Small Arms Armory

Whether it is a Veritech or a Valkyrie, Robotech or Macross II, Earth is in danger eitherway. Grab your mecha and fight the good fight.

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The Artist Formerly
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Small Arms Armory

Unread post by The Artist Formerly »

"Taking it to the streets!"

One of the issues for GMs to deal with in all three eras of the earth saga is that Mecha combat is limited to only three forces. 1) Aliens 2)EBSIS 3)RDF/ASC/REF. Now there are ways to mix this up a bit, hightech bandits stealing stuff, refitting stuff or building some sort of Mech-enstein's monster/hybrid. But that's still limitting for GMs. Especially when most armed forces on the field would be hard pressed to field a solid conventional force, let alone run the expense and effort to keep a mecha unit in the field. Mecha are hyper complex pieces of machinery.

Here are some ideas on how to make infantry, bandits and other ground pounders more threatening to mecha. Usually, I just grab one of the Palladium books that has a larger collection of SDC weapons like N&SS or the HU GMs guide, and convert from there. They give you ranges, payloads and SDC damage which is a big help for where to get started.

The X-cal lists one of it's weapons as a 12.7 mm Machine gun that inflicts MDC. 12.7mm is the same as a fifty caliber. Lots of those already in existance. But we also know that their are SDC versions of the same weapon. Odds are the differance between the two is the nature of the rounds, not the gun itself. Granted the MGs are likely made out of lighter more relisant MDC materials then their SDC throwing counterparts. In all likelyhood these improved rounds probabaly place more stress on the weapon and would be dangerous to use the MDC rounds in standard 50 cal MGs. There is an easy solution for this.

A few new parts for old guns. "Bob's guns mod kits" for conversion of SDC weapons into MDC weapons, bullets not included. Available with instructions in Chinese, Russian, Spanish, English and Zentraedi. Likely there are dozens of small nations and military forces that not only produce these things for themselves but for export as well. Easily mounted on the back of a jeep, APC or the like, as well as any other place one might find a MG in a conventional setting. Odds are there are similar kits for similar weapons like the 14.5mm MG.

"Big Bah-Da-Boom!"

The next feature would be Grenade Launchers, rocket launchers and mortors. The easiest way to deal with them I have found is to simply take the base stats of the SDC weapon and apply mini-missiles style MDC damage read outs, with a little down grading. A Fragmentation Mortor would inflict somewhere in the neighboorhood of 2d6 to 5d4 or 4d6 MDC. The damage coding varies with the era (the more time these various "Non-Mecha" and EBSIS supported groups have had to unravel RDF/ASC/REF technology the more potent these weapons become. Also, the resources and brains a particular weapons supplier has the more potent the weapons.

Disposable SDC weapons, such as a one shot rocket launcher, can be swapped out with minimal conversion. Just change the warhead supply and no stop work needs to be done on the assembly line. Reloadable might need a reinforcement here or there, but that's not a major issue. The big change is the explosion, not the means of travel so existing weapon systems should take the upgrade, no problem.

A weapon like the 40mm Grenade Launcher, so often underslung on assault rifles of many types, should have little problem delivering a 2d4 or 1d6 MDC hit to a 15-20 foot area, by about 2015 or so.

"True small arms."

These weapons are trickey because they aren't available early on and when you finally can use them, they are lasers the PCs are likey wearing laser resistant armor cutting your damage in half. To deal with that, I find the idea of the Soviets flooding the market with Koskov 47s is the premuim choice. The gun is small, light weight, easy to use, lots of fire power and cheap. Everything you could want when challanging the ASC. While one guy in body armor with a K-47 isn't much of a threat, even to a CDC light, six guys in no body armor will take alot longer to deal with and provide much more of a threat.

Though I personally love the Gallant H-90, it's specialized training makes it a poor choice for not REF characters to use. WP E-pistol gives you everything the ASC, EBSIS and most of the REF's weapons, WP H-90 gives you just the H-90.

"The best offense is a good defense."

A statement of dubious nature, but sufficent to open the next line of ideas. The various Mecha equiped forces on or of the earth will be leaving behind plenty of debris in the form of damaged armor plating. Especially the Zentraedi. While cobbling a Mecha together is unlikely for most bandits and other human hostiles, scrounging together armor plating for a car, jeep or APC isn't out of the question, as we can see in the AZO-II. They don't have to be high MDC values, just enough that a lucky shot from a light head laser won't cripple the vehicle. Use your imaginations on this part. 40 MDC for a jeep is too much, but 12 MDC isn't to bad at all.

"Location location location"

The last part of making this kind of combat work is where it goes down. Bandits attacking Mecha forces in the expanse of a Zentraedi Blast crater would be short and deadly for the bandits. But doing it in city loaded with SDC buildings, maybe a residential section, would force the pilot of that mecha to think real hard about which weapon system he was going to use and the damage setting he wanted before he pulled the trigger. Even one missed round in a burst could cause alot of heart ache suffering.

