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My old GM never gave 'performing a skill' experience for w.p.
Is he alone in this? I hadn't been counting it but I have a player who's only wp is targeting which has made me reconsider.

nilgravity wrote:My old GM never gave 'performing a skill' experience for w.p.
Is he alone in this? I hadn't been counting it but I have a player who's only wp is targeting which has made me reconsider.

I do not give experience for W.P. use. That implies to me that you get experience for every attack that is successful and its my impression that the experience point award is only supposed to be given if the skill served some purpose. Otherwise, you could have a character sit in a room for the first adventure with people bringing in hundreds of different objects and the character either identifying them or not and he'd pretty much instantly hit 4th level (you don't really get skill exp after 4th, so I guess its somewhat controlled).

Better example,
Guy buys an M.D. suit of armor, hangs it on a stand, and then goes and gets an S.D.C. knife and just stands there stabbing it over and over and over. Viola, instant 4th level character after a couple of days of stabbing.

So yeah, not how I think its supposed to work.

This is just my own personal opinion though.

nilgravity wrote:My old GM never gave 'performing a skill' experience for w.p.
Is he alone in this? I hadn't been counting it but I have a player who's only wp is targeting which has made me reconsider.

I actually do give experience for the use of a WP in combat as well as for the use of the HtH skill the character has... however, it is counted as a single use of the skill for the entire fight. Thus, one fight scene, player uses HtH Basic, WP Sword and WP Shield. Fight goes for 5 melee rounds and the player walks away with 75 XP for skill use plus whatever he gains for defeating the foe, ideas and plans, etc. If, during the fight, the player decides to switch weapons he gains additional XP for skill use based on different WP's used. If the aforementioned fighter switches to another sword, no additional XP is awarded because he's already using the WP for swords. If he switches to a Battle Axe, however, he'll get another 25 XP for using WP Axe. Of course, all of this assumes the character even has the appropriate WP's to begin with. No WP skill, no skill use XP, though they may get a bonus for using a non-proficient weapon in the fight... but they had better impress me.

I have never given experience for the use of a WP. It seems like a quick way to abuse the experience rules.

Icefalcon wrote:I have never given experience for the use of a WP. It seems like a quick way to abuse the experience rules.

Backflipping to level 10 is already a huge way to abuse the rules we have all fixed (or we all have level 15 PC's). Weapons are no different. I do like Creed's way of giving EXP, though I'd want to see what that award per-round looks like in action. You do need to keep in mind an orc character who only cares about fighting, and only fights is playing in character, and does need a way to get EXP, WP's is just a fine way to do that.

I've never known a Gm to give out XP for WP use.

In combat, it falls under the general award for combat

Out of character, MAYBE if it's done in such a way as to be both in character and contributing to the game, I may give a bonus for that, but not the W.P. itself.

Example: A gunslinger meets another in a bar, and rather than fighting, they decide to have a sharpshooting contest hitting cans/birds/stuff off people's heads.

I might give them an award for the contest, but not for each time they shoot.

Cinos wrote:

Icefalcon wrote:I have never given experience for the use of a WP. It seems like a quick way to abuse the experience rules.

Backflipping to level 10 is already a huge way to abuse the rules we have all fixed (or we all have level 15 PC's). Weapons are no different. I do like Creed's way of giving EXP, though I'd want to see what that award per-round looks like in action. You do need to keep in mind an orc character who only cares about fighting, and only fights is playing in character, and does need a way to get EXP, WP's is just a fine way to do that.

I tell my players that they only get experience for skill rolls that I call for. So of they sit there backflipping all day, I won't ask for a single skill roll.

You're only supposed to make skill checks in unusual or difficult situations, and I've always figured that you only get XP for skill checks that you make.

Now, it is arguable that rolling attacks would constitute a kind of skill check, and would therefore mean that you should get XP... but I don't think that it would be in the spirit of the game, or what Kevin or the other writers ever intended.

Cinos wrote:

Icefalcon wrote:I have never given experience for the use of a WP. It seems like a quick way to abuse the experience rules.

Backflipping to level 10 is already a huge way to abuse the rules we have all fixed (or we all have level 15 PC's). Weapons are no different. I do like Creed's way of giving EXP, though I'd want to see what that award per-round looks like in action. You do need to keep in mind an orc character who only cares about fighting, and only fights is playing in character, and does need a way to get EXP, WP's is just a fine way to do that.

The way I do it isn't on a per round basis, but on a per scene basis. It doesn't matter how many times a character attacks or parries with his weapon per round, nor how many rounds the fight goes on. Simply put, I award 25 XP for the use of a skill (WP) during the entire combat sequence. If the PC used WP Sword and WP Shield throughout the entire fight scene, whether it goes for one melee round or 10 melee rounds, he'll receive 50 XP for using those WP skills in that fight. If the player decides to switch weapons in the middle of the fight, for whatever reason, to say a Battle Axe and Shield, then the XP award goes up to 75, 25 for WP Sword, 25 for WP Shield and 25 for WP Axe. It even works if a character uses Paired Weapons; the character enters combat with a pair of Daggers and has WP Paired Weapons... 50 XP for skill use in the fight. Other XP rewards will include 25 for his HtH skill, (again for the entire fight sequence, not on a per round basis) as well as XP for plans executed, enemies defeated, self sacrifice if any and any other plausible rewards that can be applied.

