Roll to strike for robots/mecha

[Hav0k]

With all the different rules in the books and all different interpretations everyone has about this (4, 8, 10 or 12 to strike with ranged weapons, depending on the situation, -3 or -6 modifier to moving targets, etc), I forgot to ask...

All this also apply when robots/mecha combat?

I am no talking about a Juicer firing at a robot, I mean combat between big giant robots (UAR-1, spider-skull, Titan series, etc...)


The "clarification" rules appearing on GMG, Conversion book and such are not clear about this.

I think the original intent was to use the same rules for both types of combat (personal and robot/mecha). I started to wonder when the "8 to strike at long range" appeared in conversion book, since for robots, vehicles and big mecha 60m is not really "long range".

Then the -10 rule and the new 12 to strike appeared, but it was always mentioned in personal/modern weapons combat (and it can be extrapolated to Power armors too, since this is basically personal combat with more armor and MDC...).

But what about robots and vehicles? They are not able to dodge either? They are moving almost all the time, so what about the modifiers and "to strike" target numbers?

[Hav0k]

I think I may have found what you're looking for, see page 32-44 of the Rifts Game Masters Guide Book. Kevin Simbedia answers all dodge autododge and parry questions as well as addressing the highly contested "instantaneous strike" rule! (i'm gonna post this as a reply to your other thread on bonuses)

Yes Broken, that is exactly one of the source I have used and read several times, trying to figure this out without success...

1. the "12 to strike" is NOT on Rifts books that I have. I saw it in Rifts Chaos Earth, and I have been told that it seemed like "copy&paste" from the NEW Revised Rifts Conversion book, which I don't have. The original Conversion book does not mention this, that is why I am confused. I would like to have a confirmation about this.

2. Besides this, GMG is very clear about everything else EXCEPT for my question about all these rules (particularly the "Ranged Combat Revised", p38) applying to big robots/vehicles and such....
Why am I confused? Because Rifts Main Book and others (for example Robotech, Sentinels, Macross II) used to have 2 very distinctive sections: Personal combat AND high-tech machines (or robots, or mechas or such, where you also got the answer to missile firing, adding attacks, etc..). These 2 sections do not appear on later books so clearly...

Another thread suggested that it does not appear because "ranged" means ANY type (vehicle, personal guns or rifles, robots, PA, etc..). This makes sense.... but it would be good to have a PB confirmation about this....

[Hav0k]

Its in the GM Guide Book where Kevin lays down the rules as he says: "once and for all to set it straight" but then he goes on to list 2 different systems you can use one is the quick and dirty where you mostly just do unmodified dice rolls for everything. And the other is the original complicated military based one which I personally think makes a lot of sense, but I just took what Kevin said in "Ranged Combat Rules Revisited" as a license to choose.

Right.... basically I have concluded that Kevin just puts everything he believes might work, and it is up to you to finally decide what to use.

Under the section of Ranged Combat Revisited Kevin makes mention that its the computerized targeting system of *most* power armor that makes it a 5,8,10 for them to hit targets... I believe its 5,8,12 for normal OCCs standing on their own 2 feet holding a rifle... *Most* power armor computers get that +2 bonus to hit moving targets from their targeting computers, [book said something about using sophisticated computer algorithms to predict the targets flight path and put a targeting crosshair on the HUD ahead of the target this makes adjustments for the railgun slug's speed.]

Thanks.. this makes sense....

Yeah dude Ranged combat rules apply to robots&powerarmor with the (+2) targeting computer modifier assuming you're going by the hardcore original military rules kevin setup and not using the new quick&dirty rules he invented.

Thanks! this also clears things up...

Just curious... you refer to 2 types of rules: "hardcore original military" and "quick&dirty".... Can you define each, please?

[Hav0k]

Its several pages of Kevin Simbedia's "Ranged Combat Revisited" section in the Rifts® Game Master Guide™ pages 32-43 in my edition anyway. He talks about how to do the Quick&Dirty dice rolls for everything so the combat is quicker and faster and the game moves along better. Basically it amounts to this for Quick&Dirty rules you don't use any modifiers at all, you just both shoot dice at eaeach othernd whoever's higher wins. I don't really like quick and dirty rules, they're lame and don't take into account a lot of the obvious advantages and disadvantages of OCCs.

Now I am starting to get all this.... Thank you for your patience, Broken

And yes, I agree with you. I prefer the original military rules, they have a lot of details that can be exploited and used.