Cosmo Knights and thier innards or maybe lack therefore of..

[Dr. Doom III]

I think of them when they are transformed like solid metal.
Like Colossus.

[cornholioprime]

I was just wondering, well its been in my mind for a couple weeks, if a cosmo knight skin is pierced by a weapon, bullet, shard, whatever what happens? Is there blood which would look like the normal races blood? Would anything come out?

What happens if the knight gets his arm chopped off? will there be blood again, will it regenerate, will it look like a normal races anatamy inside (bones, muscles etc)?

Just trying to get an idea of the inner workings of the cosmo knight.

Aegis

Brother, I have wondered about Mega-Damage Innards and Giblets since Time began.....

When you finally kill a Mega Damage Creature, do you end up with Mega Damage Steak???? What of the SDC Guy that eats it (if he can even chew it)????

Does he get Mega-Damage Constipation??? (If a GM, do you have the Character roll for Damage by...uh....location???? If other Players are in the Immediate Area, do they have to save versus Horror Factor?????)

My friend, just assume the following: ALL Mega-Damage Creatures/Characters have MD Skin and Innards (something has to grow that MD Hide, after all) until killed.
Afterwards, if you want to use the animal/creature for food, it instantly turns to SDC Flesh; but if you want to use parts of the body for Armor, those Parts stay Mega-Damage..........

just another bit of realism you have to suspend to have a good time in the Universe of Role-Playing Games............

[Vrykolas2k]

*throws cornholio some Mega-Damage tp*

poke us, do we not bleed?
Wrong us, shall we not revenge?

I believe that Cosmo-Knights, like all supernatural creatures, bleed blood and have flesh and blood innards. They just heal really, really fast. I don't recall if a Cosmo-Knight can regrow limbs, however.

It's bio-regeneration, so I think they can...

[cornholioprime]

*throws cornholio some Mega-Damage tp*

1D6 MD PER WIPE AT THE....UH....POINT OF IMPACT, NO SAVING THROW!!

Great. Ladies and Gentlemen, just when you thought you'd seen it all...................Zerebrus has conjured up:


Lesser, Greater, and Greatest Rune Toilet Paper!!!!!!

[Dr. Doom III]

Just say hide is MDC and the innards are SDC (100 MDC = 100,000 SDC) so people don't start thinking they can shove a gun in something mouth for an instant kill.
Then the meat of MDC creatures becomes edible.

[Rimmer]

MEGA-LAX !

[Svartalf]

Well... There is nothing to say that a CK is SO redone over by the forge that his inner workings change... even though some of them are going to work much less than before (they no longer NEED to eat, drink or breathe after all)... so if cut up or opened and whatever, everything will look normal.

but DOOM, why in heck would only the skin be turned MDC? given the huge overall transformation undergone by the being, there's no reason for it.

[cornholioprime]

Just say hide is MDC and the innards are SDC (100 MDC = 100,000 SDC) so people don't start thinking they can shove a gun in something mouth for an instant kill.
Then the meat of MDC creatures becomes edible.

I pretty much agree with Doom (remember, Doom is ALWAYS right), but I just chalk it up to another little bit of reality that one must suspend to play virtuallly any Role-Playing Game.

Think of it this way, if the Character REALLY has MDC Skin, but SDC innards, what happens to his or her internal organs if their SKIN easily withstands a High Explosive, but the Shockwave still ''reaches'' their Internal Organs???

If you don't suspend a little reality (and make their innards MDC for the purposes of Game Play/Battle....you'd end up with a nice, neat MDC hide...and ALL of their internal organs squeezed out of all available openings.

(When our real-world Engineers originally designed NORAD, they almost made a fatal mistake: they AMOST forgot to plan for the Overpressure Wave. Had they not accounted and redesigned NORAD for it, a Nuke that hit the mountain would have left MOST of the Mountain unscathed [the mountain is the real-world equivalent of a Super-MDC Structure, or a super-strong skin for the purposes of our discussion]...but the Overpressure Wave would have made human toothpaste of EVERY biological inside). Just like one of the earlier Posts pointed out, you can't just bypass MDC Skin by shooting down an MDC Creature's throat....

[Dr. Doom III]

but DOOM, why in heck would only the skin be turned MDC? given the huge overall transformation undergone by the being, there's no reason for it.

I wasn't talking about Cosmo Knights then.
I already said I think when their armor is on I think of them as solid metal.

[Borast]

CK are MDC all the way through, but have internal organs.

They bleed.

They do everything you and I do (biologically speaking), except sweat and breed...although sexual relations are possible.

If you trim his extremities, he becomes GimpyKnight, wielder of the Energy Cosmic! Until something "concrete" comes down from PB, they do NOT regrow lost body parts.

