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[DhAkael]

Debate time again.
Time for all us fan-geeks to yet again do that old sand-box arguement "Who can beat up on whom?" in the megaverse.
This time, the question is which settings' capital ships are the most dangerous.
It will be arbitrary, as the game systems are pretty much in-compatible, but who cares?!
I'd like opinions anyways, based on geek knowledge and personal tastes

FYI: Robotech ships will NOT be included in the poll. There are enough postings & debates on their relative superiority (or inferiority) on this board as is

[Killer Cyborg]

Are the Vorlons included with the Babylon 5 crowd?

[cornholioprime]

This one's easy.

The WorldShip V-Ger (Star Trek: The Motion Picture) beats all!!!!

[Ice Dragon]

Phase World/Rifts/Robotech: SDF-3

[DhAkael]

I had to go for the WH40K universe my self.
Not for any technical reasons, but on sheer style alone.
Plus it is hard to beat the sheer age of some of the Terran warships.
Some of those 4 mile long vessels are sveral centuries old, and can still dish out exterminatus on heretics while taking a beating themselves.


And then there are the eldar ships...not too hardy, and their firepower is somewhat 'focussed', but for sheer manuverablity nothing in their size class comes close.

Runner-up of course is Starwars ships; I'm a sucker for that universe (even if Lucas himself has tried everything in his power to kill it / make it un-cool).

[Josh Sinsapaugh]

Well, seeing that a majority of those other universes (including Star Wars) would be S.D.C. (and don't argue that, people get hit with blasters in Star Wars and don't die...hell, in Return of the Jedi, Luke gets hit in the hand and shakes it off) I'm gonna have to say Phase World.

Especially seeing that Carella wrote the first two books.

[DhAkael]

Well, seeing that a majority of those other universes (including Star Wars) would be S.D.C. (and don't argue that, people get hit with blasters in Star Wars and don't die...hell, in Return of the Jedi, Luke gets hit in the hand and shakes it off)

Y'know...I never thought of it "THAT" way...hmmm
But it can also be argured that personal weapons are SDC, but things like the SD's and AT-At's are MEGA damage..but I digress.
If the Cap-Ships are SDC, then the have a HELLUVALOT of SDC points and AR

[Dr. Doom III]

hell, in Return of the Jedi, Luke gets hit in the hand and shakes it off)

That was his bionic hand.

[gaby]

You Forgot Battlestar Galactica.

What do you think of the Old and New One?

What about the Other Ships?

[Vrykolas2k]

I voted Yamato...

[DhAkael]

You Forgot Battlestar Galactica.

What do you think of the Old and New One?

What about the Other Ships?

Not enough info on the Cap. ships...though the new B-Star Galcatica IS able to survive a near point-blank 5 kilotonne nuke hit.
I just haven't seen the darn thing use anything besides its AAA batteris (same for the Cylon basestar) thus I left BStar Ver. 2.0 out of this particular survey.
When Season 2 hits, then I'll maybe repost this poll with BSG listed

P.S.; I refuse to acknowledge the 1970 series...bad dico era flashbacks

[Syndicate]

What? would the mechanoids fall under Phase World? I guess...I will vote Mechanoids. I don't think I have to explain why.

[DhAkael]

What? would the mechanoids fall under Phase World? I guess...I will vote Mechanoids. I don't think I have to explain why.

Never included 'Mechanoids' due to fact it is a moot point.
"A mechanoid mother-ship shows up and sends out it's battlecruiser compliment with full Wasp support...can I see your character sheets?"
--RIIIIIIIPPPPPPPripripripripriprip--
"Thank you...next campiagn / universe....roll up new characters!"

[The Beast]

What? We can't include Captin Gloval from Robotech or the one from Star Blazers?

[DhAkael]

What? We can't include Captin Gloval from Robotech or the one from Star Blazers?

Oh, you can include the Cpt. from 'Space Cruiser Yamato'
Which is what Star-Blazers was made from ( a heavily basterized and butchered edit of the S.C.Y. series).
I do not acknowledge Star-Blazers (though their voice actor for Leader Desslock was dead-on); Yamato only
And for those of you who haven't picked up an anime magizine, the Cpt.'s name was Okita, while 'Wildstar's real name is Kodai
Yeah...I'm a geek...sue me

[DhAkael]

Great poll full of tough choices with many of the series I am well familiar with - raised a sci-fi geek...

But my vote goes to the God-Emperor and his holy Battlefleet Gothic. The ships are tremendous, take a beating and still dish out exterinatus because they thought about it. I dont know how many of you are familiar with Battlefleet Gothic and or Warhammer 40K to begin with...however the descriptions of the armaments on the Cathedral ships; from smallest courier to the mother of them all: Emperor-class Battleship ( *drool* ), are well thought out with physics (to the greatest extent possible) taken into considerationg to make it seem real (like many other sci-fi shows).

