Stealth plane color
Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 9:29 pm
Is there any reason that stealth planes are black?
Thanx in advance.
Thanx in advance.
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Stealth plane color
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Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:08 pm
Besides, you can't re-paint the plane for every mission. Black is quite useful; the paint on the Stealths is a specific CLASSIFIED blend meant to deflect as much radar energy and IR waves as possible, and it looks cool. And that whole can't-see-it-at-night thing too.
Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 10:13 pm
So if the paint gets destroyed it doesnt work? oh that could hurt in robotech, where people use plasma missiles. I was sort of hoping it was the shape that made it a stealth plane.
I was thinking navy blue would work good underwater and in the sky, I can see black working well in space.. navy is dark enough for space..
I was thinking navy blue would work good underwater and in the sky, I can see black working well in space.. navy is dark enough for space..
Re: Stealth plane color
Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2004 11:06 pm
G wrote:Is there any reason that stealth planes are black?
Thanx in advance.
the real reason they are painted black, oppossed to the perfed color of deep dark blue, is that the polotitions wanted them black.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 1:13 am
The book says the shadow cloak stops working at about half mdc damage. and the shadow fighter isn't straight black it's blue-black and grey according to the rpg books. and there's an even older stealth plane the flying wing (dun remember the designation) but it was the first plane to be stealth and it scared the bejesus out of the gov't of the time so they canceled it
.
.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 5:51 am
oh the old war of the worlds remake in 1955(ish) the Yb-49 was used in that....man that movie had some funny parts in it....
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 6:35 pm
As was pointed out, the F-22 isn't black, and it's a stealth.
I think the black was chosen for optimal radar/IR absorbtion and low light camouflague for the dedicated stealth planes. Of course an F-117 was shot down, so I guess it didn't help that much.
I think I saw a picture (photograph, undoctored) of a camoupainted F-117 once.
The SR-71 was black, not sure why, those giant ram jets probably didn't help it very much at night.
I guess the deciding factor could be that a cool secret aircraft is always black.
I think the black was chosen for optimal radar/IR absorbtion and low light camouflague for the dedicated stealth planes. Of course an F-117 was shot down, so I guess it didn't help that much.
I think I saw a picture (photograph, undoctored) of a camoupainted F-117 once.
The SR-71 was black, not sure why, those giant ram jets probably didn't help it very much at night.
I guess the deciding factor could be that a cool secret aircraft is always black.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 7:04 pm
Jefffar wrote:The SR-71 was black, not sure why,
black was the best radiator of heat at the temps involved, given that it's mach 3 speed raised the temps of the aircraft to many hundred degree's (which is why i laugh sometimes when i see the speeds in the RPG. to travel at mach 5 like the VF-1 is claimed, you REALLY need that heatsheild over the cockpit.)
this is also why the spaceshuttle's underside is black.
those giant ram jets probably didn't help it very much at night.
given no force on earth then (or now) could catch it when travelling full throttle, it could fly anytime of day. and since it flew at 80,000 ft +, its not like anyone could see it anyway.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 7:19 pm
The Mach 3+ Valkyrie bomber was done in all white. It should ahev had the same heat problems as the SR-71.
X-15 was black too, if you're looking for a heat connection.
X-15 was black too, if you're looking for a heat connection.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 8:02 pm
Jefffar wrote:The Mach 3+ Valkyrie bomber was done in all white. It should ahev had the same heat problems as the SR-71.
X-15 was black too, if you're looking for a heat connection.
the valkyrie bomber could do a mach 2.5 "jaunt", it cruised just under mach 1. and it flew at a much lower altitude. so it didn't need such extreme measures.
the SR-71 (originally called the RS-71) CRUISED at mach 3. in a "jaunt" it could do almost mach 3.5
and the X-15 went to the edge of the atmosphere, then had to undergo re-entry. lots of heat there.
Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2004 10:43 pm
glitterboy2098 wrote:
the SR-71 (originally called the RS-71)
Wasnt it Renamed because during a Press confrence the officer doing the Confrence mis-said it (sr-71), and so the Changed the name to fit the press releases?
Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2004 11:38 am
A couple of points,
both Valkaries had issues with paint sheading in flight which remained through the lenght of the program.
usual for test aircraft to be painted white or white and Orange because they want to be able to spot it from a distance (I have a picture of a almost solid orange F-14 in fligh atempting a carrier landing)
both Valkaries had issues with paint sheading in flight which remained through the lenght of the program.
usual for test aircraft to be painted white or white and Orange because they want to be able to spot it from a distance (I have a picture of a almost solid orange F-14 in fligh atempting a carrier landing)
Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2004 12:26 pm
Jefffar wrote:As was pointed out, the F-22 isn't black, and it's a stealth.
