Forums of the Megaverse®

Posted: **Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:40 pm**

I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

Posted: **Sat Sep 09, 2006 10:41 pm**

taalismn wrote:I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

APS: Metal applies for all Metal forms. the only reason Mercury needed it's own is because it's a liquid and not solid metal.

but APS: metal (Steel) has the same stats as APS: Metal (copper)

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 12:09 am**

Lead has crappy thermal properties, are you thinking about radiation?

I think a set of properties for different metals could be fun.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 1:18 am**

APS: Gold = Retirement Man!

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:42 am**

Actually you can get different types of metla, just combining the APs power...with any other minor powers that do the job.
Example APS Metal with Conduct Electricity, for some super conductive metals, or impervious to fire and heat or else, I dont know all the characterist of metals.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 10:00 am**

APS Gold = Rich
APS Silver = Vampire Hunter
APS Copper = Also has minor electrical powers
APS Steel = Increased sdc
APS Palladium/Platinum = Catalyst powers (minor transformation of objects)
APS Lead = Mallable and can handle radiation
APS Aluminum = Light, somewhat mallable, flexible, somewhat strong
APS Sodium = Minor explosive (with water) or corrosive powers
...

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 10:12 am**

A while ago, I decided to think of APS: Metal as the APS: Hard Metal, and I extrapolated stats for APS: Soft Metal from the Copy Physical Structure power.
I did this, because I wanted to make a Rifts character with APS: Silver who liked to fight vampires.
Copy Physical Structures for the most part has a specific ratio for SDC from the APS powers, and the AR is dropped by one or two points. Can't remember the specifics, but it wasn't hard to figure out.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:23 am**

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
taalismn wrote:I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

APS: Metal applies for all Metal forms. the only reason Mercury needed it's own is because it's a liquid and not solid metal.

but APS: metal (Steel) has the same stats as APS: Metal (copper)

In your opinion anyways.Nekira, you arent the final answer when it comes to this stuff.

Anyways, I like the idea of varient metals to be "Altered" into. I believe there was a thread on this in the past.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:50 am**

The Deific NMI wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
taalismn wrote:I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

APS: Metal applies for all Metal forms. the only reason Mercury needed it's own is because it's a liquid and not solid metal.

but APS: metal (Steel) has the same stats as APS: Metal (copper)
In your opinion anyways.Nekira, you arent the final answer when it comes to this stuff.

Anyways, I like the idea of varient metals to be "Altered" into. I believe there was a thread on this in the past.

So tell me then. what's the DEFALT metal when you pick "APS: Metal"?

it never says. that leads me to beleive it covers all of them.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 4:41 pm**

macksting wrote:Precisely my impression, actually. Which leaves me free, as DM, to come up with a metal...

However, I kinda like the ideas here. Especially Copper. Iron, now's I think about it, might very well carry a magnetic charge, which could be fun... and immensely frustrating.

Edit: In Mutants in Orbit, I frequently refer to APS: Ice as APS: Gold.

Always figured the 'default' metal for APS Metal was some sort of dense titanium steel-like material...and that variants might predispose the chaarcter to improved stats for the various other powers one might add on later...

As for APS: Ice in space? Well, that's one way of making a superpower pay off! Provided the character wasn't just drawing moisture from the srrounding medium, and instead CREATING new water-ice, I could see how a space-based iceman could make a bundle of credits selling his product...

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 5:45 pm**

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
The Deific NMI wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
taalismn wrote:I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

APS: Metal applies for all Metal forms. the only reason Mercury needed it's own is because it's a liquid and not solid metal.

but APS: metal (Steel) has the same stats as APS: Metal (copper)
In your opinion anyways.Nekira, you arent the final answer when it comes to this stuff.

Anyways, I like the idea of varient metals to be "Altered" into. I believe there was a thread on this in the past.

So tell me then. what's the DEFALT metal when you pick "APS: Metal"?

it never says. that leads me to beleive it covers all of them.