"Putting it together."

Now let's use the above guide lines to make for adventure idea.

A Drug ring operating out of Mexico City could steal a batch of medical supplies from the RDF/ASC base there. A PC is given the order to purse and engage. Now then, in the old system, the jeep and it's occupants are imputant to do much about anything at all. New guide lines, the Jeep has three occupants, one working a .50 call machine gun in the back, one driving and one trying to uncase an MDC throwing RPG. All the while the jeep is hurtling down the sides streets of Mexico City's slums. Now that should make a PC sweat a bit. :demon:
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Unread post by glitterboy2098 »

the REF's 9mm HE ammo.

1d4 md for a single 9mm round.

what would a 5.56mm round look like (1d3?) ? or a .50 cal (1d6?)?


and its implied that you can use this ammo with normal weapons (GM's call, really), with normal burst fire rules.


suddenly all those M-16 carrying foot soldiers look pretty dangerous. Ditto the MG nests.
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Unread post by Ice Dragon »

Maybe it depends on the cost of the rounds and availability.

I like the REF Weasel Automatic Pistol - 1D4 M.D. is cool.

A standard 9mm pistol shouldn't make M.D.
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Unread post by The Artist Formerly »

glitterboy2098 wrote:the REF's 9mm HE ammo.

1d4 md for a single 9mm round.

what would a 5.56mm round look like (1d3?) ? or a .50 cal (1d6?)?


and its implied that you can use this ammo with normal weapons (GM's call, really), with normal burst fire rules.


suddenly all those M-16 carrying foot soldiers look pretty dangerous. Ditto the MG nests.


I always thought that was kind of weird that the Badger packs 9mm rounds and inflicts MDC. Especially when you concider that the Weasel only carries five rounds. Who ever heard of a five round 9mm pistol? I wonder if those weren't intended to be more like a .45 cal (like the Mac-10s using ACP rounds) or .50 cal arrangement and Palladium just screwed it up.

ANYway. :) I wouldn't worry about manufacturing explosive 5.56mm rounds. If your going for that, you want them in the 7.62mm varity. 1) Whatever that exposive substance is, you can get more of it into the larger round 2) 7.62 just happens to fit the most manufactured assault rifle in the world. The Klasnikov. Terrorist and rebels aren't soldiers, they need a weapon that is easy to maintain and will function no matter the abuse.
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Unread post by glitterboy2098 »

except i doubt the REF uses many 7.62mm weapons. tends to be a mostly soviet usage.
plus you have to figure that alot of US military gear was used by the RDF, and we're almost a purely 5.56 group.

Who ever heard of a five round 9mm pistol?


holdout gun? tiny, designed for easy concealment and/or reduced space in a survival kit?
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Unread post by Rabid Southern Cross Fan »

The animation shows the Weasel as having at least 7 rounds (thats how many shots Zor Prime gets off in A New Recruit....the one time we get a really good look at the weapon). Its also caseless as there is no slide or ejection port for a spent cartridge.

I just rechecked the animation myself. 7 shots at the least...but 24 targets total (we see him hit 8). 100% accuracy. Presumably he shoots them all....so there are shots not shown in the series. If he shot 2 per cartridge (and the series only shows he did that once) that would be at least 12 rounds per magazine.

Edit: When I submitted this to the Infopedia for Rt.com, I noted that it would be a .40 pistol and not a 9x19mm. No reason to have multiple service issue weapons of the same calibre, at least in my opinion. The 9x19mm in the series was the Walther P-38-esque pistol shown at several points.

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Unread post by The Artist Formerly »

glitterboy2098 wrote:except i doubt the REF uses many 7.62mm weapons. tends to be a mostly soviet usage.
plus you have to figure that alot of US military gear was used by the RDF, and we're almost a purely 5.56 group.


True about the Soviets. But in the 1980s there were several NATO nations who made heavy use of the 7.62mm. Heck Canada was even thinking of switching to AKs to save money back then. There are alot of guns that use the 7.62mm. And one does have to think about how alot of the nations that make up the UEG were using AKs or it's decendants and knock offs.

holdout gun? tiny, designed for easy concealment and/or reduced space in a survival kit?
I suppose... Still.
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Unread post by The Artist Formerly »

Rabid Southern Cross Fan wrote:The animation shows the Weasel as having at least 7 rounds (thats how many shots Zor Prime gets off in A New Recruit....the one time we get a really good look at the weapon). Its also caseless as there is no slide or ejection port for a spent cartridge.

I just rechecked the animation myself. 7 shots at the least...but 24 targets total (we see him hit 8). 100% accuracy. Presumably he shoots them all....so there are shots not shown in the series. If he shot 2 per cartridge (and the series only shows he did that once) that would be at least 12 rounds per magazine.