[cornholioprime]

CK are MDC all the way through, but have internal organs. They do everything you and I do (biologically speaking), except sweat and breed...although sexual relations are possible

Great. Mega-Damage....uh.....Sex.....

Anyone want to Create a Damage Table for this one??????

[cornholioprime]

how much PPE does it take to get it up? hmmm, "Summon ..."

10 PPE (it's the ''Create Wood'' Spell, Level 3 Invocation)

Or, if a Conjurer, one may conjure as follows:

SMALL Object :10 PPE
MEDIUM Object: 15 PPE
LARGE Object: 25 PPE
(NOTE: Most individuals will conjure, or will only admit to conjure up, the 'Large' Object)

ADDITIONAL NOTE: These Objects can be used to...uh...parry or block other ''attacks'' until the object's SDC/MDC runs out

Personally, I use a 15th Level Spell of Legend, namely ''Metropolis,'' to reinforce my...uh....structure (MY Structure is permanently MDC.....and it regenerates!!!!!)

[cornholioprime]

yeah, hope he doesn't need to meditate for 10 minutes...

It's Worse. I had to prepare a long, complicated Ritual, and at the end of it, I permanently lost 1 M.E. point....but boy, was it worth it!!!!!

[Vrykolas2k]

CK are MDC all the way through, but have internal organs. They do everything you and I do (biologically speaking), except sweat and breed...although sexual relations are possible

Great. Mega-Damage....uh.....Sex.....

Anyone want to Create a Damage Table for this one??????

How does anyone know thay can't breed?
Doesn't say one way or the other in the book...

[Colonel Wolfe]

this Kinda Reminds me of the Superman impregnation chat form Mall Rats...

[Svartalf]

that's a house rule... but I grant that given the massive change undergone by the Knight upon accession, it's even chance it makes them genetically incompatible with their former species... given the normal schedule of a knight, the ability to reproduce, with the concomitant temptation to found a family becomes a liability and one more possibility to fall

[cornholioprime]

this Kinda Reminds me of the Superman impregnation chat form Mall Rats...

Actually, THAT one was inspired, at least in Part, by Larry Niven's ''Man of Steel, Woman of Klennex," in which he pretty much shows how most of Superman's life couldn't happen in the 'real' world........

[Vrykolas2k]

that's a house rule... but I grant that given the massive change undergone by the Knight upon accession, it's even chance it makes them genetically incompatible with their former species... given the normal schedule of a knight, the ability to reproduce, with the concomitant temptation to found a family becomes a liability and one more possibility to fall

And of course, fallen or not, the children would likely inherit at least some of the parent's power... rather like sea titans...

[Borast]

fecund.

gadrin said fecund!

>chuckle< I didn't know anyone else on the board knew that word!

[Svartalf]

I know it, but would not likely ever have thought of using it.

[Vrykolas2k]

I think they could still breed, though perhaps the children would be equal in power to fallen knights... especially if the other parent was also an MDC being, such as a cosmo-knight mating with a sea titan, or a deity {though that one would more likely be a godling child }, or Wormwood human or whatever.
With mortals, they have to be careful... I play fallen knights mostly, and everytime I do something with their g.f.s, I roll pull punch.
I suppose a cosmo-knight or fallen one who was human could mate with a catyr, which is basically a mutated human... since the kinght or fallen knight is no longer SDC, I'd guess that the SDC damage from the low yied radiation would no longer be a bother.

[Syndicate]

....I feel sick...

[cornholioprime]

I think they could still breed, though perhaps the children would be equal in power to fallen knights... especially if the other parent was also an MDC being, such as a cosmo-knight mating with a sea titan, or a deity {though that one would more likely be a godling child }, or Wormwood human or whatever.
With mortals, they have to be careful... I play fallen knights mostly, and everytime I do something with their g.f.s, I roll pull punch.
I suppose a cosmo-knight or fallen one who was human could mate with a catyr, which is basically a mutated human... since the kinght or fallen knight is no longer SDC, I'd guess that the SDC damage from the low yied radiation would no longer be a bother.

I know that it hasn't been stated either way, but I would personally rule that Cosmo-Knight Abilities are not passed on at all to their offspring (if any; no mention either way as to whether or not they could reproduce). Since the powers can be taken away in aninstant if the Cosmo-Knight does wrongly, one may logically assume that not only does the Cosmic Forge give them the power, but that it also constantly aware of every recipient. And if aware of every recipient, one could also logically assume that the Cosmic Forge would not allow the Power to pass on to offspring, since the Knights are all Chosen in the first place....especially since the changes are -Magical??? Super-Physical?? Super-Psionic?? or any combination of these????