Yes in general it does cover all of them, but if one wanted to be more specific and capture the elements of specfic elements into their heroes/ villains form, then there is definately room to expand the APS: Metal concept.

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 6:06 pm**

If we are adding in what the metal attributes to APS metal then these are more...realistic.

APS Gold = Rich and can handle radiation Also has minor electrical powers, and an additional x3 to weight
APS Silver = Vampire Hunter Also has minor electrical powers
APS Copper = Also has minor electrical powers
APS Steel = standard ASP:metal stats
APS Palladium/Platinum = Catalyst powers (minor transformation of objects)
APS Lead = Mallable and can handle radiation, and an additional x2 to weight
APS Titatium = soft and Mallable and light, recovers from damamge faster, sutract x2 from the weight increse
APS Aluminum = Light, somewhat mallable, flexible, somewhat strong, sutract x2 from the weight increse
APS Sodium = Minor explosive (with water) or corrosive powers
APS Francium = Liquid powers and radiation control powers
APS Chrome = SDC bonus

Posted: **Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:02 pm**

Here's what i use

The Baron von Clogg (Dan) wrote:Alter Physical Structure: Metal (Modified)
Rather than the generic "metal" presented in standard version of the power, players can customize the properties of their metallic form. Basically, the player gains "points" for accepting disadvantages and spends those points for advantages.

Modifications
Starting with the standard power (Nat AR 17, 800 SDC), one chooses the Advantages they want from the table below, and then chooses some Disadvantages to balance the power. Any points left over will have to be paid by lowering the characters AR or SDC.

Points are supposed to reflect a percentage of the character's SDC- Trading in 10% of your SDC gains you 10 points to spend on advantages. Any points left over or needed at the end can be used to increase or decrease the character's Metal SDC.

Increasing and Decreasing Natural AR
Trading SDC for Natural AR should work out to be even, statistically. Raising your AR from 17 to 18 means you'll take damage 33% less often, so it requires the equivalent of 33% of your SDC.

AR Trades
19: -100 pts
18: -33 pts

16: +25 pts
15: +50 pts
14: +75 pts
13: +100 pts
12: +125 pts
11: +150 pts
10: +175 pts
9: +200 pts

Advantages:
20 pts: Non-Magnetic: Magnetic fields have little effect on character
20 pts: Reflective: Light/Laser attacks do no damage
30 pts: Highly Conductive: Electrical attacks do no damage
30 pts: High Heat Capacity: Heat/Fire attacks do no damage
30 pts: Weapon against Supernatural (harms beings normally immune, 2x damage to normal SN creatures)
30 pts: Low Density: Half weight, normal speed attribute; +2 Strike, Parry, Dodge; -5 Damage
35 pts: Natural Weapon: Physical Attacks are more Damaging; +10 damage
40 pts: Electromagnetic Booster: Electromagnetic attacks do double damage at double range: Costs two attacks per melee to maintain
40 pts: High Density: Double weight, half speed; +10 PS; -5 Dodge, Initiative, Auto-Parry is impossible
40 pts: Rigid: Extraordinary and Superhuman physical attacks do no damage; Supernatural physical attacks do 1/2 damage above Natural AR

Disadvantages
5 pts: Rusts/Tarnishes: -1 PB for every 10 minutes spent in metal form, to maximum of -5
10 pts: Highly Magnetic: Magnetic attacks/forces have double damage/effect
10 pts: Non-Reflective: Light/Laser attacks below AR do normal damage, 2x above
15 pts: Resonant: Sonic/Vibration attacks below AR do normal damage, 2x damage above
15 pts: Lowly Conductive: Electric attacks below AR do normal damage, 2x damage above
15 pts: Low Heat Capacity: Heat/Fire does normal damage below AR, 2x damage above
20 pts: Malleable: Normal physical attacks that beat AR do 1/2 damage; Extraordinary and Superhuman attacks do 1/2 below AR, full damage above; Supernatural do full damage below AR, 2x above
30 pts: Can only Maintain Metal Form for PEx2 melees; requires 1D4 hours in human form to reattempt
30 pts: Radioactive: Emits background radiation similar to Control Radiation power
35 pts: Can only Maintain Human Form for PEx2 melees; requires 1D4 hours in metal form to reattempt
35 pts: Reactive to Water: Character heats up or bursts into flame upon contact with water (like Sodium); Takes between 1D6 and 1D6x10 damage per melee (GM call based on situation)
35 pts: Thermal Expansion: Character painfully expands and contracts with variations in body temperature; Takes between 1D6 and 1D6x10 per melee

