Glitterboy Vs X

[Adam of the Old Kingdom]

Come witness the power of the Glitterboy, but is it a powerfull as it seems?


the Paper bag is MDC.

[RoadWarriorFWaNK]

anybody with a vibro-knife and half a brain can destroy a glitter boy. or make it run away crying.

[Uncle Servo]

For a good serious list you should have put a titan juicer on there.

Like all "X vs Y" scenarios, one must include terms of 'defeat,' battle conditions, terrain, intitiative and the presence/absence of pilot error. Otherwise there are too many variables to give any kind of serious answer -- under the right combinations of these factors, even a 1st level vagabond with a bar of soap and the wet MDC paper bag can defeat a Glitter Boy.

[Shadow Wyrm]

With the right tactics most power armor and robots can take out a glitter-boy on their own.

[Syndicate]

Umm...the SAMAS is highly manuverable, and has superior air and ground speed. Statistically speaking, the other choices (besides the Ulti-MAX) just don't have the stopping power or armoring to defeat a glitterboy. I chose the SAMAS because these pilots are most likely to have training in the defeat of a glitterboy. Though Europe has it's fair share of glitterboys...in North America it seems they are more popular and well known...and knowing is half the battle.

[Dr. Doom III]

The child with a bag of rocks would fall easy prey since he would be lulled into a false sense of superiority after defeating so many "all powerful" mages.

[kamikazzijoe]

The bag of rocks innocently snuck into the barrel would make the child the obvious choice. I mean come on people are you all like the knights of the gaming table and nuke the little girl on her bicycle?

[Borast]

In a straight 1-on-1 slugfest, the Glitterboy will defeat ANY basic Earth based tech 'bot or PA.

It even has a decent chance against almost any tech unit going.

As for sniping and targeting the head...at 2km and up, that's kinda hard!

Don't forget, the GB can reach-out to about 3km to touch you, and no other PA can do the same without missiles, which can be shot down... That means the GB can hit you once (at least) before you even have a chance to fire back.
That having been said, luck does play a part. About two years ago, some idiot with a pistol (in the passenger seat) fired at the driver in the car beside him. Six shots and not a ONE hit the driver...from less than a metre away! The GB could theoretically miss every shot when firing at a laser pistol armed and unarmoured opponent at 100m!

[The Galactus Kid]

Just destroy the freakin' bom gun. Alot less MDC then the armor. Whats he gonna do after that? Poop his pants, thats what.

[ApocalypseZero]

I hate when I get into these Vs. Threads. I always end up with a negative view of others on the boards.

I mean, I understand that these are half for fun, half using stats, but the mentality that some portray here leaves me wondering what type of GM/Play style they really have.

Now, I'm not one that plays a strict to the rules game, but I don't heavily modify, nor am I a strict realistic player, but I don't let go of reality as a standard for Rifts. With this out of the way....

What in the hell are you/your GM's doing with a Glitter Boy? I make my players fear them. If you see a Glitter Boy firing at you, it's because either the area is enclosed or you got the drop on him. A GB has a 2 Miles range and the optic system to shoot you that far. GB opponents should be lanced by the Boom Gun at least 2-3 times before even engaging them. Now, I will have to say situational factors need apply as well, but what I see typed here just leaves me to believe that you all think a GB can be stomped easily. It makes me want to GM a game for you all just to show you how much you should fear one. There's more to a GB than his Boom Gun, and any good GB player or GM using a GB should know this and use it.

[Dead Boy]

The UAR-1 Enforcer from the original Main Book is one of the most underappreciated bots in the entire game. And yes, one on one, it could clean a Gliter Boy's clock somehing fierce. Prior to WB:11-CWC this would not have been so, but thanks to the introduction of the Coalition's more powerful missiles... oh yea baby. The Enforcer is a missile wagon, with 6 Medium Range Missiles (5D6x10 MD each and able to launch 4 at a time - there's 700 MD on the first attack alone), 10 Short Range Missiles (2D6x10 MD each and capable of launching vollies of 5 - there's 350 MD more per attack), and 20 Mini-Missiles (1D6x10 MD per with vollies of 4 - 140 MD more per attack). And if all that weren't bad enough, the Enforcer can have a pilot AND a gunner, meaning that each one can have an attack per melee action of combat. That gives the Enforcer two attacks for every one from the Glitter Boy. If that fight went more than two attack sequences, I'd be surprised.

[Borast]

Don't forget that missiles can be shot down, and if fired in a volley, tend to be lost in total.

