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yea, well, Full Auto in Rifts means you empty your clip in one round.

a three shot per trigger squeeze is a Pulse Weapon.

but basically, Standard rate of fire means they can do can

single shot
20% clip burst (short burst)
50% clip burst (long burst)
100% empty the clip burst (full auto)

three shots per trigger squeeze is a pulse weapon, and is seperate.

interesting point. I think it more or less depends on each specific weapon. For instance some of the railguns fire a "burst" of 20 rounds at a time. I kinda look at that as a shotgun type effect. One electromagnetic pulse pulls/pushes X ammount of ammo down the barrol at a time. Kinda like a shotgun fires X ammount of buckshot at a time. Depending on what kind of shot I use, I could technically fire over 100 "rounds" on my Mossberg in under 15 seconds with relitive ease. That does not mean my shotgun is fully automatic though. This is probably one of those cases where the author does not have any military or similar experiance, so just writes what he thinks sounds good. Then when others that have such training reads it they go WTH?? Know what I mean?

Temporalmage wrote:Then when others that have such training reads it they go WTH?? Know what I mean?

here's the key. . . don't try to use your real world knowlage. it works great then

There is a question of quantifying just what the cyclic rate of the various weapons are in Rifts. If we take your average soldier who is usually somewhere betweem level 4 and 6, you're going to have a guy wiht about 5 to 6 attacks per melee round. For the sake of argument, let's say it's six because that will worlk out better. If this soldier has a burst capable weapon like, say, an old C-10, and opts to fire an old fashioned full burst, he'll deplete the entire magaizine of all power in two melee actions. Remeber, a burst that burn through the entire magazine in one mega-rip is an action that consumes two melee attacks. So if Soldier X has six melee attacks and a melee round is 15 seconds, then each and every one of his attacks represents 2.5 seconds of time. Now if it took 5 seconds to burn though one magazie, (lets say it was a long e-clip with 30 shots of power in it), then his cyclic rate was only 6 shots per second, or 360 per minute. That's pretty good, but I wouldn't call it "Full Auto". I concider true machine-gun ROF's to start at 600 RPM, like that of an Uzi or M-60. But since this is about half that, odds are the shooter of weapons like the are squeezing the trigger for each and every shot fired. Or it could be that energy weapons just have lower cyclic rates than primitive slug throwers.

Say we up the antie and see what the same weapon could do in the hands of someone with even more attacks per melee. What if the C-10 were being fired by a level 15 Juicer with HtH Assassin, the boxing skill, WP Sharp Shooting and is wearing Samas power amor, (with which he has RPA:Elite in, of course), giving him a grand total of 14 melee attacks per round. Well, 15 seconds /14 actions = each action being representitive of 1.07143 seconds. Two melee actions uses 2.14286 seconds. 30 rounds fired in 2.14286 seconds = a cyclic rate of 14 rounds a second, or 840 rounds per minute!!! Same gun, different user. Under this extreme case I guess it would be safe to call the C-10 and all similar rifles "Full Auto Capable".

Oh, and for future reference, accoring to my math here, if you want to know what the cyclic rate is for the weapon in a particular character's hands, it just Number of Attacks per Melee = shots fired per second. That would be less indicitive of the weapon's efficiency than the user's proficiency, I guess.

Did I get off topic here? I can't tell any more.

Nekira Sudacne wrote:here's the key. . . don't try to use your real world knowlage. it works great then

yes. the combat system exists as it is for simplicity, not ultra-realism.

geeze guys...chill the heck out! The guy was just asking for peaples feedback and opinions...not game lawyer's jumping down his throat.

My understanding is the design philosphy behind the G-11 caseless rifle was to produce a weapon capable of firing a 3 shot burst with an effective rate of fire approachign 2000 rounds per minute. The theory beign that a 3 shot burst at that rate of fire would ensure that at standard combat ranges, all 3 bullets would be within a space abotu the size of a man's torso, thus garunteing a hit if the sights were aligned on target.

Some modern anti-aircraft weapons are designed to fire in bursts of 10, 20, 30 or 40 rounds.

Jefffar wrote:My understanding is the design philosphy behind the G-11 caseless rifle was to produce a weapon capable of firing a 3 shot burst with an effective rate of fire approachign 2000 rounds per minute. The theory beign that a 3 shot burst at that rate of fire would ensure that at standard combat ranges, all 3 bullets would be within a space abotu the size of a man's torso, thus garunteing a hit if the sights were aligned on target.

That very well could be so. The Russians have a really good rifle called the AN-94 that can fire a two round burst with a cyclic rate of around 1,700 RPM. I've seen the thing fired and cycles so fast you can't even tell the thing just shot a burst. It uses the same 5x45mm ammo they derveloped for the AK-74, which is not a caseless round, but that doesn't seem to be a problem in the slightest. It's a shame the ruskies can't afford to field the rifle in any significant quantities. The fall of communisum really messed up their millitary.

Yeah, the Ankaban is the official succesor to the Kalashnikov (the AK-74, with it's 30 year record of service was just an interim design). When the Ruskies get the money they will switch over.