Started my first game last night...... question about combat

[Epically]

In my game and other Heroes games I play, it's you make your action when you want (provided you have enough turns to do so, ie; no spilling over into the next round), then you have no actions for the next two whilst others have their two. Obviously exclusions include parrying and non-depermental aspects of non-combat actions.

If that makes sense. Allows an easier game flow.

Remember, a melee round is 15 seconds. Typical person who chooses skills correctly has 5 actions. That's three seconds per action per round. So those three actions, or 9 seconds, is getting the absolute perfect shot off from a called aim shot. (steadying breath, lining your shot up, slowly squeezing trigger etc...)

[Epically]

At the end of the day, everything is GM's discretion and house rules.

[Epically]

Whats fanning though??

fanning is what you see in the old west shoot-em ups and spaghetti westerns.
where the slinger pulls from the hip and instead of pulling the trigger he fans the hammer.

Which obviously doesn't work on modern handguns, as they aren't designed for it.

[azazel1024]

Is it talking about an automatic pistol?

The way a burst works from an automatic weapon is substantially different and tends to be more accurate then a couple (or three, or four, or whatever) really quick trigger pulls on a pistol (of any type). Heck, especially with a direct impingement gas recoil mechanism a burst with an automatic rifle is much more accurate (and much faster, even if you are a 'speed shooter'). I am of course not speaking of fully automatic fire compared to a single pistol shot (or even a few quick shots).

Even most skilled shooters would have a hard time pulling off more then say 10-12 shots in a 15 second period with any kind of real accuracy. I'd say with any kind of semi-automatic weapon that you can fire 2 shots in a single action, but at -4 accuracy for the 2nd shot of the action. No 3 shots in an action, nor shifting aim. Must be the same target. If you want either rounds to be a called shot then both have to be a called shot (with any called shot penalties added in to both shots).
-Matt

[Severus Snape]

Is it talking about an automatic pistol?

The way a burst works from an automatic weapon is substantially different and tends to be more accurate then a couple (or three, or four, or whatever) really quick trigger pulls on a pistol (of any type). Heck, especially with a direct impingement gas recoil mechanism a burst with an automatic rifle is much more accurate (and much faster, even if you are a 'speed shooter'). I am of course not speaking of fully automatic fire compared to a single pistol shot (or even a few quick shots).

Even most skilled shooters would have a hard time pulling off more then say 10-12 shots in a 15 second period with any kind of real accuracy. I'd say with any kind of semi-automatic weapon that you can fire 2 shots in a single action, but at -4 accuracy for the 2nd shot of the action. No 3 shots in an action, nor shifting aim. Must be the same target. If you want either rounds to be a called shot then both have to be a called shot (with any called shot penalties added in to both shots).
-Matt

Ok, so I don't have the DR books. Yet - they are next on my purchase list. But I think that burst rules are something that all of Palladium's games need to have reviewed and commented on, as the burst rules could (technically) apply to any of the megaversal games. With that said...

I read and reviewed the rules on burst firing from HU2, page 75. It states under there that a burst can be fired from any semi-automatic or fully automatic weapon, which is 3 or more bullets at one time. There are 3 types of bursts: Short, Long, Entire Magazine.

Short: Fires 20% of the magazine, roll damage dice for 1 round and multiply by 2, only fire at one target.
Long: Fires 50% of the magazine, roll damage dice for 1 round and multiply by 5 for clips with 30-50 rounds (or by 2 if the clip has less than 15 rounds - which makes me wonder what the damage is for a 25 round clip then), only fire at one target.
Entire Mag: Fires the entire magazine (duh!), roll damage dice for 1 round and multiply by 10 for clisp with 30-50 rounds (or by 5 if the clip has less than 15 rounds), only fire at one target.

All bursts are +1 to strike, but the rules don't specify how many actions a burst takes. I know it takes 1 action to fire 1 round, but a burst doesn't specify how many actions it takes to fire the burst. Remember that from a semi-auto pistol you have to pull the trigger for each round that is fired. I'd say it takes 3 actions for semi-auto (for having to pull the trigger) or 2 actions from a fully automatic weapon.

I'm in favor of using the burst rules, but only if the character has the appropriate WP. If you aren't proficient with a weapon, you could still get off a shot. But you wouldn't be able to rapidly pull the trigger (or hold the trigger down long enough to compensate for recoil on a fully auto weapon) to use a burst.

[Epically]

Is it talking about an automatic pistol?

