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I got me a goddamn hat out of that encounter.

Towards simplifying the skills, what we did was instead of discrete skills, you have your skill programs, with the appropriate bonus. A task is judged Easy, Medium, or Hard, with a 60%, 45%, or 30% chance of success, respectively. To that, you add your entire relevant attribute, any bonuses from the OCC, and any penalties from bad situations. The only skills that are kept discrete are W.P..

So, let's say you've got a +10% education bonus, and have the skill program of Guerrilla Warfare. From that skill program, you'd have a couple WPs (IIRC), and can say "I'm going to Prowl". The GM determines that it's a medium task, normally (45%), but that the rain and darkness is going to give you a +10%. A PP of 15 adds 15%, and you have a 10% bonus from your education, giving you a total of 80%, meaning an 81-00 is a failure.

Now, perception is also rolled on %, with the default being a 45%, plus your IQ. So if the person looking for you has a 10 IQ, he'll see you on a 01-55... but only if his total is higher than yours. If you roll 56-80, he cannot see you, even if he succeeds... you're too stealthy for him. If you roll a 45%, and he rolls a 50%, he sees you... you succeeded in prowling, but he was better at finding than you were at hiding.

We haven't cleaved to my idea of the rules precisely (the group is used to the way we've always done things), and I'm finding it painful to think like a paranoid intelligence agent, but it's a lot of fun.

I figured that something would be coming soon... we're running up against the limits of what we can figure out without a mountain of mashed potatoes.

Sounds like it will be a fun game.

By the way Phalanx how much to bribe you into having Mark's character probed every game?

Shawn Merrow wrote:Sounds like it will be a fun game.

By the way Phalanx how much to bribe you into having Mark's character probed every game?

So long as Phalanx isn't the one probing me, I'll survive.

I feel sorry for you Mark! I think it could be painful for your characters. Just out of curiousity Phalanx. Are you going to use the N&SS to stat out this organization? If so are you going to post it? I'd like to see it.

Aramanthus wrote:I feel sorry for you Mark! I think it could be painful for your characters. Just out of curiousity Phalanx. Are you going to use the N&SS to stat out this organization? If so are you going to post it? I'd like to see it.

I would, too.

N&SS plus BTS? There is something wonderfully cool about the idea of Ninja Mulder and Cyborg Scully hunting down Little Green Men. Certainly kung fu fighting Men-In-Black will want to stop your PCs successful investigations!

Spinachcat wrote:N&SS plus BTS? There is something wonderfully cool about the idea of Ninja Mulder and Cyborg Scully hunting down Little Green Men. Certainly kung fu fighting Men-In-Black will want to stop your PCs successful investigations!

I've been describing this game to people as Ninjas and Superspies game with neither Ninjas nor Superspies. Those of us with martial arts powers have the non-supernatural ones (I think someone's got Zanshin circle, and I've got an Art of Invisibility, but nothing like Chi Combat are simply disappearing). None of us have cybernetics. It's mostly, to date, about government conspiracy to hide the truth.

Oh, and I can make some guesses about the Organization structure; I'll do it when I get home.

Can't wait to see how this organization looks according to the building guide found in N&SS.

Ok, my guesses from what I've seen:

Next Frontiers Foundation, Xenology Division

A) Outfits: Open Wardrobe. We've been able to get a reasonable amount of clothes, as needed (producing standard suits and the like).
B) Equipment: Electronic Supplies. We're about 10 years from now, so most of the equipment we've wanted has been electronic, but the $5000 limit seems about right. We've got an expense account, however.
C) Weapons: None. We've picked up a few (mostly for our techie, who's only recently gotten out of Chinese prison), but those have been out of the expense account.
D) Vehicles: Fleet Vehicles. We're travelling in a decent-sized, non-descript van.
E) Communications: Secured Service. We've got standard phones and the like, but secured lines available (in fact, secured chips for checking in with our handler).
F) Offices and Distribution: International. Next Frontiers is an NGO, working in third-world countries.
G) Military power: Private Army. They hired my character as part of their security forces, and while they're closer to Militia in any one place.
H) Sponsorship: Either Secret or Private Industry. We don't have their Board of Directors, so I lean towards Secret, especially since we're in the unofficial part of the corporation (while the Xenology is the reason it was founded, we're also not mentioned in polite company)
I) Budget: I've seen "Small Potatoes", but they might be able to swing "Large Loans".
J) Administrative Control: Loose Laws. They've got some influence, but we're bound by the law as it.
K) Internal Security: I'd put it about Paranoid, though maybe Impregnable or Iron-Clad
L) External Infilitration: Hard to judge. I'd put it at "Rare Minor Traitor" or "Information Source". Our main opposition seems to be the Air Force.
M) Agency Credentials: Unknown. While the public arm is known and somewhat Heroic, we're the quiet side.
N) Agency Salary: I'm going to put it around excellent. We're not saying "Why are we doing any work, we get paid so well", but we're not Civil Servants.

