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Just wondering if anyone's noticed that the "Standard" Hand to Hand Combat Skills don't necessarily give standard bonuses. I'll point out two that I currently have available for comparison (at work right now);

HU2ed - 3rd Printing to RUE - First Printing

H2H Basic
3rd Level: Choice of one of two Kick Attacks vs Single Kick Attack
5th Level: +1 Initiative vs +1 Disarm
8th Level: +1 Disarm vs Nothing

NET: Possible different kick, +1 Initiative vs Nothing


H2H Expert
2nd Level: Nothing vs +1 Pull Punch
3rd Level: +2 Initiative vs +2 Disarm and Karate Punch
5th Level: 2 Kicks of Choice vs Nothing
7th Level: Nothing vs Backhand Strike
8th Level: +2 Disarm vs Nothing
9th Level: Nothing vs +1 Disarm
10th Level: +2 Pull Punch vs Nothing
15th Level: Death Blow 19-20 vs Death Blow 20

NET: +2 Initiative, +1 Pull Punch, 2 Kicks of Choice, Death Blow 19 vs +1 Disarm and Karate Punch


H2H Martial Arts
1st Level: +2 Initiative vs Body Flip/Throw
2nd Level: Nothing vs Any Hand Strike
3rd Level: 5 Foot Strikes vs +1 Initiative and All foot Strikes
5th Level: All jump Kicks vs 1 Jump Kick and +2 Entangle
7th Level: Nothing vs Holds
8th Level: Leap Attack vs Back Flip and Backflip Escape
10th Level: Body Flip/Throw, +1 Initiative vs Back Flip Attack, +2 Disarm
11th Level: Nothing vs +1 Initiative
15th Level: Death Blow (unlimited) vs Death Blow 20

NET: +1 Initiative, Jump Kicks, Leap Attack, Unlimited Death Blow vs Hand Strikes, Foot Strikes, Holds, Back Flip, Back Flip Escape, Back Flip Attack, +2 Entangle, +2 Disarm


H2H Assassin
1st Level: +1 Initiative, +2 Pull Punch vs Paired Weapons
2nd Level: Nothing vs +1 Initiative
3rd Level: +1 Roll with Impact vs Karate Punch
4th Level: +3 Disarm, +1 Initiative vs Karate Kick
5th Level: Nothing vs +1 Strike with Thrown Weapons
6th Level: Body Flip/Throw vs +2 Entangle, Backhand Strike
7th Level: Death Blow vs KO/Stun 17-20, Leap Kick
8th Level: Nothing vs +1 Initiative, +1 Strike with Guns
9th Level: 3 Kicks vs +1 Initiative, Back Flip
10th Level: Critical 18-20 vs Critical 19-20
11th Level: KO/Stun 17-20 vs +2 Strike, +1 Strike with Thrown and Guns, Back Flip Attack
12th Level: +2 Initiative, +2 Strike, +1 Disarm vs +2 Pull Punch, Death Blow 19-20
14th Level: +2 Roll with Impact vs Holds
15th Level: +1 Initiative vs +1 Strike with Guns

NET: +2 Initiative, +3 Roll with Impact, +4 Disarm, Body Flip/Throw, Unlimited Death Blow, 2 Kicks, Critical 18 vs Paired Weapons, Karate Punch, +2 Entangle, Backhand Strike, Leap Kick, +3 Strike with Guns, +2 Strike with Thrown, Back Flip, Back Flip Attack, Holds

So - why such the big differences? Anyone else ever notice this?

Because Heros Unlimited is ment to be big bad superheros beating the crap out of people, while Rifts is decidely grittier with survival being a much bigger problem.

If you look at magic, a lot of spells are a lot more powerful in HU2 2nd ed as well.