[TechnoGothic]

Ok, Cosmo-Knights are not members of their former race anymore for one thing.
The Forge has completly transformed them through and through.
Without their special Cosmic Armor on, they can appear as a normal member of their former race...but they are not.

Think of the Non-armored part as a disguis only...

They have no need for an mortal requirements such as Food, drink, sleep, or even a need to breathe.

WHY would they have any innards left...would that make them vulnerable to the vaccuum of space.

Like Doom said...in a way anyways
Solid *whatever* through and through...
Far as we know, inside the Mortal Shell aspect, they are Pure Energy...

[cornholioprime]

Ok, Cosmo-Knights are not members of their former race anymore for one thing.
The Forge has completly transformed them through and through.
Without their special Cosmic Armor on, they can appear as a normal member of their former race...but they are not.

Think of the Non-armored part as a disguis only...

They have no need for an mortal requirements such as Food, drink, sleep, or even a need to breathe.

WHY would they have any innards left...would that make them vulnerable to the vaccuum of space.

Like Doom said...in a way anyways
Solid *whatever* through and through...
Far as we know, inside the Mortal Shell aspect, they are Pure Energy...

Either that or just converted, MDC equivalents of what they had inside before. There is NO WAY that the Cosmo-Knights' innards could survive Stellar Radiation/energy outside a Planetary Atmosphere (their MDC skin would be invulnerable to the energy, but the skin would either be heated up by the Energy or be at very low temperatures due to the 'energy-leeching' effect of Outer Space, and would feeze or boil their SDC innards accordingly), MDC impacts from Starship Energy Beams, the Multi-Mach speeds that they can achieve in Solid Form (G.L.O.C.), High and Low Pressure Differentials on different Planets or in hard Vacuum (a being with MDC skin, but SDC innards, would have those soft organs get squeezed out of every orifice in ANY extremely high-pressure environment, while leaving the MDC Skin intact; likewise, regular blood boils in low pressure or hard Vacuum) etc., not to mention the Aging Process of the organs themselves, if the innards were mundane SDC......

[TechnoGothic]

Cosmo-Knights are like Galatus' Heralds...
Do with them what you will

COMIC BOOK PHYSICS apply, who cares

[Sir_Spirit]

CK are MDC all the way through...

If you trim his extremities, he becomes GimpyKnight, wielder of the Energy Cosmic! Until something "concrete" comes down from PB, they do NOT regrow lost body parts.

here you go, Something Official:
Phase World Pg#101 mid-way down the Right Column
Under Powers of the Cosmo Knight:

5. Bio-regeneration: 1D4x10 M.D.C. per minute.

The definitionof Bio-regeneration:

Main Entry: re·gen·er·a·tion
Pronunciation: ri-"je-n&-'rA-sh&n, "rE-
Function: noun
1 : an act or the process of regenerating: the state of being regenerated
3 : renewal or restoration of a body or bodily part after injury or as a normal process

Do you want the definitions of regenerating and regenerated?
regenerating:

Main Entry: 2re·gen·er·ate
Pronunciation: ri-'je-n&-"rAt
Function: verb
intransitive senses
1 : to become formed again
2 : to become regenerate : REFORM
3 : to undergo regeneration
transitive senses
2 a : to generate or produce anew; especially : to replace (a body part) by a new growth of tissue b : to produce again chemically sometimes in a physically changed form
3 : to restore to original strength or properties
- re·gen·er·a·ble /-'je-n&-r&-b&l, -'jen-r&-/ adjective

For more info on regeneration go to britannica.com

[cornholioprime]

CK are MDC all the way through, but have internal organs.

They bleed.

They do everything you and I do (biologically speaking), except sweat and breed...although sexual relations are possible.

If you trim his extremities, he becomes GimpyKnight, wielder of the Energy Cosmic! Until something "concrete" comes down from PB, they do NOT regrow lost body parts.

here you go, Something Official:
Phase World Pg#101 mid-way down the Right Column
Under Powers of the Cosmo Knight:

5. Bio-regeneration: 1D4x10 M.D.C. per minute.

The definitionof Bio-regeneration:

Main Entry: re·gen·er·a·tion
Pronunciation: ri-"je-n&-'rA-sh&n, "rE-
Function: noun
1 : an act or the process of regenerating: the state of being regenerated
3 : renewal or restoration of a body or bodily part after injury or as a normal process

Do you want the definitions of regenerating and regenerated?
regenerating:

Main Entry: 2re·gen·er·ate
Pronunciation: ri-'je-n&-"rAt
Function: verb
intransitive senses
1 : to become formed again
2 : to become regenerate : REFORM
3 : to undergo regeneration
transitive senses
2 a : to generate or produce anew; especially : to replace (a body part) by a new growth of tissue b : to produce again chemically sometimes in a physically changed form
3 : to restore to original strength or properties
- re·gen·er·a·ble /-'je-n&-r&-b&l, -'jen-r&-/ adjective

For more info on regeneration go to britannica.com

Santa, are you arguing that Cosmo-Knights do regrow limbs, or are you arguing that they do not??

