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Is there a permanent way to add Supernatural P.S. to a set of power armor? Either using an Alchemist or some technology? I know there's a variety of TW augments & weapons who can kind of do it but they all have time limits.

Maybe, but I find when I'm the GM, bribing the GM with twenty crisp new dollar bills works well...

Techno-Wizardry can do anything you can imagine, if the GM approves it.

AFAIK Magic is the only way to get a SN PS on a set of power armor (or robot vehicle) going off of my (incomplete) Rifts library there are ~27 PA/Bots with SN PS and with one exception they are all TW/Magical. The one exception (Invader's Warbeast PA in DB3) has a SN PS rating due to its pilot (and there might be other examples of this style that did not get recorded properly), but the Invader's tech isn't something you can just graft onto a suit of PA though I thought I recall reading example(s) that allow the SN PS of the user to work with PA in a more traditional setup.

An Alchemist could use a Permancy Ward (Diabolist from PF2E) combined with the appropriate spell to permanently enchant the PA.

Ah that's fantastic! I didn't realize Diabolist Wards could do that. I'm surprised I haven't seen that used as an option more often.

Edit> Supernatural Agility would be REALLY fun to install with a ward, like an imitation Juicer Harness

If one were able to communicate directly with a friendly tectonic entity, it could inhabit a PA and not only would it impart SNPS 36, but it also effectively doubles the MDC of the PA as it will keep going until it is obliterated (CB3 pg 81). However, I'd say about that last bit that the pilot would be exposed / suffer damage, even if the PA is still moving under the entity's control.

Grazzik wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2024 7:20 pm If one were able to communicate directly with a friendly tectonic entity, it could inhabit a PA

I didn't consider that... but that would mean having the possibly of my Armor walking off without me in it...

Another question for the thread if I may; can Techno-Wizards create Wards? It makes no sense why they wouldn't be able to, but it's not explicitly stated

Wards on the level/range of a Diabolist might be out of their range of expertise, but they do have access to Wards via the Wizard's Invocation list (10th Level Invocation "Wards" that has a limited selection of said) as far back as RMB (wording maintained in RUE) technically (I say technically as the invocation might fallout side of their stated focus).

Aermas wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:21 am

Grazzik wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2024 7:20 pm If one were able to communicate directly with a friendly tectonic entity, it could inhabit a PA

I didn't consider that... but that would mean having the possibly of my Armor walking off without me in it...

Another question for the thread if I may; can Techno-Wizards create Wards? It makes no sense why they wouldn't be able to, but it's not explicitly stated

Ha, yes, if it inhabited the entire suit. But what it inhabited only the arms? While it may not walk away without you, it may flip people the bird at inappropriate times.

The inspiration is the Angrar Assault Robot (Mercs pg 142) which is a gestalt of demons. On that note, an option may be to summon a demon or angel and do the same thing... shape them into a PA like the Angrar Mark II Power Armor (Mercs pg 141), minus the whole merging into the demon thing. Perhaps for demons, use a dark twisted blend of techno-wizardry for the chassis to protect the pilot, and TW-enabled summoning magic to control and shape the demon. For angels or similar good entities, it's probably a voluntary process for the chance to smite bad dudes, but they are likely to be insufferably superior about it and, in the form of a PA, prone to ignoring the pilot to run off and save kittens stuck in trees, rather than rob a bank.

Rifts Manhunter robots have supernatural ps, so it can certainly be achived with tech

ShadowLogan wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2024 9:30 am Wards on the level/range of a Diabolist might be out of their range of expertise, but they do have access to Wards via the Wizard's Invocation list (10th Level Invocation "Wards" that has a limited selection of said) as far back as RMB (wording maintained in RUE) technically (I say technically as the invocation might fallout side of their stated focus).

How does it cost to pay a Diabolist to carve permanent Wards? I search through some books but didn't find any

Jockitch74 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:51 am Rifts Manhunter robots have supernatural ps, so it can certainly be achived with tech

that would be nice. What page number if you know?

Grazzik wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 6:17 am

Aermas wrote: ↑Wed Mar 06, 2024 12:21 am

Grazzik wrote: ↑Mon Mar 04, 2024 7:20 pm If one were able to communicate directly with a friendly tectonic entity, it could inhabit a PA

I didn't consider that... but that would mean having the possibly of my Armor walking off without me in it...

Another question for the thread if I may; can Techno-Wizards create Wards? It makes no sense why they wouldn't be able to, but it's not explicitly stated

Ha, yes, if it inhabited the entire suit. But what it inhabited only the arms? While it may not walk away without you, it may flip people the bird at inappropriate times.

