Annoying Players?

[PSI-Lence]

i selected 'x-file' since i only had small groups
lucky it has not as often been the issue of them not showing up (mostly game at a friends place and one of the other in the group was a room mate of his) though you can be calling at an hr to go to find out they are not there, can't do it, forgot , or something else

but the ones i hate most are the ones that either use their knowledge of the game that they as a character would not have (a d-bee fresh out of a rift staying away from CS troops), doing something uncharacteristic of their stats (like having an IQ of 6 and not RPing that, or real world electrical skills even though they do not have that skill on their sheet)
and ones that will look at their skill roll they just made, realize it is not good enough and then 'change their mind' about performing the skill

i guess all that would just fall under 'meta gamer'

[Dog_O_War]

And it's still killing as of 2013 at least. 20 people in a Madagascar village.

I was reading about how long it has lasted; it's incredible that with modern-day medicine and communication that it could still exist. But then the only answer I can come up with as to why is that in less modern times, such places simply died out and the plague had no where else to spread, whereas today, a combination of naive doctors and backwards peoples are otherwise allowing it to continue. Remove one or the other from that combination and we wouldn't have the plague.

That's really not why the disease is still around, by your logic there shouldn't be any disease then and yet Polio still hangs around too.

Let me stop you there. "By my logic" is a statement you're not qualified to make, given that I tend only to post the beginning and the end of most of my logical statements, hoping to hell that someone has the right something to fill the gap in-between so that I don't have to explain everything in detail, because frankly, I am bad at doing that.

My logic is that This plague is passed on to people by animals like rats carrying fleas. Rats congregate around humans because we humans are a sloppy bunch who don't know how to clean up after our selves, especially in places like the third world.

So instead of doing what we did in the past when it came to the plague; burn down an entire village (killing vermin and the like while we were at it), we're sending people in to figure out what the problem is and prolonging the life and lives of those infected.

This means that less villages are being contained because supplies are a two-way street; these people need supplies to continue to be treated and to be fed and kept alive. This creates "outs" for the vermin, so while control of a wider-spread problem may be maintained, killing the problem outright is near-impossible when it is allowed to persist.

[Nightmask]

And it's still killing as of 2013 at least. 20 people in a Madagascar village.

I was reading about how long it has lasted; it's incredible that with modern-day medicine and communication that it could still exist. But then the only answer I can come up with as to why is that in less modern times, such places simply died out and the plague had no where else to spread, whereas today, a combination of naive doctors and backwards peoples are otherwise allowing it to continue. Remove one or the other from that combination and we wouldn't have the plague.

That's really not why the disease is still around, by your logic there shouldn't be any disease then and yet Polio still hangs around too.

Let me stop you there. "By my logic" is a statement you're not qualified to make, given that I tend only to post the beginning and the end of most of my logical statements, hoping to hell that someone has the right something to fill the gap in-between so that I don't have to explain everything in detail, because frankly, I am bad at doing that.

My logic is that This plague is passed on to people by animals like rats carrying fleas. Rats congregate around humans because we humans are a sloppy bunch who don't know how to clean up after our selves, especially in places like the third world.

So instead of doing what we did in the past when it came to the plague; burn down an entire village (killing vermin and the like while we were at it), we're sending people in to figure out what the problem is and prolonging the life and lives of those infected.

This means that less villages are being contained because supplies are a two-way street; these people need supplies to continue to be treated and to be fed and kept alive. This creates "outs" for the vermin, so while control of a wider-spread problem may be maintained, killing the problem outright is near-impossible when it is allowed to persist.

Sorry but no, the logic you presented can be applied to any disease or condition, with you further stating it was all about the doctors and people why the disease is still around rather than other conditions (since the disease in question survives on more than just people). If you have other details you're leaving out don't expect the rest of us to be able to read your mind and just know what you're leaving out, we aren't you and leaving things for other people to fill in holes simply is an invitation for confusion and disaster because we aren't likely to go filling in those blanks with the stuff you left out.

