Spell substitutes for Survivial in the wild

[darthauthor]

I have been running a lot of Man vs Envirnment lately and I wanted to be certain I was doing it correctly.
I want to check my understand and not assume.

So characters with Wilderness survival skill and an Northern Gun Survival Kit.
He uses them.

Another has the Northern Gun Survival kit and a lot of spells that help A LOT.
"Sustain" allows character to go 1 day per level without water or food and only needs 2 hours of sleep a night.
This alone appears to make all the fishing and hunting gear redundant.

"Sheltering Force"
Character used to substitute for a tent and sleeping bag. Used it for 4 hours.

"Cleanse" Spell substituted for bar of soap and wash cloth. Bonus was it also cleaned their clothes.

In the back of my mind I felt I missed something but could not think of it.
So the character used their magic spells and didn't see much of a reason to carry a lot of gear.

I thought about it and said something like, "Well, a lot of spells replace specific skills like the 'Climb' spell. Also, using magic spells takes away from your P.P.E. so you have less in an emergency, if and when it arrises."

I started Googling about survival skills and equipment.
Found the rule 3
Can only survive
3 minutes without air
3 hours without enough heat or cold.
3 days without water
3 weeks without food.
Being reasonable the air thing would kill anybody.
Seemed like the TOP 3 things missing from a complete magic substitute for survival skills and equipment are:

1. Resistance to extreme COLD that lasts for hours.

2. Navigation. Unless you know your destination you exploring or lost. Then it is a matter of leaving markers for yourself, recognizing where you have been before or just retracing your steps backwards, or map making.
I guess there is no magic Spell substitute for "this."

3. Dealing with animals, injuries/illnesses, and insects if and when they come up.

-My first thoughts are the spell "Repeal Animals" BUT most of what I read says animals will avoid people unless they feel threatened with no escape or their young are.

-Injuries / illnesses are just that and can happen to anyone like a sprained ankle but are more serious when involving eating or drinking the wrong thing (something Sustain eliminates the need for).
assuming one is stung by a scorpion or something a "Negate Toxin/Poison" spell should remeady the situation.
The advantage being it is instant, does not expire, can't get lost in you bag or dropped by accident, etc.

The only other thing I could think of is extreme stuff.
Like involuntary wilderness survival is being an accident victim in need of rescue so they have a flair gun or something.
Spells like:
"Blinding Flash" & "Cloud of Smoke" could, in my mind, substitute for it.
Only difference is a signal fire will run as long as someone can keep tending to it successfully.

Magic seems to trump just about everything except for the NEED for P.P.E.
and a RADIO. It seems magic can't do better than a radio.

Although the spell of "Magic Pigeon" is a great way to tell someone you love you survived a plane crash or ship wreck and are marooned on a island (lost in the woods).

DID I leave anything out or miss anything major?

Amaze me with something I forgot or overlooked.

I thought about things like flooding, forest fire, and rain and even though I could not think of a magical remedy I thought the guy with "Just" survival skills and an NG survival kit is no better off in the same situation.

[Dustin Fireblade]

I think Rifts Canada and Dinosaur Swamp books both have material on survival in the wilderness extremes. The Chaos Earth books might have some stuff too that might be worth looking at.

But if you want gritty - have them fall down a cliff, loose some of their gear, get chased (no rest means no PPE recovery). Now it's a more balancing act on using skills, magic and gear to get out alive.

[ShadowLogan]

"Lantern Light" would be ideal if you need a light source (Globe of Daylight has shorter duration but is true sunlight).

"Extinguish Fire", "Fuel Flame", and "Ignite Fire" for fire management and applications involving

"Levitation" or "Fly" or "Fly as the Eagle" instead of climbing a tree (skill or spell) you could lift yourself up above the tree canopy to get situated. "Float in the Air" is to limited in height. "Astral Projection" is also an option (on the material plane, but remember you have to return for your body so no popping off at 670mph to easily return to civilization). Metamorphosis spells might also be useful in some respect here (just remember the magic doesn't work on stuff as you return to natural form naked).

