Coalition War Campaign, Pg. 197 10. The harboring of nonhumans, including D-bees used as cheap labor or slaves, is illegal and will not be tolerated. The CS will respond accordingly. All D-bees should be reported to the CS for capture and extermination.
That D-Bee's run to the 'Burbs isn't because they trust in the magnanimity and mercy of the Coalition. They do so because the risk they face hiding out there is marginally better than the horrors they face out in the wildnerness. If they're caught, though, then they're just as dead.
Cyber-Knight wrote:You say that as if what I said was untrue.
Coalition War Campaign, Pg. 197 10. The harboring of nonhumans, including D-bees used as cheap labor or slaves, is illegal and will not be tolerated. The CS will respond accordingly. All D-bees should be reported to the CS for capture and extermination.
That D-Bee's run to the 'Burbs isn't because they trust in the magnanimity and mercy of the Coalition. They do so because the risk they face hiding out there is marginally better than the horrors they face out in the wildnerness. If they're caught, though, then they're just as dead.
If that was true there be no d-bees there, but Doesn't change the fact they run to papa Prosek for whatever reason.
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
Of course it's true. It says so right in the book, and is reinforced later on when it states that "From time to time, the Coalition Military and/or ISS will engage in purges to flush out and exterminate D-bees and monsters", not to mention the Coalition's actions across numerous other books and supplements.
but Doesn't change the fact they run to papa Prosek for whatever reason.
Welcome to Rifts Earth, where hiding in a cupboard from the Nazi's is preferable to having demons feasting on your soul out in the woods.
I have always seen FQ as much more tolerant towards D-bee's ext than the CS ever was, but FQ just doesnt want them as a part of their nation. So as long as they dont poke them with a stick FQ isnt really concerned. But I also thought FQ is willing to work with D-Bees ext.
On the other hand you have the CS as quoted above really hate D-bees and abuse them every which way. Also there is so many that TRY to defend them as a good military power that isnt evil or twisted like the Nazis. (yes i know, i played that card that has been played sooo many times when describing the CS, but I firmly believe it is what KS somewhat designed them around)
Nether wrote:I have always seen FQ as much more tolerant towards D-bee's ext than the CS ever was, but FQ just doesnt want them as a part of their nation. So as long as they dont poke them with a stick FQ isnt really concerned. But I also thought FQ is willing to work with D-Bees ext.
On the other hand you have the CS as quoted above really hate D-bees and abuse them every which way. Also there is so many that TRY to defend them as a good military power that isnt evil or twisted like the Nazis. (yes i know, i played that card that has been played sooo many times when describing the CS, but I firmly believe it is what KS somewhat designed them around)
FQ doesn't want them and they make it clear to them.
CS say kill all of them, then let's them live in the burbs, then oh we need to do something lets clear out the block out in sector 30, back to business , a month later , oh no , now we need to clear out the block in sector 78 , what they are still there try sector 71 next week, hey let start a war, what about the ones in the burbs, well they will still be there after the war, off to war, hey still here you d-bees scum, what money for me , ok I didn't see you this time, and don't go nowhere near sector 43 , raid happening at 5am but don't tell anyone.
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
CS say kill all of them, then let's them live in the burbs, then oh we need to do something lets clear out the block out in sector 30, back to business , a month later , oh no , now we need to clear out the block in sector 78 , what they are still there try sector 71 next week, hey let start a war, what about the ones in the burbs, well they will still be there after the war, off to war, hey still here you d-bees scum, what money for me , ok I didn't see you this time, and don't go nowhere near sector 43 , raid happening at 5am but don't tell anyone.
Sweatshop Capitalism at its finest.
'Burn-Bloc'----Any structure or group of structures erected in the Chi-Town 'burbs without any attention to meeting firecode or incorporating any quality of life amenities such as appropriate air conditioning, water, or fire escapes. Shoddy housing and business buildings built with the anticipation of it being knocked down in a periodic CS block-razing(also 'Matchbox', 'Roach-Motel', 'Flare-House')
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
The burbs make it easy for the death squads and just sweep for dbees. It is sad that the dbees are just lining up for the gas chamber.
