cornholioprime wrote:If this is true, and the Spells listed create Objects made of PHYSICAL matter, then why can't you repair the material that's left after the Spell Duration elapses??
Because the armor vanishes when the spell duration elapses.
Just like most physical objects created by spells.
MORE IMPORTANTLY, IF THESE ARMOURS ARE MADE OF PHYSICAL ARMOR, THEN WHAT, PRAY TELL, ARE THEY MADE OF???
Good question.
Originally it wouldn't matter, but with the Mage/Armor rules I'd guess that the armor isn't made of metal...
WHAT'S THAT, LASSIE??
Asking dead TV dogs for help is a sign of immense desperation.
YOU SAY THAT NO TYPE OF PHYSICAL MATERIAL WHATSOEVER IS EVER LISTED???
WELL, GEE, THEN I GUESS THAT WITH A LACK OF EVIDENCE TO THE CONTRARY, THEY MUST BE COMPOSED OF MYSTICAL FORCE/ENERGY AFTER ALL......
Nice try.
As I have pointed out, the spells that create objects of mystical energy/force say so in the text.
B]] As stated in a previous Post, when you dispel a Armor Spell, you're left with.....NOTHING!! You can't magically dispel Physical matter out of existence. ergo, yu dispelled the MAGICAL Forces/Energies that the Suit was composed of.
Same thing applies to Throwing Stones, Wall of Not, and other spells that create physical objects on a temporary basis.
Nice Try (again with the Sarcasm from me!).
You didn't read the Spell Descriptions.
"Wall of Not" makes EXISTING Matter invisible.
Yup.
I was wrong there.
"Throwing Stones" pulls earth together to make Stones that are apparently enchanted to cause more damage.
NO indication whatsoever that a Throwing Stone itself goes away at the end of the Spell Duration; apparently, you're left with a pile of unenchanted Stones after the Spell elapses.
Actually, after the stone hits, it crumbles into dirt.
This supports your theory that the stones are made from magically affected dirt.
So that's two points for you.
-Cloud of Steam -Conjures Steam. NO mention of the Steam INSTANTLY vanishing if the Spell is dispelled; presumably, new Steam would stop being generated.
That's your presumption.
The spell doesn't say that it constantly creates steam for the entire duration of the spell.. it just says that it creates a cloud of steam.
-Miasma -essentially same as "Cloud of Steam," above.
Agreed, although I have a different take on things than you do.
-Orb of Cold -Summons PHYSICAL Ice, magically supercharges it. NO indication whatsoever that the Water/Ice in question goes away at Spell's end, just the enchantment.
Except for the part that says, "The orb disappears in one melee round (15 seconds) if it is not thrown."
If it IS thrown, then it shatters.
There is no reason to believe that any leftover shards do not disappear.
-Invisible Wall -ALL Elemental Walls, even those of Physical Matter, may be dispelled, "destroying" or "un-conjuring" the Physical Matter (BoM, page 79 and others). An exception to the "rule."
No, it is proof of the rule.
Any physical matter created by a spell with a time limit reacts the same way. It disappears when the spell ends or is canceled/negated.
Unless you can find mention in the books of those spells being exceptions...
-Wall of Clay -same as "Invisible Wall," above
-Wall of Stone -same as "Invisible Wall," above
-Wall of Thorns -same as "Invisible Wall," above
Yup.
They all prove the same thing; that magically created physical matter disappears when the duration ends or the spell is cancelled.
-River of Lava -Absolutely NO indication that the Lava, once conjured, would vanish at Spell's end or with a Dispel Magic. Presumably, the Lava Pool would cool down and harden afterwards..
The fact that the spell has a duration means that the effect ends afterward.
Why else would there be a duration? Just to keep the lava hot?
If that were the case, then there would be mention of the fact that the lava stayed and likely some mention of how quickly it takes to cool/harden.
-Wall of Iron -same as "Invisible Wall," above
-Cloud of Ash -same as "Cloud of steam" and "Miasma," above
-Wall of Ice -same as "Invisible Wall," above
-Create Fog -same as "Cloud of steam" and "Miasma," above
-Purple Mist -same as "Cloud of steam" and "Miasma," above
-Sheet of Ice -Absolutely NO indication that the Ice, once conjured, would vanish at Spell's end or with a Dispel Magic. Wet puddle on the floor once the Magic fails..
There is no mention of the ice melting when the spell ends. The duration is for the existence of the created material, just like with Wall of Ice and other spells.
-Hail -Inconclusive.
No reason to believe that the hail sticks around, but I'll admit that this spell is vaguer than the rest.
