Witches and Mind Bonds and Multi Minors and Familiars
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:00 pm
Witches who make a greater pact can choose the Gift of Union. Part of this is "the co-possessing essence also retains any psionic powers".
My question: what occurs if the super psionic power Mind Bond is used against someone?
Does the witch learn what that person knows? Does the intelligence? Do both?
On the reverse end: does the victim of the power learn what the witch knows? The intelligence? Both?
How it works with magic/psi in the case of Union is a bit confusing because it talks about differing from a possession in that control is shared. It's clearly thorough enough to make a witch drop alignment to miscreant (although I think that should depend on the alignment of the entity, if it was Anarchist/Aberrent for example, that should be the lowest it should drop, if at all).
Another issue: while the minor pact of 40yrs service takes away the gifts at the end of that duration, the gifts based on first born child/son sacrifice and destroying a sworn foe appear to be permanent (PRPG1stEd says they last for the remainder of the lifespan of the witch if they do it properly). The generic 'blood sacrifice' pact appears to require continual blood sacrifices though.
So what I'm wondering is, if a witch ends up completing the pact to kill their kid and/or major enemy, can the force (intelligence/demon or devil lord/etc.) ever reneg on the contract and strip the witch of the powers? Or does that only apply to the other contracts which have ongoing obligations?
Another issue: obviously you can only sacrifice 1 firstborn child (and maybe swing it a second time using a 'firstborn son' pact if first kid was girl) to get rewards, but the whole 'destroy a foe' thing seems repeatable if you were able to take out multiple enemies. So I was wondering: if it wasn't possible on the dark master to reneg on the terms of agreement and take away the powers, is there anything preventing a witch from becoming their enemy and serving a new intelligence under a new pact and get double witch powers?
I figure if this were possible then you'd restart as a level 1 witch and distinguish the OCCs by saying "Witch of A" or "Witch of B". Naturally some intelligences wouldn't wish to bind a witch who already had a master (obv. none with ongoing obligations) but if obligations were finite, I could see it happening, especially with intelligences who want very strong minions. Especially if they might get a sturdier contract out of it. Even if they didn't, that gift of power or magic might be worth it to the intelligence if a sworn foe was important enough that they needed them out of the way.
Also wondering: how come the Knife Master in Phase World doesn't have a familiar listed? Neither do Kreeghor witches. I got the impression that all witches past 2nd level were required to have either a lesser or greater familiar. Perhaps that's just optional? I could see that being an option, as for some with dangerous jobs a familiar could be as much a risk as an asset.
Also wondering: if a witch (or a shifter for that matter) receives the ability to link to a familiar as an OCC ability, can they link to a second familiar if they select/learn the Familiar Link spell later? Odin (Rifts CB2) has 2 ravens for familiars, but I can't remember anyone besides him having more than one. I guess technically there isn't anything in the Familiar Link spell saying that it can't be cast more than once to bond more than one familiar simultaneously (although that would be a huge risk if a missle blew them up all at once). I know Nightbane's TTGD says you can only have 1 at a time, but that refers to a separate type of familiar which you permanently expend PPE to bond and you don't give each other extra HP, so I figure that works independently of the spells or OCC abilities.
Also something I'm wondering: it mentions the damage that occurs to a mage/shifter/witch if their familiar is slain, but there is no mention of what occurs to familiars if their master is slain. Do they die? Suffer identical penalties? Nothing at all? Retain their boosted HP?
Also wondering: what happens if a spellcaster with a familiar who dies is able to somehow restore their pet to life? Like perhaps they use a resurrection spell. Would the link be re-established? Do they get their lost life points back? Same question for witchery, really. If a witch's permanent pact powers last until the end of their life, would a tricky demon use the witch's death as an escape clause so that they no longer have to bestow any abilities? I could see that, since it could be used to trick the witch into signing a new (probably more binding) one.
Also wondering: can good gods/intelligences make witches, or only priests of light? I never quite understood that. Some gods in D&G such as Tark (and I assume perhaps Aco, as well as the Church of Light and Dark aka Egypt) can have both types of light/dark priests, so I wonder if any god who can have a dark priest can also have a witch.
Reading the Dyval Dimension Book was a bit confusing as it said they only have witches and not dark priests. This clashes with the info in D+G because it specifically mentions dark priests of Dyval. The dimension book seems to weasel out of this by saying 'all of them are actually witches' but I don't really buy it. I remember the first PRPG was quite clear that dark priests could follow devils or demons as well as gods.
Another interest: there's that cool Sowki bonded to Apsu in CB2 who managed to get Union benefits without the essence living in and dominating him via signing a special pact (unique conditions) which Apsu acceded to while at the top of his power (maybe he figured it was worth it since Sowki are more competent than humans and would be a good investment). That he gradually severed the dependence (ability to withdraw the powers I assume) with PPE, and did so utterly after the big sleep.
