Gods in Phase World

[kirnos]

So, If i remember correctly, there is a planet in the UWW that "belongs" to the Asgardian gods, with an agreement of leave us alone and our people will keep producing magic items and stuff for you.

But i kind of recall something about the Olympian gods also being around somehow, although i don't have my books with me so can not say where or if it is really true. Someone remembers or knows about that?

Also, what about the other pantheons? Are they involved somehow in the Three Galaxies? Do you use your own invented gods (after all it is logic to think other gods exits beyond the "Earth ones".

[Braden Campbell]

There is Serket, an ousted Egyptian goddess, who lives in the Thundercloud Galaxy.

Hermes (Greek pantheon) is known to go shopping in Centre from time to time.

[kirnos]

Serket is in the Thundercloud? Is this on the sourcebook or are you adding this as an easter egg?

[Nekira Sudacne]

Zurvan is mentioned to hang out with second stage prometheans in their complex in center. Apparently they're advanced enough for him to understand as people.

[drewkitty ~..~]

The different deities are always meddling in places that their followers are.

[Braden Campbell]

Serket is in the Thundercloud? Is this on the sourcebook or are you adding this as an easter egg?

see Thundercloud Galaxy, pg 58

[kirnos]

Serket is in the Thundercloud? Is this on the sourcebook or are you adding this as an easter egg?

see Thundercloud Galaxy, pg 58

Oh, well, will have to read it as soon as I gain access to my books again XD But are there stats for Serket on the book?

[Axelmania]

58 is stats for the CheDive, mentions their planet Serket is named after their god, an All-Mother (meaning she could power Automatons, FoMp25)

I'm not sure where the part about her being an ousted Egyptian Goddess is though. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serket does say deification of the scorpion, I'm more interested in the 'ousted' part though.

In looking up info on her I found she's apparently in a video game: http://smite.gamepedia.com/Serqet

[Braden Campbell]

I'm not sure where the part about her being an ousted Egyptian Goddess is though. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serket does say deification of the scorpion, I'm more interested in the 'ousted' part though.

Oh... sorry. I'm referring to material that did not make the final edit (thundercloud, when first submitted was waaaay too long). Please accept this from my personal cutting room floor.
_______________________________________________________________________

The CheDive Theocracy
Population: 100 billion. These numbers have already been included in the Consortium population numbers.
Demographics: 1 Divine Being. The remainder is roughly 80% CheDive, 20% Others (following a typical Consortium breakdown)

In the north-west portion of the Gaelra Arm lies an ancient and mystical land. A planetary collective four thousand light-years in length and nearly two thousand light-years wide, it accounts for nearly 10% of the Consortium’s total Thundercloud claim. This is the CheDive Theocracy, home of the arachnoid CheDive and their patron deity, Serket. This strip of dry, desert worlds and burning suns might at first glance have little to offer. However, it contains vast deposits of killaryte, and more than half of the so-called Naruni Main lies within its borders. The Theocracy has been a full member of the Consortium for nearly a century, but its inclusion did not come easily. Like many colonial holdings across the Three Galaxies, it was conquered with scant diplomacy and an abundance of bloodshed.

Background
Much like the Oni, the CheDive’s prehistory was entirely shaped by the presence of a deific being that took corporeal form and lived among them. In fact, finding two such peoples with similar backgrounds, in the same galaxy, not to mention the incredible magic levels present within the Crèche clouds, have prompted many scholars to wonder if there might not be entire populations of “gods” living in the unexplored portions of the Thundercloud. The CheDive’s patron and creator was named Serket. Also known as “the scorpion goddess”, Serket had long-ago been a member of a powerful pantheon. Ultimately though, she was replaced by a younger, more beautiful female deity named Isis. Depressed and feeling rejected, she went into exile, choosing a hot, dry world orbiting an angry yellow star. According to the CheDive mythos, it was here, on the planet Ugapyu, that she created herself a race of devotees. Made after her own image, the CheDive were a seemingly impossible mix of scorpion and humanoid, of arachnid and mammal. Soon, there were millions of them. They erected great cities and vast places of worship. All across their world gigantic statues and effigies of Serket rose up from out of the burning sands. Still, it was apparently insufficient.

