whats with "MANHUNTERS"

[jade von delioch]

so whats with manhunters.. i know its a rifts based rpg thats seperate from the normal megaverse, but it only had the core book that was printed by a different printing company.... so what happened to it, why is it not in the catalog?

[GreenGhost]

I've heard some people saying that theydidn't like it. I got it when it first came out. I like it

[drewkitty ~..~]

Has it, yah it was bad, they didn't get their OCC concepts and Race's writen correctly. They use a good bit of Copy&Paste for the Magic & Psi OCCs. Typos everywhere. Basicly they didn't edit the book to find the stuff that needed fixing.

[drewkitty ~..~]

Has it, yah it was bad, they didn't get their OCC concepts and Race's writen correctly. They use a good bit of Copy&Paste for the Magic & Psi OCCs. Typos everywhere. Basicly they didn't edit the book to find the stuff that needed fixing.

Yes, and that separates them from an authentic Palladium book how?

Was getting into specifices what was wronge with the book....Its an Ok sourcebooks...as long as you reamber anything in it might need some tweeks.

[Kesslan]

Well Manhunter is actually quite well balanced at least within its own setting. Though yes, it does get horribly skewed once you say.. import it to Phaseworld. This is especially true of the spaceships, which if you compare the mass-mdc values alone makes them incredibly primitive.

Yet the Manhunter robots scale quite well as their about on par with FCBs, Robots and PA.

Also I'm not so sure I understand what Drewkitty means by them not having their races written correctly. They presented them in a different layout sure enough but to me they seem otherwise as well done as any race to be found in a Palladium book.

The only major difference between it as a 'core book' vs other Palladium core books is that it automatically assumes you have the RMB or some similar book as it doesnt provide you with the core skill lists etc. It adds a few (for the time or setting) 'new' skills but thats about it.

The OCCs are also relatively ok. Sure there some balance issues etc, but then thats really the problem of -all- OCC/RCCs in Palladium (In general). There's no real baseline on starting skills vs skills that get aquired as time goes on, and many OCCs are missing skills that are actually vital to what the OCC is supposed to do. Such as various pilot oriented OCCs missing basics such as read sensory instruments, or in other cases navigational skills etc.

[Nekira Sudacne]

It's a great book.

My main problem with it is that they converted what was obviously origionally a standard-damage system to MDC.


How exsactly is the bloodletter suppsoed to be relevant when only one race has can use MDC swords?

[Rayven]

Also I'm not so sure I understand what Drewkitty means by them not having their races written correctly. They presented them in a different layout sure enough but to me they seem otherwise as well done as any race to be found in a Palladium book.

Yeah, and the race descriptions in the Rifts: Manhunter are almost identical to those in the Myrmidon version (which I seem to be the only person to have).

[Kesslan]

How exsactly is the bloodletter suppsoed to be relevant when only one race has can use MDC swords?

Well given that so much of the book assumes your using stuff out of the RMB and other rifts books (At least on the rules/skill list side etc) then I would simply also assume that they use asorted vibroblades.

The damage remains on par with other melee weapons so I dont see how thats a bad option.

Its a pitty there was the falling out between the two companies as personally, I'd have loved to have seen more.

[Rayven]

How exsactly is the bloodletter suppsoed to be relevant when only one race has can use MDC swords?

Well given that so much of the book assumes your using stuff out of the RMB and other rifts books (At least on the rules/skill list side etc) then I would simply also assume that they use asorted vibroblades.

The damage remains on par with other melee weapons so I dont see how thats a bad option.

Its a pitty there was the falling out between the two companies as personally, I'd have loved to have seen more.

Even on the Myrmidon side, there's not much more. The company went under shortly after the crossover. There was only ever on sourcebook (called Into the Bloodhood) for the Myrmidon game. It has some interesting info in it, but nothing as far as weaponry that could apply in the Palladium version.

[Kesslan]

Even on the Myrmidon side, there's not much more. The company went under shortly after the crossover. There was only ever on sourcebook (called Into the Bloodhood) for the Myrmidon game. It has some interesting info in it, but nothing as far as weaponry that could apply in the Palladium version.

Eh it's not so much the weaponry, though some of that was neat. More the setting. Reminds me of the eh.. darn whats that book series again. Berserker or something?

Same basic premise. Machines bent on killing all life kinda thing that were once designed by one race to wipe out another, then evnetually turned on it's creators. Except it gets even more twisted as the machines start using time travel to try to wipe out the competition and the resistance winds up having to resort to a sort of chess game and what not to counter them. Sorta like terminator but more complex and on some sorta different basis. I think it spaned interdimensionally as well.


I dont quite recall it all, odd series but still decent for the most part.

[GreenGhost]

It's a great book.

