Meat

[boxee]

Hope you all realize the amount of meat eatten / day is off by alot. Am I the only one that realizes this?
Boxee.


As a side note ordered the rifters #59 - 60. Hope they will be here soon!

[flatline]

Hope you all realize the amount of meat eatten / day is off by alot. Am I the only one that realizes this?
Boxee.


As a side note ordered the rifters #59 - 60. Hope they will be here soon!

Could you give a little more context for your statement?

--flatline

[krispy]

As a side note ordered the rifters #59 - 60. Hope they will be here soon!

I hope you enjoy Galactus Kid's (59) and my material (60)

that reminds me, i have to get 59 as well

[krispy]

Hope you all realize the amount of meat eatten / day is off by alot. Am I the only one that realizes this?
Boxee.

Could you give a little more context for your statement?
--flatline

Second

[boxee]

The amount of food required for host armors is massive, I really dont think it was well thought out as to how much is required. I think the numbers are way too high.

[The Galactus Kid]

As a side note ordered the rifters #59 - 60. Hope they will be here soon!

I hope you enjoy Galactus Kid's (59) and my material (60)

that reminds me, i have to get 59 as well

Its ok. i still have to get Rifter 60. hahaha.

[glitterboy2098]

actually, off the cuff i'd guess it is probably too small. large high metabolism animals need huge amounts of food.
rule of thumb is about it's own bodymass a week for carnivores.

and splicer's warmounts and host armors have things like fast healing (which is a huge metabolic cost), and things like organic weaponry with multiple uses(which doesn't exist in nature, but given the energy costs of tech weaponry, would burn through even more energy.. not to mention other nutrients to grow the ammo/chemicals used)

[taalismn]

Which is why genetically-engineered carniculture would be the rage for the Resistance....creating fast-breeding, fast-growing relatively passive meat creatures and setting them loose. Ideally critters that could live off most anything, like lithovoric metabolisms, and still pack on pounds of protein-rich MEAT.
Or transgenic plant crops...Meat-trees and steak-shrubs! THese, though, would bend the definition of meat and vegetable, and might not be quite as nutrious for pure carnivores as meat-on-the-hoof/paw.
Unlucky party members and condemned criminals...it's not cannibalism is something ELSE eats them, right? Guess who just drew the short straw to feed Brutus?

THe problems with the above solutions are:
-That many beasties with fast reproduction rates equals high mutation rates and eco-disaster in the offing when the food-beasts start strippping the land and chewing into the Earth. PLus NEXUS is going to get mighty suspicious when thousands of pig-buffalo start popping up all over the landscape. Some of the NEXUS's sub-personas are going to also regard such as an affront to their 'pristine' wilderness, and will start attacking the Splicers' food chain with a vengeance.

-Meat-plants ain't natural, and NEXUS will twig to it, and start staking out any stands of such oddball plants, maybe even boobytrapping them to see who goes for them.

-Ethical objections on the Alpo solution. Few enough humans as is, without turning them into animal-feed. Plus there are better things to do with your miscreants and dissidents, like Biotic conversion.

[Premier]

Which is why genetically-engineered carniculture would be the rage for the Resistance....creating fast-breeding, fast-growing relatively passive meat creatures and setting them loose. Ideally critters that could live off most anything, like lithovoric metabolisms, and still pack on pounds of protein-rich MEAT.
Or transgenic plant crops...Meat-trees and steak-shrubs! THese, though, would bend the definition of meat and vegetable, and might not be quite as nutrious for pure carnivores as meat-on-the-hoof/paw.
Unlucky party members and condemned criminals...it's not cannibalism is something ELSE eats them, right? Guess who just drew the short straw to feed Brutus?

THe problems with the above solutions are:
-That many beasties with fast reproduction rates equals high mutation rates and eco-disaster in the offing when the food-beasts start strippping the land and chewing into the Earth. PLus NEXUS is going to get mighty suspicious when thousands of pig-buffalo start popping up all over the landscape. Some of the NEXUS's sub-personas are going to also regard such as an affront to their 'pristine' wilderness, and will start attacking the Splicers' food chain with a vengeance.

-Meat-plants ain't natural, and NEXUS will twig to it, and start staking out any stands of such oddball plants, maybe even boobytrapping them to see who goes for them.

-Ethical objections on the Alpo solution. Few enough humans as is, without turning them into animal-feed. Plus there are better things to do with your miscreants and dissidents, like Biotic conversion.

Taalisman,

I wholeheartedly agree with your assessments, however, they immediately spawned an idea as a possible solution. What if The Great House focused more on Meat wagons that they could control and contain. This would avoid the concerns of introducing fauna (meat) into habitats that could attract NEXUS’s attention, alien predators or rival Splicers to the fauna or to the House havens and bunkers. This is not to mention that the fauna would not run away or be killed off by opportunistic predators and Necros.

Let me explain:

Meat Drones

Meat Drones are sacrificially designed meat wagons that are preprogrammed much like that of War Mounts, only they are purposely designed to give their lives, literally "for the cause". Meat Drones are basically rushed production War Mounts designed to obey field ops, particularly Outriders, Packmasters and if need be, Dread Guards. Meat Drones will stay close to Splicer platoons, run and hide with them and obey general commands, though they are not combat oriented and can do very little in the field of battle. They will however avoid enemy fire & attacks and will stay close to their designated platoon as required. Meat Drones don’t emit any scent and their waste/refuse & gas is deployed in sealed, scentless gelatin bags that deteriorate rapidly (1D4) hours, leaving very little to track them.

When it is time to “contribute”, Meat Drones will surrender themselves voluntarily to be eaten by the predatory Biotechnology (Host Armors, War Mounts, Gore hounds, Biotics, etc.), without putting up any fight. When activated by pressing & holding orbs, located on each side of the throat, their bodies simply go into an induced shock so that they feel no pain, while they are being consumed. This allows Carnivore Biotechs to consume them immediately without the concern of a chase, struggle or any noise such as shrills or screams that might draw unwanted attention. While their purpose is clear and the ease of having Meat Drones go out with platoons is a nice solution to avoid interrupting sorties, and it avoids the risk of injury that can occur in wild hunts, it is not without its concerns and disdain. Outriders & Packmasters, commonly frown upon such easy unsporting kills and the hunters also don’t feel gratified nor exercised as in the true traditional hunts. Its not even a canned hunt, its often viewed as sacrificial butchery but is a necessary evil, that is not liked.

Meat Drones have been produced into (4) forms based on scale to provide the best functionality for various field operations and supplement needs.