Gods like Serket survive only because people worship them. Just like magic, their power is somehow increased by belief. Therefore, if people stop worshiping them, they weaken. If people stop believing in them, they will cease to exist altogether. The Scorpion goddess had already found herself weakened once to the point where her very consciousness began to fade way. There was no way that she was going to let such a thing happen again. So, in order to ensure her continued immortality as much as anything else, she declared that the CheDive would have no other gods before her. Then, by creating massive dimensional portals, she spread her worshipers across the width of the Gaelra Arm, telling them to be fruitful and multiply. By the dawn of the Scramble, there were more than 100 billion CheDive living on over 23,000 worlds.

As seems to be the case with many races who find themselves directly subservient to a greater supernatural being, the CheDive’s overall technology level is low. Despite the fact that they had created a crude kind of interstellar empire, the CheDive were a people stuck in the Age of Steam. They also had a limited understanding of magic, again thanks mostly to the presence of Serket. Part of her innate knowledge was the ability to create and operate dimensional pyramids, and it was through these pyramids that the many worlds of the Theocracy retained contact over such vast distances. Serket also had many, many temples built to honor her. In each of these temples, hundreds of priests would conduct services, perform miracles, and enchant items. In fact, the church was so widespread and powerful, that it eventually became the government.

As a god, Serket was technically the sovereign over all the worlds upon which the CheDive live. In reality, she ruled from a distance, preferring to let the priests handle any day to day affairs, and intervening only on very rare occasions. Over the millennia, the church became so big and bloated that its clergy outnumbered the entire armed forces of all the worlds in the Theocracy. The army and the church began a rivalry that grew with every passing century. For although their devotion to their patron goddess was absolute, there remained something in the insect portion of their makeup that longed for dominance. Control remained with the church, as it always had because that was the way of things. This was the society that had been established for them by their god, and there was no reason, no impetus, to affect change whether peaceful or no. Then the Company arrived.

The Madu Revolt
The Madu Revolt, as it came to known, was an historic milestone in the Scramble for the Thundercloud. To Consortium observers it marked the first time that they had been offered any kind of serious resistance by a native race (even though the Second War for Independence had been raging for a century on Kazematt, the CCW considers the Denlech to be Humans). The events that lead up to the Revolt began almost as soon as the Consortium made contact with the CheDive in 9890 TE. The area claimed by the Theocracy included many worlds rich in killaryte, and even while the Company’s diplomats were drinking tea with the High Priests and speaking in flowery language about a new era of prosperity for both their peoples, the Uteni were conducting planetary surveys and weeping in anticipation of record profits. The Theocracy itself was of a substantial size, and that made both the Company and the CAF want it all the more. Having the CheDive join the Consortium would add thousands of developed, populated worlds to their Thundercloud claim. Despite this, there were a few factors that made the diplomats uncomfortable. Firstly, was the presence of Serket. By the books, Ugapyu was an “entity-controlled planet”; that is, it had living on it a being whose magical powers were able to surpass the technology of the CCW. The Consortium had identified thirty-three such planets over the centuries, but this would mark the first time that such a one was offered a seat in the Congress. Secondly, there was the question of whether or not the CheDive garnered full or associate member status. Their technology was higher than many of their interstellar neighbors, but still quite behind the galactic average. Still, thanks to Serket, they had managed to colonize other planets, which was one of the mandatory achievements for full membership.

The High Priests agreed to join the CCW. In exchange for full membership, they would allow the Naruni to extract all the killaryte they wanted from the Theocracy. The Conglomerate would also pay a tithe to the Church of Serket on an annual basis as a means of thanking the goddess for providing the bountiful crystals. Behind closed doors, the Naruni balked. Taxes of any kind do nothing but cut into their bottom line. However, both the Company and the CAF Admirals forced them to accept the terms.

