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Just thought we could start reviewing these books! Starting with this one! You can go as detailed as you want! Not done reading the whole book myself, but its been very good so far. And at this time, I'd give it 4 1/2 stars out of 5. The most bad things I can think of is that it's reprinting some things that have been done, though that stuff has been updated. Pictures are great! (Chuck is great as always!) Spelling looks ok so far, though I might have missed it. And I'm finding the book very helpful so far and love the topic. So what do you all think?

Alpha 11 wrote:Just thought we could start reviewing these books! Starting with this one! You can go as detailed as you want! Not done reading the whole book myself, but its been very good so far. And at this time, I'd give it 4 1/2 stars out of 5. The most bad things I can think of is that it's reprinting some things that have been done, though that stuff has been updated. Pictures are great! (Chuck is great as always!) Spelling looks ok so far, though I might have missed it. And I'm finding the book very helpful so far and love the topic. So what do you all think?

I think most of the reprint stuff was just so you don't have to hunt for that information in other books and a lot of the old material did get updated to some of it is kinda subtle.

kaid wrote:

Alpha 11 wrote:Just thought we could start reviewing these books! Starting with this one! You can go as detailed as you want! Not done reading the whole book myself, but its been very good so far. And at this time, I'd give it 4 1/2 stars out of 5. The most bad things I can think of is that it's reprinting some things that have been done, though that stuff has been updated. Pictures are great! (Chuck is great as always!) Spelling looks ok so far, though I might have missed it. And I'm finding the book very helpful so far and love the topic. So what do you all think?

I think most of the reprint stuff was just so you don't have to hunt for that information in other books and a lot of the old material did get updated to some of it is kinda subtle.

I think I said as much. So what do you give the book? Anyone else?

I am enjoying the book immensely. The expanded history of the Atlanteans makes alot of things written in WB#2: Atlantis more realistic and believable. This was a big job and it was done pretty well.

I liked the choices for new OCCs, especially the Voyager. A tattooed Atlantean that can go dimension hopping is spot on. The revisited OCCS, and the Nomad in particular are very good. Lots of different kinds of Nomad is very fun. Crystal and Shadow magic are so fun and different. Crystal magic is so perfect as a complement to Stone Magic and really completes the picture of an Atlantean culture built on magic that is in harmony with nature.

I was very excited about the Stone Master. I was hoping that it would be given a more adventuring bent, and they did to some degree. I was hoping for a section of Stone Master build weapons and gear, like the Lemurian Stone Masters have. It seems lke the natural choice considering that Atlanteans also shy from hard science types of technology.

The Altlantean clan descriptions are cool, and really help to flesh out a new Atlantean character.

The Sunaj/Aerihman section was well done and they have updated the threat with some very powerful OCCs. The indepth history and cultural descriptions make a decades long weirdness seem much more believable. This was no small task IMO and deserves a special shoutout.

I only have a few criticisms.

I was hoping for more of the excellent set of RIFTER articles, The Black Crusade, authoured by Andrew Lander. I enjoyed these stories and settings alot. I see that there are some of his creations in this book, but not many, and it leads me to believe that most were not chosen for a reason. One of the most glaring omission, IMO, is the Drifter OCC. Along with the Nomad it is the archetypal Atlantean. I like the way they went, with the Voyager, but I was hoping for the caster version as well.

The maps in the back are my other point of criticism. They take up whole pages of the book and are pretty hard to read due to the printing being dark. small diagrams needing alot less space would have been better.

The biggest is a glaring omission, or a unnoted retcon. WB#2 says that long ago Atlanteans invented techno-wizardry. This new book tells us it is new to Atlanteans, in reference to common types of PoM. I always assumed that Atlantean society was kinda built on techno-wizardry. It's really hard to believe that Atlanteans haven't developed technologies if they didn't have TW to fall back on.

I would like to thank everyone that worked on this book. After buying both NG books and then Lemuria and loving them I am happy to say you hit another homerun. I feel like I got a product that has been built by folks that care about the world they are crafting.

I am not trying to get anyone in trouble, but I thought it would be ok to point out that several of the Shadow Spells described transfrom the caster. This would mean that Atlantean Shadow Mages cannot use Etherial in Shadow or the Shadow Self spell.

I know that the wording for both crystal magic and shadow magic allow for casters other then the Atlantean OCCs presented, but the Sunaj Shadow Mage begins knowing a spell he cannot use.

How do things like this get brought to the correct persons attention?

SereneTsunami wrote:I am enjoying the book immensely. The expanded history of the Atlanteans makes alot of things written in WB#2: Atlantis more realistic and believable. This was a big job and it was done pretty well.

I liked the choices for new OCCs, especially the Voyager. A tattooed Atlantean that can go dimension hopping is spot on. The revisited OCCS, and the Nomad in particular are very good. Lots of different kinds of Nomad is very fun. Crystal and Shadow magic are so fun and different. Crystal magic is so perfect as a complement to Stone Magic and really completes the picture of an Atlantean culture built on magic that is in harmony with nature.