paws2sky wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:Towards simplifying the skills, what we did was instead of discrete skills, you have your skill programs, with the appropriate bonus. A task is judged Easy, Medium, or Hard, with a 60%, 45%, or 30% chance of success, respectively. To that, you add your entire relevant attribute, any bonuses from the OCC, and any penalties from bad situations. The only skills that are kept discrete are W.P..

So, let's say you've got a +10% education bonus, and have the skill program of Guerrilla Warfare. From that skill program, you'd have a couple WPs (IIRC), and can say "I'm going to Prowl". The GM determines that it's a medium task, normally (45%), but that the rain and darkness is going to give you a +10%. A PP of 15 adds 15%, and you have a 10% bonus from your education, giving you a total of 80%, meaning an 81-00 is a failure.

Now, perception is also rolled on %, with the default being a 45%, plus your IQ. So if the person looking for you has a 10 IQ, he'll see you on a 01-55... but only if his total is higher than yours. If you roll 56-80, he cannot see you, even if he succeeds... you're too stealthy for him. If you roll a 45%, and he rolls a 50%, he sees you... you succeeded in prowling, but he was better at finding than you were at hiding.

We haven't cleaved to my idea of the rules precisely (the group is used to the way we've always done things), and I'm finding it painful to think like a paranoid intelligence agent, but it's a lot of fun.

This is a pretty cool idea.

I think I may steal it... I have some players who might find the Palladium system easier to choke down if the skill system was streamlined.

I have also done something similar for Rifts, on which this is based. It's at http://rpg-crank.livejournal.com/26640.html

paws2sky wrote:Cool! Now I just need a MDC to SDC conversion that everyone at my table can agree on and maybe, just maybe, I can talk my group into giving Rifts (well, Palladium in general) another try.

Thanks, Mark.

-paws

Most people who complain find 1:10 to be more reasonable. I went with 1:10 if MD weapons were damaging SDC structures, but requiring 1:20 for SD weapons to damage MD structures.

Nice chart Mark! Thank you for providing it. The link you put there was very funny! I laughed pretty hard seeing it!

So we'll get an update after this weekend! Cool!

You know, writing up that organization brings to light the need for revamped Organization rules. Cell phones were expensive bricks when N&SS was mentioned, and the idea of an expense account is never touched upon.

paws2sky wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:You know, writing up that organization brings to light the need for revamped Organization rules. Cell phones were expensive bricks when N&SS was mentioned, and the idea of an expense account is never touched upon.

Yeah, I had a similar experience when I was looking at Boxed Nightmares last week. The points cost of having a decent computer and communications setup actually made me laugh.

(I briefly entertained the idea of setting a game in the late 80's just to make the Organization rules makes some sense, rather than update the descriptions. Then I realized that re-living the 80's wasn't really high on my list of priorities...)

The organization rules are a good idea (nice way to give the players some free goodies), but I agree they need updated.

Hmm. Sounds like something for Rifter...

-paws

I've got a fair amount of stuff on my plate, Paws, and I'm not that passionate about it. I'd love to see some good, multiple-type, organization rules.

Please note: Phalanx is smiling.

Phalanx wrote:Yes, but you didn't tell them WHY I was smiling. You were so very close to having figured it all out, but not quite on the dot.

Ok, folks, let's break it down.

Phalanx's game is the kind of thing Harbard Celine would find amusing. It is a pure, total, mind****.

I am a pretty straightforward person. Thinking like Bill Cobb is hurting my brain. Why? Because I have to think "Ok, who is this guy working for? It might be this person, this person, or a third or fourth person. He might be working for a combination of them. All of these give him different goals. How can I further my goals on this, without getting in horrible trouble?"

We were talking about how to approach a contact. We know that he knows our boss. We also know that he used to be the Air Force's go-to guy on UFOs, and now runs a UFO center. He's still in contact with his Air Force buddies, who have been the folks trying to silence people we're talking to. Is he working for the Air Force, still? When he turns on a device behind his desk that he says keeps the Air Force from listening in, is he telling the truth, or is he actually turning on listening devices for the AF?