Next all the CS has to do is put a sign on the front of the gas chamber door saying, dbee free citz signup here. But that wont be till after the TS war when they dont need the cannon fodder atm.
Nether wrote:The burbs make it easy for the death squads and just sweep for dbees. It is sad that the dbees are just lining up for the gas chamber.
Next all the CS has to do is put a sign on the front of the gas chamber door saying, dbee free citz signup here. But that wont be till after the TS war when they dont need the cannon fodder atm.
Wow if this isn't untrue I don't know what but I guess it can't no worse then geofront slave camps, or torture rooms because we all know geofront is equal to the CS.
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
Mech-Viper Prime wrote:[Wow if this isn't untrue I don't know what but I guess it can't no worse then geofront slave camps, or torture rooms because we all know geofront is equal to the CS.
BETTER than the CS, you Western barbarians...BETTER. We just like to allow you to THINK you're somehow superior. Just like we did with the Mongols.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Nether wrote:I have always seen FQ as much more tolerant towards D-bee's ext than the CS ever was, but FQ just doesnt want them as a part of their nation. So as long as they dont poke them with a stick FQ isnt really concerned. But I also thought FQ is willing to work with D-Bees ext.
Don't mistake the desire to be left alone for tolerance. IIRC, according to the books, FQ is even more xenophobic than the CS. To the point that they ousted even all the loyal Dog Boys and Psi-stalkers from their territory at gunpoint because of their 'inhuman' nature.
For now, FQ just wants to be left alone, but it is possible that may change in the future.
As far as working with d-bees, the only example I can think of is when Tolkeen approached them to team up against the CS. That was a bad, bad mistake by Tolkeen, because despite their problems, FQ and CS are on the same side when it comes to magic and the inhuman.
Blade with whom I have lived. Blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend... and then farewell. -Sir Orin Neville Smyth, Flight of Dragons
I don't have the page numbers at the moment, and I'm too damned whooped to get up and get the book from the other room... but iirc, FQ's stated (ie what the author said...) operational plan is that they clear a buffer zone around their fortress city and anything that enters that zone without permission gets wasted. For now they are satisfied with what they have as covers their needs however, when their population grows large enough they will begin expanding and slowly take more and more land for themselves to meet their needs.
They, Free Quebec, have the same goals as the Coalition they just have a different time table.
"If your plan relies upon chance to succeed, then you've already failed." "Sometimes to achieve the greatest good, one must commit great evil."
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
SuperTramp?
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
SuperTramp?
I am very opinionated. Yes I rub people the wrong way but at the end of the day I just enjoy good hard discussion and will gladly walk away agreeing to not agree
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
That's all well and good but that can be stopped cold by a Mind Melter and Bio Manipulation.
I am very opinionated. Yes I rub people the wrong way but at the end of the day I just enjoy good hard discussion and will gladly walk away agreeing to not agree
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
SuperTramp?
I offer wonder if the coalition had a mutant who negated super powers, that looked like leech of the morlocks , if they would use him or kill him
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
That's all well and good but that can be stopped cold by a Mind Melter and Bio Manipulation.
I've been statting a Vagabond up and I gave him Extraordinary Intelligence as one of his Minor Powers (He's got 3 Major and 3 Minor per Conversion Book 1) because I rolled a 7 for IQ and it struck me that I didn't want a Vagabond powerhouse who was borderline retarded, but maybe I should switch that out with Immune to Psionics? He's a Vagabond. Since when is intelligence a prerequisite?
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
SuperTramp?
I offer wonder if the coalition had a mutant who negated super powers, that looked like leech of the morlocks , if they would use him or kill him
Both; vivisect him for useful information/data...after all; he's a mutant, and no telling what's going on inside him. If he's a freak occurance; well, no great loss. Lone Star can whop up clones under CS control. If he's one of a new breed like psi-stalkers, best the CS get information on his kind NOW. If anybody comes looking for him, the CS can negotiate froma position of strength, knowing their weaknesses(how to control or kill them) and if they ask about the first guy in particular, the CS can always say"No, we never saw him!" or "Bunch of evil d-bee monsters killed that guy; so sorry for your loss. Tragedy, really".