To be perfectly honest, I don't really know if this is how the XP system is supposed to work for WP's or not or even if you're supposed to award XP for using WP's. But it seems awful unfair for a fighter to not get XP for doing what his skills are supposed to let him do. If XP doesn't get awarded for using WP SKILLS, why make a Man of Arms? Sure it's easy to cheat the system when it comes to XP awards for skill use. But that just means it's up to GM's to be a little more conservative about when XP awards should be applied in the first place. A guy hacking away at a tree with a sword until he hits 10th level for skill use... Not happening... there's no real experience gained beyond learning you're really good at making firewood. Take that same guy and put him up against something that actually fights back and suddenly he starts learning real quick just how much experience he really needs to level up. That's the spirit of XP from skill use.

On a somewhat related note, do you think spellcasters should be awarded XP for casting a spell or creating/activating their circles or wards? After all the manipulation of magical energies is considered a skill, isn't it?

JuliusCreed wrote:

Cinos wrote:

Icefalcon wrote:On a somewhat related note, do you think spellcasters should be awarded XP for casting a spell or creating/activating their circles or wards? After all the manipulation of magical energies is considered a skill, isn't it?

That is my question as well.
I give XP for WP's if roll is contested by a parry or dodge, never questioned it any other way since that is how I learned to play way back when. Even if KS told me I was wrong for doing it that way I don't think my group or I would change it. It has never been abused, & we always seem to level along timelines that seemed acceptable. One successful roll = 25 XP whether to hit or to parry /dodge whatever.

I dont give XP for using a WP in a fight. I dont give xp for a body building character lifting something either. It is mainly for rolling skills although in my games in must be in a useful context (identifying every plant in a garden doesnt get you 25 xp each).

What I do do, especially for men at arms is: when the charatcers are around the camp fire with some down time and the man at arms says "I practice with my weapon" I give him 100 xp for playing in character. IF he didnt have the skill (or wasnt training to pick it at next level) I wouldnt do this. so the character is enable to have xp because of a WP.

St. Evil wrote:

JuliusCreed wrote:

Cinos wrote:

Icefalcon wrote:On a somewhat related note, do you think spellcasters should be awarded XP for casting a spell or creating/activating their circles or wards? After all the manipulation of magical energies is considered a skill, isn't it?

That is my question as well.
I give XP for WP's if roll is contested by a parry or dodge, never questioned it any other way since that is how I learned to play way back when. Even if KS told me I was wrong for doing it that way I don't think my group or I would change it. It has never been abused, & we always seem to level along timelines that seemed acceptable. One successful roll = 25 XP whether to hit or to parry /dodge whatever.

Not to put down how you're doing it St. E, but I gotta disagree with it for 2 reasons...

1> Your system allows 25 XP per successful Strike or Parry with a WP... or at least that's the basic gist I'm getting, please correct me if I'm wrong... but at the risk of sounding like a rules lawyer, the XP reward for skill use is supposed to be given whether the skill is performed successfully or not. Nitpicky, I know, but I'm just saying.

2> The XP that can rack up from each and every single strike and parry in a fight using just WP skill awards can be incredibly high, almost to the point of being abuse in and of itself. A simple 3 round fight for a first level fighter with 3 attacks against a single opponent with equal attacks can easily clear about 500 XP. Throw in the factors of multiple opponents and/or longer fight sequences and that can increase exponentially into a couple thousand pretty easily. Under these circumstances, a character can potentially gain a level or two just from getting into a bar brawl.

Again, I'm not putting down how you run your system on this and I'm glad it actually works for you and your players. I'm just throwing my two coppers in for your consideration.

JuliusCreed wrote:

St. Evil wrote:

JuliusCreed wrote:

Cinos wrote:

Icefalcon wrote:On a somewhat related note, do you think spellcasters should be awarded XP for casting a spell or creating/activating their circles or wards? After all the manipulation of magical energies is considered a skill, isn't it?

That is my question as well.
I give XP for WP's if roll is contested by a parry or dodge, never questioned it any other way since that is how I learned to play way back when. Even if KS told me I was wrong for doing it that way I don't think my group or I would change it. It has never been abused, & we always seem to level along timelines that seemed acceptable. One successful roll = 25 XP whether to hit or to parry /dodge whatever.

Not to put down how you're doing it St. E, but I gotta disagree with it for 2 reasons...

1> Your system allows 25 XP per successful Strike or Parry with a WP... or at least that's the basic gist I'm getting, please correct me if I'm wrong... but at the risk of sounding like a rules lawyer, the XP reward for skill use is supposed to be given whether the skill is performed successfully or not. Nitpicky, I know, but I'm just saying.

2> The XP that can rack up from each and every single strike and parry in a fight using just WP skill awards can be incredibly high, almost to the point of being abuse in and of itself. A simple 3 round fight for a first level fighter with 3 attacks against a single opponent with equal attacks can easily clear about 500 XP. Throw in the factors of multiple opponents and/or longer fight sequences and that can increase exponentially into a couple thousand pretty easily. Under these circumstances, a character can potentially gain a level or two just from getting into a bar brawl.

Again, I'm not putting down how you run your system on this and I'm glad it actually works for you and your players. I'm just throwing my two coppers in for your consideration.

Thats fine it works for us. We have fun,(that the point right) over a 3+ year campaign we average 8th-9th level. That is what home brew is about. Like I said it was the way I was taught how to play, so this thread is eye opening. I am glad I read this thread before I did any play by post, that could have been embarrassing.