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Posted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:46 pm
by Dustin Fireblade
Wow, missed that then on the GB. (might help if I could actually get a chance to PLAY Chaos Earth).
Thanks Kalinda for checking.
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:58 am
by Ninjafingers
Thinyser wrote:In that regard it simply silly here is why:
hmm lets do some math in regards to the weight.
-the weight of the GB is 1.2 tons
fully loaded thats 2400 pounds
-the boomgun itself weighs 867 pounds
-the armor holds 10 gals of water (@8.3 pounds per gal thats 83 pounds) plus about 4 weeks of neutrient paste (assume 1 pound per day thats 28 pounds), and it has storage for a rifle pistol survival knife and a first-aid kit figure another 25 pounds for all that
-so we have the "fully loaded" starting weight of 2400 - 867 - 83 - 28 - 25 leaving a total of 1397 pounds left for the armor itself AND ammo for the boomgun.
If that doesn't make you say that 1000 rounds is WAY too much then look at the size of the rounds (7 inches long by approxamatly 2.25 diameter) in comparison to the drum magazine that sits across the shoulders of the GB. There is NO WAY that you could squeze 1000 7"x2.25" cylinders into that drum (which by my measurement is approxamatly 1.25' diameter and 4 feet long)....they just can't fit unless there was an extradimensional space inside and this is TECH not MAGIC so I doubt that is the case.
You are my new hero.
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 1:41 am
by Drakenred®™©
a couple of minor things
1) The book referes to the costs of SDC ammo (page 268) but theirs no listing of ANY SDC firearms in the main book that I have found( I may have missed it)
2) the "old" non CS missles are MIA
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:55 am
by Thinyser
Ninjafingers wrote:Thinyser wrote:In that regard it simply silly here is why:
hmm lets do some math in regards to the weight.
-the weight of the GB is 1.2 tons
fully loaded thats 2400 pounds
-the boomgun itself weighs 867 pounds
-the armor holds 10 gals of water (@8.3 pounds per gal thats 83 pounds) plus about 4 weeks of neutrient paste (assume 1 pound per day thats 28 pounds), and it has storage for a rifle pistol survival knife and a first-aid kit figure another 25 pounds for all that
-so we have the "fully loaded" starting weight of 2400 - 867 - 83 - 28 - 25 leaving a total of 1397 pounds left for the armor itself AND ammo for the boomgun.
If that doesn't make you say that 1000 rounds is WAY too much then look at the size of the rounds (7 inches long by approxamatly 2.25 diameter) in comparison to the drum magazine that sits across the shoulders of the GB. There is NO WAY that you could squeze 1000 7"x2.25" cylinders into that drum (which by my measurement is approxamatly 1.25' diameter and 4 feet long)....they just can't fit unless there was an extradimensional space inside and this is TECH not MAGIC so I doubt that is the case.
You are my new hero.
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:11 am
by dark brandon
Overlooking Crazies and Juicers, at 15th level crazies are better at auto-dodging than Juicers (With min stat requirements).
I think (But could be wrong) Juicers are missing a +1 at 15th level (which would put juicers and crazies on par with each other in the auto-dodging department).
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:46 am
by Gabriel_V
Drakenred wrote:2) the "old" non CS missles are MIA
Aren't they in a miniaturized version of the table at the end of the giant robot combat section?
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:14 pm
by Drakenred®™©
Gabriel_V wrote:Drakenred wrote:2) the "old" non CS missles are MIA
Aren't they in a miniaturized version of the table at the end of the giant robot combat section?
If you mean the one on page 363 that the same "New" table that is from CWC
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:22 pm
by Gabriel_V
Drakenred wrote:Gabriel_V wrote:Drakenred wrote:2) the "old" non CS missles are MIA
Aren't they in a miniaturized version of the table at the end of the giant robot combat section?
If you mean the one on page 363 that the same "New" table that is from CWC
My mistake then. Since the "new style" CS missiles were statted out in the CS section, I figured the tiny reproduction of the missile chart in the rules section was for the regular types.
Maybe that means all missiles are the "new style" type?
