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This is great news. We may see Wave 1 before the summer is out.

Jorel wrote:This is great news. We may see Wave 1 before the summer is out.

Maybe... unless they're using the same shipping Harmony Gold does, in which case it'll be "stuck on a boat in China" for the next three years.

Still, unless the manufacturer is also doing packaging and shipping to the customer, I'd expect mid-to-late autumn just because of the sheer amount of sorting, packing, and shipping that six people will be doing...

they will have more than 6 people doing it.

Jorel wrote:This is great news. We may see Wave 1 before the summer is out.

YESSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!

Jorel wrote:they will have more than 6 people doing it.

Yes, they are getting people to help.

Reread to post I responded to. It was about shipping. They only have like 6 employees that will do shipping an packing unless they hire more.

Unless those helpers are going to be helping every day for 8+ hours they are still going to take weeks...unless of course they do NOTHING else at all until everything is shipped....and we know how good they are at prioritizing things......

they already mentioned having volunteers help. Depending on the number it would not surprise me if they also hired temps to help speed up the process.

It would be nice if they'd specified what in particular was being manufactured (or flat out saying all of it, in case they're producing all 8 sprues at once, plus dice, boxes, manuals, etc, etc) and estimated completion timelines for those items, which any factory worth dealing with should at least have a solid estimate on.

Especially given that from what they've said, they're doing Backer Wave One and Retail Wave One at the same time.

Jorel wrote:they already mentioned having volunteers help. Depending on the number it would not surprise me if they also hired temps to help speed up the process.

Which still doesn't change or affect anything I said. Unless they get someone, be they volunteer fan/friends or paid temp workers, they'll need them working every day for 8+ hours to get it done ins any semblance of reasonable time.

Just look at how messed up December and January are with Xmas grab bag orders and that's a fraction of the orders they are pulling here. Any work on new product is likely to be essentially shelved for a couple of months with GenCon and RRT Wave One. It would have to be with how this company does things typically.

Edit - and to be honest, I am not to keen on Joe Shmoe off the street volunteer pulling my order.

jaymz wrote:Edit - and to be honest, I am not to keen on Joe Shmoe off the street volunteer pulling my order.

If Palladium is smart they'll have a list compiled of what a backer will receive based on his/her initial pledge (i.e. First contact, Battle Cry, Showdown). Then all they need to do is address the add-on's which are available with wave 1.

EDIT: After looking at the online store it look like this bit of homework was done for the First Contact, Battle Cry and Showdown packages.

Forar wrote:It would be nice if they'd specified what in particular was being manufactured (or flat out saying all of it, in case they're producing all 8 sprues at once, plus dice, boxes, manuals, etc, etc) and estimated completion timelines for those items, which any factory worth dealing with should at least have a solid estimate on.

Especially given that from what they've said, they're doing Backer Wave One and Retail Wave One at the same time.

Yes, everything, it sounds like. At least, that is how it sounds to me.

Alpha 11 wrote:

Forar wrote:It would be nice if they'd specified what in particular was being manufactured (or flat out saying all of it, in case they're producing all 8 sprues at once, plus dice, boxes, manuals, etc, etc) and estimated completion timelines for those items, which any factory worth dealing with should at least have a solid estimate on.

Especially given that from what they've said, they're doing Backer Wave One and Retail Wave One at the same time.

Yes, everything, it sounds like. At least, that is how it sounds to me.

Rifter #66 has a list of Retail products for Robotech RPG Tactics. If you look in the online catalog you will see the same list.

Alpha 11 wrote:

Forar wrote:It would be nice if they'd specified what in particular was being manufactured (or flat out saying all of it, in case they're producing all 8 sprues at once, plus dice, boxes, manuals, etc, etc) and estimated completion timelines for those items, which any factory worth dealing with should at least have a solid estimate on.

Especially given that from what they've said, they're doing Backer Wave One and Retail Wave One at the same time.

Yes, everything, it sounds like. At least, that is how it sounds to me.

Unfortunately, there's often a fairly large gulf between what PB alludes to, and what they really mean. While it's possible you're correct, it's also quite possible you're not.

The previous Update, 144, said "In fact, many items will begin manufacturing next week, with the rest to follow quickly after.". In a project that's 7 months past due, with this being the fourth official release date, a clarification of "follow quickly" isn't out of line. Especially with the revised release date less than 7 weeks away, and GenCon less than 9, days let alone weeks, matter now.

Precisely, Morgan.

Making assumptions is generally not a good idea, and that goes double for this campaign.

Hence the hope for clarity.

Not that I'm expecting us to get it. If anything, I'm expecting us to get a vague idea with the next update, IF they deign to note that "X has been completed, Y is underway, Z is ongoing, etc", but even that is probably aiming too high.

Well, whatever it is, they will be cutting it VERY close.

Maybe they (PB and ND) should post a live version of their Gantt chart for this project... lol. That way all of the "It's never going to be done" Town criers can feel comfortable that they are right...or wrong.

Funny, some backers have been asking for a Gantt chart for literally over a year.

Hell, I know some (myself included) that would be ecstatic to be able to see tangible updated progress on a regular basis.

No, vaguely worded updates and a couple of sentences in the weekly newsletter don't count.

But something like the one the AvP project has been sending to backers? That'd be fantastic.