Examples
There's no need to pattern yourself after an existing metal, but a few examples might make the system clear. I'm sure some of the metallic properties are wrong, because I just went with what sounded good. Individual characters (rather than general metal types) can make better use of the more individualized Didadvantages....

Alter Physical Structure: Copper
Nat AR 16 (+25 pts); SDC: 1000 (25 pts)
Advantages (-60 pts): Highly Conductive; High Heat Capacity
Disadvantages (+60 pts): Tarnishes; Malleable, Thermal Expansion

Alter Physical Structure: Lead
Nat AR 14 (+75 pts); SDC: 1200 (-50 pts)
Advantages (-60 pts): Non-Magnetic; High Density
Disadvantages (+35 pts): Low Heat Capacity; Malleable

Alter Physical Structure: Iron
Nat AR 17 (0 pts); SDC: 800 (0 pts)
Advantages (-30 pts): High Heat Capacity
Disadvantages (+30 pts): Tarnishes; Highly Magnetic; Resonant

Alter Physical Structure: Silver
Nat AR 15 (+50 pts); SDC: 680 (+15 pts)
Advantages (-100 pts): Non-Magnetic; Reflective; Highly Conductive; Weapon against Supernatural
Disadvantages (+35 pts): Low Heat Capacity; Malleable

Alter Physical Structure: Titanium
Nat AR 17 (0 pts); SDC: 680 (+15 pts)
Advantages (-90 pts): Non-Magnetic; Low Density; Rigid
Disadvantages (+75 pts): Non-Reflective; Resonant; Lowly Conductive; Thermal Expansion

Alter Physical Structure: Superconductor
Nat AR 14 (+75 pts); SDC: 800 (0 pts)
Advantages (-100 pts): Highly Conductive; Low Density; EM Booster
Disadvantages (+25 pts): Highly Magnetic; Low Heat Capacity

Posted: **Mon Sep 11, 2006 12:38 am**

The Deific NMI wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
The Deific NMI wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
taalismn wrote:I'm sure the subject has been brought uo before, but has anybody done anything about variants on APS: Metal? I know of APS: Mercury, but what about specifying a type of metal one changes into....or at least assuming some of the characteristics of the chosen metal, incorporated into the super-metal of which the superbeing is composed...

For instance trading weight and some SDC/MDC to assume Aluminum form, or sacrificing some durability for supernatural killing ability as a Silver? Or adding weight for the thermal resistance of Lead?

APS: Metal applies for all Metal forms. the only reason Mercury needed it's own is because it's a liquid and not solid metal.

but APS: metal (Steel) has the same stats as APS: Metal (copper)
In your opinion anyways.Nekira, you arent the final answer when it comes to this stuff.

Anyways, I like the idea of varient metals to be "Altered" into. I believe there was a thread on this in the past.

So tell me then. what's the DEFALT metal when you pick "APS: Metal"?

it never says. that leads me to beleive it covers all of them.
Yes in general it does cover all of them, but if one wanted to be more specific and capture the elements of specfic elements into their heroes/ villains form, then there is definately room to expand the APS: Metal concept.

howso? it seems to cover all bases as it is.

Posted: **Tue Sep 12, 2006 9:54 am**

THIS is what I am talking about. Yes be creative. Don't make a whole new power. Lead will have different properties than gold and different than steel. What those differences might be you need to work out

Posted: **Thu Sep 14, 2006 5:02 am**

The Deific NMI wrote:Anyways, I like the idea of varient metals to be "Altered" into. I believe there was a thread on this in the past.

