Saving Throws vs Magic

[drewkitty ~..~]

Spell Strength:

• 1 Is there any upward cap on the number one is expected to save against vs magic?
• 2 Does spell strength continue ad infinitum, or is it capped at +4 (16 to save) unless the victim has bonuses, in which case it counts against the bonuses?

  IE, Jim Bob, my lvl 11 Shifter is aligned with a God of Magic and has +5 to spell strength. He casts a juiced up Blinding Flash (-1 to save) on Joe Bob, my lvl 3 vagabond. Joe has a PE of 27 and is normally +6 to save vs magic. No other bonuses to save apply. What must Joe roll to save vs being blinded?

• 3 Does spell strength apply to rituals? And if not, why would one bother with a ritual (for ritual-optional spells) after reaching +4 spell strength?

1) 18 I think, I've had a char with a spell Str. of 18.
2) if both sets of bonuses are equal, then they effectively cancel each other out.
3) no. Ritual magic is always have a Spell Str. of 16.

[Talavar]

There's no cap on spell strength, except ways to get it. Most classes can only get +4, a shifter can get +6, and there are a handful of other ways to get more.

For your JimBob Shifter example, Joe has to roll a 12 to avoid getting blinded: +6 spell strength cancelled out by +6 to save vs. magic.

Ritual Magic should get plusses to spell strength, because otherwise it becomes useless past having +4 spell strength.

[Library Ogre]

Spell Strength:

• Is there any upward cap on the number one is expected to save against vs magic?
• Does spell strength continue ad finitum, or is it capped at +4 (16 to save) unless the victim has bonuses, in which case it counts against the bonuses?

  IE, Jim Bob, my lvl 11 Shifter is aligned with a God of Magic and has +5 to spell strength. He casts a juiced up Blinding Flash (-1 to save) on Joe Bob, my lvl 3 vagabond. Joe has a PE of 27 and is normally +6 to save vs magic. No other bonuses to save apply. What must Joe roll to save vs being blinded?

• Does spell strength apply to rituals? And if not, why would one bother with a ritual (for ritual-optional spells) after reaching +4 spell strength?

1) No.
2) Yes, spell strength bonuses can continue. In the example, Joe has to roll a 12 or better (since the spell strength bonus of +5 negates his net bonus to save of +5).
3) Energy. A single spell caster likely has only so much energy at one time, and he cannot draw on others in the course of casting save through ritual.

[Ice Dragon]

Spell Strength:

• Is there any upward cap on the number one is expected to save against vs magic?
• Does spell strength continue ad finitum, or is it capped at +4 (16 to save) unless the victim has bonuses, in which case it counts against the bonuses?

  IE, Jim Bob, my lvl 11 Shifter is aligned with a God of Magic and has +5 to spell strength. He casts a juiced up Blinding Flash (-1 to save) on Joe Bob, my lvl 3 vagabond. Joe has a PE of 27 and is normally +6 to save vs magic. No other bonuses to save apply. What must Joe roll to save vs being blinded?

• Does spell strength apply to rituals? And if not, why would one bother with a ritual (for ritual-optional spells) after reaching +4 spell strength?

1) No cap
2) The "normal" spell strength is capped at 16 for high level mages, but they still can have boni to add to their spell strength.
3) No, rituals are always at spell strength 16 regarding the level of the mages participating the ritual (so even three 1st level LLW have a spell strength of 16 during rituals).