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Odd situation, but is it possible that a nightbane could actually have a morphus of the opposite gender (or appear as if it is the opposite gender)? I think it would be rather funny to see actually.

Don't see why not, people certainly are fixated with sexuality

Sexuality is a fixture of people.

I considered the possibility before. Considering how some forms are completely asexual I don't see any reason a morphus can't have the opposite sex. although it would be extremely rare.

Nekira,

Lets not forget that Gender like sexuality is a spectrum and there are people who are totally their own gender and those who are different mixes of the opposit gender all the way to being the other gender in all but form.

Rockwolf66 wrote:Nekira,

Lets not forget that Gender like sexuality is a spectrum and there are people who are totally their own gender and those who are different mixes of the opposit gender all the way to being the other gender in all but form.

That is a theory, one I happen to disagree with. Nevertheless, even if you are right, it wouldn't change my statement. if those who are completely one gender in the opposites body, is still a very rare thing, so the frequency dosn't change.

Types of gender a morphus can have: Male, Female, Hermaphrodite, Neuter. (the same that the humans can have)

However, if you use the "the morphus come from the self image", then opposite sex morphus would come from those who don't think they were born the right gender, those confused about gender they are, and other with 'not to standard' views about their sexuality.

Another way of looking at it would let the NB take his/her form from their wants and desires.
or they are dreaming when they have their 1st becoming and it was reversed gender dream.

thou, those with both sex organs are usually Chimeras (a person with mixed cells<-simplification, google Chimera if you want to know more)
and Neuter usually means there is something wrong with their genes

Remember,IRL, gender is in genes and sexuality is in mind (even if some people have perverted ideas about sexuality)
in the game: even if with a morphus, gender a part of the mind

Rockwolf66 wrote:Nekira,

Lets not forget that Gender like sexuality is a spectrum and there are people who are totally their own gender and those who are different mixes of the opposite gender all the way to being the other gender in all but form.

What a *edit* of *edit*.

Since there's no set reason for why a person manifests a specific morpheous, there's no real reason why not. Someone who feels they're the wrong sex manifests a morpheous of the opposite sex? Someone who is fixated on the opposite sex manifesting on the opposite sex? It could have to do with anything, or even nothing. Come up with a reason you feel is appropriate for the character.

Some results from the nightbane tables that could easily lead to a gender change or androgynous appearance:
-Beautiful appearance
-Doll-like appearance
-Fallen Angel
-Cat characteristics
-Fox characteristics
-Wolf characteristics

And others, those were just a few I could think of off the top of my head. It's by no means inclusive. For many animals there can a traditional "gender" associated with them that can lead to a gender changed morpheous.

Now with this idea, the "Opposite Sex" multiple personality would actually be able to experience being their own gender. Or the morpheous being the opposite sex could lead to that multiple personality, or even be the cause of it.

Sailor Bubba is just waiting for his Becoming?

Mark Hall wrote:Sailor Bubba is just waiting for his Becoming?

Then he will fight the Nightlords with Man Faye.

Mark Hall wrote:Sailor Bubba is just waiting for his Becoming?

I've seen them before, a few years ago when SM was The In anime, not pretty.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:I considered the possibility before. Considering how some forms are completely asexual I don't see any reason a morphus can't have the opposite sex. although it would be extremely rare.

Only reason it'd be extremely rare is because there's nothing remotely related to that side of biology in the morphus tables at the moment. Which is kinda odd considering the body-horror themes and the way the main PC race was kinda blatantly inspired by Clive Barker.

If an individual's Morphus is somehow related to or inspired by his subconcious, then by rights there should be oodles of Nightbane out there with morphus forms that reflect what the character is sexually attracted to or repulsed by. And blatantly too, without needing to bring someone in to start speculating on the Freudian implications of a bunch of stuff that doesn't seem related to gender or sexuality.

On the other hand, that assumes that sex is the primary motivating factor in Morphus creation. While it's a major motivating factor in human psychology, it's not necessarily in Morphus formation.

Mark Hall wrote:On the other hand, that assumes that sex is the primary motivating factor in Morphus creation. While it's a major motivating factor in human psychology, it's not necessarily in Morphus formation.

And yet if the Morphus form is a reflection (or mockery, or reinterpretation or whatever) of the individual psyche, you'd think it would crop up now and then, and not just in the relatively uncommon "Ken and Barbie" Nightbane who get physically attractive bodies. Especially in Nightbane whose Becomings were relatively peaceful and weren't triggered by severe violence or trauma (those poor guys obviously have other stuff on their mind at the time, just look at Burgerface).

Then again, maybe we're all trying too hard here. The fact that you get your morphus from rolling on random tables kinda shoots down in flames anything the flavour text says about the Morphus being a reflection of the character's inner self

Rallan wrote:Then again, maybe we're all trying too hard here. The fact that you get your morphus from rolling on random tables kinda shoots down in flames anything the flavour text says about the Morphus being a reflection of the character's inner self

For now maybe...

Just remember that random rolling is only ONE option.

Rallan wrote:And yet if the Morphus form is a reflection (or mockery, or reinterpretation or whatever) of the individual psyche, you'd think it would crop up now and then, and not just in the relatively uncommon "Ken and Barbie" Nightbane who get physically attractive bodies. Especially in Nightbane whose Becomings were relatively peaceful and weren't triggered by severe violence or trauma (those poor guys obviously have other stuff on their mind at the time, just look at Burgerface).

Right. Remember, though, that as a riff off the individual psyche, a large part of that is going to be personal identity, which in humans frequently has to do with gender identity. Heterosexual men may think about women all the time, but they do so, usually, in a context of identifying themselves as men, so a het male's sexual obsession with women is unlikely to manifest itself as a female morphus... not being a woman is part of the identity.