[Dog_O_War]

Sorry but no, the logic you presented can be applied to any disease or condition, with you further stating it was all about the doctors and people why the disease is still around rather than other conditions (since the disease in question survives on more than just people). If you have other details you're leaving out don't expect the rest of us to be able to read your mind and just know what you're leaving out, we aren't you and leaving things for other people to fill in holes simply is an invitation for confusion and disaster because we aren't likely to go filling in those blanks with the stuff you left out.

Sorry but yes. It is rather specific to what I was talking about, to another poster who responded with knowledge on the subject.

See, the primary difference between your polio example and my own reasoning regarding the plague is that we've spread polio about the world in order to immunize people from it.

We didn't do that with the Black Plague because that's not a viable solution. So "by my logic", it would make zero sense to compare something like the plague, for which there is not a cure, only treatment, and polio, which we have a cure for.

Basically, if you don't understand something, don't assume; learn and then contribute. That is something that I or anyone shouldn't need to say, but "by your logic", I have to.

[Vrykolas2k]

i selected 'x-file' since i only had small groups
lucky it has not as often been the issue of them not showing up (mostly game at a friends place and one of the other in the group was a room mate of his) though you can be calling at an hr to go to find out they are not there, can't do it, forgot , or something else

but the ones i hate most are the ones that either use their knowledge of the game that they as a character would not have (a d-bee fresh out of a rift staying away from CS troops), doing something uncharacteristic of their stats (like having an IQ of 6 and not RPing that, or real world electrical skills even though they do not have that skill on their sheet)
and ones that will look at their skill roll they just made, realize it is not good enough and then 'change their mind' about performing the skill

i guess all that would just fall under 'meta gamer'

Perhaps the d-bee was afraid of the skull-like visage on the armour?
Then again boldly walking up means the player is making a new character very quickly into the game...

[Nightmask]

Sorry but no, the logic you presented can be applied to any disease or condition, with you further stating it was all about the doctors and people why the disease is still around rather than other conditions (since the disease in question survives on more than just people). If you have other details you're leaving out don't expect the rest of us to be able to read your mind and just know what you're leaving out, we aren't you and leaving things for other people to fill in holes simply is an invitation for confusion and disaster because we aren't likely to go filling in those blanks with the stuff you left out.

Sorry but yes. It is rather specific to what I was talking about, to another poster who responded with knowledge on the subject.

See, the primary difference between your polio example and my own reasoning regarding the plague is that we've spread polio about the world in order to immunize people from it.

We didn't do that with the Black Plague because that's not a viable solution. So "by my logic", it would make zero sense to compare something like the plague, for which there is not a cure, only treatment, and polio, which we have a cure for.

Basically, if you don't understand something, don't assume; learn and then contribute. That is something that I or anyone shouldn't need to say, but "by your logic", I have to.

Getting into the insulting range there, I understood just fine, if you can't see that well that's your problem since again by your own statement you choose to not give complete responses and expect people to 'fill in the blanks' so if you don't like how they fill in those blanks then don't be leaving blanks and expecting other people to do your work for you and then complain when they respond and you don't think the answers fit what you said because you kept most of it in your head instead of actually saying it.

[Dog_O_War]

Getting into the insulting range there, I understood just fine, if you can't see that well that's your problem since again by your own statement you choose to not give complete responses and expect people to 'fill in the blanks' so if you don't like how they fill in those blanks then don't be leaving blanks and expecting other people to do your work for you and then complain when they respond and you don't think the answers fit what you said because you kept most of it in your head instead of actually saying it.

No, you didn't understand. See, the proof is because you posted this:

And it's still killing as of 2013 at least. 20 people in a Madagascar village.

I was reading about how long it has lasted; it's incredible that with modern-day medicine and communication that it could still exist. But then the only answer I can come up with as to why is that in less modern times, such places simply died out and the plague had no where else to spread, whereas today, a combination of naive doctors and backwards peoples are otherwise allowing it to continue. Remove one or the other from that combination and we wouldn't have the plague.

That's really not why the disease is still around, by your logic there shouldn't be any disease then and yet Polio still hangs around too. The disease doesn't appear as often as it used to and tends not to go pandemic as a mutation was introduced into the human genome that depending on if you got one copy or two of it would make you resistant or immune to the plague (it provides the same benefit against AIDS), and a pretty significant number of people have at least one copy of the gene mutation. Such disease resistance provides indirect protection to those without it (since if Joe Bob can't catch it then he can't spread to Billy Sue either).