For the next fifty years, things seemed to be proceeding smoothly. The killaryte flowed, and the Naruni got rich. The High Priests got rich too. The CheDive people represented a vast and untapped market for anyone with anything to sell, and by 9900 TE, the Theocracy was seen as a land of opportunity where a young man or woman from the Corkscrew could build any enterprise they might imagine. Things were also helped by the CheDive themselves, who proved to be cheap and hardy workers. More and more Consortium species came to live on the worlds of the Theocracy, and thus began the tension. Humans, Noro, and Wulfen were now dominating many aspects of society including banks and businesses. It was getting harder and harder for the average CheDive to improve their social standing. Moreover, Thundercloud success story that it was, the CAF felt an overpowering need to protect the Theocracy. Huge numbers of Seljuk troopers were brought in to protect vital worlds and cities. It was assumed that since the CheDive and the Seljuk both shared commonalities in language (each can speak Trade Five with ease), that this would only improve relations between the natives and the Corkscrew races. In fact, it had the opposite effect. Many CheDive soldiers now found their advancement through the ranks blocked by giant dinosaurs that mostly just stood around looking somber and drinking in the dry, hot climate. Fifty years of Consortium membership hadn’t improved the lives of all CheDive, just a select few. Dissatisfaction grew, and finally personified itself in Colonial Nalur Madu.

Madu was born in a small community. He was son to the village leader, and this allowed him to get a decent education. He completed elementary school in his home village, and then set out for the capital. He enrolled himself in the Theocratic University for two years, but feeling dissatisfied, dropped out and joined the army. By the age of twenty, he had been made the equivalent of a Lieutenant Colonel. He was a galvanising speaker. Perhaps because of his rural origins, he was seen by many CheDive as having an authentic point of view with regards to their race’s place within the Consortium. He was also well respected by many cheDive soldiers who were even now finding themselves displaced by increasing numbers of Seljuk. Madu had little trouble in gathering together large numbers of disgruntled CheDive, and before long, he had himself an army. The Colonel did not immediately unleash his fighters, much to his credit. He first tried to convince the High Priests with words and subtle threats of reprisal, demanding that the Seljuk troopers be sent back to the Corkscrew. “Bak tum Serketta ee nona CheDive”, he said (“The Theocracy is for the CheDive.”). If the Church refused to send the Seljuk home, he would. In response, the Thundercloud Development Company sent a letter to Colonel Madu stating that Consortium member worlds were expected to abide by the Civilization Compact. If the Colonel attempted to seize control of the Theocracy in a miltary coup, he would be in violation of the Fourth Freedom and would face “serious and most unpleasant consequences”. The letter also had the backing of Serket herself, who refused to see the strength of her church wain, no matter how corrupt it was becoming.

The actual Revolt began with a citizen uprising. Riots broke out all across Ugapyu during the midsummer festival, and affluent Corkscrew races were the primary targets. Whether or not Colonel Madu’s movement had anything to do with the violence has never been established, but the CAF simply assumed that it did. The fleet responded with waves of air strikes. Swooping down from the sky they strafed and firebombed many of Madu’s military encampments. However, the pilot’s cockiness quickly turned to horror as they realized that, somehow, the Colonel had acquired modern-day anti-air emplacements. Instead of ending the uprising in one fell swoop, the space fighters suffered horrible losses and were recalled. The Colonel’s forces were bloodied, but still largely intact.

