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I know for those of you who remember those nastys asked your selves this who would win the splicers or the mechanoids
let the dabate begin

Geronimo 2.0 wrote:Dude, that Nanoplauge would jack the mechanoids five ways to Sunday. And with the tech boost the machine would get, it would be over for everybody REAL Quick.

I think that we aren't playing the Game the same way that the Mechs would.

1]] Comes to Earth, to kill ALL Humans and Human-looking Robots.

2]] Mechanoid Armies that land get ravaged by the Nanites.

3]] Mechanoids retreat to high above the Splicers' Homeworld...and blast the Planet to smithereens from on high......

I'm sorry, but not having the Mechanoids fight at their full Capacity is like getting into a fight with a Dragon...and NOT letting the dragon use Flight or Magic Spells. There's a reason even whole Pantheons run away from them.......

Another option has not been considered. The Mechanoids quietly observe things for a while, then try to establish contact with the Machine via electronic means to form an alliance. The Mechanoids might see the extermination of humankind as a common ground to work from.

Mike Taylor wrote:Another option has not been considered. The Mechanoids quietly observe things for a while, then try to establish contact with the Machine via electronic means to form an alliance. The Mechanoids might see the extermination of humankind as a common ground to work from.

I did consider that. You forget that Eve, while currently confined to a small section of the Physical Planet, is the CORE of the original Program. She will NEVER agree to wipe out all Humans, and at least two other Personalities will side with her (Lilith, who wants the game to never end, and Kali because humans make the most interesting noises when you 'play' with them, and she runs through them so quickly....).

I don't see the Mechanoids having a problem with either Kali's or Lilith's POV, so long as humans ultimately die. Eve would be less of an issue, given that she has been pretty much compartmentalized by the other personalities.

Mike Taylor wrote:I don't see the Mechanoids having a problem with either Kali's or Lilith's POV, so long as humans ultimately die. Eve would be less of an issue, given that she has been pretty much compartmentalized by the other personalities.

They mean that the area of Robots she can control is limited, do they not??? I don't think that they meant how vital she is to the whole Core Program (she IS the whole Core Program)......

That's ultimately up to GM interpretation at this moment. In any case, I'm less concerned with whether or not something like that would work and more with the role-playing opportunities it presents. I also see this interaction as a way to get Splicer characters off of the Splicers world and out into the Megaverse.

umm the mechanoid body armor is a sealed enviromental power armor sense they are not natives of that world they are not affected by the plauge until they crack that egg so when was the last time you ever heard of a mechanoid opening thier suit on a planet

so in effect they are not effected by the plauge

Beast-Guyver wrote:well the nono plague is designed to react to mamals not. . umm. . not real sure what mechanoids fall under but i don't see them as mammals.

Their organic components are ultimately from human DNA.

Beast-Guyver wrote:Well I personally dont remember the books ever saying what the mechanoids originally were, but assuming your right why would they have such homocidal feelings towards humans. That would be like going back in time and saying to a cave man 'im gunna kill you cause you havent evolved into homosapien yet'. It just plain doesnt make any sense. . and befor you bring it up yes I understand by human standards they are compleatly insane, but even insanity has a method to it

Psychic Shock from the attempt of their Ancestors and Creators (They were called "Atlanees." Hmmm.) to kill the Mechanoids on Planet.
Unfortunately, since they are now a telepathic "race," EVERY single Mechanoid (evil ones) that are ever born/created will still feel EXACTLY the same way as those First Mechies felt thousands of years ago. Unfortunately, this insanity is directed towards ANY Creature, be he Monster, Humanoid, or God, that has basic Humanoid shape -and this insanity is passed on to the next generation like most life-forms transmit DNA

Shadow_otm wrote:Mechanoid DNA won't be the same as human DNA. It is certainly going to have at least as many differences as a human's DNA has from a chimps. The nano-bot plauge likely wouldn't react to them unless The Machine reprogrammed them to recognize the new DNA setup. The Mechanoids are no fools though... they would probably find out about and counteract the nano-plauge before it could be made to recognize them. The Mechanoids could possibly make a deal with the Librarians... they may even take some intrest in the bio-tech. The Librarians are probably the only ones the Mechanoids would strike a deal with.