Mark Hall wrote:

Rallan wrote:And yet if the Morphus form is a reflection (or mockery, or reinterpretation or whatever) of the individual psyche, you'd think it would crop up now and then, and not just in the relatively uncommon "Ken and Barbie" Nightbane who get physically attractive bodies. Especially in Nightbane whose Becomings were relatively peaceful and weren't triggered by severe violence or trauma (those poor guys obviously have other stuff on their mind at the time, just look at Burgerface).

Right. Remember, though, that as a riff off the individual psyche, a large part of that is going to be personal identity, which in humans frequently has to do with gender identity. Heterosexual men may think about women all the time, but they do so, usually, in a context of identifying themselves as men, so a het male's sexual obsession with women is unlikely to manifest itself as a female morphus... not being a woman is part of the identity.

So you're saying Morphus Tables in the books only apply to heterosexual males?

Rallan wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:

Rallan wrote:And yet if the Morphus form is a reflection (or mockery, or reinterpretation or whatever) of the individual psyche, you'd think it would crop up now and then, and not just in the relatively uncommon "Ken and Barbie" Nightbane who get physically attractive bodies. Especially in Nightbane whose Becomings were relatively peaceful and weren't triggered by severe violence or trauma (those poor guys obviously have other stuff on their mind at the time, just look at Burgerface).

Right. Remember, though, that as a riff off the individual psyche, a large part of that is going to be personal identity, which in humans frequently has to do with gender identity. Heterosexual men may think about women all the time, but they do so, usually, in a context of identifying themselves as men, so a het male's sexual obsession with women is unlikely to manifest itself as a female morphus... not being a woman is part of the identity.

So you're saying Morphus Tables in the books only apply to heterosexual males?

No, I'm speaking from the point of view of a heterosexual man. I don't know how het women, gay men, bi men, m-to-f transgendered, or anyone else really thinks about themselves.

you also have to take in acount that what is happeneing to the bane while they have their 1st becoming also effects what form they take. Example: Burger Face in the main book, having a burned all over morphus, because he was in the middle of a fire when he 1st became.

So if the bane, say.....was "in Drag" during their 1st becoming they might of kept their garments.

So the short answere made shorter is YES
I've had transgendered missmashed characters plenty of times, and MANY wer just horrable and grusome freaks and circus level "Chimera" mismatches, BUT I've also played a Girls who HATED men and was so fixated on that hate to the point of "Becoming" her Ideal vision of wife beater.
Yet another time I played a girl who had the opposet of hate for men, She LOVED her dad & (later in life) her boyfriend to the point of Becoming him, and thusly loosing him out of fright of her mimicry form.

I've played a male character that HATED gender period and ended up being a plastic, genderless androgynous creature.

One NPC was a perverted moster whos Morphus was an Ugly/hideous comination of MANY people of many genders (each screaming in pain with limbs & body parts sticking out all over).

Mark Hall wrote:Heterosexual men may think about women all the time, but they do so, usually, in a context of identifying themselves as men, so a het male's sexual obsession with women is unlikely to manifest itself as a female morphus... not being a woman is part of the identity.

Like you said, it's Very unlikely, but still happens just like CJ's decriptions of two separate people both ganing an insect morphus for jutxaposed reasons (One out of fixated love, and one of fixated Fear)...
But yeah, as you said It is Still likely the least likely to happen.

The REAL reason is likely ALL and any of the above. In fact, very often a bane may end up as something(s) that they NEVER find a reason fer... This isn't Aberrant where wish fulfilment happens 90% of the time, It's Nightspawn/bane where it's likely 20%.

There have been some great new morphus tables in many rifters; Rifter one had a clothing table that included opposite gender, with the option to have it be a very obvious person in drag (hairy guy in dress/woman in suit with the chest pushed out) or where they are 'passing'. Several other tables had similar options.

Of course, you can do that with just about any nightbane Morphus option: a statue form could be the opposite gender for your Nightbane ("Wait, your becoming happened on Ellis Isand? Is that why you're the Statue of Liberty?")

Of course there'd be some. People who identify more with the other gender, are fixated on it, or whatever. I also think there'd be some cross-racial becomings. Like a pale white dude who becomes an Asian morphus because he's an anime otaku. Or people with a white facade/black morphus or vice versa.

Though I'd guess it'd be somewhat rare. If someone's morphus is human enough for such traits to be obvious, then he/she is probably going to have a morphus that's them with weird traits. Like with razorwire all over them, or them but with a zipper on their throat, or them but with spikes bursting through their skin.
Maybe there should be a table for normal human traits which are just not the ones the facade has.

Rider wrote:In the end, beyond appearance (and the fun times you can have while in Morphus) this wouldn't have much of an effect since Nightbane can't actually breed as far as we know.

That said: this Morphus idea gives whole new fun uses to the 'Splittin Image' talent, doesn't it?

Narcissistic Hermaphroditus anyone?

Before the NBSG this was defeinently true, after it *shrugs*. Well lets say the waters have been muddied to the point that it is debatable.

BTW, try not to do any more topic necromancy. Sometimes there are topics better left dead.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:BTW, try not to do any more topic necromancy. Sometimes there are topics better left dead.

There are no rules on this board against posting to old threads. If old threads should not be posted too then they should be locked or deleted.

NB-SG's Extraterrestial Table could turn you into a "Hot Baby with skimpy cloths", even if your a guy in fascade, making you a woman in morphus form.

But sometimes it is better to let sleeping dog sleep.

Rider wrote:Yeah well, considering the growing number of anime fans and characters like this, I am actually suspecting that the number of people with cross-gender morphi who learn Splittin Image will be enormous

Or Natsuru Seno from Kanfer.