Need some help explaining TK to a player

[Cardiac]

Here are his questions-
1) When I want to move something, do I have to roll for "strike" to
capture it or is that automatic? I would assume that it is automatic.

If it is an inanimate object - no. If it is moving or being used by someone - like a living being or a hand-held weapon, then I may require a strike roll for the PSI to get a "good grip."

2) Can I move liquids? How much? Can I make liquid forms/shapes/etc.
Like make a bird out of water, since if I can lift the water, I can
sculpt the bird. Can I then make it animated also? (Make the liquid
bird "fly").

Not with Telekinsis. For those abilities see the Hydrokinesis power (basically a speciallized offshoot of the TK power)

3) Can I animate singular objects? (solve a rubics cube, make a doll
dance with different limb movements simultaneously, animate a rope to
tie someone up with knots and all or make it slither like a snake, etc.) How complex of animations can I do?

I would say yes - but the more intricate the motion - the more concentration it takes. Something like threading a needle, tying a knot, or animating a mannequin might take the character's full concentration (at least for a second or two or for however long he wants to maintain the effect) while just making a rope wrap around someone should't be too difficult.

4) Can I move human body parts against people's wills? (make someone
punch someone else). Lift people up, spin them around, make them crash
into others, bind their hands, make them float and dance in mid-air,
etc.

5) How strong are my kinetics against physical exertions? Say if I was
lifting something and someone else caught it and tried to pull. Who
would win out? Or if I was trying to force someone's limbs to do
something, who would win? How much strength would they need to have,
etc. Along with this, say I wanted to bend an iron bar or break
something. Would the pressure measured in pounds be the same as the
lifting ability? Same ISP usage?

This is where the Palladium TK power breaks down - "How does TK stack up/interact with someone's natural strength?"

Go with the Baron's advice - the number of "joints" on the body you wish to use equals the number of simultaneous objects you have to manipulate. You could probably get away with swinging someone's arm by just the shoulder joint, but depending on the position of the forearm it might not reach.

However, the person being manipulated, puched against, etc, still gets to "fight back." You're going to have to figure out how much weight the TK can currently lift and use that to figure out the equivalent PS. The more ISP spent - the stronger it is.

Now, as for picking someone up and flinging them around, you would probably have to roll a strike to "grab/grapple the character", but unless there is something for him to hang on to (and he doesn't dodge), it would by easy for you to pick him up (as long as the TK is strong enough). I would let the trapped person to roll to "break free" however (as often as e can with a normal grapple/hold).

6) Can I move lumps of fine objects ( a handful of salt, sand, small
rocks, etc. )

7) Can I move air? Or a billow of smoke?

As far as I know, no. With TK manipulate single objects up to your maximum limit (1 poer level with TK super I think)? Maybe if there were powers called "Aerokinesis" or "Terrakinesis" - specialized torms of TK like Pyro and Hydrokinesis.

Actually, come to think of it - there IS a power in Rifts Psyscape (not sure if its in Powers Unlimited 1) - Telekinetic Acceleration Attack - where you grab little bits of loose debris/objects in the surrounding area and fling them at a target at high speed.

8 ) I'm assuming that I exert ISP only when capturing an object with my
mind. Once "animated" I no longer exert ISP to fling it where I wish.
Is this correct?

Once you spend ISP, you can manipulate objects at that level of "strength" up to the duration, or until you pump more ISP in to make it stronger.

9) How fast can I make an object go? Acceleration speed?

Hmmm.....don't know. I think I saw something like (MEx2)=Mph or something like that in a FAQ somewhere. Not sure.

10) Can I make a object fly and spin at the same time?

Sure, why not - just like throwing a football.

11) Can I control something in mid-movement? (Catch a bird in the sky). Do I have to roll a strike for that? Is that dependant upon the
speed of the object?

Sure - depending on the speed. You probably wouldn't be able to catch a bullet or an arrow (but you may be able to raise a TK Force Field to block/parry it), you might be able to catch a thrown weapon or a flying bird however. Yes, I'd rule that you have to roll for a strike to catch/grab it.

[Cardiac]

2) Can I move liquids? How much? Can I make liquid forms/shapes/etc.
Like make a bird out of water, since if I can lift the water, I can
sculpt the bird. Can I then make it animated also? (Make the liquid
bird "fly").