Agreed.

thagema wrote:The nanoplauge is triggered by contact between mammals and metal. So, therefore, unless the mechanoids are mammals, they would be immune. Unless, as someone mentioned previously, the Machine restructed/added on to the original plague to attack the mechanoids.

Mechanoids are still genetic 'mammals' even if they now reproduce by cloning And I think it's more then just mammals that trigger the plague, but I'll have to read the book when I get home.



Daniel Stoker

Mechanoids the true ones (in the early books) destory planets as a hobby.

They would blast the planet and used the resulting asteroid belt as candy yum yums for their worldships.

Shadow_otm wrote:One or more personalities of the NEXUS might try to contact them... They might consider dealing with the Mechinoids to deal with what both would consider vermin. I don't know the Mechis that well... but the NEXUS having human stylized AIs... might be something they'd eventually decide on purging.

Wellll....there's only one pproblem with that. The Mechies tend to see Humanoids on a given Planet and then blast it to bits; it's usually only much later that they realize that somebody on the Planet in question was probably worth talking to......

Actually, I believe that the Mechanoids usually landed on a planet and started carving it into bite-sized pieces.
Not that they couldn't blow it up from orbit, just that their usual MO included landing.

Besides, a lot of the Mechanoids LIKE killing humans and want it to be up-close and personal.

the mechanoid body case is a sealed enviromental power armor mechanoids can not breathe our atmosphere so they are immune to the nano plauge until that egg is cracked so the nano plauge does not affect them and their telemechanics prevent a nanaoplauge response when some one decides to kamikaze it

Mechanoids would win, greater number.

Achalon wrote:I know this isn't stated anywhere in the book specifically, but I kinda got the impression that an ABM Oracle Mechanoid was likely the one responsible for giving the humans their Bio-Tech.

It keeps this area very vague in the book, but in the Megaversal view, it seems to fit...

I mean what else or who else would be willing and able to give humans Bio-Tech? Most Alien Intelligences I've seen in the books could care less about humans and even less about Any type of technology.

Now granted, I may be wrong and I can't wait to see what the author(s) come up with, but my guess is an ABM Oracle or something completly new. The latter is probably more likely, but I like the Oracle Idea...

The humans invented it themselves...

It is outright insinuated that the Lillith personality gave humans the secrets of biotech on the Splicers world - not that it has any bearing on who gave the rest of the Palladium/Rifts multiverse biotech. The other likely personality in Splicers is Eve who is noted as working to aid and protect humanity. As for the presence/development of alien symbiotes, I'm not even going to guess how that came about but I'd decree the symbiotes are native to the Splicers world in my own games.

Now, here's a question, if the Mechanoids didn't immediately know their alliance with normal humans, how would they regard Librarians? They are former humanoids, but like the Mechanoids, they have altered themselves into a pretty unrecognizeable state...

I ask because this thread has given me a few eeeeevvvillll ideas.

aegis wrote:

Actually, in the book it breifly mentioned that a benevolent being granted them the knoweledge. (boy my spelling is bad today - )

While I will not doubt you on that statement, I will serisouly doubt anyone even considering some sort of mechanoid giving them the secrets of it. My first problem with that is if they did that then wouldnt there be more mechanoids using organic tech, would be very handy in many situations giant, metalic cyborgs that wouldnt be handy.

Second I thought it hinted/rumored that one of the machine personalities gave it to the humans.

Aegis

It DID indeed imply that perhaps one of the Machine Personalities gave this Knowledge to the Humans.

PRIME CANDIDATE #1: Lilith (wants to continue the "game")
PRIME CANDIDATE #2: Eve ("happy" with how the Humans are now -limited in number but thriving -and wants to give them an edge for survival)

See my response in this thread:

http://forums.palladium-megaverse.com/viewtopic.php?t=33841

Shadow_otm wrote:Mechanoid DNA won't be the same as human DNA. It is certainly going to have at least as many differences as a human's DNA has from a chimps. The nano-bot plauge likely wouldn't react to them unless The Machine reprogrammed them to recognize the new DNA setup. The Mechanoids are no fools though... they would probably find out about and counteract the nano-plauge before it could be made to recognize them. The Mechanoids could possibly make a deal with the Librarians... they may even take some intrest in the bio-tech. The Librarians are probably the only ones the Mechanoids would strike a deal with.