In ALL of Palladium, from PFRPG to Splicers to Chaos Earth to Dimension Books to Rifts: Proper, there has been a 100% consistent Rule in Canon: Creatures that can regenerate, whether by Magical or Mundane means, can heal damage (for Game Play Purposes, presumably), but do NOT regrow missing limbs or organs unless SPECIFICALLY stated for that Creature/OCC/RCC. KevSim even has guidelines in the RMB for Charcaters that lose Organs or Limbs. Dictionary definition may be one thing, but the Author(s) of Rifts have their own meaning for what goes on in their Books, in Canon anyhow.

When you think about it, even we Humans (as well as ALL multicellular Life Forms on this planet) regenerate. We just don't regenerate like, say, a Lizard, or an Earthworm, or a Starfish.....

[Sir_Spirit]

Santa, are you arguing that Cosmo-Knights do regrow limbs, or are you arguing that they do not??

If you can't figure out that , then responding to the rest of your post is useless.
Except that:

In ALL of Palladium, from PFRPG to Splicers to Chaos Earth to Dimension Books to Rifts: Proper, there has been a 100% consistent Rule in Canon: Creatures that can regenerate, whether by Magical or Mundane means, can heal damage (for Game Play Purposes, presumably), but do NOT regrow missing limbs or organs unless SPECIFICALLY stated for that Creature/OCC/RCC

IN you eyes maybe, not in mine.
_____________________________________________________________

Also, why would the forge give them the ability to regenerate at all, if it could be undone by someone simply cutting off the body parts.
Such an obvious weakness would be as well known as their vulnerability to magic.
It doesn't make sense to me that it would rebuild them to regenerate in such a limited fashion and then send them out to battle every evil in the galaxies....

[cornholioprime]

Santa, are you arguing that Cosmo-Knights do regrow limbs, or are you arguing that they do not??

If you can't figure out that , then responding to the rest of your post is useless.
Except that:

In ALL of Palladium, from PFRPG to Splicers to Chaos Earth to Dimension Books to Rifts: Proper, there has been a 100% consistent Rule in Canon: Creatures that can regenerate, whether by Magical or Mundane means, can heal damage (for Game Play Purposes, presumably), but do NOT regrow missing limbs or organs unless SPECIFICALLY stated for that Creature/OCC/RCC

IN you eyes maybe, not in mine.

Kestrel has the phrase as part of (his? her?) Signature, "If the Group has fun then there's no wrong way to do it." Once again, I point out that what you and your Players agree to is one thing. Asking Questions in a Post is quite another. It's impossible for reponses to a given Post to argue anything but Canon...unless, of course, you set up/start a Post with non-Canonical Rules, and then ask the rest of us our Opinions...
_____________________________________________________________

Also, why would the forge give them the ability to regenerate at all, if it could be undone by someone simply cutting off the body parts.
Such an obvious weakness would be as well known as their vulnerability to magic.
It doesn't make sense to me that it would rebuild them to regenerate in such a limited fashion and then send them out to battle every evil in the galaxies..."

For whatever reason, the Author(s) have apparently decided that the CK cannot regenerate Limbs or Organs; probably Game Balance, or some such.

The onus is on you to show the rest us where in Rifts that the word 'regeneration' ALSO automatically means regrowing Arms and limbs,

A]] For EVERY Creature ever made by the Author(s), whenever they are allowed to regenerate Organs and Limbs, the Author goes out of his way to make such statements as "....can completely regrow a severed arm or leg in ______ days," or "....can completely regenerate a new _________ overnight!!" or even "unless ___________ is decapitated and then burned to ashes" or "unless ____________ is removed from the monster's ___________, the creature will completely regenerate within 4D6 Hours...."

B]]TWO Examples amongst MANY, over DOZENS of Books:

Both Kreeghor and Royal Kreeghor are said to be a at least minor SN Beings, but while the Kreeghor regenerate only normal damage, The Royal and Emperor Kreeghor ".....regenerate Limbs, Organs, and Eyes in 1D4 hours!!!" In EVERY case where the Creature in question regenerates Limbs and Organs, KS and Co. GO OUT OF THEIR WAY to tell you how long it takes.

Both Sea Titans and Jannissaries (essentially enhanced Humans, although one is genetic and the other a minor SN creature) are said to 'regenerate,' but again, the Authors of the Books are not only CAREFUL to say which of the two can regenerate Limbs and Organs (The Sea Titan CAN, but the Jannisary CANNOT), and they once again take pains to tell you how long it takes for the Character that CAN regrow Limbs and Organs to do so.