I was very excited about the Stone Master. I was hoping that it would be given a more adventuring bent, and they did to some degree. I was hoping for a section of Stone Master build weapons and gear, like the Lemurian Stone Masters have. It seems lke the natural choice considering that Atlanteans also shy from hard science types of technology.

The Altlantean clan descriptions are cool, and really help to flesh out a new Atlantean character.

The Sunaj/Aerihman section was well done and they have updated the threat with some very powerful OCCs. The indepth history and cultural descriptions make a decades long weirdness seem much more believable. This was no small task IMO and deserves a special shoutout.

I only have a few criticisms.

I was hoping for more of the excellent set of RIFTER articles, The Black Crusade, authoured by Andrew Lander. I enjoyed these stories and settings alot. I see that there are some of his creations in this book, but not many, and it leads me to believe that most were not chosen for a reason. One of the most glaring omission, IMO, is the Drifter OCC. Along with the Nomad it is the archetypal Atlantean. I like the way they went, with the Voyager, but I was hoping for the caster version as well.

The maps in the back are my other point of criticism. They take up whole pages of the book and are pretty hard to read due to the printing being dark. small diagrams needing alot less space would have been better.

The biggest is a glaring omission, or a unnoted retcon. WB#2 says that long ago Atlanteans invented techno-wizardry. This new book tells us it is new to Atlanteans, in reference to common types of PoM. I always assumed that Atlantean society was kinda built on techno-wizardry. It's really hard to believe that Atlanteans haven't developed technologies if they didn't have TW to fall back on.

I would like to thank everyone that worked on this book. After buying both NG books and then Lemuria and loving them I am happy to say you hit another homerun. I feel like I got a product that has been built by folks that care about the world they are crafting.

Actually the ret con about the techno wizardy brings it back into line with the more accepted starts of TW. In the three galaxies it was not until the anvil dwarfs joined to form the UWW that the Alexandrian enclave got TW items. Techno wizardy stuff seems pretty new overall and has only popped up in a few places so far. That said crystal magic gives them a lot of ability to make things that mimic techno wizardy in a lot of ways pretty well so probably was not a huge push to develop it.

I had not read the 3 galaxies part, the only dimension book I have is #4. Clan Skellion being masters of Techno-Wizardry for centuries(WB#6) is also in the mix.

I'm not sure when or how the idea was birthed that Techno-Wizadry should/had to be invented in North America. Rediscovering(with help) this powerful form of magic is analagous to the CS finding SAMAS tech, or any of the tech kingdoms using pre-rifts technology to pull themselves out of the 200 years dark ages.



I just read my copy of Book of Magic, from the bundle of holding sale. On the same page it says TW was born in North America about 20 yeas ago, AND that Manoan TW has been around longer and is much more advanced then normal TW.

given that dimensional travel and rifts allow for travel forward and backwards in time, who is to say that rifts earth didn't invent TW.. only for an atlantean or dwarven visitor to learn it, and bring it back in relative time when they went home? syncing up events across dimensional borders would be a real headache, given that we know time flows at different rates in different universes.

SereneTsunami wrote:I am enjoying the book immensely...

I was hoping for more of the excellent set of RIFTER articles, The Black Crusade, authoured by Andrew Lander. I enjoyed these stories and settings alot. I see that there are some of his creations in this book, but not many, and it leads me to believe that most were not chosen for a reason. One of the most glaring omission, IMO, is the Drifter OCC. Along with the Nomad it is the archetypal Atlantean. I like the way they went, with the Voyager, but I was hoping for the caster version as well.

I find I whole heartedly agree with you. The Black Crusade stuff I thought was some of the best stuff I've ever read in Rifters. Would absolustely love to see it expanded in the future. There's always room for more Atlantean TW items too. I like the new crystal stuff, though I thought the crystal laser rifle was quite low on damage.

Loved the art in it and on it. Cover was excellent, loved the choice there. Zeleznik nailed it with the Atlantean stepping through a rift, in crystal armor, activating a tattoo. Chuck's shadow creatures towards the back are absolutely fantastic, the Shade Hunter and Shadow Lord especially. I highly approve of his Atlantean on page 46, the wolf and broken Greek-like statues are a nice touch. Atlanteans on 67, 71 and 82 are also well done. When it comes to cities/structures, I've come to appreciate Kent Burles work (pages 28, 34, 37 and 205). Honestly, I believe a few Mumah and/or Ashbaugh pieces would have been great additions to this book however.

I've been running a campaign revolving around a Lemurian city that ended up in the Thundercloud Galaxy, and Lemurians and Atlanteans have played big roles in it. This book is what I needed to add more depth to the Atlanteans, so I'm quite happy with it. Possibly my second favorite Rifts book at the moment. It's quality writing.

I don't do Rifts. Is anything from the book adaptable to Heroes Unlimited or Beyond the Supernatural?

Yes. Shadow magic, crystal magic, new magic tattoos, monsters, Atlantean structures, ect. Since Atlanteans and are uber dimensional explorers, they could be dropped in a campaign on those worlds easy even by the stock story line.

Jerell wrote:Yes. Shadow magic, crystal magic, new magic tattoos, monsters, Atlanta structures, ect. Since Atlanteans and are uber dimensional explorers, they could be dropped in a campaign on those worlds easy even by the stock story line.

