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Not likely. The Quatoria use their abiliy to pass as a normal Wolfen to assist them in their job.

Possible yes, likely no

And if those arms can be concealed by pulling up tight against the chest unit, they are going to be too small to be usefull anyway.

They could but they won't.

Dr. Doom v.3.0 wrote:They could but they won't.

Doom... you've got like 14,000 posts to your count, and have been around these boards longer than I can remember. Can you not give any elaboration to your answers... or have you taken a vow or something?

Braden, GMPhD wrote:

Dr. Doom v.3.0 wrote:They could but they won't.

Doom... you've got like 14,000 posts to your count, and have been around these boards longer than I can remember. Can you not give any elaboration to your answers... or have you taken a vow or something?

I could.

Illithid13 wrote:I was wondering another thing about them... why do they not have the trick shooting that the gunslinger/gunfighter/psi-slinger have in new west? It even says that they have been known to shoot people behind them w/o looking.

Because New West came out after Phase World I believe.
But the W.P. Sharpshooting skill came out in CB1 and is avalable for them to take if they want it.

The real reason a Wolfen Quatoria can shoot someone sneaking up behind them w/out looking is because they have micro radar installed. As well as the more "standard" cybernetic implants such as cyber ears.

Hard to imagine that one would undergo that kind of bionic conversion, particularly given the effort to retain as much of their original organics as possible. They seem to want to retain their original Wolfen form of which 4 arms is not a standard.

It is extremely hard to to get properly tailored wolfen clothes with four sleeves so they've no choice but to stick with the normal two....

BendisAurelious wrote:

keir451 wrote:The real reason a Wolfen Quatoria can shoot someone sneaking up behind them w/out looking is because they have micro radar installed. As well as the more "standard" cybernetic implants such as cyber ears.

true, but is it REQUIRED for them get cybernetics? or is choice?

In a word, YES. The job of Quatoria is based upon the Wolfen becoming a full conversion borg primarily becasue of the kinds of criminals they pursue and the areas they pursue them to require one to either be a borg or wear power armor. Now consider that the job of a "Galatic Police Officer" may require under cover work where power armor cannot be used or gotten in.

a four armed star marshall would quickly develope a feaesome reputation especially with sharpshooting energy rifle. a four armed wolfman charging in with four rifles. cool concept

torkair wrote:

say652 wrote:a four armed star marshall would quickly develope a feaesome reputation especially with sharpshooting energy rifle. a four armed wolfman charging in with four rifles. cool concept

Cool in concept but terrible in practice, only a select few OCCs allow for firing a gun in each hand and sadly the Quatoria is not one of them.

still the star marshal can choose sharpshooting as a skill and duel weilding or in this case quad weilding is a possiblity. i would allow it. a walking one wolf fireteam at the cost of always being recognized and maybe an increased horror factor. the reputation would grow fast so would the the price for killing him. with great power comes even tougher villians lol.

so in regard to the first question asked. the answer is NO. just create a four armed borg and use your skills availible to learn as much of the star marshall occ as allowed. with rules comes compromise, with compromise comes getting something a little like your character concept. such is the price of playing with other people. a fair trade i believe

Actually, the correct answer is "will your GM allow it?" Practicality doesn't even come into this; nothing in Palladium is remotely practical in any realistic sense. You could hide an extra set of bionic arms in all sorts of silly ways. Fold them behind your back and disguise them as a backpack. Fold them into a hollow chest compartment. Take them off and store them someplace when you need to be less obvious. Heck, pull a General Grievous and have your two arms split into four.

And I'm pretty sure that Wolfen Quatoria don't actually read the Phase World rulebooks, so trying to use their description as a hard-and-fast lockdown on every Quatoria PC's personality is a bit... out there, don't you think? Rifts is campy enough without going all Planet of Hats on us here.