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Cyber-Knight wrote:A single Vagabond from the 'Burbs with the superpowers of Invulnerability, Sonic Flight, and Supernatural Strength.
SuperTramp?
I offer wonder if the coalition had a mutant who negated super powers, that looked like leech of the morlocks , if they would use him or kill him
Well, I've included a CS 'Superhuman' platoon in my games as a subdivision of psi-battallion, so it's possible in my CS anyway. All members are certified 'human', though most are mutants. Those who look the most 'inhuman' will likely be assigned to one of the CS's undercover Merc Squads.
One of the character ideas is a Tolkeen hero (officially listed as deceased) whos sacrifice to save his commanding officer left him locked in a monstrous, invulnerable body (Super Powers Invulnerability and Monstrous Form). He is currently stationed in a CS undercover Merc Group, the Reaper's Tallymen, but he has to be monitored closely, as he has a death wish and will charge into battle, or provoke an enemy in hopes that they can destroy him.
Blade with whom I have lived. Blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend... and then farewell. -Sir Orin Neville Smyth, Flight of Dragons
Mech-Viper Prime wrote:I offer wonder if the coalition had a mutant who negated super powers, that looked like leech of the morlocks , if they would use him or kill him
It's thoughts like this that led me to concept out a CS Colonel, since they appear to have the power to pull this off... hello juicers..., who feels kinship with mutant humans... or was it a more then healthy dose of guilt over that mutant who was killed by his own men after saving their lives? ...
Basically its like this... "Project: Titan" is a secret battalion of highly trained soldiers who equipped with a unique array of advanced weaponry and armor different from the normal CS armor. Though in truth they are all mutants with minimal mutations to their physical form and the 'advanced weapons and armor' they employ is designed to mask their super powers with a few examples of boosts to the super powers. Their goal is to win recognition from the CS and prove themselves worthy of serving the Coalition.
However, I basically stopped working on the project when I started looking through the list of powers and realized I'd need to reclassify each and every one of them... there is just two much range within each category to justify a two list system... and I don't have the time or patience for that kind of reworking right now.
"If your plan relies upon chance to succeed, then you've already failed." "Sometimes to achieve the greatest good, one must commit great evil."
Mech-Viper Prime wrote:I offer wonder if the coalition had a mutant who negated super powers, that looked like leech of the morlocks , if they would use him or kill him
It's thoughts like this that led me to concept out a CS Colonel, since they appear to have the power to pull this off... hello juicers..., who feels kinship with mutant humans... or was it a more then healthy dose of guilt over that mutant who was killed by his own men after saving their lives? ...
Basically its like this... "Project: Titan" is a secret battalion of highly trained soldiers who equipped with a unique array of advanced weaponry and armor different from the normal CS armor. Though in truth they are all mutants with minimal mutations to their physical form and the 'advanced weapons and armor' they employ is designed to mask their super powers with a few examples of boosts to the super powers. Their goal is to win recognition from the CS and prove themselves worthy of serving the Coalition.
However, I basically stopped working on the project when I started looking through the list of powers and realized I'd need to reclassify each and every one of them... there is just two much range within each category to justify a two list system... and I don't have the time or patience for that kind of reworking right now.
I like this this, some mad scientist stuff there
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
Yeah, the Coalition could really use a super-soldier division which tries to make humans stronger, tougher, more capable of surviving on Rifts Earth. Maybe it could be headed up by a guy who was an early test subject but for whom the experiment went horribly awry, burning away most of the flesh on his face, making it appear skull-like, and leaving what's left blood red. I think such a character would fit right in with the Coalition, someone who represents the Coalition's sense of human purity while at the same time looking like everything they hate...