The next day, Captain-General Martha Toulmen, the commander of the orbiting Consortium fleet, sent an ultimatum to Colonel Madu: either dismantle his defensive batteries or face a full-scale retaliation. Her demand was ignored. Two weeks later, with the renegade Colonel now the de facto ruler of the CheDive homeworld if not all of CheDive space, and with Serket and the remaining High Priests barricaded in the massive central temple, Captain-General Toulmen began the landing of nearly 30,000 soldiers. But Colonel Madu’s heavy defenses also contained anti-orbital lasers which opened fire, destroying several combat shuttles and crippling the Warshield CSS-Dynare’s Shadow. Nonetheless, by dawn the next day the troop complements of all five Packmaster carriers and 127 battle cruisers were standing on CheDive soil. Combined with the Seljuk troops already present on the planet, the rebels had no choice but to abandon their positions and fall back.
The Consortium ground forces were held up for five weeks around the globe, as they clashed with Madu’s supporters. Many of the troopers had been expecting an easy go of things, that thanks to their superior technology the fight would be over quickly. It came as a great shock therefore to find that the scorpion people were armed with modern energy pulse rifles, instead of steam-era bullet weapons. They also had mortars, artillery pieces, and even portable force field generators. By the end of the Revolt, the number of Consortium casualties would top 540, which one official would describe as “wholly unacceptable.”

Disgusted that the infantry was making such poor gains in what should have been an overnight conflict, Captain-General Toulmen finally sent in eighteen companies of Silverhawk Special Forces (about 2800 men). Their powerful armor allowed them to slip through the Colonel’s force fields and attack the capital directly. Within an hour, many of Madu’s supporters had either been killed or had fled into the mountains. The Colonel himself eventually surrendered. He was sentenced to exile following a military tribunal, and lived the remainder of his days in the Tail of the Corkscrew Galaxy. The High Priests of Serket resumed their leadership role under the guidance of Kenelm Dovak, a Consortium special commissioner from Noro-Gor.


The Theocracy Today
Although no one will dare come right out and say it, the Theocracy was a tactical addition to the Consortium. In exchange for a little bit of negotiation, the Company almost doubled its territory in the Gaelra Arm. This would also set the precedence that the Scramble could be more easily won by absorbing native power blocs in addition to the establishment of entirely new colonies. The result is that today the Consortium views the CheDive as an investment more than an ally, and since it has put so much time and effort into the development of the Theocracy, the Company and the CAF are willing to fight in order to keep it.

There is more going on than money-making and venture investment though. The CheDive as a whole have benefited greatly from Consortium membership. Well, some of them have. Although not as rigid a caste society as the Oni, there remains a great disparity between the Theocracy’s rich and the Theocracy’s poor. Those with the money are, naturally, those in power and this means that the Priests of Serket are the ones reaping most of the benefits. CheDive who serve the Church are vastly more well off than the average man, as are those who have worked hard to become “model Consortium citizens” – which means enlisting in the CAF, and emulating Humankind. Unfortunately, gaining full acceptance into the ranks of the Corkscrew races almost always means accepting the Cosmic Forge as one’s personal deity, and this is where relations run aground. Serket, as benevolent towards her people as she may be, is also very selfish. Her whole reason for creating the CheDive was to ensure that through belief, she would continue to exist. Therefore, there is absolutely no way that she will allow her Church to weaken; her very life depends on it. Every time that the Church of the Forge has aggressively sought to convert the CheDive, Serket has made it clear, in no uncertain terms, that she will withdraw the Theocracy from the Consortium. If the religious persecution doesn’t immediately stop, she will unleash aai sedjet (“great fire” – the equivalent of a holy war) upon the Consortium occupiers.

Needless to say, there is division and tension between the Church of the Forge and the Thundercloud Development Company over this. The Church is a supportive party of the Company, and believes that since it pays money into the Scramble effort it has the right to continue its work without interference. The Company’s other investors don’t want to see any disruption in the flow of profits or the availability of business opportunities. Naruni Enterprises has the most to loose should the Theocracy shut its borders and take half of the Main with it, and it pays far more into the Company’s coffers than the Church of the Forge does. So, for the time being everyone involved had agreed to disagree. The Church of the Forge continues to send Clerics into the Theocracy, mainly to minister to the Corkscrew and Anvil races, but also to perform conversions when they can. For their part, the CheDive continue to worship Serket, and even those who have gone over to Forgism in order to please the Company or get ahead in the CAF never take their conversion to heart.