Fluffies

Fluffies resemble large, 6-legged fluffy rabbits with 4 large almond insect eyes and long feathered moth styled antennas. They are very easy to bring along missions as they are very agile, have a low profile, quick and very attentive to their surroundings. This makes bringing several fluffies on field ops very manageable as they are fast enough to avoid most trouble that comes their way and tough enough to travel the harshest terrains. Fluffies are also a Gore hound favorite and may often tempt a Gore hound’s prey drive. There are two types of flufflies: a Standard and a chitin armored version for those operations that have to go into harsh, extremely hostile habitats or hot spots where the fluffies preservation warrants increased protection to fuel the platoon's food requirements.
Class: Supplement War Mount
Crew: none, they are drones.
Hit Points &S.D.C.: H.P.: 2D6+4. S.D.C.: 3D6+6.
M.D.C by Location for Armored Variation:
• Tail: 2
• Front Legs (2): 10 each
• Hind Legs (4): 18 each
• Front Paws (2): 5 each*
• Hind Paws/Feet (6): 10 each
• Head: 16*
• Main Body: 20*
• Feathered Antenna (2): 2*

*Depleting the M.D.C. of the Head or Main Body kills the Fluffy.

Speed:
Running: 100 mph (160 km) maximum, but normal cruise speed is only 30 mph (48 km). The act of running does tire out the Fluffy at about 10% of a rate of a human and I can run nonstop for 3 hours at full speed before needing 1D6X10 minuets of rest to go for another two hours before needing rest.
Leaping: 30 feet (9.1 m) high or across, increase by 50% with a short running start and triple when running at full speed.
Digging: 10 mph (16 km) through sand or dirt. 5 mph (8 km) through clay, rock or stone. 5 mph (8 km) when excavating and constructing a stable tunnel. Digging does not tire out the War Mount.
Swimming: 10 mph (16 km).
Underwater Depth: Maximum depth is 200 feet (61 m).
Flying: Not possible.

Statistical Data:
Height: 2.5 feet (0.8 m) at the shoulder, 3 feet (0.9 m) at the top of the head on all fours.
Width: 2 feet (0.6 m).
Length: 4.5-5 feet (1.4 to 1.5 m).
Weight: 100-120 pounds (45 to 53 kg).
Cargo: Can “comfortably” carry 40 lbs. (18 kg) on its back or drag 160 lbs. (54 kg) behind it.
Physical Strength: 1D4+5
Production Cycle: 4 month gestation period plus 2 month growth cycle.
Operational Lifetime: 6 month life span.
Bio-Regeneration Rate: 0. Does not regenerate.
Horror Factor: 1.
Feeding: The Fluffy is a Lithorvore. It needs to eat 5-10 (2.2 to 4.5 kg) pounds of dirt, rocks, and minerals each day.
Color: brown, tan, cream or gray with whit markings, or solid white in the winter snow. Dark Violet eyes.
Sleep Requirements: As an artificially created organism, the Fluffy only requires 3 hours of sleep per day.

Other Data:
Being a Drone, Fluffies are unmanned War Mounts, Drones that are able to operate independent of an Outrider, using its animal-like intelligence and instincts to respond to any given situation. It will flee when threatened and will hide or burrow underground in order to avoid conflict. It will only obey the commands of an Outrider, Packmaster or Dreadguard, but is also able to recognize the current leadership in a platoon and will automatically make that person the alpha until ordered otherwise.
Alignment: Considered to be good. Most Fluffies respond favorably to anyone who treats them with kindness and patience and they love to romp, play, being very fond of a game of tag. This behavior is so embedded that some Fluffies are given to people in havens to help desensitize fears of Biotechnology.
War Mount Attributes: I.Q.: 1D4+4, M.E.: 1D6+10, M.A.: 2D6+10, P.S.: 1D4+5, P.P.:1D4+4, P.E.: 1D4+4, P.B.: 2D6+15 (they are so…cute), Spd.: 150 mph. on the ground
Number of Attacks per Melee: 2 melee actions though they won’t attack anything, they will opt to quickly dodge and avoid.
Combat Bonuses: +2 on initiative, +3 to parry, +4 to dodge, +1 to roll with punch, impervious to disease, and poison.
Equivalent (Instinctive) Skills of Note: Climb 85%/80%, Land Navigation 60%, Prowl 65%, Swim 60%, Excavation/Mining 70%

Senses and Features: Unlike most Standard War Mounts, Meat Drones are supplements and are rushed into production and thus don’t have the necessary time for standard Warmount features. Fluffies are armed with the following:
• Seismic Sense: Can feel vibrations of earthquakes, thunder, explosions and even the approach of heavy vehicles, troops, and stampeding animals up to 12 miles away. The approach of smaller beings can be sensed within 200 feet (61 m).
• Chemoreceptors: Can diagnose by taste the exact chemical composition of dirt, stones, rocks, soil, clay, and minerals.
• Compound Eyes: 2 pairs of large almond shaped insect eyes that extend the peripheral vision to 180 degrees (270 degrees combined), allowing fluffies to see just over each shoulder and partially behind themselves, making it very difficult to surprise them.
• Antennae: This pair of feathered antennae can hear and smell, and are sensitive to temperature. As a result they can feel a change in the wind (direction, speed, temperature), detect odors and work as feelers in the dark. Platoon members may often be alerted to danger by watching early warning signs based on alarmed Fluffy reactions, if they detect trouble or changes.

Blotes

Blotes resemble large catapillars with large upper arms resembling that of a very fat silverback gorilla and the hind legs of a large cricket.

Pippers

A furred porpoise looking drone with rotund legs, built like a boar for speed and compact bulk.

Buffers

Resembles a puffer fish and a bison. The more it eats the more puffy they stretch so that they can pack on the most weight and meat. They are still built with a bison frame however, so they can run at a consistent pace and speed to keep up or catch up to most biotechnology.

**********************************************************************

I left the last 3 unstated as I figured maybe others might want to join in (if interested) to take on one of the remaining Meat Drones to write up and follow suite from there. They are listed from smallest to heaviest, so I hope they are fun. Anyone please feel free, just please post your results to share the MEAT.

[Shark_Force]

@premier: 20 trench foot mines on those things? yeesh, i'd bring those things along just for that alone... bring a small pack of them and it's suicide to chase you on the ground 0.o

also, they should probably have melee actions, whether you want them to attack or not... without actions, they cannot dodge.

[Premier]

the amount of calories a host armor would need, is actually not that much more then say, A typical American Diet which is .. like what.. 5000 calories a day? http://calorielab.com/foods/beef/77 1lb of raw meat is 1000 calories: Eating a 30lb bush pig: 30,000 calories. if the numbers are worse then this, well then, I'm gonna ignore the rifter material. if the numbers are 10 times this, or 100 times this, someone hasn't paid attention to how ecosystems work, and people with carnivore host armors will be rampageous cannibals like Ugandan Hippos. - No one will want to be near them, for fear of being eaten.