Admittedly, it looses the GB a shot with the BoomGun... But, it only has to hit the UAR once or twice to cripple it.

As for simply blowing away the GB's gun, that's kinda hard to do except from ambush.

Besides...glitterboys rarely travel alone!

[NoJack]

The flavor text anout this bot or that bot being "as powerfull as the legendary glitterboy" is so much fluff. At every instance, the mentioned piece of hardware has less armor, damage dealing ability and/or redeeming features, and that includes many of the GB variants. Take the TX-1000 Ulti-max. Great if you want a cheap underpowered GB knockoff.

Our GM always made you fear something that could shoot you 3 times before that first sonic boom reached you.

[RoadWarriorFWaNK]

As for simply blowing away the GB's gun, that's kinda hard to do except from ambush.

no it's not. The Gun only has 175 MDC. I could destroy it a hell of alot easier than the main body.

[The Galactus Kid]

TW jammer pistol.

Mage: "I shot his boom gun"
All of the Mages buddies: "we all shoot the gun"
Glitter boy: *poop*

That was fun

[RoadWarriorFWaNK]

Whoops! I just cast Mental Blast on the pilot! And Then I accidentally followed it up with Havoc! Oh, the pilot is dead and I get a new suit of armor. I win this thread!

EDIT. Nevermind. Mental Blast doesn't affect targets in power armor. But Havoc does! AHAHAHHAHAHAH!!!!

[The Galactus Kid]

YAY!!! We win!!!

[The Galactus Kid]

it doesn't. But Havoc does. Regardless, the GB would be royally screwed without the use of it's gun thatnks to the TW jammer pistol

[Dead Boy]

Don't forget that missiles can be shot down, and if fired in a volley, tend to be lost in total.

Admittedly, it looses the GB a shot with the BoomGun... But, it only has to hit the UAR once or twice to cripple it.

As for simply blowing away the GB's gun, that's kinda hard to do except from ambush.

Besides...glitterboys rarely travel alone!

Are you kidding me? Sure, that would explain the excessive use of gremlins , but still....

1) It takes a Called Shot to even try to shoot down the lead missile in a volley, and given it's size and speed that's at least with a -3 penalty to hit, (maybe -6). And even IF you hit it there's only a 45% chance or blowing the whole volley. That gives your GB maybe a one in seven chance of defeating each volley. And the Enforcer has lots and lots of vollyes it can throw at its foe.

2) Killing a GB's Boom Gun isn't that hard with the right tools. Mini-missiles can be used in an Aimed (and ergo also a Called Shot) volleys of two. That means that with after factoring in all bonuses and to hits, any weapon system capable of firing at least eight MM's can nuke a Boom Gun in 4 attacks. That's why the GBK has a 50/50 chance of winning a one on one fight agsinst a Glitter Boy. However, an Enforcer dosen't need that long since it can kill a GB in two melee attacks, possibly in the span of one melee action for the GB pilot. Hell, depending on how initiative is rolled, the GB might not even get a single shot off!

3) This one will require two parts... A) This scenario called for a one on one fight, so neither side will have backup... B) In most cases those who take on a Glitter Boy won't be fighting alone either. So there.

[The Galactus Kid]

Well, according to the RUles in the GM's guide, if you are trying to hit a target going over 40 miles an hour (i.e. the lead missile in a volley) you need a 12 or higher to hit. Not to mention any of the afore metioned dodge rules that a missile would have. There might be a penalty involved with shooting a small target, too.

As for mini missiles being able to do called shots, I thought missiles always hit the main body? I didn't think that you could use missiles to make called shots. Aimed, yes. Called, no.

[Irishmen]

I would call hitting a missle in mid flight a called shot, you would have to be a excesive marksmen to be able to do that.

When a f-16 is in a dog fight and he fires his missle at a mig, it is a 1 in 6 chance for the mig to shoot down the missle before impact, this is why they have counter messures to get the missle to hit them while the plane moves out of the way.

To use any gun in that manner would be difficult so a called shot would have to happen in my opion, but the rules might not support that.

[RoadWarriorFWaNK]

As for mini missiles being able to do called shots, I thought missiles always hit the main body? I didn't think that you could use missiles to make called shots.

whatever. you can totally make called shots with missiles. as long as it's not stupid. like you can't call a shot with a LRM to a guy's head.

[The Galactus Kid]

but where is that distinction made? If you make a comment like that, then some idiot is going to go around making called shots on the little Hydrolic systems shown on the spider skull walkers legs. (I had someone try to do this) There has to be a distinction.