Not with Telekinsis. For those abilities see the Hydrokinesis power (basically a speciallized offshoot of the TK power)

Ah you are correct but one of his other powers was TK Force Field (Super) which would allow for a force field to sculpt the water and then I am under the impression that he would then spend ISP to hurling the new object (the TK Force field shaped like bird filled with water). He would then be exerting the ISP for the TK Force Field and basic TK? right?

Well, since you put it that way - I suppose so - but it is going to be WAYYY more expensive ISP-wise. Hydrokinesis will give you more bang for your buck.

4) Can I move human body parts against people's wills? (make someone
punch someone else). Lift people up, spin them around, make them crash
into others, bind their hands, make them float and dance in mid-air,
etc.

5) How strong are my kinetics against physical exertions? Say if I was
lifting something and someone else caught it and tried to pull. Who
would win out? Or if I was trying to force someone's limbs to do
something, who would win? How much strength would they need to have,
etc. Along with this, say I wanted to bend an iron bar or break
something. Would the pressure measured in pounds be the same as the
lifting ability? Same ISP usage?

This is where the Palladium TK power breaks down - "How does TK stack up/interact with someone's natural strength?"

Go with the Baron's advice - the number of "joints" on the body you wish to use equals the number of simultaneous objects you have to manipulate. You could probably get away with swinging someone's arm by just the shoulder joint, but depending on the position of the forearm it might not reach.

I found the in the description of a TK Push (Physical Power) that it describes it as having a PS of 16 +1 per level so I was operating under the speculation that if he wanted to say grab an evil-guy's arm that has a gun pointed at an innocent to have the arm point towards a hired thug...he would first have to spend the ISP for the TK then roll a strike to "grab it" then it would be a contest of PS checks to see if the evil guy was able to resist the TK pull of his arm in the direction that he did not want it to go. Does that sound logical?

Well, the PS stat for TK Push should only apply to that one power. TK push is not force specifically applied to a single target - it is more like an unfocused wave.

The TK PS should be calculated from your current max weight limit wih your TK power. Say you spend enough ISP to carry 500 lbs - that's equal to a PS of around 25. Use that for most TK "contests of strength."

6) Can I move lumps of fine objects ( a handful of salt, sand, small
rocks, etc. )

7) Can I move air? Or a billow of smoke?

As far as I know, no. With TK manipulate single objects up to your maximum limit (1 poer level with TK super I think)? Maybe if there were powers called "Aerokinesis" or "Terrakinesis" - specialized torms of TK like Pyro and Hydrokinesis.

Again I agree with you that the basic TK (Physical Power) and TK (Super Psionic Power) would have a difficult in doing either throw a lump of fine objects or moving air, but coupled together with his other psionic powers of TK Force Field (Super Psionic Power) and TK Push (Physical Psionic Power) that he would be able to do some of what he is asking about. Exerting the ISP for half of a force field and then ISP to hurl it at someone would handle the lump of fine objects. Meanwhile if he where to either encase a force field around the billow of smoke (TK Force Field is listed in the description as air tight) would be able to move the air, or by just taking an object that could "fan" the air, to move air away. Thoughts?

I guess you could - but like I said earlier - it's going to be expensive.

[Zenvis]

Here are his questions-
1) When I want to move something, do I have to roll for "strike" to
capture it or is that automatic? I would assume that it is automatic.

Automatic unless he is trying to hit something.

2) Can I move liquids? How much? Can I make liquid forms/shapes/etc.
Like make a bird out of water, since if I can lift the water, I can
sculpt the bird. Can I then make it animated also? (Make the liquid
bird "fly").

In a jar sure but otherwise notwithout hydrokinesis

3) Can I animate singular objects? (solve a rubics cube, make a doll
dance with different limb movements simultaneously, animate a rope to
tie someone up with knots and all or make it slither like a snake, etc.) How complex of animations can I do?

No, but that could be a new power; Kinetic Manipulation.

4) Can I move human body parts against people's wills? (make someone
punch someone else). Lift people up, spin them around, make them crash
into others, bind their hands, make them float and dance in mid-air,
etc.

I would say yes but the P.S. of psionics hasn't been determined as far as I'm aware.

5) How strong are my kinetics against physical exertions? Say if I was
lifting something and someone else caught it and tried to pull. Who
would win out? Or if I was trying to force someone's limbs to do
something, who would win? How much strength would they need to have,
etc. Along with this, say I wanted to bend an iron bar or break
something. Would the pressure measured in pounds be the same as the
lifting ability? Same ISP usage?