My main problem with it is that they converted what was obviously origionally a standard-damage system to MDC.


How exsactly is the bloodletter suppsoed to be relevant when only one race has can use MDC swords?

Like I said before- I really like the book, but I do see what you mean about the weapons.

[Warwolf]

I've heard some people saying that theydidn't like it. I got it when it first came out. I like it

It definately reeks of awesomeness.

So that's why you jumped all over the chance to play my Open House game.

Speaking of which, you'll get a PM shortly.

I enjoyed the setting greatly, but a fair amount of work has to be done to bring it in line with current PB stuff (I should know, I'm having to do it to run my Open House game ).

[Kesslan]

You are correct in thinking of the Beserker series by Saberhagen. However it was not the Resistance that also went back in time but goverment agents attempting to stop the Berserker agents. IIRC.

Ah yeah thanks. Read em so long ago its hard to remember. I think I have one or two of them in storage somewhere. As for the agents vs resistance thing. I think it was abit of both. At one point it was governmetn agencies, then it was resistance as the berserkers got near to winning, then I think something happend to the berserkers, humanity got a chance to recover etc and then it basically started all over again.

If I recall, it was somethin glike berserkers using conventional means of travel. (Governmetn)

Berserkers start using time/space travel and decimate the oposition (resistance figgures out how to fight them)

Then back to goverment after something happens to the Berserkers.I do recall at some point at least, there were some folk on one of the Berserker spaceships, yet at another point the war was being fought almost entirely by these teleported agents.

My recolection on the whole thing though is quite fuzzy however.

[jade von delioch]

to be fair, alot of the older stuff would not need to be fixed if they didn't go over board with making all the new stuff for rifts super powered and on the same line as a cosmic knight...(munchkin-power gamer stuff.)

[drewkitty ~..~]

So it falls right in line with every other Palladium title. It just had a different publisher. Personally, I found scant tweaks necessary.

If you concider that their PSI tracker is said to be able to track someone worlds away and the stats are just copy and pasted out of the Mystic and LLW stats (which cotradict each other in places) and that the Kirn's enchanted swords can be activated by like 20 PPE...but the Kirn's stats don't let them have enouph PPE to activate the swords....then there is the plastisin armor that is talked about through out the OCC section but doesn't have any stats.

A few tweeks/edits like that. Most PB books don't have glaring stuff like that (except for the rift china books, *burn them in effrigy*)

[Kesslan]

So it falls right in line with every other Palladium title. It just had a different publisher. Personally, I found scant tweaks necessary.

If you concider that their PSI tracker is said to be able to track someone worlds away and the stats are just copy and pasted out of the Mystic and LLW stats (which cotradict each other in places) and that the Kirn's enchanted swords can be activated by like 20 PPE...but the Kirn's stats don't let them have enouph PPE to activate the swords....then there is the plastisin armor that is talked about through out the OCC section but doesn't have any stats.

A few tweeks/edits like that. Most PB books don't have glaring stuff like that (except for the rift china books, *burn them in effrigy*)

Actualy your just mixing up ISP and PPE costs as they can use either.

Ex: The broad sword requires 15PPE or 30 ISP, regular blade requires 10 PPE or 20 ISP.

The only real odditiy is that other than apparently following identical rules to TW weapons (Where ISP can be used to charge/use them at a 2:1 cost) is that they can apparently 'only' be used by Kirin in such a way. As far as such things go their in line with the damage and PPE/ISP cost of most other TW weapons around.

As for the seekers yes, they do contradict each other due to the wonders of cut and paste: One line says they only get 2d4 PPE, but on the next page it says they get 1d6X10+PE and 2d6 per level etc.

Thats a touch more glaring than some palladium C&Ps, but Palaldium has had it's fair

Cyberknight

share of messups too.

[Warwolf]

...then there is the plastisin armor that is talked about through out the OCC section but doesn't have any stats.

That is actually in "Into the Bloodhood", but never made it into the Palladium version.

[jade von delioch]

to be fair, alot of the older stuff would not need to be fixed if they didn't go over board with making all the new stuff for rifts super powered and on the same line as a cosmic knight...(munchkin-power gamer stuff.)

That is the tip of the iceberg in terms of fixing continuity and editing errors when compared to RUE.

it may seem like the tip, but the majority of what needs to be fixed is due inpart because of those munchkin-power gamer OOCs, weapons, armor, and magic.. i love rifts but ........ i never let players in my games play those OOCs.
the majority of the "need to be fixed tends to be only for rifts from what i have seen.(as for HU i would not have a great idea but it can't be as bad as rifts is.) theres like 3 books for Palladium fantasy that need fixed in that is just because they were first made back in first edition; all the other books are 2nd edition...