C]] Even mundane Creatures from ALL WALKS OF LIFE often have the word "regenerate" in their Descriptions/Attributes. The word 'regenerate' is even often used for Psychics and Mystics/Mages who meditate to regain HP/SDC/PPE at an increased rate. Are you telling us that if the Author uses the word 'regenerate' in the description of a meditating normal Human Mage or Psychic, that they SUDDENLY get the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs where they could not before??? Or are you telling us that a Mage who rests on a Ley Line or in a Magic Pyramid INSTANTLY gets the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs, no matter what species (s)he is??

[Overlord Rikonius]

C]] Even mundane Creatures from ALL WALKS OF LIFE often have the word "regenerate" in their Descriptions/Attributes. The word 'regenerate' is even often used for Psychics and Mystics/Mages who meditate to regain HP/SDC/PPE at an increased rate. Are you telling us that if the Author uses the word 'regenerate' in the description of a meditating normal Human Mage or Psychic, that they SUDDENLY get the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs where they could not before??? Or are you telling us that a Mage who rests on a Ley Line or in a Magic Pyramid INSTANTLY gets the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs, no matter what species (s)he is??

Yes, but the limbs of the psychic regrow as some funky lumpy mass of brain tissue

[Sir_Spirit]

Once again, I point out that what you and your Players agree to is one thing. Asking Questions in a Post is quite another. It's impossible for reponses to a given Post to argue anything but Canon...unless, of course, you set up/start a Post with non-Canonical Rules, and then ask the rest of us our Opinions...

You are assuming that if they don't say that they can regrow their limbs then just having bioregernerate doesn't mean that they can. Showing examples that they say specifically that certain creatures with regeneration can regrow their limbs only proves that regenerate can regrow limbs.
_____________________________________________________________

Also, why would the forge give them the ability to regenerate at all, if it could be undone by someone simply cutting off the body parts.
Such an obvious weakness would be as well known as their vulnerability to magic.
It doesn't make sense to me that it would rebuild them to regenerate in such a limited fashion and then send them out to battle every evil in the galaxies..."

For whatever reason, the Author(s) have apparently decided that the CK cannot regenerate Limbs or Organs; probably Game Balance, or some such. [/quote]

That not only makes no sense but IT IS JUST YOUR PERSONAL OPINION-IT IS NOT CANNON!

The onus is on you to show the rest us where in Rifts that the word 'regeneration' ALSO automatically means regrowing Arms and limbs,

No, the onus is on you to prove that having regeneration doesn't allow you to regrow limbs/organs.
Or rather to disprove that regerneration allows you to regrow limbs/organs.
The many example where they specifically state that they can regrow thier organs just proves me right.

A]] For EVERY Creature ever made by the Author(s), whenever they are allowed to regenerate Organs and Limbs, the Author goes out of his way to make such statements as

No, that is just your opinion, I've yet to see any proof that the authors only wanted the specifically named creatures to be the only ones who could regrow limbs/organs.

B]]TWO Examples amongst MANY, over DOZENS of Books:

Both Kreeghor and Royal Kreeghor are said to be a at least minor SN Beings, but while the Kreeghor regenerate only normal damage, The Royal and Emperor Kreeghor ".....regenerate Limbs, Organs, and Eyes in 1D4 hours!!!" In EVERY case where the Creature in question regenerates Limbs and Organs, KS and Co. GO OUT OF THEIR WAY to tell you how long it takes.

So in other words, they specifically state that regeneration lets you regrow limbs. Do they state in their descriptions:"Kreegor, like all the other creatures wiht regeneration, con't regrow their limbs(unless specifically stated other wise)"
No? Cause I don't see that written anywhere.

It doesn't even say that they "regenerate only normal damge" as you stated. That is just an assumption on your part.

In fact it just look's like they were pointing out how fast their bioregeneration was compared to the slower regen the normal Kreegor's have.

Both Sea Titans and Jannissaries (essentially enhanced Humans, although one is genetic and the other a minor SN creature) are said to 'regenerate,' but again, the Authors of the Books are not only CAREFUL to say which of the two can regenerate Limbs and Organs (The Sea Titan CAN, but the Jannisary CANNOT), and they once again take pains to tell you how long it takes for the Character that CAN regrow Limbs and Organs to do so.

When they state how long it takes to regenerate damage, that is to help give you an idea of how powerful their regeneration is. It does not some how imply or state that others can't regrow limbs and organs unless they specifically do so.

C]] Even mundane Creatures from ALL WALKS OF LIFE often have the word "regenerate" in their Descriptions/Attributes

.