I think this may be very different because of what a human is, routinely does and how we process food and its composition versus predators and what they require and how they process foods. Notice that athletes who work and perform in rigorous training and performance on a consistent basis consume far more on a regular bases, and process this food to replenish their expended energy and carbs versus the typical American diet (BTW, Omnivore so carbs, nutrition, vitamins, etc., requirements are different). This extreme athletic consumption would be likened to a predator’s behavior and activity or even like that of a Carnivore HA:

Various field studies have estimated that mature wild tigers and lions consume between 10 and 25 pounds of prey a day. This is between 4 and 7% of their body weight. This is only a theoretical average. In the wild tigers and lions will gorge up to one hundred pounds at one sitting and then fast for many days. In captivity tigers and lions eat considerably less because of sedentary life styles that burn fewer calories. Captive adult large cats should eat between 4 and 6% of their body weight or between 9-18 pounds of chunk meat when fed five days a week. Because temperature, habitats and exercise differ at every facility, they should be fed no more than the minimum amount that keeps them in lean condition.
Source reference

This is pretty comparable to what the stats say for Carnivore Host Armor in the original sourcebook –

Feeding: The suit eats from 10 to 30 pounds (4.5 to 13.5 kg) of animal matter a day, and may gorge on up to 50 to 80 pounds (22.5 to 36 kg) at one time. After gorging the host armor can go for 2D4 days without feeding and without suffering any ill effects. (Splicers 2004)

Now with that being said, we are also talking alien influenced, intelligently designed, bio-engineered advanced technology, so maybe in proportion to and what the Librarians could get, this is the rational, most efficient and resourceful standards they could devise without pushing the envelope one way or the other. As to the voracious appetite, It really depends on the mass to energy required ratio. Take for example the least weasel (Mustela nivalis). They are ravenous tiny carnivores (Males weigh 36-250 grams, while females weigh 29.5-117 grams) that are capable of killing rabbits 5-10 times their own weight. The least weasel’s average daily food intake is 35 grams, which is equivalent to 30-35 % of its body weight. This is because the least weasel must remain extremely active to keep itself warm since it is so small, thus it burns up far more energy (calories per day). It can’t afford to just eat and sit. The larger the carnivore predator the more it can consume, though it takes more down time for this food to process. The larger the predator the smaller the proportion in comparison to body mass of the daily requirement becomes. This is why we see the required rest time or down time exhibited by large carnivores. Lions & Tigers, often rest and sleep most of the day, especially after gorging because of this factor. So in comparison to large predators such as lions, tigers and bears (oh my) they are in the same weight category of a standard HA (300-600 pounds). This places them in comparable weight to body consumption ratios and requirements of a large cat or bear.

That’s how I see it anyways.

[Premier]

@premier: 20 trench foot mines on those things? yeesh, i'd bring those things along just for that alone... bring a small pack of them and it's suicide to chase you on the ground 0.o

also, they should probably have melee actions, whether you want them to attack or not... without actions, they cannot dodge.

Yipes! My bad. I used a different Splicers critter as a template and forgot to omit those. I also added the melee actions like you suggested, Great catches Shark Force! Rectified.

Though now you have me thinking should the food be able to drop a trench while on the run? Food that can fight, hmmm?

[Premier]

someone maybe the original poster implied they changed the feeding rates in splicers...
but in any case. I think the availability of Meat is pretty damn rare in splicers..

You said that right!!! That's why I seriously wondered how often players go hunting? Going on a hunt and searching for food could easily distract or stagnate missions, but makes for entertaining experience and or new challenges. I assume most layers gorge before leaving the haven for a mission and hope they have to do very little hunting while out in the field, at least long enough until they can return. I feel or those who get caught or pinned down in a Ruined city, Wasteland, etc.

[Shark_Force]

They would never send gorgers on recon missions. They would send plant , insect, or lithovores on those, because those require the least resources.

the packmaster pretty strongly indicates otherwise...

[Slight001]

They would never send gorgers on recon missions. They would send plant , insect, or lithovores on those, because those require the least resources.

the packmaster pretty strongly indicates otherwise...

I imagine you are both correct. Depending upon the environment and available resources any number of different metabolisms may function as viable recon unit.

On the subject of meat... can we eat HA's and other combat orientated constructs?

[Premier]

They would never send gorgers on recon missions. They would send plant , insect, or lithovores on those, because those require the least resources.

the packmaster pretty strongly indicates otherwise...

I imagine you are both correct. Depending upon the environment and available resources any number of different metabolisms may function as viable recon unit.

On the subject of meat... can we eat HA's and other combat orientated constructs?

I also agree.
Both Packmasters (actually what they were originally designed for) and other less needy HAs would be sent out for such operations, though I assume more often than not, Packmasters would be commonly assigned. In the end, I think it depends on the recon and the habitat in question, but I view Packmasters as the most versatile. In some cases however, a Falconer with Black Talons might be more suited than any of these. In other areas, such as the arctic regions you might want something more hardy and less needy (Litho, Parasitic or Swarmlords).

As to cannibalistic Biotech, I know that Wastecrawlers (Scavengers) might have something that sort of does this, but not in the sense of sustenance. With all the toxins, structures and other composition contained in Biotech, I would think that successfully digesting and applying the necessary nutrients from such a complicated composition (mdc armor, fluids, the neural snot, digestive acids if any, the various weapons and their ammo if any and the variances of the metabolism being consumed, etc.) may possibly be detrimental via time to process and or toxic. For example, eating a vampiric or lithivore HA is not likely going to provide much in the way of fats, proteins and nutrients that a carnivore HA might need to fulfill its necessary diet. It would require a metabolism that would be extremely more intense than standard carnivore/omnivore designs and I am not sure there is enough to extract from certain Metabs to support this cannibal. Seriously thinking about it, such a metab would need to be able to successfully consume and break down the same things that a carnivore, omnivore, herbivore, vampire and lithivore do all-in-one. To go through such extremes for a quarry that is likely to be far more difficult to take down upon par, might be a bit of a stretch.

[Premier]

the packmaster is for long range recon but is totally dead meat in a urban location. the Machine will recognize gorehounds from near or far and will kil lthem and target the group for annihilation. Now it's ok for Other Nature Preserves, but that's barely. there are other units better suited for that purpose, and it's because they can move fast, scatter, and stay away for a long period of time.
Assuming all the major cities of the us are either craters or replaced by the machine, that only leaves the northern climates and desert areas and swamp lands for the hunting of meat.

I respectfully disagree with your assessment of Packmasters/Gore hounds being dead meat in the urban locations.

the Machine will recognize gorehounds from near or far and will kil lthem and target the group for annihilation.

1. NEXUS standard technology on most of its robots and drones will be hard pressed to detect, continually tracking and sufficiently targeting Gorehounds in Urban Areas. The Machine may indeed and quite possibly recognize a Gore hound, “if” the Gore Hound(s) is spotted that is. Gore hounds do have exceptional senses, intelligence and prowling abilities (padded feet for silent movement), let alone any additional bio-enhancements. There are many cases currently where wild animals (leopards, cougars, tigers, deer, feral dogs, etc.) are so elusive that even with advanced modern technology, hunters and remote sensors don’t successfully track or detect them, even though empiric signs (feces, kills, nest sites, territorial markings, etc.) reveal that they are out there.

There are plenty of places for Gore hounds & Packmasters to coordinate, hide and move about in an urban environment without being detected. Actually in an urban environment with cement & brick walls, pipes, sewer systems, layers of rubble and numerous buildings to scan, there are far more solid structures in an urban environment than there are in the Preserves to help obstruct & conceal Gorehounds & Packmasters versus giving them away.

