so we can see where any possible comprimises may need to be met, but he simply wanted the House Rules gone. Remind you most of these House Rules had been in effect for almost 20 years with little to no problems.

The group was very vocal & we talked about likes & dislikes when it came to the game, primarily GM calls. One incident in the game that started a "nose dive" was the following scenario... the players were ambushed by a Coalition Squad. A volley of Plasma Mini-Missiles were fired at a random character, who on their own decided not to wear any body armor. Goodhometownboy, wearing the shredded reminents of the Violator SAMAS (from the Free Quebec book) , which had only 1 MDC left said thathe was going to shield the unarmored character with his own body. I reminded him that he had only a single point of MD left to his power armor, but his response was that the new Rifts Rule states that any amount of MD done that exceeds an existing MD of body/power armor is "dissipated." I reminded him that we had never gamed itthat way. It was a rule we had never gone by, including during games that he played with us. This went for for the players as well as me. Goodhometownboy had killed plenty of CS soldiers by depleting the MD of their body armor & the remaining MD obliterating the poor sap inside the armor. In this incident he decided that there was a problem with it. Then again, in his defense, the unarmored character that he was trying to protect was his wife. I'd expect him to be upset if he simply forgot that House Rule & I killed his character, but I gave him the opportunity to rethink his actions after I had reminded him of the rule. Either way he just wasn't hppy with much after that incident.

We did take some time off for Christmas & New Years, but it was actually a month, not 2 weeks. I used that time to get a bit ahead & get things ready for the next few games. I got to the point where the next 3 or 4 games were fleshed out. Goodhometownboy had become a relayer of the game schedule, which was great. I only had to call him & he let everyone know what was going on during their Denver game.

I don't know what happened All I do know is that from January to March I prepared for games that I scheduled with Goodhometownboy, including buying all the snack & soda, & rearranging the livingroom to accomodate everyone for games that no one showed for. So as far as "booting the whole group" I simply quit waiting around.

Goodhometownboy,
Whatever happened to the group exactly I don't know. Since I was the one waiting I can only guess, but throughout this I have no hard feelings towards anyone whatsoever. I hope you have a great gaming group that you're with now & just for the record I don't have another gaming group. No one was replaced. I've ran 3 games since our last one (1 which was for my son's 16th Birthday Party). I'm using this time building new campaigns & getting some well needed writing done. I'm sorry that this has been bothering you for the past 9 months, but no one was "dropped." My home is still open to any of you. If you want to call me we can talk about this more. If you don't have my number anymore I can give it to you in Yahoo.
I called "the friend of 15 (10) years" last night just to verify that I didn't do something unintentionally to upset him greatly as you stated here. He said that all's good and that even though he was disappointed that we weren't gaming anymore that he was never "upset."

Everyone should still feel welcomed to take part of Goodhometownboy's Poll. I just wanted to explain the other side of what happened since this particular Forum had left out a lot of details that was needed for people to make a rational judgement.

Just for the record my response is in no way meant to be a bash against Goodhometownboy at all. He's great guy & a good GM.

[Dog_O_War]

Previous statements retracted.

Also, it is amazing what you learn about people when the whole truth comes out.

[Lady Raven]

As the 'former female player' I call 'bull'. I don't want to get into it online, as I consider this well in the past, but NOTHING was ever mentioned to ME about being biased. NOTHING was mentioned to me about any person having issues with me, and in fact I offered to drop the one I was running.

Then the rest of the group was lied to as to why I was not there suddenly...some made up thing about me saying I didn't have the time anymore.

Kinda shady and low.

But, as I said, it is in the past, and my new group is much better, and I am very happy with them. I trust them to let me know if I need to tone things down or change my style, and handle things like adults should.

[GreenGhost]

You're entitled to your own opinion.

If you want you could email me and I'll explain again why I removed you. It's just not worth agruing about it in here.

[Dog_O_War]

Ooooh, just like a soap-opera unfolding before me!

Three sides to a story, three different views. You're most likely all right and all wrong at the same time.

For whatever reason, you (Lady Raven) were probably being biased without realizing it. They probably hinted to you in typical male fashion that this was going on, but often these messages are as clear as mud (possibly you figured it was just one instance where they meant all the time).

Meanwhile Goodhometownboy would rather not show himself in a bad light here, and had omitted certain facts. While some of it undoubtly happened as he tells it, there are parts that I bet are over-endulged.

Then, GreenGhost has laid out what he believes to have gone on, but he is old and has likely forgotten things. That said, he has laid out (seemingly) the most even tempered and factual account of past events, offering that his story thusly has the most pull.

