Manufacturer of JA laser rifles

[pad300]

A question: Is there any mention (in any book) of who/where the JA (-9, -11 in the main book. I personally ignore the JA-12 in Mercenaries) series of energy rifles is manufactured? Are they all pre-rifts relics? Are they knock offs made by everyone (and if so, why are just about all the "modern" designs inferior)?

[glitterboy2098]

according to the GMG:
"The following weapons and equipment are either produced by such a wide variety of manufacturers that no one can claim ownership over any of these devices, or they are pre-Rifts artifacts locally reproduced (like the Juicer specialty rifles)."

so basically the JA series is pre-rifts, but you have a number of companies producing them post-rifts copied from pre-rifts examples or plans.

[kaid]

I believe like a lot of the oldschool stuff probably a lot of manufacturers making knock off versions of these. NG makes a bunch of this kind of orphaned tech as does bandito arms/black market sources.

[dreicunan]

A question: Is there any mention (in any book) of who/where the JA (-9, -11 in the main book. I personally ignore the JA-12 in Mercenaries) series of energy rifles is manufactured? Are they all pre-rifts relics? Are they knock offs made by everyone (and if so, why are just about all the "modern" designs inferior)?

The reasons the modern designs are inferior is basically because the writers often didn't think about issues like that, though one can justify it by saying that in many places they know enough to follow the pre-rifts plans but not enough to tweak them and still have it work. R&D can be expensive and time-consuming. The CS had plans for NEMA weapons,for ages and dedicated R&D, and look how long it took them to even equal let alone surpass the originals.

[RockJock]

The JA-12(I'm assuming you mean the one in WB-10, not Mercs) can be kinda ignored. The description says it is basically a new "recreation" of a Pre-Rifts model. That lets you off the hook if you are going with the 9 and 11 models being built by everyone. Now, if you go with the JA-12 is being built by all the same groups as the other model you have the issue of the JA-12 becoming THE standard gun for PA and lots and lots of troops.

[Shark_Force]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

otherwise, you can probably equip 2 soldiers for every soldier you equip with a JA-12, and in general the 2 soldiers will be more powerful.

[eliakon]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

otherwise, you can probably equip 2 soldiers for every soldier you equip with a JA-12, and in general the 2 soldiers will be more powerful.

We also don't know if it is being produced in truly massive numbers.
It is very likely like cars.
Just because Rolls Royces and Lamborghinis exist and have price tags doesn't mean that you can equip entire fleets with them... even if you have the money needed, there simply aren't enough units.

[Axelmania]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

Yet the rifle is a lot cheaper than a SAMAS and they dno't mind spending on that.

[Shark_Force]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

Yet the rifle is a lot cheaper than a SAMAS and they dno't mind spending on that.

sure. they *have* expensive stuff for when they need the biggest force multiplier. but they don't issue it to everyone.

now, of course, this brings up questions like "why does the CS even *have* 3.2 million SAMAS if they're not going to issue them", and honestly, i don't have a good answer for that. but i can tell you that they're not looking for the discount option for when they need to make the most out of individual troops, and the JA-12 doesn't come with exceptional mobility, vastly superior protection, an integrated sensor suite, and a system that somehow or other makes the wearer able to do more things per unit time than they could do outside of the suit (provided they're trained properly).

now, i wouldn't be at all surprised if at least a few CS soldiers had JA-12s issued to them (or a CS equivalent which is a JA-12 that has random skulls welded onto it and a black paint job). in an army that size, i'm sure they occasionally come across a scenario where the JA-12 is the perfect fit. the rest of the time, send a SAMAS instead. or one of their other power armour or robot vehicle options.

(on a side note, regarding that comparison with cars: much like the JA-12, if there was high demand, i expect supply would increase accordingly. if 50 million people had the money to buy the high end lamborghinis and rolls royces, those companies would be making enough cars to sell to at least most of them. they make small numbers of cars because they have a small number of customers, not the other way round).