I'm wondering, if a witch or potential witch found out about this, could the Sowki teach them how to do it?
My question: what occurs if the super psionic power Mind Bond is used against someone?
Does the witch learn what that person knows? Does the intelligence? Do both?
On the reverse end: does the victim of the power learn what the witch knows? The intelligence? Both?
How it works with magic/psi in the case of Union is a bit confusing because it talks about differing from a possession in that control is shared. It's clearly thorough enough to make a witch drop alignment to miscreant (although I think that should depend on the alignment of the entity, if it was Anarchist/Aberrent for example, that should be the lowest it should drop, if at all).
Another issue: while the minor pact of 40yrs service takes away the gifts at the end of that duration, the gifts based on first born child/son sacrifice and destroying a sworn foe appear to be permanent (PRPG1stEd says they last for the remainder of the lifespan of the witch if they do it properly). The generic 'blood sacrifice' pact appears to require continual blood sacrifices though.
So what I'm wondering is, if a witch ends up completing the pact to kill their kid and/or major enemy, can the force (intelligence/demon or devil lord/etc.) ever reneg on the contract and strip the witch of the powers? Or does that only apply to the other contracts which have ongoing obligations?
Another issue: obviously you can only sacrifice 1 firstborn child (and maybe swing it a second time using a 'firstborn son' pact if first kid was girl) to get rewards, but the whole 'destroy a foe' thing seems repeatable if you were able to take out multiple enemies. So I was wondering: if it wasn't possible on the dark master to reneg on the terms of agreement and take away the powers, is there anything preventing a witch from becoming their enemy and serving a new intelligence under a new pact and get double witch powers?
I figure if this were possible then you'd restart as a level 1 witch and distinguish the OCCs by saying "Witch of A" or "Witch of B". Naturally some intelligences wouldn't wish to bind a witch who already had a master (obv. none with ongoing obligations) but if obligations were finite, I could see it happening, especially with intelligences who want very strong minions. Especially if they might get a sturdier contract out of it. Even if they didn't, that gift of power or magic might be worth it to the intelligence if a sworn foe was important enough that they needed them out of the way.
Also wondering: how come the Knife Master in Phase World doesn't have a familiar listed? Neither do Kreeghor witches. I got the impression that all witches past 2nd level were required to have either a lesser or greater familiar. Perhaps that's just optional? I could see that being an option, as for some with dangerous jobs a familiar could be as much a risk as an asset.
Also wondering: if a witch (or a shifter for that matter) receives the ability to link to a familiar as an OCC ability, can they link to a second familiar if they select/learn the Familiar Link spell later? Odin (Rifts CB2) has 2 ravens for familiars, but I can't remember anyone besides him having more than one. I guess technically there isn't anything in the Familiar Link spell saying that it can't be cast more than once to bond more than one familiar simultaneously (although that would be a huge risk if a missle blew them up all at once). I know Nightbane's TTGD says you can only have 1 at a time, but that refers to a separate type of familiar which you permanently expend PPE to bond and you don't give each other extra HP, so I figure that works independently of the spells or OCC abilities.
Also something I'm wondering: it mentions the damage that occurs to a mage/shifter/witch if their familiar is slain, but there is no mention of what occurs to familiars if their master is slain. Do they die? Suffer identical penalties? Nothing at all? Retain their boosted HP?
Also wondering: what happens if a spellcaster with a familiar who dies is able to somehow restore their pet to life? Like perhaps they use a resurrection spell. Would the link be re-established? Do they get their lost life points back? Same question for witchery, really. If a witch's permanent pact powers last until the end of their life, would a tricky demon use the witch's death as an escape clause so that they no longer have to bestow any abilities? I could see that, since it could be used to trick the witch into signing a new (probably more binding) one.
Also wondering: can good gods/intelligences make witches, or only priests of light? I never quite understood that. Some gods in D&G such as Tark (and I assume perhaps Aco, as well as the Church of Light and Dark aka Egypt) can have both types of light/dark priests, so I wonder if any god who can have a dark priest can also have a witch.
Reading the Dyval Dimension Book was a bit confusing as it said they only have witches and not dark priests. This clashes with the info in D+G because it specifically mentions dark priests of Dyval. The dimension book seems to weasel out of this by saying 'all of them are actually witches' but I don't really buy it. I remember the first PRPG was quite clear that dark priests could follow devils or demons as well as gods.
Another interest: there's that cool Sowki bonded to Apsu in CB2 who managed to get Union benefits without the essence living in and dominating him via signing a special pact (unique conditions) which Apsu acceded to while at the top of his power (maybe he figured it was worth it since Sowki are more competent than humans and would be a good investment). That he gradually severed the dependence (ability to withdraw the powers I assume) with PPE, and did so utterly after the big sleep.
I'm wondering, if a witch or potential witch found out about this, could the Sowki teach them how to do it?