Mech-Viper Prime wrote:[ I like this this, some mad scientist stuff there
If they're on your side, they're 'eccentric genuises'. If they're on the other side, they're 'diabolical madmen'.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
While I do use superhumans in the CS, I do not have any sort of 'Super Soldier' creation program. At least not beyond the normal use of borgs and juicers. It's more about using the available 'super-powered' human mutants that are out there, just like they do with psychics and psi stalkers. Smart use of available resources.
I see the Emperor as dead set against experimentation on humans though. To the point that, IMO, he will personally sign Dr. Bradford's death sentence should he discover what his good friend has been doing in Section 357.
Of course, everybody's got their own take.
Blade with whom I have lived. Blade with whom I now die. Serve right and justice one last time. Seek one last heart of evil. Still one last life of pain. Cut well old friend... and then farewell. -Sir Orin Neville Smyth, Flight of Dragons
Mercdog wrote:While I do use superhumans in the CS, I do not have any sort of 'Super Soldier' creation program. At least not beyond the normal use of borgs and juicers. It's more about using the available 'super-powered' human mutants that are out there, just like they do with psychics and psi stalkers. Smart use of available resources.
I see the Emperor as dead set against experimentation on humans though. To the point that, IMO, he will personally sign Dr. Bradford's death sentence should he discover what his good friend has been doing in Section 357.
Of course, everybody's got their own take.
I agree, a case could be made for humans with super powers to join the CS military.
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
A powerful nation with a powerful army is just a bunch of people lost in the scramble for their own gratification. They can be destroyed, or locked up. But if they make themselves more than just a bunch of people, if they devote themselves to an ideal, and if no one can't stop them, then they become something else entirely. Which is? A legend.
The Coalition is not about their powerful army anymore...they are an ideal, a Legend.
Head of Northern Gun Research and Development
"I'm ready man, check it out. I am the ultimate badass! State-of-the-badass-art!" - Private Hudson, ALIENS (1986).
ffranceschi wrote:Nothing could defeat the Coalition!
A powerful nation with a powerful army is just a bunch of people lost in the scramble for their own gratification. They can be destroyed, or locked up. But if they make themselves more than just a bunch of people, if they devote themselves to an ideal, and if no one can't stop them, then they become something else entirely. Which is? A legend.
The Coalition is not about their powerful army anymore...they are an ideal, a Legend.
They're an abomination, a dark legacy that for the sake of humanity needs wiped from memory so all right-thinking and decent sentients may prosper and live in peace and harmony.
Fair warning: I consider being called a munchkin a highly offensive slur and do report people when they err in doing so.
'Reality is very disappointing.' - Jonathan Switcher from Mannequin
It's 'canon', not 'cannon'. A cannon is a big gun like on pirate ships, canon is what you mean when referring to something as being contained within one of the books such as how many dice to roll for a stat.
so all right-thinking and decent sentients may prosper and live in peace and harmony.
That will never happen. 'Right-Thinking' is a flawed concept the relies upon the existence of only one path and that all people are the same and modeled flawlessly after each other. Humanity alone is to diverse for such a concept to ever truly take root. I'm not even going to touch the concepts of decent and "peace and harmony"... just too many worms in those bags.
Besides way I see it, Nightmask... siding with the D-bee's is just signing Humanities death warrant... it'll just take a while for them to die off but it will happen as population growth rates and favoritism of certain races over other races for their particular traits and advantages within a particular field.
In other words capitalism and it's natural pattern of minimizing overhead to maximize output will ensure that humanity dies off.
Does this preclude me to believing that the CS is a right and just people? Nope... shocking I know... but true regardless. Do I hate D-bee's? nope I just favor my own people. Why shouldn't I favor my own people? Is there something wrong with wanting to see my people prosper and have a secure future?
"If your plan relies upon chance to succeed, then you've already failed." "Sometimes to achieve the greatest good, one must commit great evil."
Besides way I see it, Nightmask... siding with the D-bee's is just signing Humanities death warrant... it'll just take a while for them to die off but it will happen as population growth rates and favoritism of certain races over other races for their particular traits and advantages within a particular field.