And they gained this from the Comsic forge so that they could go out and fight EVil across three whole galaxies?
Oh, that's right THEY AREN'T!
And when they can it usually refer's to their ability to regrow their own limbs and organs. Not to their ability to heal.

The word 'regenerate' is even often used for Psychics and Mystics/Mages who meditate to regain HP/SDC/PPE at an increased rate.

They don't have the abiltiy to BIO-regenerate their HP?SDC?PPE in their descriptions to they?
The CK's do.

Or are you telling me that they Cosmic forge would send out it's supposed champions to fight against the Dominators, Splugorth, and other highly intellegent foes who would quickly figure out their inablility to grow back their organs?
And would thus be able to keep one captured by simply cuttingoff it's limbs and eyes?
It seems to me that they would have mentioned this big weakness your giving them.

[Borast]

No offence Santa...but he's right.

All creatures capable of doing more than simply healing themselves of "damage," specifically state they can regrow arms/legs/organs somewhere in the write-up.

Bio-Regeneration is simply a fancy phrase for "heals really quickly." Otherwise, any psychic with Bio-Regeneration could regrow lost appendages, and they can not.

This is also why in HU they now have two powers (that I can think of) that specifically allow you to regrow lost parts...Divine Healing and Healing Ultima, where Healing Factor can not.

[Sir_Spirit]

All creatures capable of doing more than simply healing themselves of "damage," specifically state they can regrow arms/legs/organs somewhere in the write-up.

Correction, you belive that anycreature that doesn't specifically state this can't do it. No where doesn it state they unless stated other with bio-regen doesnt equal growth.
Also we are not talking about most other creatures. We are talking about guys that are designed to go against soem of the worst villiansa in the three galaxies. So why give them that weakness?
I've yet to see anyone address this. All you doo is talk about everyone else. ARe the CK's anyhone else?
NO! They're FRIKKEN COSMO KNIGHTS!

Bio-Regeneration is simply a fancy phrase for "heals really quickly."

No it means "to regenerate damage."

Otherwise, any psychic with Bio-Regeneration could regrow lost appendages, and they can not.

No it specifically state's that they can't.

This is also why in HU they now have two powers (that I can think of) that specifically allow you to regrow lost parts...Divine Healing and Healing Ultima, where Healing Factor can not.

Wrong again!
I see no reason why healing factor can't regen a body part. Besides your opinion that it can't. It was in the original HU()where it was the only such power) and it was no doubt inspired by Wolverine type of supers and they can regenerate body parts.

[Sir_Spirit]

To sum up your arguements cornholio and borast.
PB has written a many times that characters with Bio-regen can regrow lost limbs in a certan amount of time.
However it hasn't always stated this with every character/rcc/occ/etc...

No it you wanted to jsut say that not all characters with regen can automatically have regen, OK.
After all soem cases liek with the super psychic power say that they dont' regrow lost limbs...

........but instead you are trying to say that regen that doesn' say the time it takes to regrow lost limbs therefore can't regrow lost limbs.

What's worse is that your trying to back up your opinion using your opinion as examples.
None of the examples have proven anything except that in your opinion the characters who don't specifically state that they can regrow limbs can't do so.
They dont' say that in the example you listed however.
ANd WE aren't talking about jsut anyoen. We are talkingabout CK's here.
Think about it.
It you could make them into Gimpknights so easily then why don't they point out this weakness. I see no reason why it wouldn't be just as known( if not even better known) as their weakness to magic.
I've yet to see anyone address this point.

[Borast]

Actually, Wolverine can't regrow body parts...he can heal otherwise fatal damage to them, but nor regrow them. If someone were to cut off his hand, he couldn't regrow it.

As for Healing Factor, HU:R states "Heals 10x faster," and the only time it mentions regeneration is an instant recovery of 2D6HP twice a day. HU:2 is the same. No where does it say regrow. In fact, the two powers I noted earlier are the only two that specifically state they can regrow lost parts.

As for CKs...all it says in their description is Bio-regenerates damage. But, in the same book, the Royal Kreeghor, Kreeghor Emperor, and Killer Beetles all both bio-regenerate AND are capable of regrowing body parts.
All other races capable of Bio-Regeneration have no such notation.

Among Dragons, ONLY the Hydra specifically is listed as being able to regrow body parts.

Unfortunately, there seems to be no canon to support EITHER of our positions...so, submit the question to the Gods of Palladium...

[Sir_Spirit]

Actually, Wolverine can't regrow body parts...

Yes he can. In some alternate realities he's lost a hand. His andamantium(with he got back after magneto took out) would make it hard to cut off his hand, though....

As for Healing Factor, HU:R states "Heals 10x faster," and the only time it mentions regeneration is an instant recovery of 2D6HP twice a day. HU:2 is the same. No where does it say regrow. In fact, the two powers I noted earlier are the only two that specifically state they can regrow lost parts

.