[Warwolf]

it may seem like the tip, but the majority of what needs to be fixed is due inpart because of those munchkin-power gamer OOCs, weapons, armor, and magic.. i love rifts but ........ i never let players in my games play those OOCs.
the majority of the "need to be fixed tends to be only for rifts from what i have seen.(as for HU i would not have a great idea but it can't be as bad as rifts is.) theres like 3 books for Palladium fantasy that need fixed in that is just because they were first made back in first edition; all the other books are 2nd edition...

That may be your opinion, but in my experience it is the GM that sets the power level of his games, not what classes the players choose (for the most part) or the spells and equipment in the books (have you ever heard of limited availability?).

[Rimmer]

Just in case anyone is interested, i know of a store in New Zealand that has about a dozen copies sitting in the "bargain bin" a store called "Vagabonds" in Auckland.

[drewkitty ~..~]

Actualy your just mixing up ISP and PPE costs as they can use either.

Ex: The broad sword requires 15PPE or 30 ISP, regular blade requires 10 PPE or 20 ISP.

The only real odditiy is that other than apparently following identical rules to TW weapons (Where ISP can be used to charge/use them at a 2:1 cost) is that they can apparently 'only' be used by Kirin in such a way. As far as such things go their in line with the damage and PPE/ISP cost of most other TW weapons around.

...snip

Sence they don't list a standard amount of PPE each Kirn has...you woul dhave to assume that they get the standard roll of 2d6 which leaves most kirn with too little PPE to use the blades.

[Kesslan]

Actualy your just mixing up ISP and PPE costs as they can use either.

Ex: The broad sword requires 15PPE or 30 ISP, regular blade requires 10 PPE or 20 ISP.

The only real odditiy is that other than apparently following identical rules to TW weapons (Where ISP can be used to charge/use them at a 2:1 cost) is that they can apparently 'only' be used by Kirin in such a way. As far as such things go their in line with the damage and PPE/ISP cost of most other TW weapons around.

...snip

Sence they don't list a standard amount of PPE each Kirn has...you woul dhave to assume that they get the standard roll of 2d6 which leaves most kirn with too little PPE to use the blades.

True, which is one.. strange limitation over the blades in general beyond the also racial limitation. But they can get around that the same way any other class gets around PPE/ISP limitations.

They simply take an OCC that in some way channels said powers. Technically even though it's sort of an RCC of itself they could be... a mind melter or something. But that's a whole other beast.

There may well be a reason for it however. If the actual intention is that -all- kirin can use said blades, then yes. If however one needs some sort of 'special training' then it likely would fit.

They dont really go into too many specifics about it. And it looks, by the discription of the blades, they forgot some rather important information about the Kirin in general.

If you read the entry on the blades. It basically suggests they all (or at least all that use said blades) have 'mystic powers'.

Yet the RCC presents none of this. It also may be because the ISP/PPE cost is representing soley of the human made knockoffs of the blades. But thats just conjecture.

I think the only other book where I've seen such bizare oddities is the NE Wave 2 book. Especialy when dealing with the assorted 'multi weapons'.

In the end, I dont personally consider it a major flaw. It's easily something I'd chalk up to unfamiliarity with the palladium system. Which on it's own can be quite contradictory and confusing.

[jade von delioch]

it may seem like the tip, but the majority of what needs to be fixed is due inpart because of those munchkin-power gamer OOCs, weapons, armor, and magic.. i love rifts but ........ i never let players in my games play those OOCs.
the majority of the "need to be fixed tends to be only for rifts from what i have seen.(as for HU i would not have a great idea but it can't be as bad as rifts is.) theres like 3 books for Palladium fantasy that need fixed in that is just because they were first made back in first edition; all the other books are 2nd edition...

That may be your opinion, but in my experience it is the GM that sets the power level of his games, not what classes the players choose (for the most part) or the spells and equipment in the books (have you ever heard of limited availability?).

true, but i was not speaking about it as a case by case situation. i was talking about the rifts as a whole and why they feel the need to fix all the older stuff with the help of RUE. if you had read the all the post you would have seen this.
i understand that a GM can, and typically does, limit what the players play.. i do it myself by not allowing anything to be played from any of the phase world books.

[Warwolf]

it may seem like the tip, but the majority of what needs to be fixed is due inpart because of those munchkin-power gamer OOCs, weapons, armor, and magic.. i love rifts but ........ i never let players in my games play those OOCs.
the majority of the "need to be fixed tends to be only for rifts from what i have seen.(as for HU i would not have a great idea but it can't be as bad as rifts is.) theres like 3 books for Palladium fantasy that need fixed in that is just because they were first made back in first edition; all the other books are 2nd edition...