Also, Lady Raven; I know people that have claimed that very same statement, and more often than not they're lying to themselves. I find that while no problems exist in the immediate, there is still an underlying unease due to that person's actions around others.
What I mean is that your favoratism might not have been apparent to you, but it was certainly felt by others, and they had hard feelings towards you because of it - though they would never show them to your face (as you were in a position of power).


Finally, this (everything I've typed here) is all speculation and hersay, so I wouldn't take it too seriously. That and I wasn't even there, so how the hell would I know, right?

[GreenGhost]

Again, I want to state that I have no hard feelings towards Goodhometownboy and I don't want any harsh judgements made against him. I should also state that I have no hard feelings towards Lady Raven even though it sounds like she'd kick me in the neck if she saw me. Maybe she didn't realize what she was doing and like Dog_O_War said maybe I let her know in a "typical male fashion." This is why I have no hard feelings against anyone.

What happened happend and it's over. Still, both Goodhometownboy and Lady Raven, are liked and respected by me. We just had our differences. Not a lot of differences, just one's big enough to shake the Game Tree.

[Lady Raven]

I should also state that I have no hard feelings towards Lady Raven even though it sounds like she'd kick me in the neck if she saw me. Maybe she didn't realize what she was doing and like Dog_O_War said maybe I let her know in a "typical male fashion." This is why I have no hard feelings against anyone.

I always thought you were a decent GM, and have never said otherwise. I had fun while it lasted.

[GreenGhost]

I should also state that I have no hard feelings towards Lady Raven even though it sounds like she'd kick me in the neck if she saw me. Maybe she didn't realize what she was doing and like Dog_O_War said maybe I let her know in a "typical male fashion." This is why I have no hard feelings against anyone.

I always thought you were a decent GM, and have never said otherwise. I had fun while it lasted.

I appreciate that and I feel the same way about your game as well. Except for the smoke breaks... I don't smoke

Seriously though... I really liked your PF game too. You're a good GM.

[Vidynn]

as the "rant" was too long for me, I voted for kiss - though it should probably be make out and not make up, huh?

[GreenGhost]

Agree with Dog O war after reading everything. Best of luck to all of you and I hope you each find a group who you can agree with and have a good time. After all, it's all in good fun

We're all good. Including the friend of 10 years. I called him a month or so ago to be sure things weren't taken the wrong way (which would have been unintentional) and he didn't take it personal and all was good. He underdstood about the gas prices since he was the one doing the driving back then.

Again, I'd like to state that Goodhometownboy is a good guy and fun to game with. I just don't think he understood fully why the group seperated.

[Misfit KotLD]

Well, Dog of War is right about one thing, Ghost is OLD. He's like the ancient.

And he and his wife were cool to game with.

[GreenGhost]

Isn't it great that gas is cheap again?
Too bad it won't last....
Gotta get in some long distance gaming before it goes back up.

Tell me about it. Spending $400-500 a month in gas was rediculous, but like you said... this won't last.

[GreenGhost]

Well, Dog of War is right about one thing, Ghost is OLD. He's like the ancient.

And he and his wife were cool to game with.

LOL! Old? You really aren't that far behind me are you?

[Misfit KotLD]

Well, Dog of War is right about one thing, Ghost is OLD. He's like the ancient.

And he and his wife were cool to game with.

LOL! Old? You really aren't that far behind me are you?

Shush!

[GreenGhost]

Wow, this is very interesting. I really don't see any right or wrong to the situation. I am a new GM compared to you guys. I have been doing it for about 7 years now. However I did see alot of stuff that can be a problem, and I would really like to talk about it.

Disclaimer:This is MY opinion, it is based on 0 credible information, I am not an authority or a friend/foe to anyone of these people here. I am simply replying to a topic that inquired our opinions, and as a member of this forum I will display this OPINION.