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 12:29 pm
by Drakenred®™©
Gabriel_V wrote:Drakenred wrote:Gabriel_V wrote:Drakenred wrote:2) the "old" non CS missles are MIA
Aren't they in a miniaturized version of the table at the end of the giant robot combat section?
If you mean the one on page 363 that the same "New" table that is from CWC
My mistake then. Since the "new style" CS missiles were statted out in the CS section, I figured the tiny reproduction of the missile chart in the rules section was for the regular types.
Maybe that means all missiles are the "new style" type?
aparently, even though they are just about the only post 105 era tech in the book
Granted I thought that the pre 105 tec missles were a bit underpowered
Unless I'm completely blind...
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 3:54 pm
by Awer
Unless I'm completely blind there doesn't seem to be a listing for the normal PPE of classes other than CyberKnights, Crazies, and mages.
Re: Unless I'm completely blind...
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 4:23 pm
by chaserone
Awer wrote:Unless I'm completely blind there doesn't seem to be a listing for the normal PPE of classes other than CyberKnights, Crazies, and mages.
Its usually 2d6 for normal and less for mind melters.
Re: Unless I'm completely blind...
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:33 pm
by Guest
Awer wrote:Unless I'm completely blind there doesn't seem to be a listing for the normal PPE of classes other than CyberKnights, Crazies, and mages.
It's 2D6 i thought. However, if you aren't playing a magic class, why would you need them?
Re: Unless I'm completely blind...
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 5:58 pm
by dark brandon
Res Sin Kai wrote:Awer wrote:Unless I'm completely blind there doesn't seem to be a listing for the normal PPE of classes other than CyberKnights, Crazies, and mages.
It's 2D6 i thought. However, if you aren't playing a magic class, why would you need them?
If you're playing a psi-stalker, you can drain psychics of all their PPE and 1/2 their ISP (A psi-stalker can feed on pychics). Also, sacrifices for mages.
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 9:04 pm
by Gabriel_V
The Glitter Boy OCC doesn't have the Pilot Power Armor skill.
Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:34 pm
by Gabriel_V
City Rats list a bonus to PPE and that it is reduced when they reach 22, but do not list a base.
Cyber Knights, Juicers, Glitter Boys, Merc Soldiers, Robot Pilots, Body Fixers, Cyber Docs, Operators, Rogue Scholars, Rogue Scientists, Vagabonds, Wilderness Scouts, do not list PPE.
In the old edition of Rifts, a base of 2d6 PPE was assumed when not listed. This default amount of PPE is not present in Rifts Ultimate.
Re: Unless I'm completely blind...
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:36 am
by Awer
Res Sin Kai wrote:Awer wrote:Unless I'm completely blind there doesn't seem to be a listing for the normal PPE of classes other than CyberKnights, Crazies, and mages.
It's 2D6 i thought. However, if you aren't playing a magic class, why would you need them?
Magic users can draw upon willing subjects PPE (up to 70%) as well as sacrifice people for 2x their base PPE.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:50 am
by Kalinda
I'm pretty sure this is an error, and it's kind of funny too.
In the Robot Pilot OCC, the PA pilot gets 2 suits of PA, but no other form of transport, meaning he has no way to carry his PA except to wear one and lug the other around on his back.
Meanwhile the Robot Pilot gets a giant robot plus another form of transport (car, hovercraft, hovercycle or the like.) Meaning that he has to leave one or the other behind when he goes anywhere. (or use the bot to carry the car around...)
I'm pretty sure that the note under Robot Pilot that mentions the extra transport was suppose to go under PA pilot. Either that or PA pilot was suppose to have a similar note, but it got left out.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:12 am
by TechnoGothic
What the Juicer PP minium again ??
Juicer OCC forgot to list it this time around
I wrote PP = +2d4 in my book so far.
Just missing the minium PP part still...
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:04 am
by TechnoGothic
Gheralt HellWalker wrote:I do believe the minimum is 20 but dont quote me on that.
yepp dug out my old RMB
Juicers +2d4 PP, Minium PP of 20, raise to 20 if lower...
cool.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:45 pm
by Rex
Not really an errata per se, but I don't think the Coalition Medics should start with Medical Dr as a skill. At least they shouldn't be corporals if they do have the skill.