Again look at previous statement.

6) Can I move lumps of fine objects ( a handful of salt, sand, small
rocks, etc. )

Refer to the liquid statement.

7) Can I move air? Or a billow of smoke?

Refer to the liquid statement.

8 ) I'm assuming that I exert ISP only when capturing an object with my
mind. Once "animated" I no longer exert ISP to fling it where I wish.
Is this correct?

I'm not sure I understand the nature of the question.

9) How fast can I make an object go? Acceleration speed?

As with strength, they haven't determined exactly how fast or slow an object can be hurled exactly.

10) Can I make a object fly and spin at the same time?

Im not sure, I'd say no.

11) Can I control something in mid-movement? (Catch a bird in the sky). Do I have to roll a strike for that? Is that dependant upon the speed of the object?

You bet cha...

Thanks in advance.

I hope that answers some of your questions.

[Iczer]

9) How fast can I make an object go? Acceleration speed?

Hmmm.....don't know. I think I saw something like (MEx2)=Mph or something like that in a FAQ somewhere. Not sure.

Ok. AS weapons weilded by TK do damage as normal weapons, we can assume it's the equivilant of normal human strength ranges (8-14 PS) More ISP equals more weight lifted, not the same weight lifted with more force, so we can assume that objects weilded with TK move the equivilant speed of a normal man throwing, say, a baseball. I guess thats between 60-80MPH. If we used the MEx2 = MPH check, aour average telekinetic would be moving objects at around 20 MPH. I don't see a 20MPH baseball hurting anyone.

11) Can I control something in mid-movement? (Catch a bird in the sky). Do I have to roll a strike for that? Is that dependant upon the
speed of the object?

Sure - depending on the speed. You probably wouldn't be able to catch a bullet or an arrow (but you may be able to raise a TK Force Field to block/parry it), you might be able to catch a thrown weapon or a flying bird however. Yes, I'd rule that you have to roll for a strike to catch/grab it.

Or maybe a parry. Since that is what you would use anyway.


Batts

[Iczer]

I see TK in a fair few of my HU Games, and almost every session I play Psychics Unlimited. I have developed a list of rules and limitations that define TK. It makes it less apparently useful, but keeps possible abuses out of it.

1) TK is not force in and of itself. While even immense weights can be moved with a dedicated 'teeker, TK is not an invisible attack, and can neither crush nor hurt a target. (This does not include lifting a target and then dropping them from a height.

2) TK applies Motion, not speed. As the only option for increasing damage of TK attacks depends on increasing the mass of a hurled objects, it stands to reason that a 300Lb and a 30Lb object, move at near identical speeds when moved with TK. TK moves things at an even 60-80MPH. (Or so. it's a rough guide)

3) TK cannot apply more pressure than is being used to hold it. essentially this prevents characters from undoing bolts from the sides of objects with TK. Those bolts are in pretty tight, and much more force is required above the 1 ISP required to lift a single bolt.

4) With a nod to rule 3, A human being is a complex work of complex muscles and solid bones and ligamanents. If he resists a movement, then it's beyond the capacity of a character to force him to be marionetted with TK. The key here is resistence of course. It's unlikely you will be able to snatch a gun out of a persons hand (Well done, you can lift the gun. Obviously the person who is holiding the gun up in the first place has a much better grip on the darn thing though) but if he's resisting the pull, he can no longer claim to be making an 'Aimed' shot.

5) picking people up. This is sort of a GM call. I typically allow a saving throw. Psionic saves seem a bit silly for this kind of thing though (I will myself to the floor again). Once you have a person in the air (and without super TK you arn't moving him far anyway) you don't actually stop him from pulling a gun and shooting you.

6) Other defences. Most people can swing a baseball bat as fast as TK can. IT seems reasonable to say that items held with TK are sufficiently slow enough to be countered with an autoparry instead of requiring a dodge roll.

7) Miscellaneous limitations. Needless to say, TK has no feedback, so you cannot feel what you are touching, and you need to see what you are doing to do it with TK. (a common tactic in Psychics unlimited is to employ a smoke grenade. Players lives have depended on blinding a guy in someway before a PC is hurled over a ledge) Objects in motion continue as per physics when control is lost. You cannot use TK to pull an item out a person's pocket (it's out of sight). The one item at a time rule makes using TK on water, sand or other particlised items useless.