The religious tensions in this part of the Thundercloud only underscore the reasons why the Consortium prefers not to deal directly with “entities”. On the whole, gods, supernatural intelligences, and any surviving Elder Races are just too damned alien in their thinking; they have certain expectations and delusions of grandeur and they become petulant when either of those two things is shattered. Moreover, Serket’s very visage disturbs many in the Company. She most often appears as a human woman with jet black eyes and a scorpion growing out of her scalp. She can also transform herself into a giant scorpion in a matter of seconds, and remain that way indefinitely. In either of her guises, she can lash out with a poisonous venom (either from her fingertips, or from her scorpion tail) that will instantly kill most mortal races. Those who have studied her cult in-depth know that she is the sworn enemy of yet another deific creature, some kind of serpent called Apep, and fear the day when this creature makes a personal appearance in the Thundercloud Galaxy.

Worlds of Interest
Ugapyu. Third planet out from a yellow star, this is the capital world of the Theocracy and the mythic birth place of the CheDive. It is a near-desert world, with very little standing water, and almost no annual rainfall. Temperatures can easily hit 110 degrees Fahrenheit (43 degrees Celsius) during the day, but drop to 44 degrees Fahrenheit (7 degrees Celsius) when the sun goes down. Such temperatures are just fine for the CheDive, who thrive in the hot sun thanks to the arachnid portion of their makeup. Likewise the Seljuk, being cold-blooded, think the worlds of the Theocracy to be quite pleasant. Other species however, particularly Humans, tend to find the dry heat uncomfortable and exhausting. It is recommended that travelers to the Theocracy bring along light clothing made of cotton, shayald, or linen.

The capital city of Ugapyu is Ain, which translates as “priceless” in Trade Four. It is a sprawling metropolis of nearly eight million inhabitants, built up along the banks of a freshwater river named the Basi. It is dominated by the central Temple of Serket, a massive, walled complex that covers over eighteen square miles (nearly 30 square kilometers). Inside are three pyramids, a dozen places of worship, housing for the high Priests, countless statues of the scorpion goddess, and a gigantic house whose front entryway is covered in gold relief. It is here that Serket will always be found, unless she is visiting one of the other CheDive planets (she can teleport or open a rift to any place in the Theocracy at a moment’s notice). Although she has been invited to on several occasions, the goddess has never boarded a starship or left the borders of the Theocracy; many in the Company wonder if doing so would instantly weaken her, or perhaps even cause her to vanish from existence.

Ikoso. This is the only planet orbiting a red dwarf star. The rest of system’s material is found one orbit out in the form of a gigantic ring of asteroids and nebular gasses. Ikoso is quite warm, and boats a breathable atmosphere despite having almost no indigenous biosphere. So far, only a thousand CheDive live here alongside a hundred assorted Consortium archeologists, geologists, and scholars. Their mission: to study the bizarre structures left behind on this world by some unknown race so that the Company can set up mining operations in the system.

There are many worlds in the Thundercloud which bear ancient ruins, wreckages of species now dead for fifty millennia. However, Ikoso’s are unique. Instead of surface buildings, the planet is honeycombed with tunnels. Each of them measures exactly two hundred feet in diameter, are perfectly smooth, and are located exactly five miles underground (8 km). There is no indication of where all the extra material went. There are no entry shafts leading down to the tunnels either. It is almost as if trillions of tons of rock and dirt were teleported away somewhere, leaving only the tunnels behind. But to what purpose?

Acrh. Pronounced “ack-ruh”, this is just one of the habitable worlds located within the Heoda Cluster. Acrh is the third of three planets orbiting a brutally hot and blindingly bright blue dwarf star (which itself is just one of eight stars of differing types packed into the nebula). It is notable for a few things. Firstly, it is the homeworld of the Kasaro, a race of fierce fighters. Secondly, it is one of eight planets in that were colonized exclusively by the CheDive following their admission into the CCW. Finally, it is now famous as the place where the heroic Consortium Captain, Benjamin Stair, fought and died. Today, it is a Forge-forsaken place, controlled entirely by the Enage of the Kasaro and his multitudes of followers.