It's an utter mind****.

Phalanx,

that sounds like a great adventure - cannot wait to hear more about it!

Why don't you write a Rifter article on your UFO inspired NS&S/BTS campaign?


Mark,

I like the simplified skill rules. Good work.

Kind regards
Hendrik

Phalanx wrote:Rifts: Sol System

Huh?

Phalanx wrote:

Hendrik wrote:

Phalanx wrote:Rifts: Sol System

Huh?

An alternate universe I'm working on, since Mutants in Orbit is canon and I think it's sorely outdated and thin.

Says the rocket scientist.

We have a very intimidating group to play in, what with a couple rocket scientists in there.

Thanks for the update. Sounds like a very cool game. I have had only a limited number of groups where we had some real cerbral games. Most of the time the GM wants action. I'm guilty of that too once in awhile. Pleaase keep us posted on what happens with this game! And we are looking forward to haering and seeing more about the Rift's: Solar System Phalanx! When you either get it published or let us see it.

I have drawn my weapon twice in three sessions. Once was to defend the party from a wolverine. The second time was when we were running down a hillside towards a crashed, experimental, air force vehicle, and I wasn't sure the reaction I would get when I got there.

Phalanx wrote:

Hendrik wrote:

Phalanx wrote:Rifts: Sol System

Huh?

An alternate universe I'm working on, since Mutants in Orbit is canon and I think it's sorely outdated and thin.

Thanks!

Excuse my 3-year-old-level obnoxious curiosity but: "Mutants in Orbit" is canon?

Mark Hall wrote: Says the rocket scientist. We have a very intimidating group to play in, what with a couple rocket scientists in there.

Intimidating. Not per se I'd say.

If in fact you mean rocket scientists as in physicists or techies IMHO the only pain may be too much focus on tech and the "proper simulation level" but then that can be fun, too, right.

Moreover, I do not think that you are easily intimidated in-game.

Mark Hall wrote:I have drawn my weapon twice in three sessions. Once was to defend the party from a wolverine. The second time was when we were running down a hillside towards a crashed, experimental, air force vehicle, and I wasn't sure the reaction I would get when I got there.

That, actually, sounds not intimidating but like a great game!

Kind regards
Hendrik

Prior to meeting with Erik and seeing the ship for himself, Bill was working off a pretty simple premise:

I don't really believe in it; I accept that it is intellectually possible, but I don't really believe it. However, my employers aren't paying me to believe in it... they're paying me to thoroughly investigate it.

Along the way, he's collected some evidence that makes it a hell of a lot likely to be true, but he went into it thinking "I'm just going to investigate this, and see where it leads me."

Someday would like to be in one your games Phalanx.

Phalanx wrote:

Shawn Merrow wrote:Someday would like to be in one your games Phalanx.

You gonna be at Open House?

Unfortunately don't have the money and health makes it painful to travel anyway.

Shawn Merrow wrote:Unfortunately don't have the money and health makes it painful to travel anyway.

Sorry to hear that, Shawn. I hope you can get better!

I cannot come myself, unless I find that gold bucket - alas, fat chance that'll happen; from Germany my cost would be around 750 (USD 500 for the flight, 40 for the 3-day pass and let's say 75 bucks each night for 5 nights for hotel expenses) and that would be before buying one or many books, of course. Worth it, yes I think, but pretty hard on a budget. But I will make it one day!

Phalanx wrote:Maybe I can get talked into running an online campaign or something.

Now, THAT would be interesting, Phalanx! I would love to be on that game. Kindly consider this my preemptive application !

Kind regards
Hendrik

Pretty nice if you can keep the violence down for most of the game and actually do some investigating. Do you guys know who your big enemy group are?

Aramanthus wrote:Pretty nice if you can keep the violence down for most of the game and actually do some investigating. Do you guys know who your big enemy group are?

Terrestrial, we know of a corrupt Air Force General at Hill AFB/Dugway PG. He has legitimate authority over a sizable number of air force personnel are guilty only of following orders that they can't really know contradict humankinds best interests (as seen by our employer). However, Calloway likely has backing amongst some factions of the visitors... those who are less about benevolent uplift, and more about their immediate benefit.

Sounds pretty cool! Has your team been able to actually recover any proof in the game? Or do you have the luck of Fox Mulder? So close and yet so far!