There was, it was a six page monster thread, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY back in the day.

The gist of the thread was that one takes APS metal and mixes in other powers that fit with the concept. For example APS Metal/Copper might have electricty type powers mixed to the character. Or Mercury would have APS Water combined in for some kind of hybrid power. It would take a bit of book work for the GM and the player to come out with the exacts, but it can be alot of fun.

Posted: **Thu Sep 14, 2006 4:38 pm**

The Baron vonClogg wrote:I love mixing in Minor Powers to add flavor, but having a little bit of flavor for the base APS powers can save the need for umpteen other APS powers.

I can see an APS:Gold character that has circuitry type powers and selects Machine Merge, EE: ElectricalField.... He could have a deific friend with APS:Gold augmented by Divine Aura, a miner-49er buddy with APS:Gold and CEF:Earth, and a girlfriend with APS:Gold and Gem Control. It would be a shame if they all had to blow additional powers on making themselves shiny.

you know, in regard to looking like gold, i generally rule that with aps and matter expulsion of metal and stone, the player can just say that's what form it takes (visual properties only). that's the same with any power a player wants to make a cosmetic change to that effects game play very little. especially when said power doesn't get specific about colors, etc.
any additional abilities, bonuses, or effects beyond cosmetic can be paid for by spending minor or major powers (or unusual characteristics if available). Otherwise, why not have a major power that can do anything? A major power that has benefits of 2 or three other powers is more than major.
that being said, more powers (aps included, even if derivative) are always appreciated (especially if in published books).

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 2:26 am**

I went to school for welding and , well , from a welders stand point and from classes of electricity , almost all non ferrous metals are really exceptional for electronics and conducting electricity , the low iron content , and in some case almost complete lack their of , prevents corrosion and makes it harder for these metals to become magnetized,which is essential in making good quality devices and machines , after all we all know from the early days of computers what a small magnet could do to your computer or screen if it got to close, imagine what would happen if over time some of the wiring itself became magnetized,but then again some devices basic functions or concept's must have a magnet,which is where you see people jumping from copper onto gold simply cause the extra protection is needed. P.S. while non ferrous metals are not supposed to contain any iron in them at all,the sad fact of the matter I realized growing up around welding and smelting (melting of metal down) revealed that most manufactures liked using lesser forms , ie impure metals, subtle alloys to cheapen cost,after all,if you add some steel into the copper being smelted then your increasing the amount of the so called copper and since your melting them together no one else is going to find out and you just increased your profit margin , half the time the only person who can figure this out is those person who either know how to or have access to smelting equipment or person's.......and one more thing , Non-ferrous generally speaking have low melting points , chalk it up to the low iron content , so for me it is hard to beleave that a metal can be non magnetic and highly reistant to fire , except those that are already in a liquid state like mercury.........and this post was just way to infomercial for my taste.....I am done babbling and will shut up now. :shock:

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 12:01 pm**

Actually i was just telling everyone from a person's stand point who has grown up with metal fabricating and all of it's process and schooling in response to the good barons post on the variants and modifications of aps:metal , I like his rendition , in fact i copy paste it into a notepad file and saved it , but knowing that some would just look at it and think they could use it to get invulnerability dang near just by lowering their sdc , and if a gm let's them then fine , it's his game , new metal alloy's are constantly being made or re-made due to not many people actually discussing their work , most people dabbling in smelting or metal working aren't with large corporations with scientist's to experiment on all aspects of the metals that they create , look at titanium and Tungsten they have been around for over a hundred years and within the last 20 years or so their just now starting to implement it into everyday use such as jewelry , btw , that is what I want as my wedding band , tungsten

which incase anyone was wondering would be the metal alloy variant most believable as a SUPER metal man type person with it's nigh invulnerability to heat and it's density making it one of ,if not the hardest alloy known today,as a matter of fact that is what I think they (don't quote me on it ) used on the shuttles , satellites , and space stations , or at least they better have or I will take my tax money and move to canada ,they would be stupid if they didn't use it

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 3:54 pm**

Wow. Did you know you made that entire post without using a single period? :-D

That's just awesome.

jolt

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 4:20 pm**

yeah....er....well, I figured I put too many in the last one?

