Forums of the Megaverse®

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 4:05 pm**

Sounds very much like a four tiered damage system I whipped up when Matty posted his tiered system a while back.

Maybe I'll type it up and post it for all to review.
:-D

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 4:13 pm**

Corradus wrote:Yes, that is exactly what I am talking about. It takes a little work to install but well worth it IMHO.

To be honest, I like the MDC system just fine as is. I figured that I'd come up with a way to have an SDC system that allowed all current statistical data (damage, structural capacity) to stay the same, while trying to address people's gripes about the whole SDC/MDC issue.

It was in fun, never really meant to be posted... but now I'm thinking I should post it.

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 5:07 pm**

Yes it does.

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 5:14 pm**

It works just fine as is.

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 6:49 pm**

MDC works very well, thankee.

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:13 pm**

I experamenting with scrapings the MDC system for my next rifts game. I understand some people are fine with it but the vaperazation factor annoys me to no end.

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:03 pm**

Corradus wrote:Yes, you are absolutely right. Whatever was I thinking. Suspension of disbelief, that's the key. My mistake. *gets back in line*

Right. Silence in the line *Cracks whip.* Any other dissenters? *Readies pistol.* If so, you're in the wrong game.
:lol:

Posted: **Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:18 pm**

Megadamage works just fine for Rifts.
Or rather, it CAN work just fine for Rifts.
Power Creep has made things increasingly absurd, but it's still workable enough that I don't see the need for a 4 tiered system.
If you want Vehicles and Giant Robots to be tougher, just up their MDC by a certain amount. There are rules for adding extra armor to vehicles, so this could even be done by the book.
Also, allow all vehicle mounted energy weapons to fire bursts and sprays.
Alternatively, limiting your PCs access to the more powerful weapons can also work.
A lot of the newer weapons can't fire full-auto anymore anyway.

Personally, I look at it as an interesting view of a world where the ability to deal damage has outstripped the ability to prevent it. I'm fine with things being deadly.

Posted: **Wed Oct 27, 2004 10:01 am**

Corradus wrote:*snipped*
What do you think?
Questions?
Comments?
Anyone care for a mint?

Well the system looks to be thought out, did you play test this?

Anyway I too have a few problems with the current system. What I did was far more basic than what you have here though.

Basically infantry and PA weapons (with the exception of rail guns and mini-missiles) have their damage divided by 10 vs large robots/vehicles, while those robots/vehicles automatically do their max damage to infantry EBA and PA suits.

More to the point using your example of a C-12 vs a unarmored target I always just got creative for effects, though the norm for me was simply to convert it straight to SDC and double it.

Posted: **Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:17 am**

Corradus wrote:
Now we have clever characters sneaking up to MkV APC's, jamming their laser rifles into their wheel-wells, loosing all the ammo in their clips and blowing the thing in half. Difficult to sneak up, but if it is done, so can the other thing be done. The player beams at me and rolls the damage for every round in the clip. Why? Because he could not possibly have missed at that range, and you know what? He is right. Now, I told him his weapon was slagged since he discharged it so close to the target but still. For the cost of a laser rifle, the enemy has been denied an armored vehicle.

You realise the armor on a M-113 Lynx can be pennitrated by a .50 cal round from an M82A1.

Posted: **Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:25 am**

I think it works just fine.

Posted: **Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:35 am**

Corradus wrote:Okay, I played RIFTS for years..until about 1996 when my interests took me elsewhere...but I still have all my books and I leaf through them fondly from time to time.

I also played Robotech since it's release (until around 1995, when everyone I knew lost interest in it).

I compared the effects of an MDC damage system in both games and remembered why RIFTS used to make me pull my hair out so much...

See...

In Robotech's combat for the longest time if you weren't a massive 40ft tall battle armored Zentraedi warrior or a Veritech or Destroid or Battle Pod, you weren't much else. You got hit with an MDC weapon, splatter. Boom. Die. Ouch. Avenge me and so forth.

This made a lot of sense. I mean, most of the Robotech weapons were huge. The armor was thick and bulky. Vehicles were like moving skyscrapers. Big things dish out big damage. All makes sense.

Then I looked at Rifts. Human being wears body armor that cannot be much thicker than an inch or he cannot walk. Even if it is 'super science materials' scale cannot be avoided. Measure evolves at the same time as countermeasure. Side A makes tank. Side B makes missile to defeat tank. Side A makes chaff to defeat missile. Side B makes ECCM to defeat chaff. And so on.

Then they say that man-portable weapons (ie: Infantry class laser rifles) do MDC AND that they use the standard firearms rules. Now along come the rules lawyers - and by the way, just because you are familiar with the rules and can think around them this does not make you a bad gamer, the rules are there to protect everyone so they have to work. The rules lawyers say that "Well, see KS clearly intended the firearms combat system to reflect the notion of the inherent inacurracy of automatic fire and it's consequent ammo wastage." Very well, I will debate this notion in another post but for this one let us assume we run with it.

Now we have clever characters sneaking up to MkV APC's, jamming their laser rifles into their wheel-wells, loosing all the ammo in their clips and blowing the thing in half. Difficult to sneak up, but if it is done, so can the other thing be done. The player beams at me and rolls the damage for every round in the clip. Why? Because he could not possibly have missed at that range, and you know what? He is right. Now, I told him his weapon was slagged since he discharged it so close to the target but still. For the cost of a laser rifle, the enemy has been denied an armored vehicle.

I don't seee what your problem with this senario is

makes sense to me.

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