Qev wrote:Actually, the correct answer is "will your GM allow it?" Practicality doesn't even come into this; nothing in Palladium is remotely practical in any realistic sense. You could hide an extra set of bionic arms in all sorts of silly ways. Fold them behind your back and disguise them as a backpack. Fold them into a hollow chest compartment. Take them off and store them someplace when you need to be less obvious. Heck, pull a General Grievous and have your two arms split into four.

And I'm pretty sure that Wolfen Quatoria don't actually read the Phase World rulebooks, so trying to use their description as a hard-and-fast lockdown on every Quatoria PC's personality is a bit... out there, don't you think? Rifts is campy enough without going all Planet of Hats on us here.

Except that's not going 'planet of hats', given the nature of Wolven and that Quatoria attempt to actually look normal additional arms would violate the concept of looking normal. The Wolven selected for the process clearly are tested so that they settle within that particular range and aren't going to add on extra limbs like that.

"A Wolfen Quatoria would never do this" is effectively dictating the character's personality to the player creating it. I find that a bit silly. Then again I find any rule that's "always <this personality trait> no exceptions!!!" entries on OCCs / RCCs etc. to be daft.

There's like, a hojillion ways one could disguise or hide extra limbs in a setting this advanced. His fellows might think him a bit odd, maybe he gets passed up for occasional promotions due to his quirky nature. So what? Roleplaying.

Qev wrote:"A Wolfen Quatoria would never do this" is effectively dictating the character's personality to the player creating it. I find that a bit silly. Then again I find any rule that's "always <this personality trait> no exceptions!!!" entries on OCCs / RCCs etc. to be daft.

There's like, a hojillion ways one could disguise or hide extra limbs in a setting this advanced. His fellows might think him a bit odd, maybe he gets passed up for occasional promotions due to his quirky nature. So what? Roleplaying.

That's really not dictating the personality, and to a degree every class dictates something that you have to go to be in that class. If you want to be a Wolfen Quatoria then the class dictates that you don't pile on extra limbs or what have you because you think it's cool. Contrary to what many thinks not everything is subject to 'do whatever you want' some things restrict your choices and you live with them or choose something else.

Well yes, of course in some instances there'll be restrictions. But this isn't specifically disallowed, so I feel that - provided it can be sufficiently concealed or even modular - modifications of this sort seem unobjectionable.

Didn't NGR have rules for concealable extra arms somewhere?

Here's a question; why bother?

To wield 4 guns, or to hold a prisoner with 2 while beating on him with the other, Goro-style?

Like I said, it would be unusual, but there's always at least one odd bird in any group, even if the birds are wolves.

enhancer wrote:I think the problem with this idea is trying to turn a cop into a soldier. Giving up the ability to blend in and act like a cop(i.e not to intimidate everyone you meet, like witnesses), and use normal equipment and vehicles just says why not be a soldier? If a 4 armed quad wielding wolfen shows up on your doorstep, you don't think he's a cop, you think he's a merc. Also the fake skin isn't for their humanity(wolfanity?), it says "They voluntarily sacrifice their humanity to serve their people". Under Living Shell it says the skin "allows the Quatoria to lead a normal life and hide his bionic features and abilities." (My emphasis)
They are supposed to be able to work undercover. Being a 4 armed gun wielding obvious borg sort of limits the cover selection a bit. Again, ultimately up to the GM, but if you are going to play a cop, play a cop. If you want a war borg for kickin butt, make one of those instead.

A Quatoria is a borg for kicking butt... criminal butt!

And really, in a setting where bionics are as common as they are, nobody's gonna bat an eye at a four-armed dog-headed dude. Well, unless they're into four-armed dog people. I'm not judging!