Well, they aren't, but whatever. And that's still just your personal opinion that it can't regrow just because it doesn't specifically say so....

.As for CKs...all it says in their description is Bio-regenerates damage. But, in the same book, the Royal Kreeghor, Kreeghor Emperor, and Killer Beetles all both bio-regenerate AND are capable of regrowing body parts.

And your assuming that the CK can't bio-regenerate a lost body part. The others list times just to give you an idea of how fast their dio-rregen works. No where doesn it state that they can't.

Among Dragons, ONLY the Hydra specifically is listed as being able to regrow body parts.

That's just due to their head thing and you know it.

Unfortunately, there seems to be no canon to support EITHER of our positions...so, submit the question to the Gods of Palladium...

And you have yet to address my point about how being able to turn a CK into Gimpyknight would be such an obviously glaring weakness that everyone would know about it.
So why don't they?

[Borast]

Among Dragons, ONLY the Hydra specifically is listed as being able to regrow body parts.

That's just due to their head thing and you know it.

And you have yet to address my point about how being able to turn a CK into Gimpyknight would be such an obviously glaring weakness that everyone would know about it.
So why don't they?

No...the Hydra's description INCLUDES the regeneration of the head. It also includes body parts and organs.

As for the rest of it...the Cosmo-Knight, like I said earlier, their description specifically states they can bio regenerate damage. You shoot them, break a bone, and open a wound, and the damage heals. It does not allow that they can regrow an arm blown off due to massive damage. Why? Simple...it's EASIER to simply shoot the CK until you kill it than try to shoot-off it's arms/legs, etc. That, plus how many times do you see a CK falling into someone's grasp and allowing them to mutilate them. Add to that, CKs do not have a segregated MDC. Whether you want to kill him/her, carve-out an eye, cut-off an arm, etc, you have to deplete ALL of their MDC.

However, hopefully we will see a canon response from PB on this matter shortly.

[Sir_Spirit]

No...the Hydra's description INCLUDES the regeneration of the head. It also includes body parts and organs.

In your opinion, that is....

As for the rest of it...the Cosmo-Knight, like I said earlier, their description specifically states they can bio regenerate damage...Whether you want to kill him/her, carve-out an eye, cut-off an arm, etc, you have to deplete ALL of their MDC.

IF the latter were true then they would show no signs of damage until they died.

If the former were true then my point still stands. It would be abig weakness and thus well known, and thus mentioned....

Hmm, I suppose I should post this is the Paladium Qand A section....

[cornholioprime]

C]] Even mundane Creatures from ALL WALKS OF LIFE often have the word "regenerate" in their Descriptions/Attributes. The word 'regenerate' is even often used for Psychics and Mystics/Mages who meditate to regain HP/SDC/PPE at an increased rate. Are you telling us that if the Author uses the word 'regenerate' in the description of a meditating normal Human Mage or Psychic, that they SUDDENLY get the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs where they could not before??? Or are you telling us that a Mage who rests on a Ley Line or in a Magic Pyramid INSTANTLY gets the ability to regrow Limbs and Organs, no matter what species (s)he is??

Yes, but the limbs of the psychic regrow as some funky lumpy mass of brain tissue

That goes DOUBLE for me.

[Sir_Spirit]

I asked this question in the Palladium Q&A forum Check it out....

..hopefully this will lead to something Official....

[Borast]

No...the Hydra's description INCLUDES the regeneration of the head. It also includes body parts and organs.

In your opinion, that is....

Nope...black letter in the Hydra description (Dragons and Gods) -
Super Regeneration (Special)...regenerate severed limb (hand,...tail) within 2D4 days
(Needless to say, I edited to keep within board rules... )

As for the rest of it...the Cosmo-Knight, like I said earlier, their description specifically states they can bio regenerate damage...Whether you want to kill him/her, carve-out an eye, cut-off an arm, etc, you have to deplete ALL of their MDC.

IF the latter were true then they would show no signs of damage until they died.

If the former were true then my point still stands. It would be abig weakness and thus well known, and thus mentioned....

Hmm, I suppose I should post this is the Paladium Qand A section....

I already sent the same question to the Feedback line. Ideally, we can find an answer from CJ or Kev...

[Sir_Spirit]

No...the Hydra's description INCLUDES the regeneration of the head. It also includes body parts and organs.

In your opinion, that is....

Nope...black letter in the Hydra description (Dragons and Gods) -
Super Regeneration (Special)...regenerate severed limb (hand,...tail) within 2D4 days
(Needless to say, I edited to keep within board rules... )

I already sent the same question to the Feedback line. I deally, we can find an answer from CJ or Kev...