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:18 pm**

darn, i thought titanium was the ultimate metal.. that's MY wedding band. happened to find one titanium wedding band in the one jewelry store we shopped in, and it fit. i want to get titanium glasses too (the frame, of course).

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:03 pm**

Hey Baron , actually Tungsten is the only metal barring a compound alloy, I hadn't thought of that mulitple hours ago when I first posted hadn't even dawn on me as usual their is always a exception , probally becuase it is used so often in mig and tig welding , if you ever see a mig/tig welding machine, look in the nozzle of the gun,that piece of metal right in the center where the argon gas is exiting around,that is tungsten,

Yukon---->titanium is still a awesome metal in it's own right,not heavy like tungnsten,which i didn't mention earlier,but a aps:tungsten person about 6ft and with the build of a 200 bld athlete would weight upwards around 1ooo blds,and titanium is so light the person's weight would only be about 400 - 450 blds,and you can always make a alloy with another highly resistant metal like vanadium ( which is found in a lot of thing actually , cheap as a chemical but it turns into a powder substance which can be smelted if memory serves ) and be completely immune to heat and dang near nuclear blast's , that is a metal I could get my hands on , if i had the money, it's a by product cause of it's commonality, I believe it is a by product of processing oil , just like arsonic is a by product of processing gold , if any of you live in the bay area here in california,it's (Vanadium)the white mound out at Tosco , you see it getting transported in trucks to ToscO metal works in Antioch , you mix that with tungsten though...what's kryptonite? although titanium and Vanadium is still much lighter and used as skins on aircraft's according to my cousin's (HI DON< he's a mp),that ultra sheer metal that is light weight but tough , although knowing a lot about this subject does tend to ruin certain movies where normal bullets just rip right through airplanes as if made of aluminum,the newer aircraft,not the older ones.........man do I babble about this,but hey, I see it as damn near my only time to shine.....heh.<----look a period. oh yeah Yukon,here ya go. http://www.titaniumkay.com/Tungsten-Car ... 02265.html

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:25 pm**

um , it might be easier to call a school and get a complete periodic table of elements for metals a welding school or supply store , or smelters supply store. besides if he did that , he might not get to play for a long time , he'd be too busy,off the top of my head their are close to, I would have to say about a hundred different combinations. Any other welders in the forum want to back me up on this? has it increased? Actually on second thought it could seem like a endless list if you count all the different chemicals , metals , and the different portions that could be added together. look at brass and and Bronze both different portions of copper and tin and a little to zinc , to completely different metal's,now add vanadium instead of zinc...and mix the two metals together and...you get the picture?

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:40 pm**

TJ_1976 wrote:um , it might be easier to call a school and get a complete periodic table of elements for metals a welding school or supply store , or smelters supply store. besides if he did that , he might not get to play for a long time , he'd be too busy,off the top of my head their are close to, i'd have to say about a hundred different combinations. Any other welders in the forum wanna back me up on this? has it increased? Actually on second thought it could seem like a endless list if you count all the different chemicals , metals , iand the different portions that could be added together.

maybe that's why something like baron's trading-for-sdc/ar solution would be best, then you could have the ingredients to make a alloy or composite of one's own choosing out of the near limitless options. that way, each player/gm can do his own research as to what metal has which properties. or they can create their own pretend metal.

Posted: **Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:44 pm**

yeah....knew their was a reason I like that chart but as a normal rule though normally their is already a trade off,tungsten ,yes again about tungsten, is the best one for all the above, but the weight , i would say cut the speed at in half on that one,or that your ps has to be at least twice as high as spd.

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Variants on APS Metal?

Variants on APS Metal?

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ummm