Ex: Thermo signatures eventually get lost in dense trees and wilderness, so I can imagine once a Gorehound, “if” detected, quickly slips through some buildings, how easily it will lose machines if it is detected by Thermo. Motion tracking for most standard machines is only 120 feet (36.5 m), so a fleeting Gorehound easily gets out of this range as well. What good is binocular /telescopic vision in such an area where there are so many large and dense places to hide behind, between and through. Gorehounds won’t be running out in the open unless commanded to.

2. Gore Hounds were intentionally designed and honed for this function.

If Spotted by an enemy, the Gorehound knows to either strike (if that was its instruction) or take evasive action and retreat back to its master. Gore hounds were built for speed and evading robot patrols, so escape should be easy (Splicers sourcebook Pg. 117).

They were built for this and this is what they do and excel at (including "deep insertion" per Pg.
117).
Strategically enhancing and customizing a pack of Gorehounds with such enhancements the likes of Seismic Sense, Chameleon skin and upgrading to Stealth fields and equipping with Suction Cups and Gripping Hairs on the paw pads, and you have a pack that can easily navigate urban areas. You don't even need to spend all the Bio -E doing this on each Gorehound of the pack, just the more stealthier unit(s). Its the strength of the entire pack, not each individual that makes it a good pack,w ith each carrying out and performing their specific tasks. This means they are from being "deadmeat" in my book.

Rappanui wrote: Packmasters and their gorehounds require too many things to keep em active. Like Live game. There's no game in the wastelands that fill the land, nature preserves are Alot less common then you'd think.

True there aren’t many Nature Preserves and there are far more game items in the Preserves versus other habitats, however, that doesn’t mean that the other habitats must be barren and absent of wildlife. The original sourcebook clearly indicates:

The persona is able to use the cryo zoos to reintroduce and all wildlife that she sees fit, but any creatures that strays from the designated areas is fair game (so to speak) (Splicers sourcebook: Nature Preserves - Pg. 18).

This a clear indication that the Preserves aren’t going to be the only places that game will be found, or are they designed to detain or confine them.

Gaia is regularly unleashing some of the strangest and most deadly alien species she has in her cryo zoo collection, for the express purpose of keeping humans out of her domain as well as killing humans on general principle. In fact, she finds humans to be loathsome parasites in need of extermination. (Splicers sourcebook 2004, Gaia, Mother Nature - Pg. 26)

This indicates that Gaia is not only reintroducing a nice surplus of various species, she is also purposely releasing species designed to kill and exterminate humans. That gives us a nice array of wildlife (alien predators and prey) that wanders and strays from Preserves and into other habitats. Whether they are killed off, adaptive or transient to other Preserves is all up to that species and the GM. With that being said, it is well-known history that many species of wildlife (especially adaptive invasive species) will successfully meld to all kinds of areas and environments. So I see no reason why Battlefields, Boneyards, Ruined Cities, Wastelands, Highlands, and certainly the Great Ocean, Havens, Sewers & maintenance Lines, Havens, Seedlings and Preserves would not harbor some form of game. That’s 11/15 listed habitats in the book. Not to shabby for wildlife to possibly exist and lurk at all.

Sure some may be scarcer in certain areas and it may be slim pickings on the menu, but the possibilities and feasibility is there. With Gorehounds at your side, this equates to potential game that can be located and tracked, especially by intelligent packhunters the likes of Gorehounds. I have seen how a coordinated pack of hounds, wild dogs, dholes or wolves (Gray or Ehiopian) that can wind (scent) and track large areas to flush or discover quarry and they can cover very large expansions of land in a very short amount of time. Some of these predators can even detect scents that are more than one day old. With Gorehounds this would be even quicker. This is not to mention that Gorehounds and Packmasters would all be well fed before being deployed on a mission. This is in conjunction with Packmasters coming standard with a 2 week supply of rations for one man, and a week for all of the Gorehounds. That is in addition to the full bellies before deployment. So it’s only the long term duration, well after this time frame in the field that food will even become a factor.

[Premier]

Packmasters and their gorehounds require too many things to keep em active. Like Live game. There's no game in the wastelands that fill the land, nature preserves are Alot less common then you'd think.
Assuming all the major cities of the us are either craters or replaced by the machine, that only leaves the northern climates and desert areas and swamp lands for the hunting of meat.

May I ask why you feel there is absolutely “no game in the wastelands”? Just because it’s a harsh and barren land doesn't mean that game absolutely can’t reside or even thrive there. In some of the earth’s most barren habitats currently today, there resides wildlife and even some flora. These things have simply adapted to the harsh climate and conditions, most may be subterranean habitants. So while “nothing grows” in Splicers wastelands, this doesn't mean that the habitat has to be absent and 100% devoid of life.

Example 1: The Arctic Tundra.

It’s the coldest of all biomes. Most noted for is frost-molded barren landscapes, being a treeless plain, extremely low temperatures(below freezing t night), little precipitation, very poor nutrients and short growing seasons. Dead organic material functions as a nutrient pool providing nitrogen and phosphorus that is created by the precipitation.
With all this harsh climate there still exist wildlife. A layer of permanently frozen subsoil called permafrost exists, consisting mostly of gravel and finer material. There are no deep root systems in the vegetation of the arctic tundra, however, there are still a wide variety of plants that are able to resist the cold climate. There are about 1,700 kinds of plants in the arctic and subarctic, and these include:

All of the plants are adapted to sweeping winds and disturbances of the soil. Plants are short and group together to resist the cold temperatures and are protected by the snow during the winter. They can carry out photosynthesis at low temperatures and low light intensities. The growing seasons are short and most plants reproduce by budding and division rather than sexually by flowering.

The fauna in the arctic is also diverse:
• Herbivorous mammals: lemmings, voles, caribou, arctic hares and squirrels
• Carnivorous mammals: arctic foxes, wolves, and polar bears
• Migratory birds: ravens, snow buntings, falcons, loons, ravens, sandpipers, terns, snow birds, and various species of gulls
• Insects: mosquitoes, flies, moths, grasshoppers, blackflies and arctic bumble bees
• Fish: cod, flatfish, salmon, and trout
Animals are adapted to handle long, cold winters and to breed and raise young quickly in the summer. Animals such as mammals and birds also have additional insulation from fat. Many animals hibernate during the winter because food is not abundant. Another alternative is to migrate south in the winter, like birds do. Because of constant immigration and emigration, the population continually oscillates.

Example 2: Death Valley National Park Salt Flat:

The Death Valley NPSF with its great range of elevations and habitats supports a variety of wildlife species, including 51 species of native mammals, 307 species of birds, 36 species of reptiles, three species of amphibians, and five species and one subspecies of native fishes. Small mammals are more numerous than large mammals, such as desert bighorn, coyote, bobcat, mountain lion, and mule deer. Mule deer are present in the pinyon/juniper associations of the Grapevine, Cottonwood, and Panamint Mountains.
Source

Example 3: The Sahara Desert:

The Sahara is the world’s largest hot desert and one of the harshest environments on the planet. It is third largest desert overall after Antarctica and the Arctic, which are cold deserts. The Sahara’s northeasterly winds can reach hurricane level and often give rise to sand storms and dust devils. Half of the Sahara receives less than an inch of rain per year, and the rest receives up to 4 inches (10 centimeters) per year. The infrequent rain is usually torrential.
there is little water or vegetation to sustain life in most part of the Sahara. Some exceptions include the Nile Valley, a few oases, and the northern highlands, where Mediterranean plants such as the olive tree are found to grow. The change occurred in about 1600 B.C., after shifts in the Earth's axis increased temperatures and decreased precipitation.