"Carpet of Adhesion" or "Magic Net", for hunting game

"Create Water", "Purification", "Stone to flesh" for when "Sustain" isn't an option (PF also has a Create Bread and Milk spell). "Water to Wine" could also act as an indirect way to make water safe to drink.

"Eyes of the Wolf" for nightvision, but also identification of fruits and plants, tracking might also be useful (and situational)

"Phantom Mount", if on foot (though fly spells above might be better). "Metamorphosis" spells again might be useful substitute (just remember note above)

"Mystic Fulcrum", "Featherlight", "Telekinesis" and/or Strength spells could be useful in situations where someone becomes trapped/pinned or the path is blocked (and you don't want to double back)

"Swim as a Fish", if you find a body of water (river or lake, etc) you're likely to also to find settlements on/near them (so once at the water, swim at a rate of SPD attribute of 20 which depending on attribute rolls might be better than their on foot SPD attribute, it also comes with no fatigue factor).

Something else to consider:

IMHO while "Sheltering Force" is useful, its duration for low level characters could make the character bleed PPE (and not get a restful sleep) for a "night camp" making an actual shelter a better option.

Casting spells on oneself for injuries (like a snake bite or scorpion sting, broken bone, etc) might not be an option at the GM's discretion if the character is too distracted by it.

Also keep in mind that while a signal fire can last longer than spells as long as they are maintained, those spells could be set off on demand at a moments notice (something you could not do potentially with a signal fire).

[darthauthor]

ShadowLogan,

Good Analysis.

Some of the characters I am running with are coming on 7th level.

They are having to make choices about secondary skills.

Some are questioning if it is better to use spells over skills or skill over spell.
Some have both.

I agree about P.P.E. conservation.

The spell casters however are asking questions about their equipment and restocking.
Why weigh yourself down with gear?

1. I use Armor of Ithan for MD armor.
2. A tent or survival kit? That's why I took "Sheltering Force" and "Sustain."
He only needs 2 hours of sleep a night.
He's walking around with an empty backpack.

3. He still has no protection for cold or heat so he layers up.
Uses the "Cleanse" spell for daily laundry and showering.

4. As you say, he uses "Lantern Light" for light instead of a campfire.

5. Plus his teammates can start a fire.

Since the "Sheltering Force" Tent is good for at least 2, the teammate is emptied their backpack also.
The spell caster casts "Sustain" on them both.

Their days are like:
Start the night with "Lantern Light" (1). 3.5 hours of light

"Cleanse" (6) spell cast on self and teammate. For 12 PPE they go to sleep shower clean with clean clothes.
PPE: 1+12= 13

They sleep in a "Sheltering Force" tent (20). PPE spent so far 1+ 12 + 20 = 33
The tent keeps out bugs.

Casts the spell "Watchguard" (10) for 40 foot area security alarm.
PPE spent so far: 1 (lantern light) + 12 (Cleanse) + 20 (tent) + 10 (alarm) = 43 points.

He's a Ley Line Walker.
Recovers 7 PPE for every 1 hour of sleep
So, 49 PPE recovered in 7 hours of sleep.

7 hours later their tent evaporates.

Starts the morning with 1 hour mediation.
Meditation restores P.P.E. at 15 per hour of meditation and is equal to one hour of sleep.

So he gets the equivalent of 8 hours of sleep.
Recovers 64 P.P.E.

Has a base of around 200 P.P.E.
Let's just say he starts the day with 200

Hiking toward their destination, depending on the terrain, casts a "Superhuman Endurance" spell.
Burns 24 PPE
They get 2 hours to run as fast as they can safely go without getting tired.
Depending on the terrain they just did a marathon.

Break.
Creates Water (15)
3.5 gallons of water later they have re-filled their canteens. Washed their hands and face.
Cast "Create Bread and Milk" (15) spell.
Chow down.

Afternoon after meal relaxing rest behind some cover / Camo for 1 hour: Recovers 7 PPE
Take time to Look at their map
Do the navigation thing.

