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Tell me because ibthink it works this way. In the part where you roll to see if the cosmo knight attributes are better and you keep the better one, does that count for the MDC. For example: I made a true Norse giant, and his MDC is well alot, do I keep it or the cosmo knight roll, or do they add?

There are no rules on that - it is subject to the will of the GM.
It isn't something that is likely to ever occur mind you considering Supernatural Beings and Creatures of Magic cannot be Cosmo Knights.

1st roll the char's starting stats.
2nd roll the CK stats as per the class.
3rd pick the higher of the two stats attribute by attribute .

This is as per the text in the CK attribute section.
--------------------------------------------------
Their MDC.....hummmm.
If your GM thinks that their xDC is an attribute then Yes, if not, then No.
Or you can just go ahead and bold face and make it as if that the xDC is an attribute, and take it like a brave american if your GM notices and takes umbrage to your making the assumption.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:1st roll the char's starting stats.
2nd roll the CK stats as per the class.
3rd pick the higher of the two stats attribute by attribute .

This is as per the text in the CK attribute section.

What about MDC?

They definitely don't add.

Edit: Upon further examination, if I were the GM, I would rule that like dragons, prometheans and demons, Norse Giants cannot become cosmoknights. They are major supernatural beings with considerable inherent magical powers. If the Forge would rule out similar beings, I would be likely to conclude it would rule out the Norse Giants.

Of course they can't. Loon is the sanest one here.

Stop tweaking and focus on how awesome things are instead of trying to blend them to be MOAR POWAHFULLL!!

arent the norse giants out of pantheons supernatural creatures?
i thought supernatural creatures couldnt be cosmo knights...
am i misremembering something here?

edit: looked into this and I know you werent asking but

pantheons of the megaverse pg. 163
"These giants were supernatural creatures whose powers were almost the match of the gods"

phase world pg. 99
"Humans, kreeghor, wolfen and noro have all been chosen, as have members of almost every race in the three galaxies. The only exceptions are supernatural creatures like dragons, demons and the promethean race, again for reasons unknown."

RAW says a True Norse Giant cannot become a Cosmo-knight.

IF YOUR GM APPROVES, who cares what RAW says.

Yes take the higher of the two mdc amounts.
Remember Cosmo-knights also can summon their Cosmo-armor for +500 mdc
If Your Giant has 900 MDC, then he has 900 mdc. Plus he can summon his cosmo-armor for that +500 mdc. His MDc becomes 1,400 MDC in cosmo-armor

Looonatic wrote:They definitely don't add.

Edit: Upon further examination, if I were the GM, I would rule that like dragons, prometheans and demons, Norse Giants cannot become cosmoknights. They are major supernatural beings with considerable inherent magical powers. If the Forge would rule out similar beings, I would be likely to conclude it would rule out the Norse Giants.

I would agree.

However, If I was to allow them, the CK powers would replace whatever natural powers they had. Keeping the natural attributes as is.

TechnoGothic wrote:RAW says a True Norse Giant cannot become a Cosmo-knight.

IF YOUR GM APPROVES, who cares what RAW says.

Yes take the higher of the two mdc amounts.
Remember Cosmo-knights also can summon their Cosmo-armor for +500 mdc
If Your Giant has 900 MDC, then he has 900 mdc. Plus he can summon his cosmo-armor for that +500 mdc. His MDc becomes 1,400 MDC in cosmo-armor

RAW?

Rifts advanced weapons?

I say some races keep certain natural abilities like nightvision, sense of smell, or whatever... this is an OCC after all.
A wolfen doesn't suddenly lose the abilities to see in the dark, go deaf, and become scent-deprived when he takes on Ley Line Walker, either...
As for the Norse Giant thing, no... the Forge doesn't take supernatural or magical beings as knights.

@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

TechnoGothic wrote:@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

Still an OCC.
You'd still have natural abilities... unless you suggest that all Cosmo-Knights are blind, deaf mutes with no sense of touch either.

Vrykolas2k wrote:

TechnoGothic wrote:@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

Still an OCC.
You'd still have natural abilities... unless you suggest that all Cosmo-Knights are blind, deaf mutes with no sense of touch either.

While the CK class is mislabeled as an OCC, all other things about the class reads as a race with a starting rcc.

Striping off the PB labels, the class is a Mystically Augmented Char Class.
In that they would share a class type along with all the types of T-men and T-women.

Giant2005 wrote:Supernatural Beings and Creatures of Magic cannot be Cosmo Knights.