[Axelmania]

All you need to do now is admit she's behind the hijacking of The Three's automatons!

[kirnos]

Wow Mr Campbell!!! This a true jewel. Why didn't that made it to the final cut? I wonder how much more could have been included... Any possibility to see more of that material on the website?

In any case I really like the whole background. It shows the theme behind the Thundercloud Scramble very well (greed and more greed), and also another factor that as far as I remember was not on the book: how some members of the new species profit from working alongside with the colonists, even if it means selling their people. Which means a lot of plots and good ideas for adventures.

I really hope to see more and more info on the Three Galaxies, through new books and also this sneak peeks. Phase World has endless possibilities.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Hmm

Before I accept that as quasi-Canon, Brandon, do you know it was cut for space reasons only, and not for other reasons (Such as Kevin not approving of the idea, or not enough of the idea to be worth a re-edit to fix?)

[Braden Campbell]

Honestly a bit from all three columns.

The manuscript I submitted was, I now realize, filled with too much background and not enough actual gaming material. So, yes, it was too long to print as submitted, it was not enough of what the editors prefer in their books, and publication deadline pressures meant that it was easier to cut than rework.

Not everything I wrote should be taken as Thundercloud gospel, but it might at least give you a better look at what I originally envisioned, which was to transpose an actual historic era that is not often explored into a space opera setting.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Honestly a bit from all three columns.

The manuscript I submitted was, I now realize, filled with too much background and not enough actual gaming material. So, yes, it was too long to print as submitted, it was not enough of what the editors prefer in their books, and publication deadline pressures meant that it was easier to cut than rework.

Not everything I wrote should be taken as Thundercloud gospel, but it might at least give you a better look at what I originally envisioned, which was to transpose an actual historic era that is not often explored into a space opera setting.

I suppose that might actually be why I found the Thundercloud Galaxy so unfufiling. A LOT of my games are historically based, with the Age of Sail and Colonozation something that i've done over and over again. I really did not like the Race for the thundercloud simply because I like sci fi to get away from that area of history while still exploring new lands and finding new civilizations. I've had more than enough of it from actual age-of-sail games

Not a knock on your work. you did it pretty well, you just competently wrote the last thing I wanted for Phase World, through no particular fault of your own

I LIKED that the CCW stuck to it's principles, and that the UWW was a completely volentary club for magic users. what imperialism there was was handled by the TGE and Splurgorth and smaller local powers and was easy to ignore. Having the two good factions sell out just killed the book for me, no matter how "historically accruate" it was. I want sci-fi to be humanity making brand NEW mistakes, not repeating the same old ones.

I'm not trying to say that as a critism of you as an author. the book is good, it's just the exact opposite direction I wanted PW as a setting to go. There would be no fix but to do a ground up rewrite with a completely different theme.

[kirnos]

My idea was to use a godling or demigod as a kind of ambassador from the UWW that goes to make first contact and negotiations for the admission of new members in an unexplored sector of the galaxy (Anvil or Corkscrew, yet not decided). Just imagine the scene, the powerful and charismatic presence presenting himself/herself as an envoy. To cross paths with the players, even make a friendship or partnership.

[RockJock]

Awesome Braden, thanks for sharing. The background info really helps flesh things out.

There is the Japanese goddess who brought the Oni out of the dark ages. She isn't there now, but was in historical memory.

[Furoan]

I forget what book its in, I can't see it with a quick glance, but I remember that in one of the Dimensional books it mentions that there are various planets ruled by 'entities' which include various Gods, Splugoth, Demon Lords and the like. IIRC there were at least 30, and most of them were in the United Worlds of Warlock simply because the UWW didn't go around and bother them much. It might have been in Anvil Galaxy or the Original Phase World book, but I can't see it on a quick glance through.

[kirnos]

Awesome Braden, thanks for sharing. The background info really helps flesh things out.

There is the Japanese goddess who brought the Oni out of the dark ages. She isn't there now, but was in historical memory.