Camels, most often associated with the Sahara, were introduced to the desert around 200 A.D. Their advantages over the horses they replaced include soft feet that are aligned so that they can move quickly and easily through sand and their ability to go for up to 17 days without food or water.
Rodents, snakes and scorpions thrive in the desert environment. Among the 40-plus species of rodents in the Sahara is the jerboa, related to the mouse, rat and squirrel. To keep cool, the jerboa burrows underneath the desert's sands to more humid soils.
Jackals and several types of hyenas are among the carnivores that roam the Sahara. Weighing less than 3 pounds (1.4 kg), the Mall Fennec Fox is another carnivore that makes its home in tunnels in the sand dunes during the day and comes out at night to prey on the rodents.

In other words, Wildlife is everywhere, even in the harshest climates, so I see no major reason why they wouldn't be or eventually be in urban and wasteland areas. As long as there is food (rather it’s a predator-eat-predator hierarchy or not, its up to the GM), places to hide, then wildlife will be there. Some wildlife may have simply adapted to survive in such harsh climates or may have been purposely engineered to survive such climates so that they can give humans a very hard time. Being that humans have learned to use wastelands as a rally point, I don’t see why Gaia would ignore the opportunity to releasing certain alien predators into these habitats.

This is exactly one of the reasons why I passionately want to release a Splicers: Preserves sourcebook to indicate these factors. I even created a wildlife species to give an example of this game dynamic:

CARNIFEX THYLACO RAT Aka PACK RATS

“They thrive in so many habitats including plague environments like Wastelands, battlefields, ruins, Bone-yards & Sewers, as well as swamps, jungles, highlands, forest and deep subterranean areas. Particular and alarming regions such as outskirt caves & tunnels underneath havens, seedlings and catacombs/ cemeteries potentially exposes Splicers to all kinds of bacteria, chemical waste, radioactivity, micro-agents and various other germs. This means that Carnifex rats will quite commonly expose & spread fatal diseases to human communities. Some packs have been known to unconsciously expose havens to radioactivity and contaminating Splicer water/crop sources. “

If you for some reason(s) don't want wildlife in these harsh climates for your own reasons, then that's fine and I can respect that, but IMHO it is a serious underestimation of how some wildlife can adapt and evolve to harsh conditions, let alone when you have the elements of advanced bio-engineering with the intent to kill (exterminate) humans and you are armed with various alien species DNAs at your disposal. If some modern earth scorpion can withstand and resist doses of radiation that would fry a human...

scorpions have an unusually high resistance to ionising radiation, they were one of the few creatures to survive near ground zero of a nuclear blast. Looking at the "Metals in Cuticular structures, R. Schofield" Scorpion have an unusually high amount of manganese species present throughout their cuticle. This helps in explaining their resistance to ionising radiation as an ability to repair damage to macromolecules through the "marvels of manganese".

... then what the heck could some alien species do and adapt to? Surely a Splicers wasteland. And I am petty sure there would be all kinds of critters scurrying around in urban areas (sewers, abandon buildings, ruins, etc.). Mice and other pests have proven this and where there are pest there are sure to be predators. At least enough to feed Gorehounds. Thus," Looks like meat is back on the menu boys...."

[The Galactus Kid]

well mainly cause of things like anti-living metal, Robot reapers, and Landscape obliterating mega damage weapons, === al lthe birds dead from sitting on formerly safe electric wires, Fish being killed off before they spawn by touching metal waste, from the "cities" ...
seriously, the author did not think these things through when he created the nanoplague. - There would be no living critters outside of preserves as anything within the domain of man is pretty much a dead zone. And that goes for the roaches too - oops, I contacted metal, nanomachines impale my whole body and i die!.

The nano-bots only affect humans, not animals.

[Premier]

well mainly cause of things like anti-living metal, Robot reapers, and Landscape obliterating mega damage weapons, === al lthe birds dead from sitting on formerly safe electric wires, Fish being killed off before they spawn by touching metal waste, from the "cities" ...
seriously, the author did not think these things through when he created the nanoplague. - There would be no living critters outside of preserves as anything within the domain of man is pretty much a dead zone. And that goes for the roaches too - oops, I contacted metal, nanomachines impale my whole body and i die!.

I understand your theory, but I also disagree with its conclusion.

A: Anti-Living Metal –
I think your assessment has either a misinterpretation or a major oversight of the nanobot plague and its reaction speed and sensitivity.

Splicers 2004, Pg. 11 states:
“ In fact, it will react to contact with any mammal – human, ape, dog, cat, hose, rat, etc. – with the same deadly consequences. If a player character has contact with metal or a devise with metal content, the nanobots inside the metal react and attack. How quickly the nanobot plague responds varies with the level of sophistication of the devise. The more advanced the devise is, the faster the plague seizes control and attacks.

On the same page below in the section described ”Length of Time Before the Nanobots React”, it states:

Thus a simple item like a knife, spoon or chunk of metal can take a minute of exposure to human flesh before it is taken over and attacks. On the other hand, hightech gear, like energy weapons, electronics, etc., are taken over and attack in a matter of seconds. This is further demonstrated with the response able Length of Contact Required indicators:
Simple Metal item: 1D4+1 Melee rounds
Complex Metal items: 1D4 Melee rounds
Simple powered items: 1 Melee round.
Complex powered items: 4 to 7 seconds.

This is plenty of time for fast moving animals like birds, mice and fish to take off or bolt before the reaction kills them. For those that don’t escape or come into contact wit complex powered metal items, then they just die, but it’s a far cry from being the end of the species. Animals are released regularly by Gaia, particularly the major prey item types you listed and they reproduce quickly in high numbers and rapidly. Some of them even learn. So the fish you described that brushes along a simple metal waste item while swimming is not automatically dead, quite far from it. It simply takes too long for the required contact to trigger a significant reaction and by the time the reaction kicks in, the fish has already swam off. The same can be likened to a bird on a wire. This is not to mention the skin composition playing role when mentioning insectoids (roaches).
Page 13. States that it may take insectoids prolonged exposure (turn minutes into hours) before the reaction happens. So roaches aren’t dying by bumping into metal objects either.

B: Robot Reapers –
There aren’t many robots or drones in the NEXUS production that are actually seeking out to destroy or hunt wildlife. The ones(Necro borgs) that might opportunistically predate wildlife are few and between via design and even then, If Gaia is concerned then that unit can be turned away from killing any animal she wants to protect, unless that robot is under and the personality influence. Birds, mice, fish, pigs and roaches reproduce abundantly and some do learn how to adapt quite well, literally becoming epidemic and plague like in some cases.