Qev wrote:

enhancer wrote:I think the problem with this idea is trying to turn a cop into a soldier. Giving up the ability to blend in and act like a cop(i.e not to intimidate everyone you meet, like witnesses), and use normal equipment and vehicles just says why not be a soldier? If a 4 armed quad wielding wolfen shows up on your doorstep, you don't think he's a cop, you think he's a merc. Also the fake skin isn't for their humanity(wolfanity?), it says "They voluntarily sacrifice their humanity to serve their people". Under Living Shell it says the skin "allows the Quatoria to lead a normal life and hide his bionic features and abilities." (My emphasis)
They are supposed to be able to work undercover. Being a 4 armed gun wielding obvious borg sort of limits the cover selection a bit. Again, ultimately up to the GM, but if you are going to play a cop, play a cop. If you want a war borg for kickin butt, make one of those instead.

A Quatoria is a borg for kicking butt... criminal butt!

And really, in a setting where bionics are as common as they are, nobody's gonna bat an eye at a four-armed dog-headed dude. Well, unless they're into four-armed dog people. I'm not judging!

Except they'll immediately know he's a borg meaning he's an MDC killing machine if he wants to be rather than mistaking him for an easily hurt/killed SDC creature. It grants a tactical advantage NOT exposing that you're a cyborg or otherwise super-powerful creature and leave them thinking you're more vulnerable than you actually are.

Nightmask wrote:Except they'll immediately know he's a borg meaning he's an MDC killing machine if he wants to be rather than mistaking him for an easily hurt/killed SDC creature. It grants a tactical advantage NOT exposing that you're a cyborg or otherwise super-powerful creature and leave them thinking you're more vulnerable than you actually are.

I think the general idea was to have the extra arms concealable, but just because you have cyborg parts doesn't necessarily mean you're a combat cyborg. Maybe they're civvie models. <__<

Qev wrote:

Nightmask wrote:Except they'll immediately know he's a borg meaning he's an MDC killing machine if he wants to be rather than mistaking him for an easily hurt/killed SDC creature. It grants a tactical advantage NOT exposing that you're a cyborg or otherwise super-powerful creature and leave them thinking you're more vulnerable than you actually are.

I think the general idea was to have the extra arms concealable, but just because you have cyborg parts doesn't necessarily mean you're a combat cyborg. Maybe they're civvie models. <__<

Considering where Quatoria tend to go the people that attend those locations would be Too Dumb To Live if they saw someone with obvious cyborg features and assumed they were harmless (relatively speaking) SDC features especially on a Wolfen.

I have plans to play a Quatoria soonish, and In doing research for the role, I've come to the conclusion that the ability to blend in with "normal" 3 G Wolfen is something that is essential to the Quatoria. Proof? The fact that unlike nearly all other borgs these are built around Terminator style ENDOskeletons illustrates the fact that they want to keep their true nature and power hidden until necessary. Walking around with four arms would defeat the purpose.

That's kind of silly, though. Cybernetic modifications would be ubiquitous in the Three Galaxies; a wolfen with them wouldn't turn any heads. And again, they can be made concealable...

Not when the borg in question is built on an ENDO-skeleton chassis with living tissue over it, which is the case with the Quatoria. When your hypothetical hidden arms were extracted for use, it would tear open the flesh revealing the otherwise inconspicuous Wolfen as a combat borg. Which is something they don't want until necessary. Pg 66 Phase World "A number of cybernetic implants make Quatoria perfect spies and detectives." Pg 67 under abilities 3. Living shell: Through advanced surgical procedures, the skin, fur, and some of the muscle structure are grafted onto a cybernetic endo-skeleton. This allows the Quatoria to lead a normal life and HIDE (emphasis mine) his bionic features and abilities. Taking more than 100 SDC will tear up enough to reveal the cyborg body beneath. This revelation usually has a horror factor of 14!"

Based on this information it is clear the Quatoria were not intended to walk around with cybernetics gleaming multi-armed. The fact that they are in fact full conversion borgs is intended to be a hidden not commonly known advantage. Could you do it? Sure, this is Rifts and the 3 G. Would it go against the spirit of the class? Yes absolutely.