Yes Amaterasu. There is some info on that in the Phase World Sourcebook and on Thundercloud Galaxy.

[kirnos]

I forget what book its in, I can't see it with a quick glance, but I remember that in one of the Dimensional books it mentions that there are various planets ruled by 'entities' which include various Gods, Splugoth, Demon Lords and the like. IIRC there were at least 30, and most of them were in the United Worlds of Warlock simply because the UWW didn't go around and bother them much. It might have been in Anvil Galaxy or the Original Phase World book, but I can't see it on a quick glance through.

I think it is on the main Phase World book. If i remember correctly it says 33 worlds (can be wrong ,as don't have the books with me and i'm an old man). That was the info that got me to wonder about all those worlds and the pantheons and gods that go around the Three Galaxies

[Furoan]

Yes, I found it. Main Phase-World book, Page 90. The passage is listed below.

Entity-Controlled Planets: In Three Galaxy Terms, an 'entity' is any being with powers beyond the technology or magic available to the most advanced civilisations. Supernatural Intelligences, Demon Lords and so called 'gods' all belong to this category. Most political and economic power in those worlds are in the hand of one or a handful of entities and their minions. A few planets are controlled by a pantheon of gods (see Rifts Conversion Book Two: Pantheons of the Megaverse for more information). Many of these gods are relatively primitive , but have the power to face off starships single-handed. On many occasions, an exploration ship has had the misfortune of making contact with a powerful but insane creature(s) that may subject the crew member to all manner of lethal games for its amusements.
Not all entities are malevolent. A few even take part in galactic affairs, fighting against would-be tyrants, supernatural threats and other dangers. However, for the most part they are distrusted by all 'lesser' beings. So far, thirty three entityies controlled worlds have been recorded in the galactic records. Nine of them exist amongst the United Worlds

Also, for another god in the Three Galaxies or at least was there once, the Oni legends tell that Ameratsu brought them into the 3G (Phase World Sourcebook, page 15).

[glitterboy2098]

those entity controlled worlds sound like fodder for plots comparable to the old Star Trek TOS episodes "Squire of Gothos", "Who Mourns for Adonais?", and "Catspaw". (and the animated series episode "Bem")

[gaby]

I have No problem with people came up with Aliens gods.

[kirnos]

I have No problem with people came up with Aliens gods.

Aren't technically all gods aliens?

But yes, I agree it is only logical there must be gods of other cultures beyond the human. Although on the Three Galaxies the Forge legend is so important it can explain why there are only 33 known planets controlled by gods/supernatural entities (not technically gods, but then what is a god?).
Connecting with what Braden Campbell said previously, I am also interested on this Church of the Forge. Who are they? What are their tenets? How much power do they have on the CCW? Are they represented on the TGE, UWW et al? Do they have access to supernatural powers or just plain people? I am sure they must have a very important position on the Forge War on the Anvil Galaxy.

[Furoan]

kirnos: My take on the 'Church of the Forge' would be a kind of organisation about the Nine Forge Heresy listed in Anvil Galaxy. IN the description of them and the forge world it mentioned that this or that of the heresy's were sometimes official doctrine of various interplanetary governments, and that vicious wars had been fought over people who claimed that the Cosmic Forge couldn't POSSIBLY have manifested as X, it was completely obvious that it was Y.

I don't think they have powers in the same way that a priest of a god has powers but since we are talking about phase world I bet the organisations are pretty big...and very, very fractured. Much like the Catholic Church of our own world has fragmented into a lot of sub-groups that reinterpret the Bible very differently or what it means to follow it, I bet there are a lot of factions in the 'Church of the Forge', each of them following one of the different heresy's and each of htem certain beyond words that if thye do A, B and C they will be led to the Cosmic Forge and given unlimited power.

[Axelmania]

I have No problem with people came up with Aliens gods.

Aren't technically all gods aliens?

Only in the sense that everything is an alien relative to very planet other than their own.