I think the black was chosen for optimal radar/IR absorbtion and low light camouflague for the dedicated stealth planes. Of course an F-117 was shot down, so I guess it didn't help that much.
I think I saw a picture (photograph, undoctored) of a camoupainted F-117 once.
The SR-71 was black, not sure why, those giant ram jets probably didn't help it very much at night.
I guess the deciding factor could be that a cool secret aircraft is always black.
F-22 is not classified as being stealth but rather having stealth properties.
The SR-71 also stretched out 3 feet from skin friction at full speed.
Aircraft usually have black paint because it defuses heat faster than lighter colors. However it also absorbs heat faster. (e.g. SR-71, U-2, and X-15) The lighter color or silver aircraft absorb heat slower but also disipate it at a slower rate. (e.g. test bed F-16).
Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2004 12:36 pm
Jefffar wrote:I think I saw a picture (photograph, undoctored) of a camoupainted F-117 once.
Ya im positive it was desert cammo
Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2004 2:11 pm
Zer0 Kay wrote:
Aircraft usually have black paint because it defuses heat faster than lighter colors. However it also absorbs heat faster. (e.g. SR-71, U-2, and X-15) The lighter color or silver aircraft absorb heat slower but also disipate it at a slower rate. (e.g. test bed F-16).
??? what do you mean black paint defuses heat faster than other colors?
Black is the "warmest" color there is, and the warmer a color, the more it absorbs and retain heat.
Conversely, the "colder" a color, the more it reflects heat off and radiates away what is absorbed (ever wonder why people from cold countries tend to dress in darkish colors while those desert people are in love with white robes?)
Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2004 3:17 pm
Basara_549 wrote:I thought it was LBJ himself that made the speaking error....
I Think it was too, but i Dont wanan be Misstateing facts from Democrats.
funny thing is, if John Kerry was Nameing it, he'd prolly call it the SR-71 one day, and the RS-71 the next... Least LBJ was consistant.
Rabid Should ask his Uncle about it, He know some peoepl at Boeing I think.
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 2:24 pm
svartalf wrote:Zer0 Kay wrote:
Aircraft usually have black paint because it defuses heat faster than lighter colors. However it also absorbs heat faster. (e.g. SR-71, U-2, and X-15) The lighter color or silver aircraft absorb heat slower but also disipate it at a slower rate. (e.g. test bed F-16).
??? what do you mean black paint defuses heat faster than other colors?
Black is the "warmest" color there is, and the warmer a color, the more it absorbs and retain heat.
Conversely, the "colder" a color, the more it reflects heat off and radiates away what is absorbed (ever wonder why people from cold countries tend to dress in darkish colors while those desert people are in love with white robes?)
Uh because the black absorbs more heat and the white reflects more. So your saying the reason a white cement divider retains heat longer than a black asphault cement isn't because of the color?
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 4:37 pm
Heelhook... you're right for the many layered dress... but the dark thing applies, so far as I know, only to Tuareg and some berber populations (and not all of them too boot) . On the other hand, Arabic and Turkish populations in North Africa and the Near/middle East DO prefer white, at least for the outer garment.
ZerOKay... well, your example goes reverse to my own experience... last tipe I checked, once the evening comes, tarmac remains warm longer than light colored cement.
ZerOKay... well, your example goes reverse to my own experience... last tipe I checked, once the evening comes, tarmac remains warm longer than light colored cement.
Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 8:27 pm
Ok guys
for the last time its the MATERIAL that is respionsible for how fast or slow it absorbes, transferes, and radiates heat not the color
for the last time its the MATERIAL that is respionsible for how fast or slow it absorbes, transferes, and radiates heat not the color
Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 10:17 am
Ok...for some, this is going to be like re-reading their birth certificate (with the odd error creeping in...it's been a while since I did any reading / watched the right shows on the Discovery Channel, etc... 
)
For others, this will be new stuff...except that which has been ground into the ground already!
Colour:
Dark colours absorb energy faster, and hold it longer...however...the total volume/mass of the object has a more direct effect on both absorbtion. (The more mass/volume, the longer to absorb, and the longer it takes to radiate away the absorbed energy...this is the source of the "Urban Heat Island" effect, ie: the down town area of a city is always 3-5deg C warmer than the suburbs)
Light colours reflect energy (have a higher albedo)...this is why snowy areas (more than 30cm deep) are cooler than non-snowy areas - the energy normally absorbed by the earth is refelcted back out into space. (It is also why a light coloured object appears "brighter" visually in almost all levels of illumination.)