The nano plague effects any organic material... that is why a Splicer in a Parasite armor can't use metal weapons.

LordChronos wrote:Even thought the Mechaniods would only land and slaughter on the Splicers planet if it resembled Earth and if they thought it would get a good laugh, the Mechaniods would still be slaughtered.

Not becuase the nanoplague would tear them to shreds, they wouldn't. They'd infest but that is all. The nanoplague would end up helping the Machaniods.

When it came to fighting the Mechaniods would probubly not even bother with the Machine and her robots (outside of the drones). The Mechanoids would recognize the host armors and the resistance for what it is, Human, and slaughter them.

The bulk of the Machine would rejoice at this, but Gaia, Kali, and Eve would be enraged, and this would be the Machanoids downfall. Remember those acres and acres of robot repositories? Yha, can we say goodbye Psyckic aliens?

And don't get me started on the lack of ambient mystic energy. It would cost the Mechanoids twice the usual I.S.P. cost to manifest a psychic power and their I.S.P. would regenerate at half the rate.

And this would ultimatly result in an inevitable bonus to the Resistance as they would be smart and hole up underground and hide until the Mechaniods had been eliminated and a good chunk of the Machines forces were eliminated along side, then they would strike, and strike hard. Damn those Librarians and Engineers are smart.

So does no one even remember the planet eaters that the mechanoids have... who's got the old comic book RPG books for Mechanoids? They have planet size ships that are fueled by consuming planets and breaking them down to their elements. So if the Splicers planet doesn't look like Earth then it's fuel if it does look like Earth and they start loosing then it's fuel, if they get bored it's fuel. So Mechanoids win.

cornholioprime wrote:

aegis wrote:

Actually, in the book it breifly mentioned that a benevolent being granted them the knoweledge. (boy my spelling is bad today - )

While I will not doubt you on that statement, I will serisouly doubt anyone even considering some sort of mechanoid giving them the secrets of it. My first problem with that is if they did that then wouldnt there be more mechanoids using organic tech, would be very handy in many situations giant, metalic cyborgs that wouldnt be handy.

Second I thought it hinted/rumored that one of the machine personalities gave it to the humans.

Aegis

It DID indeed imply that perhaps one of the Machine Personalities gave this Knowledge to the Humans.

PRIME CANDIDATE #1: Lilith (wants to continue the "game")
PRIME CANDIDATE #2: Eve ("happy" with how the Humans are now -limited in number but thriving -and wants to give them an edge for survival)

The book also, however, implies that it was given to humans by an Alien.

Mechanoids for the following reasons.

- They cannot survive in our atmosphere which means they are environmentally sealed and would not come into contact with the nano-plague. If they did, they'd be dead anyways.
- I don't care if it's a deadzone for mystical energy. The mechanoids have incredible amounts of ISP.
- Lets see here, the incredible numbers, speed, power, intelligence, of the mechanoids. Game over. If anyone managed to upset them enough, the whole planet would get glassed.
- The mechanoids really have no equal other than themselves. They are essentially the "perfect" race. Next to the old ones, they're like the most powerful force in existance.
- They have incredible genetic abilities and would be perfectly capable of creating the host armors and the such.
- They have incredible technology. They freaking tear apart stars to create their energy crystals. They essentially eat stars. If a direct assault fails against the planet they could always just convert the star into power crystals and freeze the planet, killing almost everything on it and then just go in and mop up the rest while they mine the planet.
- Their psychic abilities really give them an edge.

I think I've covered the main ideas.

As far as who I think gave the technology to the human resistance. I say Lilith did it. However the hint at Mechanoid Space on page 167 (top right corner) does make this a viable theory.

EDIT: Wow, didn't realize how old this was. My bad.