1. I empathize with Green Ghost in a few areas. When you have things going on outside of gaming, it can get pretty tied up. There will always be players that are more "dedicated" than others, or simply have a gamer friendly life. It's hard for some people to compete or keep up with those players, especially a GM. HOWEVER with that being said, don't be a GM. Being a GM is being committed; your not a player...you Game Master. What that means is your the manager, the captain, the lead programmer, the director, CEO...you have to be able to put in a ridiculous amount of time to step up to this position. If you can't GM, but love Rifts then be a player-an easier job. With this being said I find many GM's loving what they do, but having it pulled out of their hands because of personal matters. Hence they continue trying to run a half-arsed campaign where they are miserable and the players are too. Take off time, regroup and think, and plan, slowly...and when you think your ready...stop and plan some more. Take 6-months to a year off, when your schedule gets more bearable jump in and unleash that epic you have been planning for all those months in wait. You will find yourself refreshed, motivated, and better prepared. Also it seems like you are really into these house rules and how long you have been playing them. Just because they have been doing the trick for 20 years doesn't mean, they do the trick now. I mean hell, most RPGs core books change rules after 20 years! Yes, they worked. However the new crowd didn't seem to be a fan of them. I am glad you gave the guy a warning, and I am glad you killed him. That's what good GMs do, they don't water down a scenario in-play. However after you killed his character, you could have sat down with him and said "hey....maybe we will come up with a compromise rule" or even say "hey, ill think about it". I think that would have smoothed over the tension. In the other shoes though...I must admit, many times players get killed and blame the GM; why not take that anger from the game and put it BACK into the game. Sounds like the real culprits were the Coalition, now make a new character and get some revenge!

2. I sympathize with goodhometownboy. It sucks being booted from a game. Dropping a group of dudes without telling them is flat out cheap. Simply tell them. Communication is key. Let the players know that you don't want them in your game. Let them sit on that egg-yes they may hate the GM for booting them, but what if they go to another game and another GM is having problems. Now the players know it could be THEM. Out of this whole group I feel that goodhometownboy is the biggest victim, kindve like a child in a custody battle. Tied between two people he generally liked, and kindve having to pick sides. Never-the-less homeboys comments didnt convey the whole story; your post criminalized GM "Bob" and made him out to be a power hungry kid with his finger on the button. In reality it sounds more like a stressed out GM who couldn't commit. Anyone who has GM'd can empathize with this. GMs get little credit, zero thanks. I am lucky if someone shares a slice of pizza. GMing is HARD, its a mix of acting, memorization, art, planning, and improvising...people forget that. So what if the guy didnt want to drive to wherever, he was probably already spending hours of his time to scratch up NPCs for you guys to obliterate, drawing maps that you only used for 5 minutes of play, and jotting down plot lines that would never be used. On the other hand; it's hard to have a GM half step it and spend $50 dollars of gas to get there.

3. Now to lady raven. The one who was the spark to all this gasoline it seems. All fingers point to you Apparently whatever happened with/to you was the catalyst in the scenario. That's weird that he would lie to his players about why you were not at the game. Never-the-less a very "political" move on his part. What should he have said? "I kicked her out because I am a bad guy GM" ; it could have gone the flip side - he could have told truth in HIS words. "I kicked her out because she was unfair and biased". Now I am not saying that Ghost was a bad guy, or that you were biased...I am just saying that he was being tactical. It might not be truthful, but it will calm the mood down if he said "She is sick" or "Her car is broken down" or whatever. Anyway, that's not the problem. Seems to be that he thinks you were biased, and he never said anything to you. Great thing is, as a GM ....you also have to be psychic. When you are playing a campaign you can usually tell if a player doesn't like whats going on. Look at his facial expression, maybe his lack of interest, or look at how is character acts in game. I find many players show their distaste through their characters. Tension is great, becuase it is one of those animal instincts in humans that we dont always have to be vocal or visual about...you can feel it in the air.



So to all of you involved. Shut this nonsense down. If your still mad or hurt go to your corners and do your own things. Let GM "Bob" GM his new players, let Lady Raven and hometownboy go play their new campaigns.

OR you can take my advice and try to avoid these mistakes in the future so you don't get smacked in the face with the same hand the same way -again.

1¢ + 1¢ = 2¢

I appreciate all the time and thought that you obviously put in for this. There were just a couple of things I did want to mention...

1- It was about this time last year that the rescheduling started increasing. LOL! It's the Holiday Season and each and every one of the players had to reschedule at some time for one reason of another (Christmas shopping, dangerous road conditions to your typical winters in Colorado, etc.). It wasn't that I couldn't "keep up with the players." LOL! I've been keeping up with GM/DMing since about '78. There was no stress on my side. For the most part the adventures that I was running at the time had been created and fleshed out during the 2-3 years that I was living in NC and not gaming (except for a couple of games that I ran for Misfit). I still have a good year or two worth of games that I'm sitting on and will be using for a new group. So, again, there was no stress from the GM's side.

2- I never killed the character. I retracted the ruling to keep the game on track. I went against my own ruling as a GM so that the whole debate on why I wouldn't change a rule that we had used for the part few months (with Goodhometownboy) and for 17 years for the games before he joined the group. I really hadn't changed the rule simply because a player wasn't happy with it, but to keep the game going, that's what I did.