Jay05 wrote:Not when the borg in question is built on an ENDO-skeleton chassis with living tissue over it, which is the case with the Quatoria. When your hypothetical hidden arms were extracted for use, it would tear open the flesh revealing the otherwise inconspicuous Wolfen as a combat borg. Which is something they don't want until necessary. Pg 66 Phase World "A number of cybernetic implants make Quatoria perfect spies and detectives." Pg 67 under abilities 3. Living shell: Through advanced surgical procedures, the skin, fur, and some of the muscle structure are grafted onto a cybernetic endo-skeleton. This allows the Quatoria to lead a normal life and HIDE (emphasis mine) his bionic features and abilities. Taking more than 100 SDC will tear up enough to reveal the cyborg body beneath. This revelation usually has a horror factor of 14!"

Based on this information it is clear the Quatoria were not intended to walk around with cybernetics gleaming multi-armed. The fact that they are in fact full conversion borgs is intended to be a hidden not commonly known advantage. Could you do it? Sure, this is Rifts and the 3 G. Would it go against the spirit of the class? Yes absolutely.

Besides, the Quatoria are supposed to be like Maj. Motoko Kusanagi from Ghost in the Shell; outwardly squishy looking, inwardly finely tuned killing machine (literally).
If you WANTED a non-standard Quatoria, okay... they lose the outer flesh on 90% of the body, have all the 'Chrome' tri-gal credits can buy and aren't actually Quatoria. They're now part of the Leigon (re; army).
Oh yeah, they'd still be specialists, but they wouldn't be Quatoria. More like Praetoria.

DhAkael wrote:

Jay05 wrote:Not when the borg in question is built on an ENDO-skeleton chassis with living tissue over it, which is the case with the Quatoria. When your hypothetical hidden arms were extracted for use, it would tear open the flesh revealing the otherwise inconspicuous Wolfen as a combat borg. Which is something they don't want until necessary. Pg 66 Phase World "A number of cybernetic implants make Quatoria perfect spies and detectives." Pg 67 under abilities 3. Living shell: Through advanced surgical procedures, the skin, fur, and some of the muscle structure are grafted onto a cybernetic endo-skeleton. This allows the Quatoria to lead a normal life and HIDE (emphasis mine) his bionic features and abilities. Taking more than 100 SDC will tear up enough to reveal the cyborg body beneath. This revelation usually has a horror factor of 14!"

Based on this information it is clear the Quatoria were not intended to walk around with cybernetics gleaming multi-armed. The fact that they are in fact full conversion borgs is intended to be a hidden not commonly known advantage. Could you do it? Sure, this is Rifts and the 3 G. Would it go against the spirit of the class? Yes absolutely.

Besides, the Quatoria are supposed to be like Maj. Motoko Kusanagi from Ghost in the Shell; outwardly squishy looking, inwardly finely tuned killing machine (literally).
If you WANTED a non-standard Quatoria, okay... they lose the outer flesh on 90% of the body, have all the 'Chrome' tri-gal credits can buy and aren't actually Quatoria. They're now part of the Leigon (re; army).
Oh yeah, they'd still be specialists, but they wouldn't be Quatoria. More like Praetoria.

Yep, that'd be a way to do it with the same basic class and have the extra arms etc and not lose the flavor that is Quatoria specific.

at the cost of the nanobot regeneration, this might work. light japanese borg. build four arms on the frame. grab the heroes book for the cost to add fur and an animalistic head(possible bite damage also) and poof 4 armed wolfen. i would reccomend using the japanese police officer occ also. hand hand akido and of course sharpshooting in your favorite wp. as the character levels allow phaseworld upgrades

Just because something could work, doesn't necessarily mean it should. Wolfen borg with four arms? Fine. He's just not a Quatoria.

Jay05 wrote:Just because something could work, doesn't necessarily mean it should. Wolfen borg with four arms? Fine. He's just not a Quatoria.