-Shards of Ice -The ONLY PHYSICAL Object in your List apart from the Elemental Walls, made of PHYSICAL Matter, that can be dispelled.
Really?
And where does it say that?
-Encase in Ice -similar to "Invisible Wall," above. ONLY the Warlock can make the Ice Block disappear and it apparently CANNOT be dispelled.
Sure it can, with a Negate Magic spell.
Just like most spells.
-Ten Foot Ball of Ice [color=blue]-the ONLY Spell in your List, involving PHYSICAL Matter, in which the Physical Matter vanishes once the Spell elapses.
Except for all the others, that is...
By the way, NONE of these PHYSICAL Objects created by these Spells seem to "go away" at Spell's end (not dispelled) EXCEPT for the 10-foot Ball of Ice.
Yes, they do.
That's what the duration is for.
You are desperately grasping at the fact that the spells do not specifically say, "Disappears when the spell ends"... but virtually no spells actually say that.
Globe of Daylight, for example, doesn't specifically say that the globe disappears when the duration ends, but it's safe to assume that it does.
That's the point of having a duration.
Invincible Armor has encumberance penalties.
[color=blue]That's fine.
You found ONE Magical Armor that has encumbrance Penalties.
You could say that.
Or you could say that one third of the Armor spells have encumberance penalties.
But wait....if you're trying to say that Encumbrance Penalties are the mark of a PHYSICAL Object, then by reverse inference, those Armor Spells that DON'T have those Penalties are made of MYSTICAL Energies...which, again, would not necesarily be subject to Physical Laws and therefore could co-exist in the same space (stacked together)....if necessary.
Nope.
As I already mentioned, Armor Bizzare is clearly a force creation.
That leaves Armor of Ithan, which is clearly enchanted to be Weightless and Noiseless... hence, no encumberance or prowl penalties.
E]] One other Area that ALL of us forgot: How is it that Magically enchanted Mages can cast the Spell onto others in the first place?? If the Armor in question is subject to normal Physical laws, and is COMPLETELY tangible, then why doesn't the Armor chop off the Fingers of the Casting Mage (has to touch the Target) once the Armor comes into existence??
That's like asking why casting Fireball doesn't scorch the mage's hand.
Magic spells have built in safety features to avoid that sort of thing.
You could run it however you want:
-The mage briefly touches the recipient, then pulls his hand away and the guy is in armor.
-The mage grabs ahold of the recipient's arm, and is suddenly holding onto the guy's armor once the spell goes off.
-Or any number of other special effects that you like, depending on whim and circumstance.
Or how about THIS Special Effect: The Armor is 'solid' to Attacks but 'intangible' to most everything else, depending on how the Armor's Spell is crafted??
Nope. Doesn't work that way... I think that the encumberance penalties, and the fact that only one of the spells creates armor made out of force clearly show that.
For that matter, how does ANY Character draw a Weapon once ensorcelled by an Armor Spell (if it was in a Scabard or holster, say, at his side), not to mention a whole host of possible Non-Combat Actions once the Spell came into effect UNLESS the Armor has the MAGICAL properties of being effectively intangible to the wearer but SOLID to attack??
It's magic.
One second you aren't wearing armor, the next second you are wearing armor. Your holster and ammo belts were strapped over your chest, now they're strapped over your chest plate.
Now THIS is rich.
You say that I am wrong to assume that a Wizard can make multiple Magical Armors stack on his person because the Armor in question doesn't necessarily follow Physical Laws..
...but you say that the Wizard's Items can appear ABOVE the Armor after Spell casting...because of Magic??? And with NO evidence whatsoever to back your Claim that said Items/Weapons change position??
Hey, make up whatever explanations that you want.
The real answer is probably that KS never really bothered to wonder about that sort of thing.
The fact that you have unresolved technical questions does not negate the fact that AoI and IA both create physical suits of armor.
And this is BEFORE one realizes that said Items/Weps MUST remain under the Magical Protection anyways, lest they become vulnerable to attack!! Ever heard of a Wizard's personal posessions taking damage whilst (s)he is fully protected by Magical Protections of ANY sort??? No, I didn't, either.
Really?
Huh. Happens all the time when I game.
But you probably use funky house-rules.
It's the same problem that tech guys have... either you wear something under your armor and cannot get it easily, or you wear it over your armor and it can be stolen/destroyed.
Of course, mages do have an advantage in that they can create force-fields and walls that protect them and all their gear.
If you have anything canon saying otherwise, feel free to quote it.
Quit while you're behind......
Again, I have to ask...
Has that tactic EVER worked...?