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Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 3:37 pm
by Voodoolaw
Would you allow TK to “excavate” mud or otherwise remove it like a TK bucket? Let’s say a character or object was sucked into a sinkhole and needed rescuing. Technically you only have visual on the surface and mud isn’t very cohesive.
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 3:53 pm
by Library Ogre
I allow telekinesis to be used as either an "arm" or a "bowl"... so you can TK a group of coins on a table without having to act separately on each coin, so long as your "bowl" is strong enough to hold all of them.
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:45 pm
by Voodoolaw
I wasn’t sure how I felt one way or the other on the “bowl” description before your comment but the example of a pile of coins puts it into perspective. If they used it to grab some coins, I probably wouldn’t even give it a second thought. But yeah, technically a psychic can only concentrate on “one item at a time.” Guess I will just have to feel it out to where I draw the line and try not to contradict myself later. I am surprised this hasn’t come up before but I guess our crew doesn’t do a whole lot with physical psychics. This scenario hasn’t even come up but with one of the adventures I have planned, it might. If somebody in EBA gets it, they’ll have time to figure something out. Otherwise, “What’s that Timmy? Checkers the dog boy got sucked down in the muck?”
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 10:12 pm
by torjones
Voodoolaw wrote:Would you allow TK to “excavate” mud or otherwise remove it like a TK bucket? Let’s say a character or object was sucked into a sinkhole and needed rescuing. Technically you only have visual on the surface and mud isn’t very cohesive.
I basically treat it as an extra set of hands. If you could do it with your hands, then you can do it with TK, with the other limitations and benefits mentioned.
Honestly, it's more dependent on the player's ability to communicate to me what they want to try and do with the power, than pretty much anything else. Does it sound cool? does it sound like it's within the power's ability to do ? (maybe?) then why not? I'd rather allow something that shouldn't be than deny something that should have happened. It's a lot easier to start the next session saying "After further review, this action that was allowed, shouldn't have been. going forward, it won't be."
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 7:54 pm
by drewkitty ~..~
Voodoolaw wrote:Would you allow TK to “excavate” mud or otherwise remove it like a TK bucket? Let’s say a character or object was sucked into a sinkhole and needed rescuing. Technically you only have visual on the surface and mud isn’t very cohesive.
Simple answer: Yes.
Further commentary: Remember that the Power or spell has a duration, and thus there is no need to pay the cost of the power for each hand-full or bucket-full of mud dug out with the power. The payment is only for the 1st handful but can be used for multiple handfuls for the payment.
I had a psionic character with super TK use this method of paying just for the initial lift of a book (actually many different books...but is n't going to why) and emptying a pit full of books stacking the books about the room. Only having to re-pay the base cost for the STK when the duration ended. Even through the char moved many individual books during that time that would of be much over the total limit of the STK power and the char's total ISP available if moved all at once.
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 8:19 pm
by Library Ogre
drewkitty ~..~ wrote:I had a psionic character with super TK use this method of paying just for the initial lift of a book (actually many different books...but is n't going to why) and emptying a pit full of books stacking the books about the room. Only having to re-pay the base cost for the STK when the duration ended. Even through the char moved many individual books during that time that would of be much over the total limit of the STK power and the char's total ISP available if moved all at once.
That works for me, yeah.
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:39 pm
by Nuristas
torjones wrote:Voodoolaw wrote:Would you allow TK to “excavate” mud or otherwise remove it like a TK bucket? Let’s say a character or object was sucked into a sinkhole and needed rescuing. Technically you only have visual on the surface and mud isn’t very cohesive.
I basically treat it as an extra set of hands. If you could do it with your hands, then you can do it with TK, with the other limitations and benefits mentioned.
Honestly, it's more dependent on the player's ability to communicate to me what they want to try and do with the power, than pretty much anything else. Does it sound cool? does it sound like it's within the power's ability to do ? (maybe?) then why not? I'd rather allow something that shouldn't be than deny something that should have happened. It's a lot easier to start the next session saying "After further review, this action that was allowed, shouldn't have been. going forward, it won't be."
I fully agree with that. The story needs to flow, that needs to be the priority.
Re: Telekinesis and Mud
Posted: Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:16 am
by ShadowLogan
Voodoolaw wrote:Would you allow TK to “excavate” mud or otherwise remove it like a TK bucket? Let’s say a character or object was sucked into a sinkhole and needed rescuing. Technically you only have visual on the surface and mud isn’t very cohesive.
Mud can have different consistencies, which turns this into a solid: IT DEPENDS. The more liquid-ie the mud is the less likely that TK can work on it effectively, but it gets into the realm of Hydrokinesis (#3 Water Spout ability specifically which kicks in at 75% water content). TK can not stop/manipulate gases which are a fluid (so are liquids) per the text so your "TK Bucket" might work for solids, but liquids could leak out IMHO it isn't a force field (per text) meaning it could be like using a screen mesh instead of a plane of wood to move something.
If the Mud's consistency was such that TK could work on it, moving it could get expensive in terms of ISP. Mud has a median density of 111.5lbs/ft^3* (between loose and steady), which means it would cost ~17 ISP for TK regular (TK super is 10ISP per 100lbs) just for one cubic foot of mud, if the person/object you want rescue is in that volume of mud you are moving you would need to spend even more ISP to lift them and the mud. An average person (human) is going to occupy ~1.8cubic feet and is going to weigh more than 100lbs (don't forget the weight of their gear either), and sense you do not know how far down they have sunk you will need to lift more than 1.8ft^3 of material (once in the air the mud could strain out revealing object/person).
*https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/dirt-mud-densities-d_1727.html