What I dont get is why something with such an awesome array cant completely destroy a Space Hulk with one volley... >.>

Two reasons:
#1; Archaeotech. There have got to be dozens of weird devices on any particular 'hulk' some of which probably are powerful field generators.

#2; Sheer mass / size. Even the smallest 'hulk' is descibed as being the size of an Emperor-class...and as we all know, Emp.-Class dreadnaughts do NOT go down in one shot

[DhAkael]

Even though I personaly voted 'WH40K' for nastiest Cap-ships in the megaverse, I give place of signifigance to the Ships of the 'Earth Defense Forces' or "Space-force" from S.C.Y. (Yamato).
I know I know; WW2 naval ships as space-cruisers seesm silly, but hear me out...
The Yamato had THE most powerful wave-motion gun ever created (even the mighty Andromeda with its twin WMG's only had 50% of the total destructive force of Yamato's single gun), and it's shock-cannon batteries could, in a single volley, destroy a Gamelon battleship. Also, the ship just..would..not...DIE! During one of the most brutal engagements in the war against the Comet Empire (series #2), Yamato took shot after shot, round after round to its hull when ambushed by Desslers armada...for what was estimated at a full hour (compressed to within 22 minutes for us viewers)!
You have to admit, if it wasn't for S.C.Y. there wouldn't have been a SDF Macross, there wouldn't be Batlefleet Gothic, the D-Star (based off the Comet Empire) would have been just a cheesy laser ON a moon, and we certainly wouldn't have had the inside jokes in Starcraft about the 'Yamato cannons'

So in closing, I must tip my admirals cap to the creators of S.C.Y.; definately not a 1st place winner, but a major second for pop-cultural 'infection'

[Josh Sinsapaugh]

Well, seeing that a majority of those other universes (including Star Wars) would be S.D.C. (and don't argue that, people get hit with blasters in Star Wars and don't die...hell, in Return of the Jedi, Luke gets hit in the hand and shakes it off)

Y'know...I never thought of it "THAT" way...hmmm
But it can also be argured that personal weapons are SDC, but things like the SD's and AT-At's are MEGA damage..but I digress.
If the Cap-Ships are SDC, then the have a HELLUVALOT of SDC points and AR

One further note of digression.

The AT-STs get taken out by Ewok's with logs, rocks and sticks...not an M.D. vehicle from my viewpoint.

But thn somebody could simply argue that the AT-ST are S.D.C. and the Star Destroyers are M.D.

This is not the thread for such digression.

[DhAkael]

Looks like Star Wars wins, with Yamato in second place and Phase world comming in third.
Pity that WH40k didn't get it's due, but -eh-, whatchagonnadoaboudit!?
But yes; Star Wars Cap. ships ARE fearsomely powerful and dead-sexy...even the ones from the much lammented (but not beloved) prequels.

Next post; "Skarrins, Klingons & Kreeghor, oh my!"

[Kagashi]

Zentraedi, hands down. Its not on the list, im dissapointed.

[Kagashi]

there is no way S Wars is superior to S Trek.

Lasers do absolutly NO damage to S Trek shields of any kind. As a matter of a fact, there was an episode where the humans of Trek were ashamed to be engaged with ships who were armed with lasers cause it was such a one sided battle.

ALL S Wars ships (Capitol or not) use lasers as their energy weapons of choice. The ONLY way they could damage any Trek ships was to use concussion missiles/photon torpedoes and thats assuming that they are powerful enough to even damage those shields (being a Wars fan, I would say they do).

So that settles that...the Zentraedi would kill EVERYBODY.....

[Killer Cyborg]

there is no way S Wars is superior to S Trek.

Lasers do absolutly NO damage to S Trek shields of any kind. As a matter of a fact, there was an episode where the humans of Trek were ashamed to be engaged with ships who were armed with lasers cause it was such a one sided battle.

ALL S Wars ships (Capitol or not) use lasers as their energy weapons of choice. The ONLY way they could damage any Trek ships was to use concussion missiles/photon torpedoes and thats assuming that they are powerful enough to even damage those shields (being a Wars fan, I would say they do).

It is quite possible that the Star Wars lasers are far more powerful than the Star Trek lasers.
The Death Star beam looked like lasers, for example.

[Kagashi]

there is no way S Wars is superior to S Trek.

Lasers do absolutly NO damage to S Trek shields of any kind. As a matter of a fact, there was an episode where the humans of Trek were ashamed to be engaged with ships who were armed with lasers cause it was such a one sided battle.

ALL S Wars ships (Capitol or not) use lasers as their energy weapons of choice. The ONLY way they could damage any Trek ships was to use concussion missiles/photon torpedoes and thats assuming that they are powerful enough to even damage those shields (being a Wars fan, I would say they do).

It is quite possible that the Star Wars lasers are far more powerful than the Star Trek lasers.
The Death Star beam looked like lasers, for example.