Superhuman Endurance again.
Burn 24 PPE

Another minor marathon.

Maybe some action happens.
Maybe it does not.

"Armor of Ithan" (10) for two people 20 PPE last 7 minutes provides 70 Mega Damage protection.
They evade combat or engage.

S.D.C. encounter:
Rifle or maybe Bow Bang Bang.
Low on ammo or bad ammo
Energy Bolt spell (5). Say 20 PPE burned.

MD encounter:

Electric Arc spell (8) Say 24 PPE

There are a couple of ways that can go but still wisely PPE maybe be 50 or so.

After battle rest.
Loot.
Investigate.
2 hours break, so 14 PPE recovered.
Store the loot in their empty backpacks.
Boost their ride.

It is maybe 4 or 5 PM

They look for and find themselves a campsite and camouflage it. 1 hour.

6 PM REST 3 hours. Recovers 21 PPE
Finish the bread.
Cast "Lantern Light" for (1)

9 PM Mediate Recover 15 PPE

Casts the spell "Watchguard" (10) for 40 foot area security alarm.
PPE spent: 12 (Cleanse) + 20 (tent) + 10 (alarm) = 42 points.

So he gets the equivalent of 8 hours of sleep.
Recovers 64 P.P.E.

Finishes mediating with about 150 PPE left of his base.

Arguments could be made that the Ley Line walker would burn more in combat.

He's covering a LOT of ground though.
One could also argue that he could use a "Fly" spell and cover a greater distance.

[darthauthor]

In all fairness, this mage is going to need more to eat and will go a little crazy if he does not get some variety in their what they eat.

He is going to have to take some food rations with him or ride it out to the next town with the "Sustain" spell.
Even then, I believe a guy will go insane without the morale raising process of eating and drinking.

[ShadowLogan]

Some are questioning if it is better to use spells over skills or skill over spell.
Some have both.

The ones who have both are the ones who are better off IMHO, but skills shouldn't be discounted. The skills are always on after all, something you can't do with spells (or a lot of PPE).

The spell casters however are asking questions about their equipment and restocking.
Why weigh yourself down with gear?

Some of it is going to come down to situational scenarios based on level and other factors like numbers.

A Tent comes in a variety of sizes and can be "naturally" camouflaged (ie camo pattern for environment) not to mention can be used to setup a longer term base camp (useful in some situations). And while Sheltering Force is invisible, it doesn't obscure the contents within ("no privacy") and has limits on the number of people it can take in. The spell in this case is good for quick reaction events IMHO (sudden storm ex), but isn't a substitute for the physical gear.

Physical Armor is also a necessity for two primary reasons: 1. for when the spell isn't up (depleted AoI, low initiative, or surprise), 2. it doesn't cost PPE to use (no PPE management). That doesn't mean they should rely on the physical armor, they shouldn't but the armor in this case acts to supplement the spells (its like Cyber-Armor, you don't really want it as your primary source of armor, but its still useful to have).

Physical weapons also tend to out perform magic in terms of combat performance (range and damage and ROF), especially at lower levels.

I agree there is some mental games to consider here, but also consider that if a character is constantly using a spell to survive ("Sustain" in this case), there might be unintended consequences from repeated/heavy use of the spell (magical mutation/experimentation IS a thing in the setting) or there may come a point where the spell stops having an impact (Psychics can't keep activating Resist Thirst/Hunger powers forever, they will eventually need to actually drink/eat. While the spell doesn't state this like the psychic powers IIRC, it is something you could house rule with some precedent).

And I do think it would be "in character" for mages to question the utility of lugging around physical gear, I think they should at least consider that some gear/skills will still have utility over magic (especially in the long term). From a nutrition standpoint, "Create Bread & Milk" and "Create Water" aren't going to cover all the bases IMHO, you still need fruits/veggies and possibly meat.

Physical gear and skills gives you something to easily trade with other "campers" you might bump into (topics to discuss to) or make tracking difficult (PPE "vampires") and possibly avoid the issue of prejudice (anti-magic people exist in the setting).