C: Landscape obliterating weapons:
As much warfare (including atomic, high explosives and bombing) that has taken place on earth, there is still many species of animals that thrive in these hostile hot spots, and where talking SDC structured wildlife. Now what happens when that wildlife is actually MDC based as stated:

“These creatures are often Mega-Damage beings with natural attacks and abilities that can harm other Mega-Damage structures.” (Splicers sourcebook - Pg 18)?

[Premier]

well mainly cause of things like anti-living metal, Robot reapers, and Landscape obliterating mega damage weapons, === al lthe birds dead from sitting on formerly safe electric wires, Fish being killed off before they spawn by touching metal waste, from the "cities" ...
seriously, the author did not think these things through when he created the nanoplague. - There would be no living critters outside of preserves as anything within the domain of man is pretty much a dead zone. And that goes for the roaches too - oops, I contacted metal, nanomachines impale my whole body and i die!.

The nano-bots only affect humans, not animals.

Actually they do affect animals as well.
Splicers 2004, Pg. 11 states:

In fact, it will react to contact with any mammal – human, ape, dog, cat, hose, rat, etc. – with the same deadly consequences. If a player character has contact with metal or a devise with metal content, the nanobots inside the metal react and attack. How quickly the nanobot plague responds varies with the level of sophistication of the devise. The more advanced the devise is, the faster the plague seizes control and attacks.

and its not just limited to mammals per
Splicers 2004, Pg 13 states:

Likewise, intelligent beings who are not mammalian or similar organic lifeforms - i.e., silicon/rock or plant/vegetation beings - do not trigger the plague reaction and can use metal devices and salvaged meal weapons and parts. All others, however, including deevils, demons, dragons, Faerie Folk, Lizard Men, Dog Boys, and most other flesh and blood beings will trigger the hostile response of the nanobot plague. Even Xiticix and other Insectoids activate the plague...

So if the nanoplague is not being triggered or attacking some animal that is contacting metal, which would normally elicit a response given enough time, then I would assume it is intentionally being sedated by one of the NEXUS Personalities, with my eyes on Gaia as the protective culprit.

[Premier]

I'm sure splicers can be fixed to remove various vagueries created by Blanket statements meant to kill off pcs from rifts.
Until it does, the setting is unplayable mess. although not as unplayable as Dead reign.

Now this is merely your opinion. Splicers has been successfully played with enjoyable entertainment, details, great story arcs and expansion for years. With just one sourcebook. One Sourcebook that was also nominated for Inquest Gamer Fan Award for Best New RPG of 2004 mind you. An "Unplayable mess" would NOT get that type of nomination nor recognition. I find it ironic that your the one saying Splicers is "vague" with blanket statements and needs to be fixed and is this unplayable mess, but yet it was you that didn't even know & or overlooked crucial details that were comprehensively explained in the beginning portion of the book.

As to purposely killing off Rifts PCs,
Splicers was not meant to be a Rifts book in the first place. That's why its a dead zone for magic and so negative towards psionics. It's a different style of gameplay for a different style of setting. No powers or spells to bail you out, its about wit, survival, horror, and creativity. If the material wasn't designed to be its own setting/stand alone game, then the material in Splicers might as well have been a Rifts expansion book just introducing new biotechnology. Your assumptive statement is really unfounded.

The book contains rules for conversion "if" Rifts gamers wanted to use the material and or setting. This makes the product versatile and opens the doors for those interested in crossovers (just like a Robotech conversion would be). Some games have elected this and are doing quite well with their campaigns, usually exporting Splicers into Rifts Earth and not vice versa.

Let's just get back to the MEAT (punt intended) of this thread shall we...

[The Galactus Kid]

well mainly cause of things like anti-living metal, Robot reapers, and Landscape obliterating mega damage weapons, === al lthe birds dead from sitting on formerly safe electric wires, Fish being killed off before they spawn by touching metal waste, from the "cities" ...
seriously, the author did not think these things through when he created the nanoplague. - There would be no living critters outside of preserves as anything within the domain of man is pretty much a dead zone. And that goes for the roaches too - oops, I contacted metal, nanomachines impale my whole body and i die!.

The nano-bots only affect humans, not animals.

Actually they do affect animals as well.
Splicers 2004, Pg. 11 states:

In fact, it will react to contact with any mammal – human, ape, dog, cat, hose, rat, etc. – with the same deadly consequences. If a player character has contact with metal or a devise with metal content, the nanobots inside the metal react and attack. How quickly the nanobot plague responds varies with the level of sophistication of the devise. The more advanced the devise is, the faster the plague seizes control and attacks.

and its not just limited to mammals per
Splicers 2004, Pg 13 states:

Likewise, intelligent beings who are not mammalian or similar organic lifeforms - i.e., silicon/rock or plant/vegetation beings - do not trigger the plague reaction and can use metal devices and salvaged meal weapons and parts. All others, however, including deevils, demons, dragons, Faerie Folk, Lizard Men, Dog Boys, and most other flesh and blood beings will trigger the hostile response of the nanobot plague. Even Xiticix and other Insectoids activate the plague...

So if the nanoplague is not being triggered or attacking some animal that is contacting metal, which would normally elicit a response given enough time, then I would assume it is intentionally being sedated by one of the NEXUS Personalities, with my eyes on Gaia as the protective culprit.

I stand corrected. i'd have to go back and read that section again. I was sure that I saw it somewhere that it only affected humans. Now, that being said, it leads me to believe that it was an editing erro (like we've seen in other sections in the book) or that my brain broke.

[Premier]

... What Sourcebook. A stack of rifter articles is not a sourcebook. Splicers is a core book. like BTS-2, or Robotech Shadow Chronicles. if somehow Splicers got a sourcebook somehow, and it got discontinued, Lord, tell me now!

I am not going to argue about semantics. Regardless of what you try demean Splicers as, the core book is a well proven, entertaining game. Manuscripts for future sourcebook have been turned in.

It's a fun book, but playing inside a death trap is only fun for sadists.

I disagree with this. Its designed as a survival horror post apocalyptic setting, in which many games, particularly video games and movies are well known for. There is nothing “sadists” about playing in a game that requires one to utilize their wit and employ strategies. The game is more so designed for small platoons (as in player commando teams) to be often utilized employing guerilla warfare tactics. The game also allows you to really enjoy some awesome customization and a new take on technology not seen in many other games. Splicers is more of an exclusive that can pose a challenge than anything else your suggesting. If it is too hard then one can simply play a TJ.

it's a game where sdc is meaningless but is included to show how much mdc critters are needed.

No it’s not, SDC is used to show a comparison and to also validate mortality and is ance reflection on the way most of the world use to be, befoe the NEXUS betrayal. “If” one person is caught outside of their HA, Living Body Armor, etc., then they are extremely vulnerable, and this dynamic can happen. Adventures where a team must go into a Retro village for example might require the team or some of them to expose themselves to this risk. HAs that are nearly destroyed could also create this vulnerability where a player is forced to think and perform outside of is MDC armor. This is a risk and it makes it more exciting. That’s not to mention that when your gaming inside a haven or seedling, you don’t have that MDC armor, so there is plenty of SDC gaming that can be conducted in a more prominent SDC environment. Your interpretations and labels are very misconstrued and sort of sour sounding.

it's melee mechanic of stacking features to add to damage violate most MDC weapon design constraints ( why on earth would a "robot strength" character do more damage with reinforced exoskeleton that didn't translate into more PS? for example, whilel wielding a giant bone blade? ... but in splicers, this is allowed, but in the new games only the greatest mod applies because of wimpy gms wanting to cap everything)...