[RoadWarriorFWaNK]

Regular missiles can too. The only missiles that alwaysstrike the main body are Smart Missiles. Im looking at the rulebook right now and thats what it says.

[Killer Cyborg]

The UAR-1 Enforcer from the original Main Book is one of the most underappreciated bots in the entire game. And yes, one on one, it could clean a Gliter Boy's clock somehing fierce. Prior to WB:11-CWC this would not have been so, but thanks to the introduction of the Coalition's more powerful missiles... oh yea baby. The Enforcer is a missile wagon, with 6 Medium Range Missiles (5D6x10 MD each and able to launch 4 at a time - there's 700 MD on the first attack alone), 10 Short Range Missiles (2D6x10 MD each and capable of launching vollies of 5 - there's 350 MD more per attack), and 20 Mini-Missiles (1D6x10 MD per with vollies of 4 - 140 MD more per attack). And if all that weren't bad enough, the Enforcer can have a pilot AND a gunner, meaning that each one can have an attack per melee action of combat. That gives the Enforcer two attacks for every one from the Glitter Boy. If that fight went more than two attack sequences, I'd be surprised.

This is the most intelligent post on this thread.
Most people who claim a GB would lose a fight against anything act under the assumptions that:
-The GB only has one weapon. Even though all GB pilots start with an energy rifle, and energy pistol, and one non-energy weapon of choice.
-It takes an attack or two every time the GB wants to sink pylons or turn around.
-Glitterboys are slow moving and bulky, even though they offer "the mobility of the human body".


You actually know your stats and take missiles into account.
Just to nitpick, though...

You list medium range missiles as doing 5d6x10 MD, which indicates that you're using the Multi-warhead missiles. Which means that the GB could roll with impact to reduce the damage by half. So that initial 700 would be reduced to 350 MD with a successful Roll with Impact.
Having fired 4 out of 6 missiles, you can "only" dish out 350 MD average on the next volley, 175 after a successful roll with impact.
So the medium range missles, if the GB rolls decently, will only do a total of 525 MD before you are out of Medium range missiles.

Short Range missiles that do 2d6x10 could be plasma, armor piercing, or heavy explosives. If they are HE, then the pilot could again attempt to roll with impact. The damage per volley would drop to 175 MD per volley, 350 total before you are out of short range missiles.

The mini-missiles you list seem to be plasma, so no rolling with impact there. Full damage, sucks to be the GB.

Instead of rolling with impact, the GB can choose to block incoming missles with his arms, letting them take the damage instead of the main body. The GB's arms have 270 MDC each, providing the GB with an extra 540 MDC against missile attacks. Added with the 770 from the main body, the total MDC of the GB before it is put out of comission is 1310 MDC.

A good chunk of the battle is decided by whoever wins the initiative and how well the pilots know the enemy. An experienced GB pilot who wins the initiative could well use his first attack to shoot one of the missile launchers. Maybe the mini-missile launcher, because even if the Boom Gun does minimum damage, the launcher is destroyed.

So if the GB wins initiative, things could go like this:
-GB takes out mini-missiles.
-UAR-1 pilot fires medium range missiles. GB rolls with impact; takes 350 damage. (420 left in the main body).
-At the same time, the gunner fires the short range missiles. The GB rolls again and takes 175 damage (345 left in the main body).
-Now, Some people play that when you use an attack to dodge or roll that you lost your next attack, some say it comes off of the total number of attacks.
Either way, I'll say the GB does nothing on his attack.
-The Pilot fires his remaining 2 Med. range missiles, the GB blocks with his arms and rolls and takes 175 MD (365 left)
-The gunner fires his second volley of Short Range missiles, the GB blocks with his arms and rolls, taking 175 to his arms (195 MDC left in his arms).
-GB's up again and this time it comes down to rules and dice. If you play that he can use his final attack now, and he rolls well, he might be able to take out the Enforcer's rail-gun (100 MDC)
If he takes that gun out, then the UAR-1 is down to hand to hand combat.
If he doesn't/can't take it out, then he will be chewed up by the railgun until next initiative.
Since I don't think it's possible for the pilot and the gunner to both fire the same gun at the same time, this means that the GB will take 4 bursts for an average damage of 140 MD by the end of the turn (205 MDC left in the main body.
The GB will likely own the second round of combat, taking out the rail gun first, then the main body of the UAR-1.

Of course, all this depends on the GB making his Roll with Impact checks against the missiles, which is not a sure thing by any stretch of the imagination. The fact is, the battle could go either way... with a strong edge to the UAR-1, especially if it has a lot of plasma-missiles (I usually avoid carrying all plasma missiles due to the high number of things that are immune or resistant to heat damage; bursters, mages with the right spell up, dragons, etc.)