NOTE: WWII "Stealth" aircraft were painted light blue on the belly, and had a dun coloured cammo pattern on the upper surface. Additionally, to break-up the silhouette, they had slots and holes along the trailing edge of the wings and tail assembly to allow light to pass through the aircraft. All told, the tech and design worked frighteningly well.
Stealth:
Based on shape/materials for the F117 and B2. With these two aircraft, the radar beam is scattered away from the aircraft due to the shape of the aircraft.
For the F22, it is based on electronics AND shape(partly)/materials(mainly), as at first glance, the F22 looks like "just another fighter jet." The design is such that when flying directly at or away from a radar source, the aircraft is harder to detect (an artificially reduced radar cross section), however, when turning within the radius of a radar, or doing a "broadside" flyby, they are almost as easy to spot as a "normal" fighter.
Colouration of a Stealth Jet:
Anything that does not attract attention to the jet in flight. At night, that means black. For aircraft (like the blackbird) that fly at obscene heights (even with the blatantly obvious contrail), that means black (as the environment they fly in is referred to as "blacksky").
Believe it or not, the German navy in WWII, to "stealth" their ships, painted them in jagged stripes of white and black. In good light and at port, it stood out like a sore thumb. In typical lighting at sea, it was hard to find, because the sub's gunners couldn't get a "fix" on the ship.
)
For others, this will be new stuff...except that which has been ground into the ground already!
Colour:
Dark colours absorb energy faster, and hold it longer...however...the total volume/mass of the object has a more direct effect on both absorbtion. (The more mass/volume, the longer to absorb, and the longer it takes to radiate away the absorbed energy...this is the source of the "Urban Heat Island" effect, ie: the down town area of a city is always 3-5deg C warmer than the suburbs)
Light colours reflect energy (have a higher albedo)...this is why snowy areas (more than 30cm deep) are cooler than non-snowy areas - the energy normally absorbed by the earth is refelcted back out into space. (It is also why a light coloured object appears "brighter" visually in almost all levels of illumination.)
NOTE: WWII "Stealth" aircraft were painted light blue on the belly, and had a dun coloured cammo pattern on the upper surface. Additionally, to break-up the silhouette, they had slots and holes along the trailing edge of the wings and tail assembly to allow light to pass through the aircraft. All told, the tech and design worked frighteningly well.
Stealth:
Based on shape/materials for the F117 and B2. With these two aircraft, the radar beam is scattered away from the aircraft due to the shape of the aircraft.
For the F22, it is based on electronics AND shape(partly)/materials(mainly), as at first glance, the F22 looks like "just another fighter jet." The design is such that when flying directly at or away from a radar source, the aircraft is harder to detect (an artificially reduced radar cross section), however, when turning within the radius of a radar, or doing a "broadside" flyby, they are almost as easy to spot as a "normal" fighter.
Colouration of a Stealth Jet:
Anything that does not attract attention to the jet in flight. At night, that means black. For aircraft (like the blackbird) that fly at obscene heights (even with the blatantly obvious contrail), that means black (as the environment they fly in is referred to as "blacksky").
Believe it or not, the German navy in WWII, to "stealth" their ships, painted them in jagged stripes of white and black. In good light and at port, it stood out like a sore thumb. In typical lighting at sea, it was hard to find, because the sub's gunners couldn't get a "fix" on the ship.
Posted: Sun Oct 10, 2004 4:37 pm
links provided by a good samaritan who wishes to remain unknown.
Stealth plane color hiding in Plane sight, pg 3
full article.
Stealth plane color hiding in Plane sight, pg 3
full article.
Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:30 am
I saw something the other day on the Nighthawk, and the Skunkworks wanted to paint it sort of a weird pinkish color which they found was the least visible at a distance in the night sky, but the pentagon balked at it.
The absorbing and reflecting "light" isn't the issue with high speed and high altitude like the Blackbird. Instead your dealing with frictional heat. The quicker a material absorbs the heat the quicker it transfers it away.
That is totally different then the F117 or the B2.
The absorbing and reflecting "light" isn't the issue with high speed and high altitude like the Blackbird. Instead your dealing with frictional heat. The quicker a material absorbs the heat the quicker it transfers it away.
That is totally different then the F117 or the B2.
Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 9:34 am
RockJock wrote:I saw something the other day on the Nighthawk, and the Skunkworks wanted to paint it sort of a weird pinkish color which they found was the least visible at a distance in the night sky, but the pentagon balked at it.
The absorbing and reflecting "light" isn't the issue with high speed and high altitude like the Blackbird. Instead your dealing with frictional heat. The quicker a material absorbs the heat the quicker it transfers it away.
That is totally different then the F117 or the B2.
thats what i said. but no one will beleive me.
Posted: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:34 pm
Glitterboy, I was just trying to word it differently so maybe some people would catch on;)