Again, your saying this in comparison to what... other game lines. Splicers is not designed nor was it suppose do be like other games. In a game where you are easily outnumbered, and have so to be contending with so many factors at times, that type of fighting prowess is so necessary at times. It also comes with its checks and balances. The bigger you are or the more damage your dealing out, then the more of a target you become. This also means the consideration of sustaining a living power house, which is not very easy. Let alone, true physic mechanics of the strength, musculature, alien composition, of a HA or Warmount wielding a giant bone blade is going to do significant damage. The combined elements of strength, momentum and substance of the composition of the attack validate this. The reason why this ideology is not applied in other games, mainly in Rifts ( I’m assuming your hinting at) is because Rifts has so much more going on in it that such constraints might be warranted to preserve overall game balance. When you are talking about all the powers of the supernatural, psionics and magics let alone the array of advanced technology, technowizardy , biomancy, etc., then it can quickly get out of hand. Calling GMs whimpy for wanting to preserve that game balance is a little harsh don’t you think.

without the Outriders the hosts armors are mostly little more then power suits vs Giant machines of war that outgun and run them. It's the Biological horror suit version of Star ship troopers. (the anime version, not the bad no power armor tv version)

OK, First, there is nothing wrong with Biological versions of Power Armor. Splicers Page 9 even states that the Resistance instituted and made power armors. This was before the nanobot plague. Therefore, it is only natural that the Resistance would continue this same line of thinking and design when transferring over to biotechnology. This is extremely valid where the Resistance needs as much power as they can pack into small packages because they can’t commonly walk around in extremely large constructs that would make them far easier to detect and target. The setting is well designed to support this angle of play for HAs.

And its not just HAs versus Giant robots. There are far more robots that are equal in stature or smaller than HAs that would be most likely encountered versus the bigger robots. There is also the factors of Blood feuds and Alien Predators that adds to the is dynamic. HA pilots can’t just focus on fighting machines without considering the necessary ability to fight and defend against rival Splicers and predators. What your implying would be more similar to a karate match with only one dynamic for combat. Splicers HAs are more like MMA fighters that have to be far more diverse to contend with many combat dynamics. So HAs are far more than what your implying.

Now Robert Heinlein’s Starship Troopers (1958) has influenced many popular games, movies and novels with the concept of power armor/suits in a militia.

Books include: Enders Games, Armor, The Forever War, Old man’s War, etc.
Games include: Warhammer40K, Starcraft, Outwars, Tribes, Crysis, Halo, Aliens, etc.
Cinema and Animation include: Aliens, Mobile Suit Gundam, Ironman, Transformers, etc,

With that being said there are some major differences that Splicers Host Armors (HAs) have that make them unique and perfect for this game's setting. Splicers HAs are Living Powered Armors designed with alien influences and are customizable from predatory to Photosynthetic bases as well as sensors, aesthetics and armament. It would be totally by coincidence to bump into an identical HA in the Resistance with as much variables as this game has. Guyver would be more likely an inspiration versus Starship Troopers. And even then, there are major differences once you add the Splicers variations and customizations. There is very little out there that compares to Splicers HAs when one really thinks about it in comparison to standard PAs. This is also not to mention that HAs are but a small faction of the entire Resistance regime and what it has to offer (Living Body Armors, Warmounts, Gorehounds, Biotics, Skinjobs, TJs, Scarecrows, etc.)

So I don’t get why you are trying to demean and deduce this awesome innovative setting that many of us are passionate, knowledgeable on and entertained by. I don’t see nor agree with your unsound gripes about a game that has been successfully played for 9 Years, nominated for a Game of The Year Award and is still growing, has a wonderful developing fanbase and hopefully soon enough, more sourcebooks to boot.

BTW, NOTHING currently being mentioned here has anything to do with the thread’s topic of “meat”. So lets get back on track shall we.

[Blindscout]

Well said, Premier!

[Premier]

Read back to my prior post. Outside of preserve,s there is no meat, because of Vague editing decisions.

And I already addressed this issue with sound empiric reasoning in my previous post near the bottom regarding "meat" outside of the Preserves, with references and I listed sound, scientific references how "Meat" can thrive outside of the Preserves in this previous post.

There is meat outside of the preserves and I have given solid reference that would support this. The "Core" book is 224 pages. How much more could be squeezed into it, when Carmen already stated that so much was edited from it? Your not making reasonable deductions at all. The Preserves deserves a Preserves book to be done with the quality and vastness that the subject entails. That too is in production.

The only thing anyone can do is to add to this publication with new source material for expanding it and that is exactly what Spliceheads have proactively done. There is a boatload of quality homebrew on the forums, there are quality Rifters articles, a Rifter 0 PDF article and a huge manuscript for new sourcebooks with a completed painted cover and majority of the interior artwork already done to boot.

[Premier]

Well said, Premier!

Thank You kindly sir! Man... I can't wait till PB gets those Splicers books processed. So many things that can be answered or expounded upon with those released.

[Blindscout]

Well said, Premier!

Thank You kindly sir! Man... I can't wait till PB gets those Splicers books processed. So many things that can be answered or expounded upon with those released.

Oh Gods, yes. I cannot wait for more!

[Premier]

Well said, Premier!

Thank You kindly sir! Man... I can't wait till PB gets those Splicers books processed. So many things that can be answered or expounded upon with those released.

Oh Gods, yes. I cannot wait for more!

Trust me, with the amount of info that is submitted, and I can't take being buttoned up with info, especially when people are asking for info that I know could help and that we have submitted.

[Premier]

here's another issue i found with the original premise of metal infection... metal in the water.. Lots of places have this or due to polution have it in great amounts (mercury, silver, etc)... Humans who drink unpurified water risk dying from Metal virus killing them. Same with most fauna.

I respectfully disagree that this is problematic for the premise of the setting, versus simply a challenge (in some cases) for any post apocalyptic survival horror setting where contamination is a factor to consider. In nearly any post war setting that utilized nukes, this could be equally a factor to be concerned with as far as contaminates go. it doesn't mean all is hopeless.

Side note: I once discussed something very similar with Kevin regarding Rifts dealing with the possibilities of major plagues. Now I see exactly why PB avoided this type of issue from surfacing into RIFTS. I had mentioned to him that with all the "D-bees" that enter into Rifts Earth, why is it that none of them have introduced any major epidemic diseases, parasites or the likes. Just the transition from one human colony of a continent to another continent on the same planet, catastrophically introduced smallpox and other epidemics that killed thousands. Surely the array of aliens, supernaturals, etc. would have brought fa worse eventually, (if one wants to be keenly realistic). If some Gamers can't handle one nanoplague in Splicers, I clearly see why game preservation sometimes overrules certain aspects of preserving aspects of reality.