This is why you make the arms concealable. This isn't hard with PW tech.

so while not a true star marshall the guy can play roughly what he wants. at the cost of lower attributes and no nano regeneration. remember a good compromise leaves both parties upset.(thats 15 years of married wisdom right there lol)

Qev wrote:

Jay05 wrote:Just because something could work, doesn't necessarily mean it should. Wolfen borg with four arms? Fine. He's just not a Quatoria.

This is why you make the arms concealable. This isn't hard with PW tech.

As I said... again, not without compromising the sdc outer skin resulting in horror factor and cover blown. Quatoria at their core are Undercover Cops.

say652 wrote:so while not a true star marshall the guy can play roughly what he wants. at the cost of lower attributes and no nano regeneration. remember a good compromise leaves both parties upset.(thats 15 years of married wisdom right there lol)

Yes, absolutely. And no he would not be a Star Marshal.

-sigh- the only reason I'm seeing people want to do the whole "4 arms" thing with the Quatoria is to munch out their PC even further with the paired weapons in two sets of arms AND the extra attack. Personally, I see this as being immature, and going against EVERYTHING that the Quatoria (in canon) is described to be... a "CONCEALED" cyborg.
The arguments AGAINST it have been given previously.
Anyone further arguing FOR the insecta / spider wolf borg thing with Quatoria systems / training is just trying to make their GM's have a migraine.
But hey, you want to toss out everything and have an uber-borg, knock yourself out.

DhAkael wrote:-sigh- the only reason I'm seeing people want to do the whole "4 arms" thing with the Quatoria is to munch out their PC even further with the paired weapons in two sets of arms AND the extra attack. Personally, I see this as being immature, and going against EVERYTHING that the Quatoria (in canon) is described to be... a "CONCEALED" cyborg.
The arguments AGAINST it have been given previously.
Anyone further arguing FOR the insecta / spider wolf borg thing with Quatoria systems / training is just trying to make their GM's have a migraine.
But hey, you want to toss out everything and have an uber-borg, knock yourself out.

Nah, that's someone on another board I frequent who wants to make a godling cosmo-knight.

Although technically speaking, all Quatoria have forearms...

Qev wrote:

DhAkael wrote:-sigh- the only reason I'm seeing people want to do the whole "4 arms" thing with the Quatoria is to munch out their PC even further with the paired weapons in two sets of arms AND the extra attack. Personally, I see this as being immature, and going against EVERYTHING that the Quatoria (in canon) is described to be... a "CONCEALED" cyborg.
The arguments AGAINST it have been given previously.
Anyone further arguing FOR the insecta / spider wolf borg thing with Quatoria systems / training is just trying to make their GM's have a migraine.
But hey, you want to toss out everything and have an uber-borg, knock yourself out.

Nah, that's someone on another board I frequent who wants to make a godling cosmo-knight.

Although technically speaking, all Quatoria have forearms...

Wise-guy...

Qev wrote:

DhAkael wrote:-sigh- the only reason I'm seeing people want to do the whole "4 arms" thing with the Quatoria is to munch out their PC even further with the paired weapons in two sets of arms AND the extra attack. Personally, I see this as being immature, and going against EVERYTHING that the Quatoria (in canon) is described to be... a "CONCEALED" cyborg.
The arguments AGAINST it have been given previously.
Anyone further arguing FOR the insecta / spider wolf borg thing with Quatoria systems / training is just trying to make their GM's have a migraine.
But hey, you want to toss out everything and have an uber-borg, knock yourself out.

Nah, that's someone on another board I frequent who wants to make a godling cosmo-knight.

Although technically speaking, all Quatoria have forearms...

funny

the japanese lightfull conversion frame is not nearly as powerful as a star marshal. not really any stronger or durable than a partial conversion borg actually but it is the lightest full conversion borg which a full conversion frame is neccesary for multiple limbs. low bionic attributes low mdc but the good part is low prowl penalty.