Perhaps they should get the Field Surgery skill in CWC, I think it's in there, don't have it handy. And perhaps a new skill called Field Medicine which would only cover maladies common in a field environment. (Allergies, Hot/Cold weather injuries, etc.)
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:29 pm
by Thinyser
General_Sarkoff wrote:Basara_549 wrote:BTW, most military vehicles in REAL LIFE list their weight as it is without fuel and ammo, and only occasionally add a number for "fully loaded and fueled" as a second piece of data (though aircraft often include a Max T/O weight which includes fuel and weapons.)
1.2 tons could be the weight of the GB with Gun, or GB without gun - but it's perfectly within normal rules for military vehicles for declared weight to be without ammo and other consumables (or even Palladium products - a number of Robotech and Rifts items have had both empty and loaded weights given).
Yes but can you name a SINGLE vehicle whose ammo weighs 83% of the vehicles unloaded weight?
My point exactly, there is no precident for the GB to carry such a load of ammo....and it does state "fully loaded" weight as 1.2 tons (2400 lbs).
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:46 pm
by Jason Richards
Can we please keep this thread to listing errata, and leave the debate for the forums? I think that will maximize its utility to the Palladium staff.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:21 pm
by Thinyser
Jason Richards wrote:Can we please keep this thread to listing errata, and leave the debate for the forums? I think that will maximize its utility to the Palladium staff.
Well sure.... but some people disagree that it should be errata...I (and others) were simply pointing out the fact that a GB should not be ABLE to carry 1000 boomgun rounds that measure 7" by 2.25" and weigh about 2 pounds each.
The person who started the thread could easily go though the posts and EDIT their first post to show the errata that needs to be fixed so that we could ALL see what has been found and listed with a glance.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:56 pm
by Thinyser
March Hare wrote:body fixer has outdoorsmanship as an occ skill but the wilderness scout does not. is this errata or does the wilderness scout get his occ bonuses instead of a skill?
sounds like errata to me...WTH does a bodyfixer need outdoorsmanship for anyhow?
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:17 pm
by Kalinda
Don't know what kind of error this is, but on page 289 under "determine Psionics." they list the wilderness scout among the OCCs that get minor Psi abilities as part of their package. The OCC lists no such Psi abilities.
Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:22 pm
by killhound
i don't know if this is an error or not but shouldn't psi-stalkers be an rcc . if not i can't wait to make that dragon psi-stalker
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:02 am
by Kalinda
killhound wrote:i don't know if this is an error or not but shouldn't psi-stalkers be an rcc . if not i can't wait to make that dragon psi-stalker
Two points, read the Psi stalker OCC, Page 154, under 'Racial requirements', then read a bit more about RCCs. particularly page 278, bottom of the first column, and page 148, second column under 'designer's notes.'
Basically, Psi stalkers can only be humans, and RCCs can't have another class.
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:58 am
by TechnoGothic
Tenchi Jeff wrote:Corporal??? For a Doctor?
Um, from what I know, a military M.D. would be either a "Specialist", or minimum rank of Captain (Hey, they gotta get good pay!)
CS Technical Officer MOS Medical
Corporal is a Level One Technical Officer...
Green, newbie...
2000 creds per month...
Went right from Basic training to the MOS training...no real experiance in the field yet...
"specialist" is CS Special Forces, CS Juicers, CS Strike Troopers Cyborgs
Level One : Lieutenant
Green Newbie...
Used to be a grunt though, so has experiance under their belt. Just new to this OCC...
2200 creds per month...
Hope that Helps...
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:20 pm
by demos606
March Hare wrote:Thinyser wrote:March Hare wrote:body fixer has outdoorsmanship as an occ skill but the wilderness scout does not. is this errata or does the wilderness scout get his occ bonuses instead of a skill?
sounds like errata to me...WTH does a bodyfixer need outdoorsmanship for anyhow?
Checked all occ's. Only body fixer and elemental fusionist have outdoorsmanship. none of the military occs get it either. little bit of an oops. house rule addition!
Isn't outdoorsmanship a decidedly "ameture" skill? Scouts should have more specific skills with better bonuses for everything outdoorsmanship covers anyway.