3- I never booted anyone from the game. I got my wife ticted at me for months. Every other Saturday I would rearrange the furniture in our apartment and run to the store, spend $15 to $20 for goodies and snacks and wait for players that never showed. So it was actually me that was "booted." I have no hard feelings towards Goodhometownboy, his wife, or any of the other players for deciding to game in Denver with their own group, regardless of them not telling me.

4- When it comes to Lady Raven... in all honesty. She's a GREAT player and a GREAT GM. There were some things that I didn't like that was going on, but I can tell you that it wasn't solely her fault. I take just as much blame for it. Like I said before... I do believe there was a little favortism, but as someone else has stated, maybe I didn't express what I felt about it properly. Also, I'm now convinced that she wasn't aware that she was doing it. So, like they say... you learn from experience and I've learned from what happened between her and I. After talking to her in here I can take a step back, look at that situation and say that I honestly regret how I handled that situation. She's the only player that I have ever booted from a game and I see that it wasn't the right thing to do. It's not every day that you get a player (or a GM) like her.

This all being said, I hope that they all are having a great time with their new group. Any of them (Raven included) would be more than welcome to game with me again sometime. I think some people were hurt during this more than others, but the invitation from me will always stand. They were a GREAT gaming group. I only had one gaming group that I enjoyed running better than them, but that was only since that group stayed together for 2-3 years (the old friend mentioned in this forum was one in that group as well).

[GreenGhost]

Well, Dog of War is right about one thing, Ghost is OLD. He's like the ancient.

And he and his wife were cool to game with.

LOL! Old? You really aren't that far behind me are you?

Shush!

Linda said, "you wouldn't be shushing me if you weren't so close to us in age!"

[ZorValachan]

On the Home Rules. Did you have these written out and give all players a copy? I have found this helps a LOT.

Type out all your changes. The House Rules take precedent to any Books. I normally email them to everyone as a WORD document as well as have it copied to the very email I send with this attachment. If a person for some reason doesn't have email. I make them a hard copy. Then I specifically tell everyone that they do not have to read the email/document, but it is their fault if they do not know. They were all given the rules in advanced. If something in-game happens that brings up this situation, the Written House Rule applies no matter what (I think you should not have changed it for this guy, that to my group would show favourtism, which is what Lady Raven was accused of. As a GM of as many years as you, I've learned that any rule breaking for 'game flow' that goes against a rule that was used for someone else and has not since been 'officially' changed (by the company or by a new House Rule) leads to resentment by other players. If upon playing a rule you see it needs to be changed, or changed again, after the session add/change it in your House Rules document, and resend it. Let people know that from this point on it will be different.

I have found in my own gaming groups this prevents all shows of favourtism. The rule as it stood was obeyed and from now on it may be changed, but counts towards all characters as it is now. For whatever reason writing and giving has much more impact than just 'saying it', even if you said it for 20 years. "I didn't read it" puts blame squarely on the player, "I don't remember you saying it" is more evasive and tries to place blame on the GM.

Simply put, my group doesn't mind house rules, or even house rules changing. As long as 1) it applies to all, from when the rule was instated to when it was retracted in writing. 2) They can argue for/against the house rule (If changed based on their argument, they know the new ruling will not take effect until the next session) 3)New rules are not used until written and sent.

[GreenGhost]

On the Home Rules. Did you have these written out and give all players a copy? I have found this helps a LOT.

Type out all your changes. The House Rules take precedent to any Books. I normally email them to everyone as a WORD document as well as have it copied to the very email I send with this attachment. If a person for some reason doesn't have email. I make them a hard copy. Then I specifically tell everyone that they do not have to read the email/document, but it is their fault if they do not know. They were all given the rules in advanced. If something in-game happens that brings up this situation, the Written House Rule applies no matter what (I think you should not have changed it for this guy, that to my group would show favourtism, which is what Lady Raven was accused of. As a GM of as many years as you, I've learned that any rule breaking for 'game flow' that goes against a rule that was used for someone else and has not since been 'officially' changed (by the company or by a new House Rule) leads to resentment by other players. If upon playing a rule you see it needs to be changed, or changed again, after the session add/change it in your House Rules document, and resend it. Let people know that from this point on it will be different.

I have found in my own gaming groups this prevents all shows of favourtism. The rule as it stood was obeyed and from now on it may be changed, but counts towards all characters as it is now. For whatever reason writing and giving has much more impact than just 'saying it', even if you said it for 20 years. "I didn't read it" puts blame squarely on the player, "I don't remember you saying it" is more evasive and tries to place blame on the GM.