Good deal. That makes it easy. Is the conversion easy to SDC play? Do you just knock off a digit from the MDC and presto, there it is?

Should be one of the easiest in recent memory. A lot is already done for you. I don't have it front of me at the moment, however I recall the spells and monsters I've looked at thus far listing both SDC and MD/MDC. Maybe a few of the weapons (e.g. Crystal laser pistol) may require conversion.

Have you paid your dues Jack?

Finally got to finish up my official copy. Caught the plague at gen con so been just picking away at it. I really liked it. The raw preview was super solid so I was expecting nothing less and it came through nicely. A few additions either I missed or were added such as the power self destruct tattoos for the sunaj are both really useful for what they are doing and nasty. It would really be hard to stop them from offing themselves if captured especially if you are unaware of it.

The shadow and crystal magic are excellent new magic types and lots of nice tattoo upgrades and additions.

The pyramids are nicely fleshed out now and some changes in how they work make them a lot more sensible for their functionality and how they are used.

Stone magic is still nice a few more offensive type powers and they have their crystal usage for more specific spell damage but still probably more of a stay at home type and less of an active adventuring class.

Overall if people like atlanteans then it's a great source book.

Oh forgot to talk about dimensional tattoos. These and the atlantean OCC that specializes in them are both really good and kinda needed for such a dimensional hopping bunch of people. Having some good tatoo based ways to get people in and out of other dimensions is really handy for groups of undead slayers and tattoo defenders. Really helps round their tattoo magic capabilities out in a way that really was helpful.

For those capable of getting them getting the one that is the tattoo of your "home pyramid" is really nice. Pretty cheap way to always be able to get back to your main base like shifters return hope option.

Jack Burton wrote:

Jerell wrote:Yes. Shadow magic, crystal magic, new magic tattoos, monsters, Atlanta structures, ect. Since Atlanteans and are uber dimensional explorers, they could be dropped in a campaign on those worlds easy even by the stock story line.

Good deal. That makes it easy. Is the conversion easy to SDC play? Do you just knock off a digit from the MDC and presto, there it is?

It looked like everything I was paying attention to had SDC conversions where appropriate already done.

kaid wrote:Oh forgot to talk about dimensional tattoos. These and the atlantean OCC that specializes in them are both really good and kinda needed for such a dimensional hopping bunch of people. Having some good tatoo based ways to get people in and out of other dimensions is really handy for groups of undead slayers and tattoo defenders. Really helps round their tattoo magic capabilities out in a way that really was helpful.

For those capable of getting them getting the one that is the tattoo of your "home pyramid" is really nice. Pretty cheap way to always be able to get back to your main base like shifters return hope option.

While I wanted a caster based dimensional traveller similar to the Tolkeen Artifact Hunter for Dimension Book #7 the dimensional tattoos are an elegant answer to how a Atlantean Nomad actually travels to other dimensions. I especially liked the extra cost to cast the more powerful dimensional tattoos. The temporary PE drain sets a realistic limit on "D-Hopping".

Yes it is a very logical niche for an OCC given their reliance on tattoo magic and love of dimensional wandering makes perfect sense they would have found a way to combine the two. One other nice thing about them is their PPE due to all the tattoos is pretty dang high at base to better let them actually use their portal abilities pretty well.

I quite agree. Tattoo magic for dimension/world jumping makes sense and was sorely needed, and high base PPE is kind of needed for it. I'm in agreement also with Tsunami on the temporary PE drain. It's a good and reasonable mechanic. It was just good all around.

Though I still like the Atlantean Drifter OCC from one of the Rifters also.

Overall it's very good supplement. However I agree about the maps. Seems to be a problem when colored art is used and it doesn't greyscale well at all.

laserburn wrote:Overall it's very good supplement. However I agree about the maps. Seems to be a problem when colored art is used and it doesn't greyscale well at all.

As someone who's mapped Atlantis, this intrigues me. Who did made the maps? Are there color versions available online?

Hotrod wrote:

laserburn wrote:Overall it's very good supplement. However I agree about the maps. Seems to be a problem when colored art is used and it doesn't greyscale well at all.

As someone who's mapped Atlantis, this intrigues me. Who did made the maps? Are there color versions available online?

If I recall, Carl Gleba made the maps, and no, nothing online available.

Hotrod wrote:

laserburn wrote:Overall it's very good supplement. However I agree about the maps. Seems to be a problem when colored art is used and it doesn't greyscale well at all.

As someone who's mapped Atlantis, this intrigues me. Who did made the maps? Are there color versions available online?

I haven't seen any of the Maps available in their color version on the website. I believe that he is using Campaign Cartographer to produce the maps. They look very close to what campaign cartographer output looks like. I believe he did the maps for Hades and Dyval with Campaign Cartographer as well.

They are nice enough maps but color versions would be awesome!

He had color versions available at the open house.

Hmm...

Saw it in a store, was not too impressed by the art or what it contained, though for those enjoying True Atlanteans and that stuff, maybe it is a good book. But not a book i would buy if I still played Rifts. maybe if I found a pdf somewhere in the future, but not worth any shelf spots.