[Dead Boy]

The UAR-1 Enforcer from the original Main Book is one of the most underappreciated bots in the entire game. And yes, one on one, it could clean a Gliter Boy's clock somehing fierce. Prior to WB:11-CWC this would not have been so, but thanks to the introduction of the Coalition's more powerful missiles... oh yea baby. The Enforcer is a missile wagon, with 6 Medium Range Missiles (5D6x10 MD each and able to launch 4 at a time - there's 700 MD on the first attack alone), 10 Short Range Missiles (2D6x10 MD each and capable of launching vollies of 5 - there's 350 MD more per attack), and 20 Mini-Missiles (1D6x10 MD per with vollies of 4 - 140 MD more per attack). And if all that weren't bad enough, the Enforcer can have a pilot AND a gunner, meaning that each one can have an attack per melee action of combat. That gives the Enforcer two attacks for every one from the Glitter Boy. If that fight went more than two attack sequences, I'd be surprised.

This is the most intelligent post on this thread.

Why, thank you! That will give me a warm fuzzy feeling for the rest of the day.

Just to nitpick, though...

You list medium range missiles as doing 5d6x10 MD, which indicates that you're using the Multi-warhead missiles. Which means that the GB could roll with impact to reduce the damage by half. So that initial 700 would be reduced to 350 MD with a successful Roll with Impact.
Having fired 4 out of 6 missiles, you can "only" dish out 350 MD average on the next volley, 175 after a successful roll with impact.
So the medium range missles, if the GB rolls decently, will only do a total of 525 MD before you are out of Medium range missiles.

Short Range missiles that do 2d6x10 could be plasma, armor piercing, or heavy explosives. If they are HE, then the pilot could again attempt to roll with impact. The damage per volley would drop to 175 MD per volley, 350 total before you are out of short range missiles.

That is quite true. A Roll with Impact/Explosion move would half the damage on these attacks. But there is one thing I don't think you're taking into consideration. the Roll with x maneuver is a defensive move like Dodge, and as such it uses the character's next available attack. Just to be sure I took a gander in the Rifts GMG and in nowhere in the move's description is it listed as an Automatic move, so it should use an attack. As such, though the GB could half the damage of all the major missile strikes on a successful roll (probably around 60% of the time) this would keep him on the defensive, allowing the Enforcer to fire even more unanswered attacks at the chrome PA.

Instead of rolling with impact, the GB can choose to block incoming missles with his arms, letting them take the damage instead of the main body. The GB's arms have 270 MDC each, providing the GB with an extra 540 MDC against missile attacks. Added with the 770 from the main body, the total MDC of the GB before it is put out of comission is 1310 MDC.

Again, this too is very true. But once the extra 540 MDC is gone, that also means that his friggin arms are gone too! And the Glitter Boy's Boom Gun is aimed by the mini-bot's arms, not to mention anything built into the arms or hand-held weapons. Only the Triax version of the GB has a turreted self-aiming cannon, not the American versions. So he may get the extra armor from his arms, but it will cost the Glitter Boy dearly. In fact, I pray to God that he does do exactly that so the Enforcer can neutralize him in a three-quarters the time. After that they can save the expense of the missiles and chip away his other 700 MD for the next ten minutes with the rail gun and lasers. Savor the moment!

[Killer Cyborg]

The UAR-1 Enforcer from the original Main Book is one of the most underappreciated bots in the entire game. And yes, one on one, it could clean a Gliter Boy's clock somehing fierce. Prior to WB:11-CWC this would not have been so, but thanks to the introduction of the Coalition's more powerful missiles... oh yea baby. The Enforcer is a missile wagon, with 6 Medium Range Missiles (5D6x10 MD each and able to launch 4 at a time - there's 700 MD on the first attack alone), 10 Short Range Missiles (2D6x10 MD each and capable of launching vollies of 5 - there's 350 MD more per attack), and 20 Mini-Missiles (1D6x10 MD per with vollies of 4 - 140 MD more per attack). And if all that weren't bad enough, the Enforcer can have a pilot AND a gunner, meaning that each one can have an attack per melee action of combat. That gives the Enforcer two attacks for every one from the Glitter Boy. If that fight went more than two attack sequences, I'd be surprised.

This is the most intelligent post on this thread.

Why, thank you! That will give me a warm fuzzy feeling for the rest of the day.

Just to nitpick, though...