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:06 pm
by Killer Cyborg
RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Posted: Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:07 pm
by Killer Cyborg
RUE, p. 204
The Electric Arc spell:
"This means a character with four attacks per melee round uses up two attacks to cast the spell, leaving him with two electrical attacks possible that melee round."
Not anymore.
Since Electric Arc is a 4th level spell, it should only take one action to cast.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 12:59 am
by Randomfist
Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:45 am
by Killer Cyborg
Randomfist wrote:Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
Nope.
I want the Palladium staff to come to my house with a pen and some white-out and fix my copy personally!
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:54 am
by Drakenred®™©
Geronimo 2.0 wrote:Man, It's the "Ultimate" edition... and it still needs fixing? I guess I'll wait for the "Second Edition Ultimate Edition".
um Geronimo, if it did not need fixing, it would not be a Palladium book
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:55 am
by Killer Cyborg
Geronimo 2.0 wrote:Man, It's the "Ultimate" edition... and it still needs fixing? I guess I'll wait for the "Second Edition Ultimate Edition".
But "Ultimate" means "Final".... They can't come out with any more ever again.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:41 am
by Kalinda
Killer Cyborg wrote:Randomfist wrote:Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
Nope.
I want the Palladium staff to come to my house with a pen and some white-out and fix my copy personally!
Bring it to Gencon next year and see if KS will fix it for you.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:07 pm
by dark brandon
Tenchi Jeff wrote:Why did they bother with this book anyways? It only marginally clarified the rules, and didn't explain much.
I still don't know how to interpret Rate of Fire for guns.
From varius Paladum Books, Rate of Fire is listed under specific weapons differently.
Rate of Fire: Standard
Rate of Fire: Standard, see Modern Weapon Profiency Section.
Rate of Fire: Standard, Aimed, Burst, or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Aimed, Burst or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Equal to the number of combined hand to hand attacks.
WHAT THE HELL DOES ALL THIS MEAN?????
Palladium should have just done a Rifts 2nd Ed will clear, working, and logical rules that are explained instead of just stated.
Wow...
Look at the weapons. There is no more "standard rate of fire"...
You have Rate of fire "each blast counts as one melee attack".
Unless it has a burst setting, it can't burst. Like the c12. has a burst setting, and your WP bonuses are 1/2.
It's really not all that compicated.
So, for older books, like say a WR-17 wilderness "double" Rifle, it does 3D6 or 4D6, but does not have burst capabilities.
There that wasn't so hard was it?
Rate of Fire: Standard
Rate of Fire: Standard, see Modern Weapon Profiency Section.
Rate of Fire: Standard, Aimed, Burst, or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Aimed, Burst or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Equal to the number of combined hand to hand attacks.
BTW, all those mean exactly the same thing, just said differently.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:32 pm
by Braden Campbell
Geronimo 2.0 wrote:Man, It's the "Ultimate" edition... and it still needs fixing? I guess I'll wait for the "Second Edition Ultimate Edition".
You read my mind. I'll stick with my beaten up, duct-taped, honey oil-stained RMB for now, thank you.
Let em know when
Rifts: super ultimate mega edition comes out.
Posted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 11:18 pm
by Killer Cyborg
Tenchi Jeff wrote:Why did they bother with this book anyways? It only marginally clarified the rules, and didn't explain much.
I still don't know how to interpret Rate of Fire for guns.
From varius Paladum Books, Rate of Fire is listed under specific weapons differently.
Rate of Fire: Standard
Rate of Fire: Standard, see Modern Weapon Profiency Section.
Rate of Fire: Standard, Aimed, Burst, or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Aimed, Burst or Wild.
Rate of Fire: Equal to the number of combined hand to hand attacks.
WHAT THE HELL DOES ALL THIS MEAN?????
ROF: Standard means...
-If the weapon does not list a specific number of shots per melee, and is not a heavy energy weapon, that it can use the burst/spray rules from p. 34 of the main book. (Same as "Aimed, Burst, Wild")
-If the weapon lists a specific number of shots ("single shot only" or "3 shot burst", etc.) then each pull of the trigger counts as a melee action/attack.
-If the weapon is a Heavy Energy weapon, then each pull of the trigger counts as a melee attack/action.
ROF: Aimed, Burst, Wild means...
