A Heresy of the most paramount nature in Rifts

[BruicNanSgahan]

A Rifts campaign done in SDC instead of MDC.....How do yall feel about it...Have any of yall done it...if so how did it go have any suggestions on how to best do it...was it hard for you...if you dont like why (other than you like using MDC)......thanks

[Nekira Sudacne]

heard of it tired, several on the boards have their own system.

me? I love MDC just the way it is

*waits for the standard lineup of systems to come in*

[grandmaster z0b]

This has been discussed many, many times and I'm sure you'll find a wealth of information if you do a search. My opinion is that Rifts works better with AR, if not necessarily going to full SDC. I play 1 MDC = 10 SDC, others play 1 MDC can equal 2, 5, 20, 25 or higher in SDC. I was actually quite against this to begin with but actually enjoy it a lot more now. My two main reasons are;

1) weapons aren't as powerful so you can use cover without it getting blown away in 2 seconds and a firefight in a building will not blow it to smithereens after 2 melee rounds.

2) AR makes combat faster and more realistic, at least that's my opinion.

Also it means that now not everybody is getting around in full MDC EBA. A dog boy in half armour (AR 16) can still survive a single blast from a laser pistol if it gets past the armour but they will be out of the battle. So if that dogboy is a player they need medical treatment but that MDC blast is not instant death, if they are an enemy they are out of the battle after one good shot.

I like the idea of 50 cal machine guns and LAWs still being scary weapons but not as good as a railgun or mini-missiles.

Finally I feel that there is a problem with the damages of vehicle weapons particularly tanks and robots, upping them by another x2, x3 and x100 is hard when hand weapons are so powerful already. By lowering MDC I can more readily adjust the damages of railguns, plasma canons and tank guns without making them ridiculously powerful.

Edit: because I had more to say

[grandmaster z0b]

1) weapons aren't as powerful so you can use cover without it getting blown away in 2 seconds and a firefight in a building will not blow it to smithereens after 2 melee rounds.

What do you think about beam/projectile weapons not destroying buildlings/cover but passing through leaving relatively small holes? I've been toying around with the idea that SDC cover doesn't provide cover but does provide concealment. So if a guy with a laser rifle shoots at a guy hiding behind a pre-rifts car he has a negative to hit, but if he does hit it is for full damage. Meanwhile MDC explosives still destroy SDC structures.
I'm also thinking about using the beam/bullet hole idea to have less than lethal MDC breakthrough (i.e. 6 MDC damage hits an SDC creature wearing armor with 4 MDC left). An SDC character with breakthrough would go into shock but may survive if they receive prompt medical attention, and even then may require cybernetics to fully recover.

Yeah that's the way I sort of play it anyway - technically I play 1MDC = 10 SDC but in general I don't bother to work out the math for cover. A boulder would provide good cover while an SDC car will provide some cover but a clear shot through the car would only take away a quarter or half the damage.

[Natalya]

I was thinking about Rifts with just SDC. I'm thinking of taking my PF game dimension-hopping, and what better culture shock than Rifts? But I'm a new GM, and I'm not sure I can control the damage well enough to keep from killing the PCs stupidly. I can't change the MDC=SDC ratio, because it's a shared universe, and the other two GMs are comfortable using MDC.

Plus, I'll admit, my first MDC game as a player left a very bad taste in my mouth. I thought it a little unfair that when another PC wanted to play a practical joke on my vegetation-based alien PC, and asked for plant-eating bugs that would inflict pain and no damage. The GM allowed it, and after the bugs were set loose said that aphids would actually do 70 MDC damage. In an SDC world, aphids might do 7 SDC points - and that's only if the PC needed to be taught a lesson or I was feeling particularly mean or something. I know everyone says Rifts is high damage, but I don't see how it's fair that things like bugs do so much in an MDC environment. The other player felt bad that his character's joke had gone so horribly wrong.

[Rex]

I admit, I've wanted to try it...

But it just seems so, well, dirty.

[BruicNanSgahan]

Thanks guys and gals I really appreciate the insight on the MDC to SDC Rifts it has really been helpful.

[Nekira Sudacne]

1) weapons aren't as powerful so you can use cover without it getting blown away in 2 seconds and a firefight in a building will not blow it to smithereens after 2 melee rounds.

What do you think about beam/projectile weapons not destroying buildlings/cover but passing through leaving relatively small holes? I've been toying around with the idea that SDC cover doesn't provide cover but does provide concealment. So if a guy with a laser rifle shoots at a guy hiding behind a pre-rifts car he has a negative to hit, but if he does hit it is for full damage. Meanwhile MDC explosives still destroy SDC structures.
I'm also thinking about using the beam/bullet hole idea to have less than lethal MDC breakthrough (i.e. 6 MDC damage hits an SDC creature wearing armor with 4 MDC left). An SDC character with breakthrough would go into shock but may survive if they receive prompt medical attention, and even then may require cybernetics to fully recover.

I've always given large structures, such as houses, bases, and fortifications and walls, MDC per 10x10 block.


for instance, in my games a standard CS Baracade wall around a base has 200 MDC per 10x10 wall. so if you hit a section with a volley of Armor Peircing mini missles for say 240, you have blow a 10x10 hole in the wall and can now try to go though into the base. the rest of the wall is still standing however.

I've also been toying with the idea of doing something similar with Deaths Head Transports, APC's, and similar large transport vehicles sinse you should be able to blow holes in it without wreaking the whole thing.


I took this idea off of the old Robotech RPG, in which very large ships had MDC per X by X section of the hull and interior walls, while retaining an overall 20,000+ MDC before the ship itself breaks apart. so you can blow holes in a Carrier ship and get in without waiting for the whole thing to blow up.

[Rex]

I admit, I've wanted to try it...

But it just seems so, well, dirty.

Has Darklord told you how my game's going? It sure sounds like he has.

I didn't know you two gamed together...

I'm going to try to visit when I'm home in August.

[Nekira Sudacne]

I admit, I've wanted to try it...

But it just seems so, well, dirty.

Has Darklord told you how my game's going? It sure sounds like he has.

I didn't know you two gamed together...

I'm going to try to visit when I'm home in August.

online game. yes, i'm in it too.

[grandmaster z0b]

I don't like the idea. It would mess up the game. Weapons like the 50 cal machine guns and LAWs can not hurt most heavily armor stuff out there now. They should not be doing much damage to MDC stuff at all. A LAW would be lucky if it could punch through the back of any main battle tank out there today let alone any type of PA in rifts.

Yeah but what about a LAW or a 50 cal hitting a guy in body armour?
Even if the armour itself was indestructible that would still really hurt the person inside.

[Killer Cyborg]

A Rifts campaign done in SDC instead of MDC.....How do yall feel about it...Have any of yall done it...if so how did it go have any suggestions on how to best do it...was it hard for you...if you dont like why (other than you like using MDC)......thanks

I ran a few adventures for an all Vagabond party that took place in an SDC town. There was some MDC, like a Big Boss ATV or two, but all combat was SDC.
Later I started working in more MDC, like a lone, wounded xiticix soldier... and some demons with only 1 MDC each...

[grandmaster z0b]

I think people play Rifts for the setting rather than the system.

I don't think there's anything wrong with tweaking the system to the way the players and GM see fit. I rarely say this but KS does point out that all rules are optional.