You list medium range missiles as doing 5d6x10 MD, which indicates that you're using the Multi-warhead missiles. Which means that the GB could roll with impact to reduce the damage by half. So that initial 700 would be reduced to 350 MD with a successful Roll with Impact.
Having fired 4 out of 6 missiles, you can "only" dish out 350 MD average on the next volley, 175 after a successful roll with impact.
So the medium range missles, if the GB rolls decently, will only do a total of 525 MD before you are out of Medium range missiles.

Short Range missiles that do 2d6x10 could be plasma, armor piercing, or heavy explosives. If they are HE, then the pilot could again attempt to roll with impact. The damage per volley would drop to 175 MD per volley, 350 total before you are out of short range missiles.

That is quite true. A Roll with Impact/Explosion move would half the damage on these attacks. But there is one thing I don't think you're taking into consideration. the Roll with x maneuver is a defensive move like Dodge, and as such it uses the character's next available attack. Just to be sure I took a gander in the Rifts GMG and in nowhere in the move's description is it listed as an Automatic move, so it should use an attack. As such, though the GB could half the damage of all the major missile strikes on a successful roll (probably around 60% of the time) this would keep him on the defensive, allowing the Enforcer to fire even more unanswered attacks at the chrome PA.

Instead of rolling with impact, the GB can choose to block incoming missles with his arms, letting them take the damage instead of the main body. The GB's arms have 270 MDC each, providing the GB with an extra 540 MDC against missile attacks. Added with the 770 from the main body, the total MDC of the GB before it is put out of comission is 1310 MDC.

Again, this too is very true. But once the extra 540 MDC is gone, that also means that his friggin arms are gone too! And the Glitter Boy's Boom Gun is aimed by the mini-bot's arms, not to mention anything built into the arms or hand-held weapons. Only the Triax version of the GB has a turreted self-aiming cannon, not the American versions. So he may get the extra armor from his arms, but it will cost the Glitter Boy dearly. In fact, I pray to God that he does do exactly that so the Enforcer can neutralize him in a three-quarters the time. After that they can save the expense of the missiles and chip away his other 700 MD for the next ten minutes with the rail gun and lasers. Savor the moment!

1. The rules on defensive actions can be interpreted a couple of different ways. I don't think the books every clearly state where the attack comes from; some people play that it takes the next attack, some people play that it comes off of the overall number of attacks.
Either way, you'll notice that in the scenario I posted the GB IS on the defensive for pretty much the whole first round after he makes his first attack.

2. As you'll note in the above scenario, the GB pilot doesn't risk his arms until his main body has taken significant damage and the UAR-1 doesn't have the firepower to actually drop the arms MDC too badly (using average damage rolls, that is. If the UAR-1 rolls really well, the GB is screwed.... but exceptional rolls can always skew things.)

[Dead Boy]

1. The rules on defensive actions can be interpreted a couple of different ways. I don't think the books every clearly state where the attack comes from; some people play that it takes the next attack, some people play that it comes off of the overall number of attacks.
Either way, you'll notice that in the scenario I posted the GB IS on the defensive for pretty much the whole first round after he makes his first attack.

It always comes down to the interpetation of the rules. And I'll give you exactly that. Given the vagueness of much of the Palladium System some rules can be read one way or another... and technically speaking, BOTH can be right. I had a similar thing going on a few weeks back where I was interpetiong the rules of how the Psi Stalker's PPE drain works in its non-lethal mode. By the way it was written, I was pretty sure I was interpeting it correctly, but others reading the exact same words saw things differently.

Hey, there is one source that might clear this one up. I recall reading in one of the earlier books an example melee written by Kev da Man himself that used all the various moves. IF it can be found it might give more credence to one interpetation over the other. I say "might" because the official interpetation of the rules fluctuates with the prevailing winds and the whims of Kev.

2. As you'll note in the above scenario, the GB pilot doesn't risk his arms until his main body has taken significant damage and the UAR-1 doesn't have the firepower to actually drop the arms MDC too badly (using average damage rolls, that is. If the UAR-1 rolls really well, the GB is screwed.... but exceptional rolls can always skew things.)

Yea, that'd be the smart way to play it. However, given the the sheer magnitude of firepower the Enforcer can lay down, timing is absolutely critical! To be fair said move shuold be declaired before the damage is rolled. In additin to that, should the arms not be blwon to smithereenes,the book also highly suggests that you roll on the Optional Dmage tables as well, which could lead to a malfunction that will make the GB operation of its Boom Gun imposible. In such a case, though the arms may have MDC in them, the GB would be all but defenseless.