1)And I stand by my assessment that it only mention the Super-Regen is because it deals with their heads. (cut off one and it become two and so forth) Thoug hIt does seem more powerful than the regenof other dragons. They made it that way because the other dragons can't get their heads cut off and survive.

2)Never heard of the Feedbackline.
So I asked it in the Q&A forum...
Either way we should get something....

[Sir_Spirit]

Since you brought up the point of dragons.....

Any being that it says their body rejects cybernetic/bionic implants do so because they regrow whatever was removed to implant the artifical system.

I remember Kev saying that the Dragon on the cover of "Rifts Conversion book" wasn't wearing a Cybernetic eye but tha it was jsu some sor tof scope thingy. That they couldnt' wear it because it would be rejected...
Since the Great Horned dragon hatchling doesn't say specifically that it can regrow stuff that destroy's your theory's basis....

[cornholioprime]

Since you brought up the point of dragons.....

Any being that it says their body rejects cybernetic/bionic implants do so because they regrow whatever was removed to implant the artifical system.

I remember Kev saying that the Dragon on the cover of "Rifts Conversion book" wasn't wearing a Cybernetic eye but tha it was jsu some sor tof scope thingy. That they couldnt' wear it because it would be rejected...
Since the Great Horned dragon hatchling doesn't say specifically that it can regrow stuff that destroy's your theory's basis....

Dragons are one of the VERY few RCCs ( I believe that Faerie Folk and Demons/Deevils are the other two) that don't have a consistent description of how they regenerate in the Rifts Series. My understanding, however, is that all Dragons, regardless of subspecies, regenerate (or 'heal,' or 'recuperate,' or 'bio-regenerate,' or 'regain;' the Authors use ALL of these phrases interchangeably throughout the Rifts Books) Organs and Limbs, except where otherwise indicated (The Basilisk is a notable exception -can NOT regenerate its Eyes). The VAST MAJORITY of the so-called 'creatures of magic' do have the ability to replace Limbs and Organs, including but not limited to Dragons, Faerie Folk, Sphinxes, Demons/Deevils, and so on. It is also my Understanding that Dragons have a more accurate description of their abilities from the PFRPG Books -And Kev once said in an early Book that he brought Palladium Dragons directly over from PFRPG into Rifts. In fact, there is a Great Horned Dragon that had to have some sort of Super-Spell performed on it to stop one of its Eyes from growing back ("Barrtk Krror," Rifts: Siege on Tolkeen #6: Final Siege).

(Since I have almost no Palladium Books, I can't tell you personally if Dragons and other Creatures of Magic have more accurate Descriptions of how they regenerate, but was told that their Healing Powers are described more fully in those Books) Got PFRPG, anyone???

[Sir_Spirit]

blahblahblah

I DO have the pfrpg, and Dragon and Gods...

And if you think Palladium is consistant in ANY of it's descriptions you need to get alot more of their books....

....that's another point.
You seem to think that Palladium books ingeneral is consistant in it's descriptions when it quite well known that their text is almost universilly unclear on various points-regen included...

...and you arguement only works if they are consistancly clear, sise they aren't, then your opint doesn't really work. Not that it would work anyway....

[Borast]

It is also my Understanding that Dragons have a more accurate description of their abilities from the PFRPG Books -And Kev once said in an early Book that he brought Palladium Dragons directly over from PFRPG into Rifts.

Actually...no it doesn't. There is absolutely no mention anywhere about dragons being able to regenerate lost body parts. Well...other than the hydra.

There is even canonical evidence they can't, since there is one dragon who's wing sails have been shreaded to the point where it could no longer fly (and would not)...might have been a symptom of the radiation it was emitting, but you never know!

[cornholioprime]

It is also my Understanding that Dragons have a more accurate description of their abilities from the PFRPG Books -And Kev once said in an early Book that he brought Palladium Dragons directly over from PFRPG into Rifts.

Actually...no it doesn't. There is absolutely no mention anywhere about dragons being able to regenerate lost body parts.

Rifts: Siege on Tolkeen: Final Siege. Baartrk Krror (a Great Horned Dragon AND Dragon King) had to have special Atlantis-based Bio-Wizardry performed on him to prevent his Eye from growing back once they cut it out (he lost to Styphon himself, and was held captive/tortured after beating Styphon nearly senseless, but then falling to treachery from Styphon). There are other examples in Rifts of Dragons who have to have powerful Magicks worked on them to stop the Dragon's Healing Abilities from taking hold....

[Borast]

Cornholio...I was REFERRING to PF books...

They have no more (or less) info than RIFTS...

[cornholioprime]

Cornholio...I was REFERRING to PF books...

They have no more (or less) info than RIFTS...

Roger-Roger.