That's like saying people will stop having kids because somebody else has all the social advantages. If anything, dominant and wealthy cultures grow complacent and distracted, and their birth rates fall.
-------------
"Trouble rather the Tiger in his Lair,
Than the Sage among his Books,
For all the Empires and Kingdoms,
The Armies and Works that you hold Dear,
Are to him but the Playthings of the Moment,
To be turned over with the Flick of a Finger,
And the Turning of a Page"
Does this preclude me to believing that the CS is a right and just people? Nope... shocking I know... but true regardless. Do I hate D-bee's? nope I just favor my own people. Why shouldn't I favor my own people? Is there something wrong with wanting to see my people prosper and have a secure future?
that about sums it up
Ravenwing wrote:"Killing Dbee's isn't murder, they aren't human, it's pest control!"
Zardoz wrote:You have been raised up from Brutality, to kill the Brutals who multiply, and are legion. To this end, Zardoz your God gave you the gift of the Gun. The Gun is good!
Does this preclude me to believing that the CS is a right and just people? Nope... shocking I know... but true regardless. Do I hate D-bee's? nope I just favor my own people. Why shouldn't I favor my own people? Is there something wrong with wanting to see my people prosper and have a secure future?
that about sums it up
I guess I identify with fictional characters based on their ideals rather than their race.
In the real world, I'm totally for the survival of the human race, but in a fictional world, it doesn't matter to me.
Does this preclude me to believing that the CS is a right and just people? Nope... shocking I know... but true regardless. Do I hate D-bee's? nope I just favor my own people. Why shouldn't I favor my own people? Is there something wrong with wanting to see my people prosper and have a secure future?
that about sums it up
I guess I identify with fictional characters based on their ideals rather than their race.
In the real world, I'm totally for the survival of the human race, but in a fictional world, it doesn't matter to me.
--flatline
I'm all for the survival of the human race in fiction as well, well at least as long as they aren't xenophobic monsters killing anything that's different which is what you get with someone like the CS in charge. That and it's an absurdity to speak as if 'well if humans don't kill off everything else then they must go extinct because it can only be them or us', a major argument of the monstrous xenophobe that uses the 'either/or' fallacy as it's entirely possible to have cooperation so everyone survives and prospers (and given some of the things available to aliens humanity's survival improves immensely working with rather than against them).
If humanity makes itself a target by telling everyone 'we're gonna kill ya because you're different!' it's responsible for its own extinction.
Fair warning: I consider being called a munchkin a highly offensive slur and do report people when they err in doing so.
'Reality is very disappointing.' - Jonathan Switcher from Mannequin
It's 'canon', not 'cannon'. A cannon is a big gun like on pirate ships, canon is what you mean when referring to something as being contained within one of the books such as how many dice to roll for a stat.
Does this preclude me to believing that the CS is a right and just people? Nope... shocking I know... but true regardless. Do I hate D-bee's? nope I just favor my own people. Why shouldn't I favor my own people? Is there something wrong with wanting to see my people prosper and have a secure future?
that about sums it up
Based on what you describe, wouldnt the New Navy, NGR, Japan, Geofront or Australia suit your view as a decent nation far more than the CS?
Why is it you believe in the CS so strongly over the other nations out there?
I have a character that I enjoy playing that is a CS Mind Melter and he is all about pro Human, and taking back his planet. He doesnt want to hurt non humans for any malicious reason, but the planet belongs to the Humans and unfortunately there is alot of innocent caught in the middle, but he has no desire to share the planet with any non human. By game standards he is a bad alignment (abberant) but he wants revenge, and to retake his home at any cost. In adventures he has even told other players playing a non human that they are a valueble ally but when teh time comes and they dont pack up and get the ell off my planet we will have to fight.
Just saying regardless of this character, it doesnt change anything in my mind that the CS evil SoBs.
All members are certified 'human', though most are mutants. Those who look the most 'inhuman' will likely be assigned to one of the CS's undercover Merc Squads.