That may be your opinion, but in my experience it is the GM that sets the power level of his games, not what classes the players choose (for the most part) or the spells and equipment in the books (have you ever heard of limited availability?).

true, but i was not speaking about it as a case by case situation. i was talking about the rifts as a whole and why they feel the need to fix all the older stuff with the help of RUE. if you had read the all the post you would have seen this.
i understand that a GM can, and typically does, limit what the players play.. i do it myself by not allowing anything to be played from any of the phase world books.

I was referring to the fact that you made specific mention of "munchkin-power gamer O.C.C.'s, equipment, and magic".

I am simply contending that there aren't very many of those present in Palladium books, but rather the problem is that GM's allow things to get out of hand and let (or even encourage) their players to run buck-wild with what is not intended for such applications.

[jade von delioch]

i would if i was not to busy with my own game system.

[Marcethus]

Personally I love the Manhunter RPG its great there are some lil bugs (Like the speeds that the space ships use and others such things that have been covered already in this thread) I do think it would be a great idea if PB approved (or mods at least) that we could work on correcting the glaring issues in the book. But I think Myrmidon never released the license to PB when they did the game so I doubt that it will ever be allowed to happen.

[Nekira Sudacne]

Can anyone recommend an easy way of updating the Martial Dragon OCC from Manhunter to something more in keeping with current Rifts rules?
It's based solely on race-specific martial arts hth styles...and yet is sadly lacking when compared to the 'generic' martial arts hth skill.
Perhaps simply upping the starting number of attacks to 4 as a start...or lowering everyone else's to two might even be better...but I'd love some help if anyone's so inclined.
I'd like to start with the Ular, as that's the only PC in my game that is making use of that skill.

Or...is there perhaps a pure Martial Artist OCC in another book that might be more up to date?

Thanks in advance!

*snerk* just make 'em Oni Ninja's from Phase World Sorcebook!

[drewkitty ~..~]

Would it be 'kosher' or acceptable for fans of the Manhunter setting to use these forums to start 'fixing' the book and/or expanding on what's been established?
The book has such potential...and yet a quick jaunt around the interwebs shows very little being done with it.


If it's not something that makes Palladium Books shiver with distaste, is anyone interested in working on such a thing?

That you use this site for your postings, No, while it is a *blech* Rifts book, the books it was converted from are copywrited by another company, by that same said company. So I would point out that you risk perm banning posting any copywrited matiriale here. Read the rules of the board to get the specifices.

While I would love to see that book brought up to PB quality, doing so would be a bird's nest of tangles and headaches.

[AzathothXy]

to be fair, alot of the older stuff would not need to be fixed if they didn't go over board with making all the new stuff for rifts super powered and on the same line as a cosmic knight...(munchkin-power gamer stuff.)

Meh. The Mulkas would own the Cosmo Knights.

[FreelancerMar]

The Only reason I got the palladium version as opposed to the "Origional" Versions is because I saw no need to learn a completely new RPG Rules system at the time. All I needed to do is drop the PC's into the new enviornment and hit the ground running so to speak.

[drewkitty ~..~]

I got the Origanal manhunter books thinking I could fix stuff and fill in missing data.
Waste of $$$.

[TechnoGothic]

I use the manhunters rather than the mechaniods for many reason

AM I the only person here to own COSMIC ENFORCERS and its sourcebook ??
and would love to see it done in Palladium's system.

[NMI]

I use the manhunters rather than the mechaniods for many reason

AM I the only person here to own COSMIC ENFORCERS and its sourcebook ??
and would love to see it done in Palladium's system.

No you are not the only person
Actually Myrimiddon had put out quite a few books before crashing. I have quite a few.

[NMI]

I can never find the Cosmic Enforcers from myrmidon, i only find the original which isn't as cool as I really wanted to use it and villains and foes ..

Cosmic Enforcers

[jade von delioch]

Cosmic enforcer was interesting. I saw it at a used book store once and flipped through it. Interesting concept of having superheroes in a space opera setting. Kind of a green lantern or justice league type of idea. But i like my heroes more down to earth i think.

[Warwolf]

That you use this site for your postings, No, while it is a *blech* Rifts book, the books it was converted from are copywrited by another company, by that same said company. So I would point out that you risk perm banning posting any copywrited matiriale here. Read the rules of the board to get the specifices.

And if no such materials were recopied?
Would it not be the same as, for example, the community doing a thread on 'converting Jedi for Rifts' or 'Warhammer 40K, Rifts style' or the like?

You can't do anything with it here. Myrmidion effectively licensed their setting to Palladium IIRC so they could do a version with the Palladium rules set. I would guarantee that Palladium no longer holds that license, and can thus not have anything to do with any new material that was derivative of that work. It's the same reason why we couldn't go about making a TMNT 2nd Ed. on these boards.

Now, you could start something up elsewhere... as long as you didn't profit from it.