It says that no supernatural creatures have ever become Cosmo-knights. I may be splitting hairs here, but that doesn't mean that the Cosmic Forge CAN'T make a supernatural creature a Cosmo-Knight.

...and this is why I've only ever allowed ONE into my games...
Ever.
The arguing and "why can't add this" or "How come I have to use THESE dice values, my original dice vaules were better but Cosmo knights have such cool powers can't I just get those and keep everything else?"

Short answer; "no"
Long Answer; "HELL NO!"

Mind you it is up to the individual GM to untangle the mess that is the CK PC class as written.
HOWEVER; The MDC and stats do NOT stack.
EVER.
In my campiagn that is

In someone elses game; well, that's up to THAT GM.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:

TechnoGothic wrote:@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

Still an OCC.
You'd still have natural abilities... unless you suggest that all Cosmo-Knights are blind, deaf mutes with no sense of touch either.

While the CK class is mislabeled as an OCC, all other things about the class reads as a race with a starting rcc.

Striping off the PB labels, the class is a Mystically Augmented Char Class.
In that they would share a class type along with all the types of T-men and T-women.

It isn't mislabeled at all; you're now discussing a house-rule.
A 'borg is also remade; however that is still an OCC as well.
But T-People, 'Borgs, and Cosmo-Knights are all... OCCs.

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:

TechnoGothic wrote:@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

Still an OCC.
You'd still have natural abilities... unless you suggest that all Cosmo-Knights are blind, deaf mutes with no sense of touch either.

While the CK class is mislabeled as an OCC, all other things about the class reads as a race with a starting rcc.

Striping off the PB labels, the class is a Mystically Augmented Char Class.
In that they would share a class type along with all the types of T-men and T-women.

See I just wanted to make a giant cosmo knight, and my favourite type of giant is a Pogtal Giant, but they're only an RCC. So they can't be, so I went two one of my other favourites, the norse giant. Would it be more exceptible to make a Titan? That seems more likely, wouldn't you agree?

SamBell wrote:

drewkitty ~..~ wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:

TechnoGothic wrote:@ drewkitty ~..~
Rules As Written = RAW

@ Vrykolas2k
What are you Talking about Vry...
Cosmo-Knight is more than an OCC, it is an RCC change really.
The Cosmic Forge complete changes you into a Cosmo-Knight. You may Look like a "wolven", but your not a "wolven" anymore. You Lose skills, etc...Get the higher of the two attributes, etc...
You do not Eat, Breathe, Drink, or Sleep anymore.

Cosmo-Knight is like being turned into a Vampire or Corrupt in many ways.
A Wolven becoming a LeyLine Walker is not even in the same ball-park as becoming a Cosmo-knight.
When you become a Cosmo-knight you are "Reborn"

Still an OCC.
You'd still have natural abilities... unless you suggest that all Cosmo-Knights are blind, deaf mutes with no sense of touch either.

While the CK class is mislabeled as an OCC, all other things about the class reads as a race with a starting rcc.

Striping off the PB labels, the class is a Mystically Augmented Char Class.
In that they would share a class type along with all the types of T-men and T-women.

See I just wanted to make a giant cosmo knight, and my favourite type of giant is a Pogtal Giant, but they're only an RCC. So they can't be, so I went two one of my other favourites, the norse giant. Would it be more exceptible to make a Titan? That seems more likely, wouldn't you agree?

Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Vrykolas2k wrote:Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight.

Akashic Soldier wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight.

That might actually be an interesting character.

Akashic Soldier wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight.

That was my thought too!

Akashic Soldier wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight.

What book are they in?

SamBell wrote:

Akashic Soldier wrote:

Vrykolas2k wrote:Titans are also magical.
Try an ogre or oni.
Or use the alien race creation charts to make your own giant race.
Remember, just because the race might have SN strength, endurance and MDC doesn't make it a supernatural or magical being.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight.

What book are they in?

Robotech.

Zentradi Cosmo Knight ... Great Idea !!

Robotech (1st Edition) pg.96
OMG can you seeing one with a Supernatural PS 2,000 !! (PS 20x100).
Who cares if he is 60 ft Tall right

TechnoGothic wrote:Zentradi Cosmo Knight ... Great Idea !!

Robotech (1st Edition) pg.96
OMG can you seeing one with a Supernatural PS 2,000 !! (PS 20x100).
Who cares if he is 60 ft Tall right

I'd forgotten all about that...