Simply put, my group doesn't mind house rules, or even house rules changing. As long as 1) it applies to all, from when the rule was instated to when it was retracted in writing. 2) They can argue for/against the house rule (If changed based on their argument, they know the new ruling will not take effect until the next session) 3)New rules are not used until written and sent.

The House Rules were explained to every player prior to playing, let alone prior to character creation. The only player that had ahard time with it has the House Rules explained and emailed to him before he even got to the state of Colorado. LOL! However, I hadn't given them out as a Word Document. That's actually a great idea and will impliment that immediately!

I agree with you that I shouldn't have changed the House Rules for this one player. It did show favortism, which is one of the reasons that I regretted doing that. I was completely caught off guard. I had never had anyone want to change a rule. We had even played it that way with that particular player for the past 2 months or so. He was able to kill a good number of CS troops using my House Rule. It was just when it wasn't in his favor this particular part of the game that he wanted to challenge it. I do have to say that every other game session with this player was great! It was mainly just this one incident.

You make a lot of good points! I'm definately going to write up a House Rule Book! I've thought about it before, but since I never had a problem I just really didn't need to. Now that I've had this problem, I'll definately make a House Rules Book.

[ZorValachan]

i'm glad you liked my own uses I didn't want to sound condescending or anything. I've house Ruled for a long time. In just about every system I've GMed, except for the one I wrote, lol.

But I learned from my own group that they hate 2 things more than all others.
1) Rewinding of time to change a past action (if it is not a specific time-change spell or similar). like the guy who says 2 rounds later 'wait, I remember I have +5 to strike, I should have hit that guy'. All the way to a GM who told a player the next adventure 'your character didn't do that thing you said he did. Find a reason why you didn't do it'. If I change a rule, or read it wrong. I admit the error. Notify everyone. and it takes place in future instances.
2) When I GMed TORG each book contradicted another book in some way or another. I gathered them all and wrote the way it would be in my game. One 'core' rules to everyone and one 'realm rules' to those who had characters from that realm. it seemed that people didn't care if the rules were too harsh or too easy. They just liked knowing what changed and that it would be fair to everyone. They hate rule changes that only affect a certain situation at a certain time (because the GM felt like it that time). they like consistancy

And I have made house rules and changed them due to me not realizing some X factor that got brought up in game. I played it as the rule stood. After the game discussed it with players, then changed the rule based on that. Wrote it up and emailed the update.
Since I started Palladium again a BTS-2/Rifts interlocked campaign and the 2 games have slighly different comabt rules (I like some GM guide rules better than R:UE), I printed my 'Palladium Combat Rules' that works for both games. It just seems for my players, they appreciate knowing the GM isn't changing things willy nilly.

It is ironic that the only guy who was given the rules in writing is the one who complained.

[GreenGhost]

i'm glad you liked my own uses I didn't want to sound condescending or anything. I've house Ruled for a long time. In just about every system I've GMed, except for the one I wrote, lol.

But I learned from my own group that they hate 2 things more than all others.
1) Rewinding of time to change a past action (if it is not a specific time-change spell or similar). like the guy who says 2 rounds later 'wait, I remember I have +5 to strike, I should have hit that guy'. All the way to a GM who told a player the next adventure 'your character didn't do that thing you said he did. Find a reason why you didn't do it'. If I change a rule, or read it wrong. I admit the error. Notify everyone. and it takes place in future instances.
2) When I GMed TORG each book contradicted another book in some way or another. I gathered them all and wrote the way it would be in my game. One 'core' rules to everyone and one 'realm rules' to those who had characters from that realm. it seemed that people didn't care if the rules were too harsh or too easy. They just liked knowing what changed and that it would be fair to everyone. They hate rule changes that only affect a certain situation at a certain time (because the GM felt like it that time). they like consistancy

And I have made house rules and changed them due to me not realizing some X factor that got brought up in game. I played it as the rule stood. After the game discussed it with players, then changed the rule based on that. Wrote it up and emailed the update.
Since I started Palladium again a BTS-2/Rifts interlocked campaign and the 2 games have slighly different comabt rules (I like some GM guide rules better than R:UE), I printed my 'Palladium Combat Rules' that works for both games. It just seems for my players, they appreciate knowing the GM isn't changing things willy nilly.

It is ironic that the only guy who was given the rules in writing is the one who complained.

None of us liked the "Rewind" when it came to gaming, LOL!

That was really the only incident with that player that I can remember. He's a cool guy.