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I am playing a HU2 game and one of the players brought up a thought and I wanted to bring it here. Heroes train their bodies with melee combat skills so that they can fight the 'bad' guys, right? Why is it then the 'good' guy can use his bonus to strike (with his hands and feet) to hit with his eye beams (ranged attack)? And that new found attack that they got from kicking and punching, should it go toward that blast coming from their fist?

This player thought that a separation would be needed like WP Archery with it own strike bonus and attacks because the bonus should apply to the training weather by self or by a teacher. What do you think, should it be treated like a WP or just thrown in together?

I have always felt that there needs to be further clarification on the Strike Bonus rules (and the combat system overall). After all, training in knife throwing is vastly different than training to punch.
I feel that there needs to be a separate Ranged Attack bonus, separated by Energy Blast, Hurled, and Firearms. Battle Magi in Federation of Magic specifically get Sharpshooting: Mystic Blast to reflect their specialized training. Why shouldn't someone get WP Energy Blast? Or a level-based bonus specific for ranged attacks?

Zenvis wrote:I am playing a HU2 game and one of the players brought up a thought and I wanted to bring it here. Heroes train their bodies with melee combat skills so that they can fight the 'bad' guys, right? Why is it then the 'good' guy can use his bonus to strike (with his hands and feet) to hit with his eye beams (ranged attack)? And that new found attack that they got from kicking and punching, should it go toward that blast coming from their fist?

This player thought that a separation would be needed like WP Archery with it own strike bonus and attacks because the bonus should apply to the training weather by self or by a teacher. What do you think, should it be treated like a WP or just thrown in together?

As far as I was aware, natural energy attacks do use HtH bonuses, they also don't qualify for Modern Ranged Combat modifiers though. Guns and such don't get HtH or PP bonuses, but they have significant benefits from being 'Modern Ranged Combat'.

Armorlord wrote:

Zenvis wrote:I am playing a HU2 game and one of the players brought up a thought and I wanted to bring it here. Heroes train their bodies with melee combat skills so that they can fight the 'bad' guys, right? Why is it then the 'good' guy can use his bonus to strike (with his hands and feet) to hit with his eye beams (ranged attack)? And that new found attack that they got from kicking and punching, should it go toward that blast coming from their fist?

This player thought that a separation would be needed like WP Archery with it own strike bonus and attacks because the bonus should apply to the training weather by self or by a teacher. What do you think, should it be treated like a WP or just thrown in together?

As far as I was aware, natural energy attacks do use HtH bonuses, they also don't qualify for Modern Ranged Combat modifiers though. Guns and such don't get HtH or PP bonuses, but they have significant benefits from being 'Modern Ranged Combat'.

I do not believe that natural energy attacks receive the "to strike" bonuses from hand to hand :whatever. They only get the bonus listed in the power. (And as Wayne Breaux demonstrated with the super villainess Shock, if you spend skill slots you can essentially take W.P. Energy Blast....and you get the equivalent of modern ranged weapon bonuses. (I had played that before the HU GM guide came out, was just glad to see someone else also used it. ))

I would refrain from also giving them the PP bonuses to strike. Of course, if you eliminate the -10 to dodge energy blast rule, go right ahead and let them use the PP bonuses as well. Note, house rule here on this last one, not cannon.

PP bonuses should aply to energy expulsions.

This isn't a question that can be answered by 3 simple choices. There is so much more to this than just yes, no, maybe.

For starters, most ranged weapons should never get HTH strike bonues as they are ranged and the bonuses are explicitly for HAND TO HAND combat. However, there are times that the strike bonus should be allowed (and I have made these rulings in my games):

1. Thrown weapons, so long as the character has the appropriate WP for the thrown weapon;
2. Bows, provided the bow is custom made for the character AND the character is a weapons master or similar OCC/Power Category;
3. Energy Expulsion powers should get the bonus as they are coming directly from the character him/herself;
4. Some other powers as the power is dependent on the physical prowess of the character.

As far as bonus HTH attacks/actions for ranged weapons? My ruling is that all HTH attacks apply whether or not you are in HTH combat. Why should you not be able to get the extra attack from boxing just because you aren't punching? I can see where GMs do this, but I'm not going to make my players do even more bookwork on their characters than they already have to do.

The only exception I can think of off the top of my head (which doesn't mean that something may or may not come up in later games) is WP Archery. Firing a bow has its own ROF, and that needs to be followed if you are using a bow.

The way my group always played was:

Modern Weapons get WP bonus only (Pistols, rifles, etc.)
Ancient Weapons get WP bonus + PP Bonus
HTH Combat gets HTH Skill Bonuses + PP Bonuses
Natural Energy Blasts get PP Bonus only
Robot and Bionic Weapon systems get PP Bonus + any bonuses from other components

I don't think we followed the -10 rule for dodging energy blasts though.

Mediapig71 wrote:The way my group always played was:

Modern Weapons get WP bonus only (Pistols, rifles, etc.)
Ancient Weapons get WP bonus + PP Bonus
HTH Combat gets HTH Skill Bonuses + PP Bonuses
Natural Energy Blasts get PP Bonus only
Robot and Bionic Weapon systems get PP Bonus + any bonuses from other components

I don't think we followed the -10 rule for dodging energy blasts though.

How do you deal with number of attacks? Do you allow your players with eye beams to use their melee combat total?

SpiritInterface wrote:PP bonuses should aply to energy expulsions.

Ok you have a strike bonus but how many attacks? Do you use melee or a new number?

Zenvis wrote:

SpiritInterface wrote:PP bonuses should aply to energy expulsions.

Ok you have a strike bonus but how many attacks? Do you use melee or a new number?

Use the number of attacks from your melee