The inspiration is the Angrar Assault Robot (Mercs pg 142) which is a gestalt of demons. On that note, an option may be to summon a demon or angel and do the same thing... shape them into a PA like the Angrar Mark II Power Armor (Mercs pg 141), minus the whole merging into the demon thing. Perhaps for demons, use a dark twisted blend of techno-wizardry for the chassis to protect the pilot, and TW-enabled summoning magic to control and shape the demon. For angels or similar good entities, it's probably a voluntary process for the chance to smite bad dudes, but they are likely to be insufferably superior about it and, in the form of a PA, prone to ignoring the pilot to run off and save kittens stuck in trees, rather than rob a bank.

See that's the issue, I'd put so much effort into the armor, just to have it refusing to open up in a crisis, because I called it names

Another question that needs to be asked is - why do you want to add SNPS to a PA? Do you want to do more damage? Lift/carry more? Is there a use case that requires a supernatural aspect to the PA's strength?

Damage - by comparing damage charts, I'm sure some sort of conversion ratio can be made to do equivalent SNPS using Robotic PS. Though the standard chart for Robotic PS goes up to 60, WB25 China 2 pg 154 describes the Gun Dragon as having Robotic PS 61 with listed HtH damage, and could be used to extend the damage progression somewhat. Then, if you want to go all-in munchkin, there is Giga-damage from Rifter 9.5 ...

Lifting/carrying - this would have to get into the use of localized weird tech like contra-grav emitters or some d-bee tech that alters physical laws in a limited capacity to reduce the weight of encumbrances. Remember, sufficiently advanced tech can be perceived as indistinguishable from magic, even if the game mechanics are different.

Supernatural aspect - this gets to the very nature of the property and AFAIK tech cannot stand in for the supernatural without some form of supernatural transformation or enhancement.

Because I want to flex on Warlock Marines & match the strength of Demons in the Minion War

Aermas wrote:How does it cost to pay a Diabolist to carve permanent Wards? I search through some books but didn't find any

For Rifts I don't know off hand as the class isn't formally part of the setting (AFAIK, its gotten a mention a few times though). Diabolist is a PF-line OCC. The PF2E Mainbook for the Alchemist (who is a mutli-classed Diabolist in PF2E) says on pg247 "and will never sell permanence, power, or mystic energy drain" normally, "but such a ward will cost dearly, probably some powerful magic item or knowledge worth millions.). A diabolist is going to be 10-30% cheaper than an Alchemist though (same page).

Cost wise we know that you need the "bone of a dragon, demon, deevil, godling, or god" (PF2E pg132). Off hand I don't know the prices for Rifts for these things, but in PF2E (pg261) the cost is 10,000 gold per lb for Dragon Bone (and Demon/Deevil are 7,000 gold per ounce OR 112,000 gold per lb, god/godling bone is 40,000 gold per ounce or 640,000 gold per lb). So depending on what type of bone the Alchemist/Diabolist uses, how much of the bone they need (likely vary by "font size", PF2E gold to Rifts Credits conversion rate, cost of Alchemist/Diabolist "labor", additional supplies (or services as it doesn't make sense to just get the single Ward you need a Ward Phrase or active spell effects which also need to be paid for), etc I can see it why (in PF2E setting) it might cost at least 1million gold pieces.

Grazzik wrote:Another question that needs to be asked is - why do you want to add SNPS to a PA? Do you want to do more damage? Lift/carry more? Is there a use case that requires a supernatural aspect to the PA's strength?

I agree the raw damage and Lift/Carry is achievable w/o swapping to SN PS it just requires beefing up the PS score of the PA. The SN aspect is the only real thing that tech can't (easily) manage/duplicate (in general, there might be specific material/vulnerability cases), though here if you're looking at enchanting it might just be easier options (enchanted weapons) than trying to enchant the full suit.

If the pilot has SN PS already though tech suits exist that allow the operators "natural" PS to be used in place of Robotic/Augmented tables (Dragon Death Power Armor pg141 of WB6 though no specific PS rating is given, the Kreeghor's Warlord Mark I Combat Suit has a SN PS rating bonus to its pilot in DB2 pg137-9, Gurygoyle G-10 pg205-6 in WB5 is similar to the DD PA in WB6 are quick examples I could find during a quick search). So we know it is technically possible to allow a tech suit to enhance/allow-use of a SN PS of its pilot though who can do it might be another matter.

Rifts Manhunter in the hand to hand section of all of the Manhunter bots, page 9 to start