[Sureshot]

At this point with Triax, Northern Gun and other such manufacturers mass producing newer tech. Unless a pre-Rifts item requires something special to function assume it is mass produced. It is one of the reasons they upgraded what the Vagabond received in terms starting equipment. If nations on Rifts Earth are producing newer tech. The long lost art of soap and candy making is no longer lost.

[kaid]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

Yet the rifle is a lot cheaper than a SAMAS and they dno't mind spending on that.

Overall power armor+ its weapon systems is a lot more overall useful than one above average rifle. I imagine some of their special foces/commandos probably can and do use weapons of choice like this.

[kaid]

the JA-12 is most certainly going to be the weapon of choice for anyone that can't afford more soldiers but can afford to spend a lot of money per soldier. that doesn't describe too many places... even the CS, which apparently has nigh-infinite resources, prefers to just use that to equip their nigh-endless supply of soldiers.

Yet the rifle is a lot cheaper than a SAMAS and they dno't mind spending on that.

sure. they *have* expensive stuff for when they need the biggest force multiplier. but they don't issue it to everyone.

now, of course, this brings up questions like "why does the CS even *have* 3.2 million SAMAS if they're not going to issue them", and honestly, i don't have a good answer for that. but i can tell you that they're not looking for the discount option for when they need to make the most out of individual troops, and the JA-12 doesn't come with exceptional mobility, vastly superior protection, an integrated sensor suite, and a system that somehow or other makes the wearer able to do more things per unit time than they could do outside of the suit (provided they're trained properly).

now, i wouldn't be at all surprised if at least a few CS soldiers had JA-12s issued to them (or a CS equivalent which is a JA-12 that has random skulls welded onto it and a black paint job). in an army that size, i'm sure they occasionally come across a scenario where the JA-12 is the perfect fit. the rest of the time, send a SAMAS instead. or one of their other power armour or robot vehicle options.

(on a side note, regarding that comparison with cars: much like the JA-12, if there was high demand, i expect supply would increase accordingly. if 50 million people had the money to buy the high end lamborghinis and rolls royces, those companies would be making enough cars to sell to at least most of them. they make small numbers of cars because they have a small number of customers, not the other way round).

Given the threat environment and the overall durability of power armor it is very possible that the pilot survives their armor or can limp their heavily battle damaged unit back to their base/camp. You make more armor than you need for the same reason you make more weapons and equipment than you have troops. Battlefield attrition that stuff is going to get busted up/broken/lost. Sure you may be able to fix the armor up to good as new but it is faster to ship in some new armor and then ship back the broken ones to work on back at base than to try to field repair something that is past a certain level of damage.

[glitterboy2098]

plus we don't know the condition of that extra armor. it could well be largely stuff that has been damaged or downchecked due to system problems which is waiting to be recycled and repaired.

[RockJock]

The JA-12 is a great weapon at 50k, especially for for use with power armor, or as a heavier infantry rifle. The only large weakness is against laser reflective armor, with the grenades giving some minor fire even against impervious to energy. If you are going against the CS it beats most 100lbs+ railguns.

In WB33 alone NG has half a dozen energy weapons in the 50k+ price bracket. They are generally meant to be "heavy" weapons, or sniper rifles, but in the firepower/price range of a JA-12.

As an example take a look at the NG-E12. 80k price, a heavy shot matching the JA's pulse, but with half the range of the JA-12. You do get the advantages plasma has in situations over lasers and the grenade launcher. The disadvantage side for the E-12 includes a lot more weight, less shots, and no grenade launcher, all for a higher price.

I'm not saying the JA-12 is for everyone in all situations, but if you are looking for a rifle for PA/exoskeletons, fireteams, or just a better gun for foot soldier it works well. At 50k it is an expensive weapon, but in the range of many WIlks, Triax, and even NG weapons of similar capabilities. Assuming you make their manufacturing similar the other JA rifles. That is why I suggested putting the JA-12 in a separate bucket.