If you had actually understood, then you would not have posted a "by your logic" response, because it has become abundantly clear that you did not understand my logic, because I had to explain it to you.

[Nightmask]

Getting into the insulting range there, I understood just fine, if you can't see that well that's your problem since again by your own statement you choose to not give complete responses and expect people to 'fill in the blanks' so if you don't like how they fill in those blanks then don't be leaving blanks and expecting other people to do your work for you and then complain when they respond and you don't think the answers fit what you said because you kept most of it in your head instead of actually saying it.

No, you didn't understand. See, the proof is because you posted this:

And it's still killing as of 2013 at least. 20 people in a Madagascar village.

I was reading about how long it has lasted; it's incredible that with modern-day medicine and communication that it could still exist. But then the only answer I can come up with as to why is that in less modern times, such places simply died out and the plague had no where else to spread, whereas today, a combination of naive doctors and backwards peoples are otherwise allowing it to continue. Remove one or the other from that combination and we wouldn't have the plague.

That's really not why the disease is still around, by your logic there shouldn't be any disease then and yet Polio still hangs around too. The disease doesn't appear as often as it used to and tends not to go pandemic as a mutation was introduced into the human genome that depending on if you got one copy or two of it would make you resistant or immune to the plague (it provides the same benefit against AIDS), and a pretty significant number of people have at least one copy of the gene mutation. Such disease resistance provides indirect protection to those without it (since if Joe Bob can't catch it then he can't spread to Billy Sue either).

If you had actually understood, then you would not have posted a "by your logic" response, because it has become abundantly clear that you did not understand my logic, because I had to explain it to you.

One last time, I understood quite fine, if you can't understand that or just want to keep saying otherwise because you want to spend your time with obfuscating posts using 'attack the poster' fallacies instead of actually address the actually points I made (after admitting you deliberately leave stuff out of your posts and expect the readers to somehow just know what you meant) that's your problem. If you can't manage to respond to my actual post there really isn't any point in further responding to you since you'll keep spending your time going after me instead of actually posting anything useful.

[Dog_O_War]

One last time, I understood quite fine,

If you understood, then would you be receptive to answering a question?

Why make a statement such as "by your logic", which you claimed to understand? Considering my logic was that isolation is the only solution to stamp out the presence of a disease for which there is no cure - which you're claiming to have understood. It makes your post nonsensical given that you knew my logic, but your post just isn't considering it and it just doesn't make sense otherwise.

If you can't manage to respond to my actual post there really isn't any point in further responding to you since you'll keep spending your time going after me instead of actually posting anything useful.

You mean this post?

That's really not why the disease is still around, by your logic there shouldn't be any disease then and yet Polio still hangs around too. The disease doesn't appear as often as it used to and tends not to go pandemic as a mutation was introduced into the human genome that depending on if you got one copy or two of it would make you resistant or immune to the plague (it provides the same benefit against AIDS), and a pretty significant number of people have at least one copy of the gene mutation. Such disease resistance provides indirect protection to those without it (since if Joe Bob can't catch it then he can't spread to Billy Sue either).

Well let's see here; addressing your first point - you have stated that you understand quite fine my point that our modern science and intelligence cannot seemingly stamp out a disease spread via carriers due to naive medical practitioners and uneducated peoples because we can't seem to manage a decent quarantine, because people attract the animals which carry the bugs which carry the disease, and they only bring in more people in an attempt to "help" the situation. But you state that this is not why the disease is still around; a statement which would stand stark against my reasoning that we cannot quarantine the situation effectively.

You then state rather contradictory to your understanding of my point that my logic alludes to the quarantine of a disease like Polio, which we both know we humans actively and purposefully spread.

Then you go into a bit of science of why it does not appear as often and tends not to get to pandemic level because of a mutation that was introduced into the human genome, of which I cannot find any evidence of such a thing happening anywhere regarding the black plague, let alone a "significant number of people" that have either copy of this genome which you're claiming also prevents AIDS.

So, given my challenge of your statements, would you mind providing your proof of this "significant number of people" that have an immunity to both the plague and AIDS?