Phaze wrote:Maybe they (PB and ND) should post a live version of their Gantt chart for this project... lol. That way all of the "It's never going to be done" Town criers can feel comfortable that they are right...or wrong.

Er, dude... as disorganized as the companies involved in this mess usually are, what makes you imagine that they bothered to make a Gantt chart or engage in any other form of high-level project planning? Hell, being that these are all small-time outfits that've clearly never involved a business major... what makes you think they even know what a Gantt chart is?

You really can't help but Devil's Advocate this thing every chance you get, can you?

Should we just append a "HG, PB and ND are all slow and incompetent and seem to strangely hate/fear money and success" notation to every post? Y'know, save you a little time?

I don't think I've seen a post critiquing the campaign that you couldn't take thinly veiled shots at, and man, it's getting old. We get it, you think they couldn't find their asses with both hands and a map, and that every backer who has a complaint is even dumber than that.

It's cool man, it's cool.

Forar wrote:You really can't help but Devil's Advocate this thing every chance you get, can you?

Eh... it's not really being a Devil's Advocate if I'm not encouraging an argumentative discussion process or I'm not inviting people to explore the point further. I'm just pointing out a very likely, and uncomfortable, explanation for why certain requests are unlikely to be acknowledged, let alone fulfilled.

Forar wrote:Should we just append a "HG, PB and ND are all slow and incompetent and seem to strangely hate/fear money and success" notation to every post? Y'know, save you a little time? [...]

If you think it would help people keep their expectations realistic, then sure... because those unrealistic explanations are the key source of disappointment. Just owning or running a business, especially a very modest business, doesn't mean that the people running it have even the faintest clue what a high level project planning method like a Gantt chart is. Moreover, very few businesses would release the internal planning documents behind their products simply because the customers wanted to see them... most, in my experience, are quite reluctant to share them under any circumstances.

Nightfactory wrote:Uncomfortable truths are always difficult for people to hear.

Doubly so here... because there's a nesting doll-style cycle of uncomfortable truths. In the unlikely event that these rather disorganized, very informal businesses actually put together Gantt charts and any other types of planning documents, most companies would never release internal product planning documents in any circumstance other than having received a court order requiring them to do so.

(Hell, more than one company I've worked with has had a policy where even showing timing documents to other employees who haven't been given access to them is a firing offense the first time, every time.)

Nightfactory wrote:No offence, Forar: I've noticed yourself and several others wanting a 'magic wand' cure for this debacle. There is not one, though, whether you like it or not. This is the way things are.

Kindly point out one instance of my asking for a 'magic wand cure'. If that's what you've read into my posts, then we are not on the same wavelength at all.

That you believe "constructive criticism regarding their new business venture" construes 'wanting a magic wand cure' speaks far more about Palladium and you than it does me.

It's been said that the definition of 'insanity' is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results each time. If you feel like its getting old when people rebut your unrealisitic demands, then quit making them.

"Stop sucking" is an "unrealistic demand". Gotcha.

That's a wee bit melodramatic, wouldn't you say? Nobody is calling the backers dumb. There are a few backers (in this context, mind you) who are frustrated and expressing their frustration through 'what if' scenarios. What if Palladium made a Gantt Chart? What if Palladium released the rules ahead of the game? What if.....? But unfortunately, these things are not realistic.

Yes, hyperbole for humourous effect is truly some cutting edge 'tech'. Welcome to the interwebs, enjoy your stay. Also, stay away from youtube comments. It's for the best.

Everyone understands what it's like to be frustrated, but working oneself into a frenzy with speculative ideas and "If I Were King, Here's What I Would Do" type arguments is not getting anyone anywhere.

You can't see it, but I'm flipping you the bird. Have a nice day.

So the game is in the manufacturing stage but it's still being tweaked? Great more PB double talk.

And now HG is pandering their flock for money to make a pilot episode that no one will probably buy. As seto says, because it's RT it's a failure from the start. I'm in total agreement.

I don't think wave two will show up this year only because of past experience, but I'm looking forward to someday getting all of my pledge.

"Let the Saliva FLOW!"

Can't wait, can't wait, can't wait....

Painting table cleared....check.
Fresh Paints....check.
Terrain ready....90%
Told the wife that I will be MIA until Gencon while I paint these...Uh...well not really, kinda alluded to it.

Ah well...sometimes its easier to ask for forgiveness, than ask for permission.

I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that RTT will be for sale at GenCon 2015.

Pretty much. I'll be very surprised if it is at GenCon 2014 for sale.

At best we MIGHT see some for sale at GenCon IF they pay for airfreight to get some here by then.....IF they have manufacturing done to the point of being able to do so. Though they do that then a LOT of people will NOT be happy.

Jorel wrote:Pretty much. I'll be very surprised if it is at GenCon 2014 for sale.

Would it be terribly gauche of me to say "GenCon 2025 or bust"?

Just going by the content of their last few updates they've posted, it sounds like actual mass production of sprues hasn't started in earnest yet and they're still trying to work out the logistics of importing it all. Even getting it to the customers looks like an issue that's still pending consideration.

(Admittedly, large-scale importation of goods IS a megaton-scale pain in the butt...)

actually I keep getting the read from it that mass production has started on all but those final bits.

RRT is giving RTA a bad rap. Folks keep harping about PB on the RTA ks. You know you have a pr nightmare when your project is messing with other people's projects.