There are some gods native to earth. In Spirit West you have She Who Walks the Circle who was an elevated Shaman and in Pantheons you have Herakles.who was a.demigod born to a mortal. I think Dionysus too but not sure if his mom was on Earth or not.

[kirnos]

I have No problem with people came up with Aliens gods.

Aren't technically all gods aliens?

Only in the sense that everything is an alien relative to very planet other than their own.

There are some gods native to earth. In Spirit West you have She Who Walks the Circle who was an elevated Shaman and in Pantheons you have Herakles.who was a.demigod born to a mortal. I think Dionysus too but not sure if his mom was on Earth or not.

Dionysus mother was human, so yes, half-alien

On Rifts/Phase World, gods are essentially supernatural intelligences, so really alien in concept and essence. And their very lifes depend on the worship of the mortals, so are they in fact more like vampire intelligences?

[gaby]

I would have it that Some Alien Intelligences pass themsleves as Gods,control planets and entire systems in Secret with some races as ther main Minions and other slaves.

What do you think?

[drewkitty ~..~]

I would have it that Some Alien Intelligences pass themsleves as Gods,control planets and entire systems in Secret with some races as ther main Minions and other slaves.

What do you think?

Since most/some/Path orginators/etc….. of the PB deities are or could be called AI splinter fragments…..*shrugs*
An AI passing itself off as a deity would not be notable to the PB deities. So long as they don't get as powerful as the Old Ones.

[glitterboy2098]

I would have it that Some Alien Intelligences pass themsleves as Gods,control planets and entire systems in Secret with some races as ther main Minions and other slaves.

What do you think?

sure, why not? it works in Stargate. and most of the actual pantheons appear to have gotten their start in just such a fashion in DB2. i would resume that any AI/demons/etc that uses their own name to start a religion would eventually gain deific type powers once the religion grows big enough. the pretenders don't get this because they are just leeching off the fame of an existing pantheon.
so if Grubbax the destroyer sets himself up as a god of war, he'd eventually become at least a godling, because all that prayer and dedication is feeding into him.
but if he pretended to be Ares, he'd never see a benefit because any prayer/dedication those who follow him wou.d give ends up going to the real Ares.

[taalismn]

I would have it that Some Alien Intelligences pass themsleves as Gods,control planets and entire systems in Secret with some races as ther main Minions and other slaves.

What do you think?

sure, why not? it works in Stargate. and most of the actual pantheons appear to have gotten their start in just such a fashion in DB2. i would resume that any AI/demons/etc that uses their own name to start a religion would eventually gain deific type powers once the religion grows big enough. the pretenders don't get this because they are just leeching off the fame of an existing pantheon.
so if Grubbax the destroyer sets himself up as a god of war, he'd eventually become at least a godling, because all that prayer and dedication is feeding into him.
but if he pretended to be Ares, he'd never see a benefit because any prayer/dedication those who follow him wou.d give ends up going to the real Ares.

Unless maybe the prayer energy goes to whoever is in the area to collect it...If you're sacrificing something for PPE, I don't believe you can 'earmark' it solely for the consumption of a particular recipient unless it's part of a very specific ritual/spell(like a summoning).
This would be a good incentive for a god-being to hang around their bigger concentrations of worshippers/sources of power, or have a trusted lieutenant with the ability to collect and store it, rather than have some pretender swoop by and poach the energy.


A possible way around the 'ritual lock' might be the pretender successfully initiating a 'change in orthodoxy', convincing the local priests of a new change in ritual that directs the prayer/sacrifice energy to the usurper. Again, this gives another incentive for a god-being to regularly check on its flock to make sure the proper ritual 'codes' are being observed and followed.

Yeah, it makes divinity sound a bit like electronic banking....

[Furoan]

I agree that there probably are a few 'pretend gods' floating around the Three Galaxies. Alien Intelligence are usually on the same level of power as gods and well...not all the alien intelligence are hideous to behold like the Splugoth. There are probably a few ancient dragons or high level magic users who have set themselves up as demi-gods floating around, waiting for their power base to grow large enough to make that jump to godhood.