Phalanx wrote:

Shawn Merrow wrote:Unfortunately don't have the money and health makes it painful to travel anyway.

Sorry to hear that. Maybe I can get talked into running an online campaign or something.

Been years since I played in an online game but sounds fun.

Aramanthus wrote:Sounds pretty cool! Has your team been able to actually recover any proof in the game? Or do you have the luck of Fox Mulder? So close and yet so far!

Photographic evidence, mostly. We have a digital and a photographic camera, and took a lot of footage of the test flight. Our EW specialist picked up some material evidence, but it disintegrated into sand when the ship exploded.

Sounds pretty cool! I hope you keep us posted on how your campaign is going. I'm interested in continuing to hear about it!

Those who read my Robotech session recaps are probably wondering why I'm not doing that with our N&SS campaign.

I'm not because, from the outside, it seems like we're doing nothing. Most of any session is spent looking at each other, trying to figure out how our employers or contacts are going to screw us, and talking around things with people who saw events that we're trying to make sense of. There's no action. There's no epic battles. There's a lot of "How the hell does all this make sense?"

I echo Aramantus' request for periodic updates. Over in the BtS forum, there is a current thread about technoloigical terrors as opposed to supernatural enemies. This campaign concept would fit right in.

Mark, I think your modified skill system is a step in the right direction. My gut, however, tells me that the skill mechanic could still be further simplified without removing any of the appeal.

Here is how I ran a play-by-post game of Palladium Fantasy with simplified skills last year. First, I told the players to use the regular skill list of the game to choose their skills but ignore the listed percentages. I think that most players like the wide range of skills from which to choose, but flipping back and forth to calculate percentages is a pain in the neck.

Second, I had them record all skills as having a base of 25%. All skills increased by 5% per experience level including the first level. If a character had a skill at first level – even with no bonuses – that same skill would max out at 100% at level 15.

Advanced skills don't need lower percentages. They just need prerequisites. Before taking any advanced skill (like an engineering or Math: Advanced), I required that the PC first take the basic version of that skill. Before learning Medical Doctor, you must learn Paramedics. Before learning Paramedics, you must learn First Aid. Before learning Hand to Hand: Expert, you must learn Hand to Hand: Basics. Actual skill trees aren't needed so much as common sense. Got it? Exceptions are allowed when a Class specifically grants an advanced skill.

Third, add any class-derived bonuses as listed in the class. I also allowed them to add I.Q. Bonuses. We were using my Modified Attribute Bonus Chart which hands out bonuses more gradually and from an attribute of 11 on up, so I think everyone got a skill bonus. I also liked Mark's suggestion of using an attribute score based upon an appropriate attribute instead of everything being related to a skill.

I did not come up in my game, but I would have allowed PCs to grow skill percentages above 100%. This is allowed in vehicle combat rules, but for some reason I can't figure out, it isn't allowed in any other canon implementation. I tend to apply a lot of situational bonuses and penalties.

Phalanx wrote:Well, they are really in the thick of it now. The General panicked after the crash and sent out a request for aid from the very people whose ideas he ripped off without fully understanding what they had done. Erik was one of those people, so he took the opportunity to get inside Calloway's organization. The players are his "consulting team," because A) it will intimidate Calloway and B) he knows there will eventually come a time where he can't work on his own.

After a day or so of routing through various forms of air travel, both commercial and government, the team (and some of Erik's old colleagues, one of whom he has a history with) found itself on Calloway's base and in their main hangar. Erik and the other greybeards quickly figured out that Calloway's people had simply scaled up their old designs linearly, without understanding that the alien programming system is tied to the structure. So, not only were their craft malfunctioning, they were rejecting Calloway's attempts to graft human hardware on them like a human body might reject a medical implant.

Calloway went from impatient to the verge of a nervous breakdown upon the realization that he had utterly failed those he represents. The team now has to figure out how to take advantage of this weakness and get to who is pulling Calloway's strings.

I loved the suggestion from Maggie... "Why don't you just get a battery-powered GPS transponder and bring it in with you?" You could HEAR the foreheads being slapped.

And I spent my time poking at Calloway... we're pretty sure he's working for some alien interests. I kept pointing out that I wasn't an engineer, and if only we had some of the builders to walk us through it... he kept getting paler and paler.

Cool update! It does sound like a really fun group! Please keep it coming!

The description reminds me of Deus Ex. I'm not really sure why. And IIRC, you guys are still on the SE side of Houston, right? *waggles eyebrows*