Lets start with metals...

"The only exceptions are precious metals, which can be handled by anyone, and our own Technojackers who are not affected by the nanites of the plague for reasons unknown to us." Reference Splicers 2004 - Pg 10.

You listed "silver" and it is considered a precious metal. Thus not a factor.

Pg 10 & 11 define the simplest of metal items, all of which are solid metal objects as a good implication of such items that may trigger the nanobot reaction. There is nothing implying such microscopic fragments would even be warranted a concern. I also highly doubt there are enough metals, especially solid metals in water that one would purposely consume, nor are dense enough in solidified atomic mass to localize and do any damage such as that of the nanobot plague. At the very least, your talking about consuming a pin or nail, paperclip, bullets or shrapnel or a boatload of lead or iron flakes that would have to be inside you to trigger this affect.

This is not to mention that I would take into account that by living in such a harsh world setting that in most cases Splicers would utilize their Warmounts, HAs, biotech purifiers or other Biotech devises to test and purify drinking water supplies, or carry purified water from home. This is not just due to possible metal contamination, but also with radioactive fall-out, biological contaminates, biowarfare tactics, microorganisms and parasites that could be exercised by a rival Great House or introduced accidentally by an alien predator, etc., that one can't afford to be reckless and drink from every availed water source without things and purifying.

As obsessed as Gaia is about her Preserves, I highly doubt she is going to allow or tolerate her precious preserves or creatures to drink from contaminated or harmful water sources, nor would I expect retro villages to have contaminated waters.

BTW, typical pollution in our current Water that is metallic is:

Naturally: heavy metals created from underground rocks containing arsenic, cadmium, chromium, lead, and selenium). Groundwater is located underground and typically requires less treatment than water from lakes, rivers, and streams.

Splicers dwell in underground havens and seedlings far more, so assess to more pure water sources already benefit underground based Splicers. All they have to do is purify it with less treatments.

Human/Machine Activities: heavy metals (mining construction, industrial products and wastes, factories, industrial plants, leaking underground storage tanks, landfills and waste dumps). Lead, a metal found in natural deposits, is commonly used in household plumbing materials and water service lines. However, Lead is rarely found in source water, but enters tap water through corrosion of plumbing materials. Very old and poorly maintained homes may be more likely to have lead pipes, joints, and solder. However, new homes are also at risk: pipes legally considered to be “lead-free” may contain up to eight percent lead. These pipes can leak significant amounts of lead in the water for the first several months after their installation.

Your drinking water comes from surface water or ground water. The water that systems pump and treat from sources open to the atmosphere, such as rivers, lakes, and reservoirs is known as surface water. Water pumped from wells drilled into underground aquifers, geologic formations containing water, is called ground water. The quantity of water produced by a well depends on the nature of the rock, sand, or soil in the aquifer from which the water is drawn. Drinking water wells may be shallow (50 feet or less) or deep (more than 1,000 feet). More water systems have ground water than surface water as a source (approx. 147,000 v. 14,500), but more people drink from a surface water system (195 million v. 101,400). Large-scale water supply systems tend to rely on surface water resources, while smaller water systems tend to use ground water.

Reference

“Heavy metal pollution can arise from many sources but most commonly arises from the purification of metals, e.g., the smelting of copper and the preparation of nuclear fuels. Electroplating is the primary source of chromium and cadmium. Cadmium, lead and zinc are released in tiny particulates as dust from rubber tires on road surfaces; the small size allows these toxic metals to rise on the wind to be inhaled, or transported onto topsoil or edible plants.
Through precipitation of their compounds or by ion exchange into soils and muds, heavy metal pollutants can localize and lay dormant, which can have severe effects on the environment. Unlike organic pollutants, heavy metals do not decay and thus pose a different kind of challenge for remediation. Plants, mushrooms, or microrganisms are occasionally successfully used to remove some heavy metals such as mercury. Plants which exhibit hyper accumulation can be used to remove heavy metals from soils by concentrating them in their bio matter. Some treatment of mining tailings has occurred where the vegetation is then incinerated to recover the heavy metals.

Reference

Iron can be a troublesome chemical in water supplies. Making up at least 5 percent of the earth’s crust, iron is one of the earth’s most plentiful resources. Rainwater as it infiltrates the soil and underlying geologic formations dissolves iron, causing it to seep into aquifers that serve as sources of groundwater for wells. Although present in drinking water, iron is seldom found at concentrations greater than 10 milligrams per liter (mg/L) or 10 parts per million.

***************************************************************************

There is a ton more that can be referenced for this very comprehensive issue, but the reality is this. Water contamination will be as big of an issue as a GM wants to make it. In the grand scheme of things by living in such a dire harsh world, I would think that precautions (testing, purifications, etc.) would be a major factor before drinking from just any ole water source.

Also, with the host armors being made from slugs, bugs, birds, beasts and Plant life, Most of the machine ais will exterminate all those life forms in their territory. Save for Gaia and ishtar, who have diffirent fighting styles. not Even the Terabear microorganism is safe in splicers. ...

NEXUS despises humans & pests, NOT every living creature that inhabits the planet.
Gaia has a VERY STRONG interests (OBSESSION actually) to preserve and protecting these creatures. So I highly doubt she is going to sit idle and let her sisters run amuck and take calculated measures to purposely destroy every living creature that the machine comes into contact with. Sure some creatures and flora might get killed when they exceed the Preserves, that is part of life and natural order (sort of speak). Gaia can chalk that up. But this is also a strong Personality that will sacrifice a legion of robots to stop humans from defiling one of her preserves. That type of obsession is not going to see wildlife go extinct.

Also, who is to say that NEXUS is even aware of and how the Resistance is making and producing HA, Warmounts, etc., according to the book pg 26, Gaia resents the Resistance for holding a knowledge and power that she doesn’t over nature.
So who is to say what NEXUS knows about the Resistance and what resources the Resistance requires via wildlife and flora.

Seriously, Is it just me, but it appears you are fishing for issues to find against this setting, and I don’t get why?

[Premier]

Hey Rappanui,

Maybe I am going about this the wrong way. Please, let me try another approach. Yes, Splicers does have its short comings and issues that may require some tweaking, more comprehensive explaining/expansions, etc. Sure there are things that we would all like to see expanded and developed so we can further enjoy this game's setting. No its not perfect, is basically what I am saying.

However with that being said, what game is ever perfect or even close to being perfect, None. Splicers is and has provided a lot of successful entertaining campaigns and stimulated growth and quality innovations. Splicers is also a very unique setting that that is very hard to find nowadays and it is full of character customization and style of gameplay that is to be expected in a post apocalyptic survival horror setting. Even with its flaws many Gamers have adapted and found this setting to be enjoying and are hungry for more material to enjoy. The fact that it currently only has one '"core" book is Splicers biggest flaw, and it is one flaw that we hope to rectify with what we are all contributing and maturely demanding from Palladiumbooks.

cheers and lets get back to the meat shall we?