Edit: When I submitted this to the Infopedia for Rt.com, I noted that it would be a .40 pistol and not a 9x19mm. No reason to have multiple service issue weapons of the same calibre, at least in my opinion. The 9x19mm in the series was the Walther P-38-esque pistol shown at several points.

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The .40 cal makes more sense. More trama then the 9mm but more rounds and more zip then the old .45s. The forty is a better round in terms of ballistics and lots of armies and police forces are adopting them.
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Unread post by Nekira Sudacne »

you might want to consider bringin the equivlent of rifts Ramjet rounds over here.

they're low tech. . .slightly modified normal bullets with Jet Fuel rather than the normal gunpowder used in bullets today, and work out of normal firearms.

granted 1 MD from small arms fire and 1d4 MD from larger rifles and machinegun fire isn't all that great, but hey, it's a lot better than nothing AND makes those annoying bandits and even normal criminals a MUCH bigger threat to Civilans.
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Unread post by Comrade Corsarius »

Taffy, that's downright creepy. I've been doing similar stuff for years by up-kitting anti-unification rebels etc. the AZO vehicle in one of the later books is a godsend for those of us sick of zapping aliens.

I also think (not entirely sure) that the ak-74 uses a 5.56 round instead of the venerable 7.62. It's mostly Chinese and various other knock-off manufacturers that still build the old AK-47 (which, having handled one IRL, I am very impressed with). Then again, I have heard that some african arms manufacturers are still building Stug-44 assault rifles.
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Unread post by The Artist Formerly »

Corsarius wrote:Taffy, that's downright creepy. I've been doing similar stuff for years by up-kitting anti-unification rebels etc. the AZO vehicle in one of the later books is a godsend for those of us sick of zapping aliens.

I also think (not entirely sure) that the ak-74 uses a 5.56 round instead of the venerable 7.62. It's mostly Chinese and various other knock-off manufacturers that still build the old AK-47 (which, having handled one IRL, I am very impressed with). Then again, I have heard that some african arms manufacturers are still building Stug-44 assault rifles.


AK-74 fires the 5.45mm (but I think they may well be able to chamber the 5.56).

The change was brought on when it became apparent that 7.62 didn't have the zip to drill though modern bodyarmor. I think they should have gone with Kalashnivo's idea and just invested in modernizing the 7.62 to give it that extra zip it needed. The guy is the most inovative weapons designer since Browning, and if he says "hey I got an idea", then perhaps people should listen. The faster moving 7.62, according to Kalashnikov, could do everything the 5.45 could, plus it made a hole half again the size of the 5.45. Now that's tissue trama.
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Unread post by Jefffar »

Common and special military rifle cartridges.


5.45 mm - The current standard former soviet assault rifle round. It debuted with the AK-74 and most currently produced assault rifles in the former communist block are avaialble in that calibre. This round was designed after the 5.56 but has certain refinements to enhance its lethality. It stills uffers from the disadvantage of a light, high velocity bullet - poor tissue damage effects when the velocity drops.

5.56 mm - The current NATO standard assault rifle round. Appeared in the M-16. It was a revolutionary round when it was introduced, trading projectile size for higher muzzle velocity and less recoil. A 5.56 weapon is more controllable than more powerful guns, bt is just as lethal . . . unless the bullet slows down before it hits the target, then you might as well use a .22.

5.8 mm - New chinese round, based on the small calibre, high velocity idea that lead to the introduction of 5.56 and 5.45. The difference is that this bullet keeps more mass, thus offsetting the problems when velocity drops off.

6.8 mm SPC - a new round being developed for the American Special Forces. The round has much better long range performance and terminal ballistics than a 5.56, but is still lighter and easier to shoot than 7.62 NATO.

7.62 x 39 M1943 - This is the round made famous int he AK-47. It features a heavy 7.62 mm bullet in a relatively short 49.5 mm cartiridge case. The resultign bullet is slow and inaccurate over long ranges, but still delivers quite a punch.

7.62 x 51 NATO - This is the standard 7.62 mm round used by NATO in sniping rifles and machineguns. This round is an old fashioned round, firing a heavy bullet at high speeds. This means it's very powerful, almost too powerful. Automatic rifles firing this round have a tendancy to be uncontrollable.

7.62 x 54R - This is an old russian round, dating back to the turn of the 20th century. This round started its life in the Moisin-Nagant Rifle and continues to see service to this day in sniping weapons and machineguns. Like the 7.62 NATO it fires a heavy bullet at high velocity. The combination yields superior range, penetration and terminal ballistics - at the cost of high recoil.

9x39 - This is a brand new Russian assault rifle round. it is used in a special family of silent assault rifles. The design features a very, very heavy bullet installed in the case of a 7.62x39 cartridge. The roudn has a subsonic velocity, making it very quiet and msot fo the guns using this round have silencers built into them making them virtually undetectable. Despite the low muzzle velocity, the mass of the projectile of this round allows it to punch through most body armours as effectively as a 7.62 x 54R. The large projectile diameter makes for a large wound corridor too.
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