Ill give you the Death Star. But still, we have to assume a laser is a laser is a laser, and a photon torpedo is a photon torpedo no matter what universe its in. Cause otherwise, this whole discussion is moot because who is to say what this technology is worse than the others?

I would say that Trek shields (at least Federation shields anyway) would have the ability of "immune to lasers".

[DhAkael]

Ok...lets do some logical and rational thinking.

Phasers = a Beam of photonic light with a neat name, streams in a continuous pulse until otherwise canceled - usually 3 to 5 secs, sometimes shorter. Has some added oomph (because of how there described in the ST Tech Manuals)

Lasers = a beam of photonic light with the original name, streams in a continuous pulse until otherwise canceled - usually 3 to 5 secs, sometimes shorter.

Now lets do a comparison of Capital Starships-

NCC-1701E USS Enterprise
6 Phaser Banks (or more, dont remember)
Photon Torpedos

VS

Imperial Star Destroyer
SIXTY Turbolaser Cannons
SIXTY Ion Cannons
Tractors beams

See the difference in numbers here? Also, Turbolasers are a much much more powerful kind of laser anyway, most likely parallel with Phasers in terms of fire power.

Let's not forget the Imp-Star Mk.2's 30 proton-torpedo luancers as well

[GaredBattlespike]

My vote is Star Trek. Why? Answer: The Borg! "We are the Borg. You will be assimilated. We have analyzed your offensive and defensive capabilities and have determined that you are incapable of withstanding us. Resistance is futile.Prepare to be assimilated."

[glitterboy2098]

the whole "phaser vs. turbo-laser" debate is pointless.

in my mind, you need to break this down further.

Best ships:
Best superweapon: deathstars, planetkillers and nova-bombs, OH MY!
Best fleet: numbers, training, supply, and tactics....
ect.


my votes...

Best ship: Enterprise-E gets top billing, although the Andromeda Acendant comes a close second (due to the fact you really never see it doing much fighting, and when it does, its against immense odds forcing retreats....) Impstar's come in third, through sheer intimidation factor, though i doubt their firepower or defenses are much better than the enterprise. (impstars seem to be more of a "landing craft-tank", rather than a battleship, designed to deliver lots of troops to a target with just enough naval support to cover them.)

Best super weapon: Nova-bombs, all the way. the deathstar gets second, the rest can only at best destroy the surface of a planet.

Best fleet: tough one. on size i'd say the Empire. on training i'd go with the federation.



unfortunately, phaseworld comes in dead last every time, slow, pathetically armed ships with really weak weapons ranges, militaries that are pretty pathetically weak (due either to bad stratagy (CCW) or through bad orginization (TGE) )

[bigwhitehound]

I say the VEIGER from ST. As for you who say SW your forgetting one thing. Lasers are useless in ST. So the death stars main gun would not even scrach the paint on a ST shuttle pod. Do to the Naviagation shield.

[rem1093]

Andromeda, all the way. it slipstreams in, launches one Nova Bomb, slipstreams out, sun explodes, everybody and everything in vaporized.
as for the star wars, star trek, debate. star wars no shields just deflectors, star trek shields and deflectors. no X-wing can shoot a missile into any hole on any star trek ship or station.

[DrBeau]

as for the star wars, star trek, debate. star wars no shields just deflectors, star trek shields and deflectors. no X-wing can shoot a missile into any hole on any star trek ship or station.

Actually, they're both the same. The ST shields are basically a boosted deflector shield. Also, SW's deflectors are shields, as when the Millennium Falcon was running from someone (prolly Imps) and Han is screaming something about losing the rear deflector. This would imply that the blasts coming from behind are hurting the deflector shield.

Also, the Enterprise-D is 640 meters long. The Star Destroyers come in 900 and 1600 meter versions, along with a Super Star Destroyer measuring almost 13 kilometers. You can't compare the armament situation of these things. This is not to say that Star Wars is better, just that comparing these things is like Apples and Oranges.

[bigwhitehound]

Not bull. Not at all. This is from the Daystrom Institute “The navigation shields also posses another intriguing property; they are immune to attack from laser weaponry. This is due to the trans-static flux effect which occurs as a by-product of the deflection process; when laser light impinges on a deflector field, the effect creates a small portal into subspace, causing the laser beam to pass harmlessly into this domain. As the beam is not subspace encased, it will re-emerge into normal space within a few milliseconds, putting it several hundred light seconds away. Since the beam never actually impacts on either the deflector shield or hull the power of the attack is irrelevant to the effect. This process is not regarded as a serious defensive measure, since laser weapons are considered obsolete by most major powers.”
So lasers can't be the same as phasers. If they were the would damage ST ships and wouldn't be considered obsolete.

[rem1093]

I always thought that phasers were more of a particle weapon. also if you use enterprise as history, they start out with plasma and go to phaser, and if they are lasers then it seems more of a back step to go from plasma to laser, well to me anyways.