These are just houserules. Most TK I see is the lesser power. It is extremely versitile and allows a lot of neat tricks, but it sould not be a way to do darn near everything, especially in a single lesser (or super) power.

Batts

[Uncle Servo]

Heres my problem with TK. I play in a group with another player that loves TK. And his favorite thing to do is pick someone up and spin them like a top. Or if they have a helmet, grab it and try to snap their neck.

Example. I was playing a Battle Magus (180 lbs) and he had a Zapper with Super TK. we got into a fight and he picked me up and spun me all arround. couldn't shoot or cast a spell. I was dead with something like 30 ISP spent. No chance whatso ever. And he pointed out other things he could have done that i'd have no save aginst. Like collapsing a lung or pulling an eye out. Nothing can be done aginst this.

What do you guys suggest?

I suggest laying a 2x4 to this player's head... Juuuuuuuust kidding.

My first instinct is to say your Battle Magus got hosed by someone (player, GM, or both) who takes a few 'unrealistic' liberties with the TK power. Had this Zapper's player started claiming all these 'kewl' things he could do without so much as a save roll in my game I as a GM would put the brakes on it quickly and firmly.

First of all, collapsing a lung IMO is impossible for two reasons: one, because it's not within the Zapper's line of sight (unless the lung is outside of the body), and two, because nowhere in either the TK or TK Super power descriptions does it mention being able to inflict crushing damage. I would also rule against plucking an eye out as the vast majority of the eyball itself is not visible. At the most generous I would have him make a strike roll at some severe penalties to see if he can 'get a grip' on it.

While I would allow a TK player to 'grab' someone and maybe move them around to the point of distraction (and without a save roll), I would also rule that the Zapper in this case couldn't do anything other than pick you up and move you around (takes up all his concentration). On the other hand, you should have had the opportunity to take a shot at him -- it'd be shooting wild, granted (though I might mitigate the penalties somewhat as a Battle Magus should be better with a gun than most folks), but there's always the chance of a lucky shot.

Now, as for the 'grabbing the helmet and snapping the neck' trick... the question is does the TK provide enough sudden force to do it? TK Super maybe, but I'd probably make him roll to strike (heads tend to move around a lot) and then give the intended victim roll a D20 and throw in any PE bonuses -- if that roll meets or beats the Zapper's strike roll, then the victim doesn't get his neck snapped. Of course, if the roll fails... hello mister rag doll.

[Uncle Servo]

Notes on Telekinesis - Physical Psionic
The psychic essentially has the equivalent of an invisible tractor beam. The beam can only exert force in one direction at a time (vertical, horizontal, angular, even curved). The "tractor beam" can be of any thickness, and requires a direct line of sight.

Super Telekinesis - Super Psionic
This psychic can "split" the symbolic tractor beam into many (one per level). In the case of manipulating objects (like a rubic cube), think of each beam as a tentacle. If solving a rubix cube, one "beam/tentacle" holds the cube aloft while another applies force to a corner, rotating that portion of the cube. Only one complete item can be manipulated per "beam", so only single smoke particles or water particles can be moved. Thus if a psychic were to (theoretically) get to level 643 728 546 258 934 658, then they could probably move a good portion of water or smoke. However, a first level telekinetic can manipulate a bowl to scoop up the water, or a fan to blow away the smoke, even with the minor psionic power.

Any object that is connected to an intelligence (such as a person's limb, a cyborg's limb, an advanced robot's appendage etc.) can not be manipulated. The object being moved has to be unconnected to any mind which is susceptable to telepathy, empathy or other mind-to-mind psionics.

However, a telekinetic can fly by using telekinesis oh his/her belt or shoes, or strangle someone with their own necklace, or swing at someone with the gloves on a victim's hands. The only way to be safe from a telekinetic's influence is to be naked in a room where every object weighs more than the telekinetic can move.

This is good... where'd you get it?

[Uncle Servo]

Hmph. Nicely done then. I like the 'tractor beam' analogy.

[Levi]

Below is my 2 cents on how TK works. Take from it what you will...

Many players and GMs feel that telekinesis applies force to an object to move it. However, what telekinesis actually does is induce kinetic energy in an object through some form of physical telepathy and sheer force of will. Kinetic energy is the energy of an object in motion. An object can gain kinetic energy naturally by being acted on by gravity, or some other force pushing or pulling it. Telekinesis can “charge” an object with kinetic energy causing motion. This is not a force that pushes or pulls the object. Nor is telekinesis a force that can crush something.