-The weapon can use the burst/spray rules on p. 34 of the main Rifts book.
ROF: "Equal to the number of combined hand to hand attacks" means....
-Each pull of the trigger counts as a melee attack/action.
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:31 am
by Swift-13
Heheh...and the good ole Coalition C-27 Plasma Cannon still has the best range *ever* for a hand-held weapon...
488 km!
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 8:35 am
by TechnoGothic
Randomfist wrote:Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
the Unlimited Edition is
Hardcover too...
There is no "softcover" edition....
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 10:12 am
by RainOfSteel
Swift-13 wrote:Heheh...and the good ole Coalition C-27 Plasma Cannon still has the best range *ever* for a hand-held weapon...
488 km!
The page refs would be:
URMB p.258 col.1: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
RMB p.203 col.2: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 11:28 am
by Swift-13
RainOfSteel wrote:Swift-13 wrote:Heheh...and the good ole Coalition C-27 Plasma Cannon still has the best range *ever* for a hand-held weapon...
488 km!
The page refs would be:
URMB p.258 col.1: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
RMB p.203 col.2: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
And unless I'm mistaken, that's the way it's printed in the Game Master's Guide and Coalition War Campaign!
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 11:52 am
by RainOfSteel
TechnoGothic wrote:Randomfist wrote:Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
the Unlimited Edition is
Hardcover too...
There is no "softcover" edition....
What Unlimited Edition are you referring to? Is there something I missed?
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 11:56 am
by RainOfSteel
Swift-13 wrote:RainOfSteel wrote:Swift-13 wrote:Heheh...and the good ole Coalition C-27 Plasma Cannon still has the best range *ever* for a hand-held weapon...
488 km!
The page refs would be:
URMB p.258 col.1: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
RMB p.203 col.2: C-27 Heavy Plasma Cannon: "Effective Range: 1600 ft (488 km)."
And unless I'm mistaken, that's the way it's printed in the Game Master's Guide and Coalition War Campaign!
Interesting, but I'll skip page refs for them here, that would be two separate errata topics.
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:18 pm
by Drakenred®™©
Swift-13 wrote:Heheh...and the good ole Coalition C-27 Plasma Cannon still has the best range *ever* for a hand-held weapon...
488 km!
Yep
Too bad the damage is not that good
although in mass, say 100,000 of them they can use surpessing fire to let the CS get into space
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 1:51 pm
by Braden Campbell
That error has existed since 1990, when the game was released.
Perhaps they kept it in knowing that, after all this time, if they changed it, we would die of shock.
And then someone would complain how the C-27 is now underpowered.
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 2:20 pm
by demos606
RainOfSteel wrote:TechnoGothic wrote:Randomfist wrote:Killer Cyborg wrote:RUG, p. 191
"The Rift opening is usually near or at ground level (see cover illustration), but..."
Ultimate Gold doesn't use that picture as a cover illustration.
I'm not even sure if that picture is in the book anywhere at all.
Considering that probably 99%+ of all RUE books are not going to be the limited gold edition but the soft cover edition with the cover of said rift, I think that one can slide.
the Unlimited Edition is
Hardcover too...
There is no "softcover" edition....
What Unlimited Edition are you referring to? Is there something I missed?
*ALL* Rifts Ultimate Edition printings are hardcover. There is *NO* softcover for this book.
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 9:41 pm
by Drakenred®™©
Tenchi Jeff wrote:Why did they bother with this book anyways? It only marginally clarified the rules, and didn't explain much.
.
Basicaly they Decided that with the comeing of the whatever you want to call it game and the movie they needed to update the main book more than they did with the other RIFTS books that they have updated so far. This is now the "First book" in the RIFTS series (turn it over, see that Catalog number of 800-HC or 8000HC? this book replaces the old 800 RMG, Its out of print, its gone, they will not print any more ever, this is now the first book, you might want to order your now while they still have copies avalible or Haunt E-bay to see if you can score one of the old ones.
Posted: Sat Aug 27, 2005 10:27 pm
by RainOfSteel
demos606 wrote:*ALL* Rifts Ultimate Edition printings are hardcover. There is *NO* softcover for this book.
Yes, I know. I never said otherwise.