[Vrykolas2k]

Anyway, back to the topic at hand...

[Nightmask]

Anyway, back to the topic at hand...

Yes, it's why I stopped reading the posts and let it dropped, since no meaningful dialogue was occurring.

[Alrik Vas]

I understand the issue with guys like that. BECAUSE I AM ONE...

Though, to be fair, when the GM looks at me and shrugs, saying something like, "Then there must be something else going on, don't you think?"

I go, "aaaahh...." then lose my mind for a little trying to sort it out. Or I just let it go. Either way it doesn't go beyond the first challenge, because that is annoying as hell.

Though there are times when a GM gets corrected and gets mad at a player for being corrected. When i get caught I go. "Oh...whoops!" and make adjustments, because it was my mistake. Or, i give the "Think about that...warlocks can't teleport, but they got here so fast...how would that have happened? Hrm... "

[Vrykolas2k]

I voted the Power Gamer / Munchkin, but the Rules Lawyer would've been my 2nd choice because in my experience they're usually one and the same.

I recently had to kick someone completely out of my game because they would challenge every single call I made, even if it was irrelevent.

For example, in a PFRPG game set in the city of Llorn, a party member set fire to a tavern. About ten minutes later, a team of the city's warlocks showed up to help put out the fire. The player argued: "How did they get there so quick? We're on the far side of the city and they shouldn't have arrived for nearly an hour! They would've had to teleport in and Warlocks can't cast Teleport!" It had no bearing on anything, nor was he the one who started the fire.

Another time, same setting: the party was on a small single-masted merchantman sailing to Lopan. On the way, they encountered the wreckage of another boat with several bodies floating in the water. The party was examining the bodies and discovered it was some NPCs they'd met the day before. The player: "We wouldn't be able to tell who they were. Do you know the corrosive effect of salt water? Plus sharks would've eaten them by now. Also---" Etc, etc.

That was it. I told him to pick up his gear and get the hell out of game. *sigh*

There are bad and good rules-lawyers... that guy is the epitome of bad (although the warlocks thing does have a bit of merit).

[Dog_O_War]

(although the warlocks thing does have a bit of merit).

Interesting. Why do you think so?

I don't think it does; you could've just told the player to "ask the Warlocks themselves" for the answer. The simplest of which was "we were close by dealing with another problem". I mean, I'm assuming these Warlocks aren't the local fire-brigade, just waiting around specifically for fires, and instead have other duties which would take them about town.

And that's just one answer in a sea of plausible answers. Maybe another mage contracted by the Warlocks has built gates around the city for Warlock use, so it wouldn't be advertised that they're there, and the closest gate was around 10 minutes away. etc. etc.

[arouetta]

I voted the Power Gamer / Munchkin, but the Rules Lawyer would've been my 2nd choice because in my experience they're usually one and the same.

I recently had to kick someone completely out of my game because they would challenge every single call I made, even if it was irrelevent.

For example, in a PFRPG game set in the city of Llorn, a party member set fire to a tavern. About ten minutes later, a team of the city's warlocks showed up to help put out the fire. The player argued: "How did they get there so quick? We're on the far side of the city and they shouldn't have arrived for nearly an hour! They would've had to teleport in and Warlocks can't cast Teleport!" It had no bearing on anything, nor was he the one who started the fire.

Another time, same setting: the party was on a small single-masted merchantman sailing to Lopan. On the way, they encountered the wreckage of another boat with several bodies floating in the water. The party was examining the bodies and discovered it was some NPCs they'd met the day before. The player: "We wouldn't be able to tell who they were. Do you know the corrosive effect of salt water? Plus sharks would've eaten them by now. Also---" Etc, etc.

That was it. I told him to pick up his gear and get the hell out of game. *sigh*

There are bad and good rules-lawyers... that guy is the epitome of bad (although the warlocks thing does have a bit of merit).

There are good and there are bad, but bringing up physics shouldn't automatically be a mark of a bad rules-lawyer. If there's a plot point, say "It's my game." If not, have a good time debating the various physics for a few minutes, adjust the setting and move on.

[Vrykolas2k]

(although the warlocks thing does have a bit of merit).

Interesting. Why do you think so?