The way a burst works from an automatic weapon is substantially different and tends to be more accurate then a couple (or three, or four, or whatever) really quick trigger pulls on a pistol (of any type). Heck, especially with a direct impingement gas recoil mechanism a burst with an automatic rifle is much more accurate (and much faster, even if you are a 'speed shooter'). I am of course not speaking of fully automatic fire compared to a single pistol shot (or even a few quick shots).

Even most skilled shooters would have a hard time pulling off more then say 10-12 shots in a 15 second period with any kind of real accuracy. I'd say with any kind of semi-automatic weapon that you can fire 2 shots in a single action, but at -4 accuracy for the 2nd shot of the action. No 3 shots in an action, nor shifting aim. Must be the same target. If you want either rounds to be a called shot then both have to be a called shot (with any called shot penalties added in to both shots).
-Matt

In that case, the only way in my game I'd allow that with that much accuracy is if the person had WP heavy weapons and WP rifles, as well as being an Apocalyptic Soldier. Coming from my military background, it takes years of practice to get that good with a machine gun. Not that I know how accurate it is with a rifle, because we only fire single shot.

[The Beast]

If somebody makes a called and aimed shot that will take three melee actions in total. Does that mean they get to shoot right away or that the enemy gets their two actions in whilst the player is aiming at them?

I'd have no problem with a called shot being done on the round it's announced. Amied shots, however, shouldn't happen unitl the next round or two due to the fact that the shooter is taking his time to get a proper shot off.

[jedi078]

I must admit I messed up on some melee... forgetting to let them parry at times and adding too many bonuses to shooting. Also letting them dodge and then take their next action as well forgetting they used that to dodge.

I think everyone makes mistakes the first time they GM a game.

If somebody makes a called and aimed shot that will take three melee actions in total. Does that mean they get to shoot right away or that the enemy gets their two actions in whilst the player is aiming at them?

I would say the enemy gets the three actions in as the character takes aim. So if you do any kind of aiming make sure your far enough away where the Zombie won’t reach you as your aiming.

Remember, a melee round is 15 seconds. Typical person who chooses skills correctly has 5 actions. That's three seconds per action per round. So those three actions, or 9 seconds, is getting the absolute perfect shot off from a called aim shot. (steadying breath, lining your shot up, slowly squeezing trigger etc...)

and yet it doesn't take me 9 seconds to do that....it takes me about 2-6 seconds depending on what weapon I am using and how far away the target is.

So we know that little rule is flawed for military trained characters....

If they Aim up for two actions and then their opponent hits them via a claw or a bullet do they lose that aim bonus as they have been knocked by a hit??

If the PC is hit on action one or two of aiming then the bonus would be lost. But if the PC aiming is hit on action three when they shoot it is a simultaneous attack.

On top of that I’ve found I have a player who likes to leap on the back of crawlers and then says they can hit them as he is on their back and then he cuts their heads off. I let the crawler hit him though saying it wriggled about enough to get a hit on him. Surely you couldn’t really stand on their backs and try and rend their heads off. Should I impose a penalty to hit the zombie or a penalty against a skill for him to try and stay on a zombies back?? I was taken aback at the time at what he had done and just let him hit it.

It will take one action to get on the zombies back, a second action to hold on, then a third action to cut the head off. But IMO this would more be like slicing/slitting a throat then cutting off a head. So maybe a sawing back and forth motion for 2-3 action is more appropriate then a single attack to lop off the head. The attack would also be a “called shot.”

Regardless of how you rule the attack, for all three actions the zombie is not going to just sit there and let itself be killed. It will fight back, trying to reach behind it and grab the person, or maybe walk towards other zombies who will attack the PC on the zombies back. Other Zombie may just walk up and attack the PC on the Zombies back as well.

I would say your right in letting the PC get hit by the zombie. Also don't forget there are hold rules in the DR book.

another question.... my friend wanted to shoot in sucession three quick shots from his 9mm in a melee action. i have seen this happen in films etc. i said a single shot is a melee action but agreed he should be able to fire off more than three shots from a 9mm in a single mellee action. how woul;d you rule this? big minus? But ltting him do this kind of negates using a sub machine gun.

Automatic pistols, as well as anything else (SMG’s, assault rifles, pistols, and semiautomatic shotguns) that has a magazine/cylinder and a single shot feature can be rapidly fired. For in game purposes this would be similar to burst fire.

This can also be done with some pump action shotguns where the shooter just holds down the trigger and pump the shotgun.