Because I've been in gaming situations all too often where the "local problem-solvers" just appear in spite of the fact they really have no reason to be there that soon; as well, I've seen players try to do the same thing. It's kind of the same sort of problem a lot of players and GMs have where their characters/ NPCs just "know" who the toughest opponents are, even though the opposing party is all human-like with no obvious tells.

[Alrik Vas]

They guy could have asked, "Did they pop out immediately, or when we started walking down the hall?" If they popped out immediately, why wouldn't he be able to leap back into the elevator?

Of course, the guy sounds like a handful. You're probably better off without him.

And honestly, how is a borg taking an elevator anyway? Guy weighs a ton...

[say652]

Master P. S. I. O. N. I. C. S. Ugh. These guys are such a pain in the butt. You major bad guy. Boom biomanipulation and beat the guy to death. Or you xatch them unarmed psi-sword. Unarmored tk forcefield. Lets burn them pyrokinesis. Haha you cant pilot the alien ship telemechanics. Ugh can nothing stop these buggers!!

[Alrik Vas]

psychics aren't that tough. Hard to ambush them, yeah, but not impossible to hit them while you're out of their range.

[Alrik Vas]

Even so...most people don't need more than 15 seconds to finish you off if you're already in Bio-M range.

[Vrykolas2k]

Master P. S. I. O. N. I. C. S. Ugh. These guys are such a pain in the butt. You major bad guy. Boom biomanipulation and beat the guy to death.

Long ago I had to make a house rule that Biomanipulation's duration is in melee's, not minutes.

How to make psionics even weaker than they already are...

[arouetta]

Master P. S. I. O. N. I. C. S. Ugh. These guys are such a pain in the butt. You major bad guy. Boom biomanipulation and beat the guy to death.

Long ago I had to make a house rule that Biomanipulation's duration is in melee's, not minutes.

How to make psionics even weaker than they already are...

Psionics are neither weak nor over-powered. Like many things, how you use it and your GM's ruling on unclear areas determine its power (like the time my character picked up a 1 lb rock, quoted the section on teleporting it into someone else's pocket, sack, etc, and asked if inside their skull was allowed at that percentage. I was thrown into a situation where I had a knife and 5 enemy mercenaries had grenades, automatic weapons, armor, and a couple of rocket launchers. Eep!).

The biggest gripe I have about psionics are the lousy regeneration rate. If your GM likes to throw situation after situation after situation without proper rest time in between, your pet psychic character is out of ISP pretty fast. He can't pull from ley lines or animal sacrifices or receptacles or other things that help a mage regenerate quickly. In the games that I've played a psychic, the GM was kind enough to bump up the regeneration rate so I could be useful in my primary function, but the fact that it had to either be house-ruled or the GM would have to change his campaign style so that I could have a useful character is sad.

[Vrykolas2k]

Master P. S. I. O. N. I. C. S. Ugh. These guys are such a pain in the butt. You major bad guy. Boom biomanipulation and beat the guy to death.

Long ago I had to make a house rule that Biomanipulation's duration is in melee's, not minutes.

How to make psionics even weaker than they already are...

Biomanipulation is outrageous, though. Duration: 4D4 minutes? That's 16-64 melee rounds. Might as well crack open Dragons and Gods and add it to the Deific powers.

Yes, however you're also going to have to look at how easy a lot of subjects are going to resist the effects (see, Saving Throws); and the fact that the penalties it causes aren't that overwhelming.

[Jerell]

I do not like the loner. At all. The loner would be better suited to getting a solo game by himself or herself somewhere. This person can slow up the whole game for everyone if the GM isn't experienced with that type, and even then it can be a real pain.

I don't mind a hack and slasher now and then, I can deal with that.

Never had to deal with a stinky slob, thank the Emperor.

Maybe I'm lucky, but I think most of my players tend to be well rounded. They do show up late now and then, but eh, if that's the only complaint one could have, I'd say that's not bad at all. And when they do come late, they'll usually bring food or snacks for all, so maybe's that's fine anyway.

[Chronicle]

Meeeeeeee im the most annoying player. I eat with my mouth open, I fart till the room clears, my character shops for 3 irl hours, and I try to apply real life physics and attempt moves that makes the gm cringe.(none of this is true)