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Has anyone had someone play (or themselves played) a malvoren( from D-bees of North America) in a campaign. These guys look great on paper; I was wondering how well they worked in actual play.

Captain Shiva wrote:Has anyone had someone play (or themselves played) a malvoren( from D-bees of North America) in a campaign. These guys look great on paper; I was wondering how well they worked in actual play.

As they are pretty flippin' new, I doubt many have had the chance to yet. Heck, I just got finished reading them, and they will probably be on my "initially restricted" list. I love the concept, but GM's will have to keep a watchful eye on their players to make sure they aren't hijacked by munchkins.

Two things I'd do to keep them under control; A. Where it says after bonding with a weapon, they can use it six level higher than their current level, I would rule that as level of proficiency with the actual weapon,not their character level.So if you were a 5th level malvoren, and took WP energy rifle at 1st level, bonding would give you 11th level proficiency. If you had no WP for a bonded weapon, you would use it at 6th level proficiency. B. Strictly enforce the no magic rule.

Captain Shiva wrote:Two things I'd do to keep them under control; A. Where it says after bonding with a weapon, they can use it six level higher than their current level, I would rule that as level of proficiency with the actual weapon,not their character level.So if you were a 5th level malvoren, and took WP energy rifle at 1st level, bonding would give you 11th level proficiency. If you had no WP for a bonded weapon, you would use it at 6th level proficiency. B. Strictly enforce the no magic rule.

I dunno, why do they need balancing?

Using a weapon at "6 levels above your own" is what, an additional +3 to strike/Parry?

An additional +3 to strike, which means he hits an additional 15% of the time, doesn't seem to me to be that overpowering of an ability. Is there more to it somewhere? Additional melee attacks? More Dodging? More crits? Something in addition to just a possible +3?

I just wanted to plug up that particular munchkin loophole.

Captain Shiva wrote:I just wanted to plug up that particular munchkin loophole.

Doesn't seem so much of a 'loophole' as a 'way for characters, through exhaustive amount of work, and a large amount of time, to get an additional +3 strike/parry'.

If the player goes to all that work to get the character to 5th level just so he can start his WP's at 11th level.... Let him! He'll feel clever, all he'll get is maybe a +3 or so. you as the GM wont even have to re-scale the encounters, everybody wins!

It's the sad truth of Palladium weapon proficiencies, levels just plain don't matter much. At least in the old edition, and I don't think they changed it much in RUE. If, for example, the weapon is a chain, getting six levels sometimes only gets you +1, and getting it at TWELVE levels above gets you a +3.... and considering the work you need to do to get to those 12 levels..... +3 is kind of comedically light.

No self-respecting munchkin would go that route, the cost benefit analysis is way off. But Nerfing players even before a problem is detected... they hate that!

I just am not real comfortable with the idea of someone picking up a weapon they have no training with, a suddenly being able to use it at 11th level.
.

Just rolled one up, I'll let ya know after I give him a spin (starting at level 2).

Warwolf wrote:

Captain Shiva wrote:Has anyone had someone play (or themselves played) a malvoren( from D-bees of North America) in a campaign. These guys look great on paper; I was wondering how well they worked in actual play.

As they are pretty flippin' new, I doubt many have had the chance to yet. Heck, I just got finished reading them, and they will probably be on my "initially restricted" list. I love the concept, but GM's will have to keep a watchful eye on their players to make sure they aren't hijacked by munchkins.

Make gunfighters out of them. what is the PP? nevermind ill look it up 3d6+4, cool. Definatly a gunfighter from phase world using NE4 plasma cartridge pistols, paired. Giddy up.

Shadow_otm wrote:

Greyaxe wrote:

Warwolf wrote:

Captain Shiva wrote:Has anyone had someone play (or themselves played) a malvoren( from D-bees of North America) in a campaign. These guys look great on paper; I was wondering how well they worked in actual play.

As they are pretty flippin' new, I doubt many have had the chance to yet. Heck, I just got finished reading them, and they will probably be on my "initially restricted" list. I love the concept, but GM's will have to keep a watchful eye on their players to make sure they aren't hijacked by munchkins.

Make gunfighters out of them. what is the PP? nevermind ill look it up 3d6+4, cool. Definatly a gunfighter from phase world using NE4 plasma cartridge pistols, paired. Giddy up.

I thought PP bonus didn't effect strike with firearms.

It does with the sharpshooting skills of a gunfighter, so not only do you have the natural bonuses of the RCC but the PP bonuses and extra attacks of the sharpshooting skill as well. VERY munchkin...in going to make one.

bear in mind that the only real weakness they have (besides being a popular slave race) is having nothing whatsoever to protect them from improved invisibility.

Can't select an OCC (gunfighter) with Malvoren RCC. Unless ya wanna do a little, ahem, rule bending.

The one I rolled is by the book, so RCC Skill set only. He should be making his debut this Saturday.

<grumblingly gets up off the couch, lurching toward bathroom, cursing bob's name for making me move>

DBoNA page 142
Available O.C.C.s: None; a Malvoren does not get to choose an OCC and must instead rely on RCC skills and natural abilities.

When you say they have no protection against improved invisibility(I assume that what you actually mean is the spell, Inivisibility:Superior,) you mean other than the fact that they can chose " See The Invisible " as one of their psychic powers.

Captain Shiva wrote:When you say they have no protection against improved invisibility(I assume that what you actually mean is the spell, Inivisibility:Superior,) you mean other than the fact that they can chose " See The Invisible " as one of their psychic powers.

Or Sixth Sense

asajosh wrote:<grumblingly gets up off the couch, lurching toward bathroom, cursing bob's name for making me move>

DBoNA page 142
Available O.C.C.s: None; a Malvoren does not get to choose an OCC and must instead rely on RCC skills and natural abilities.

Bad Josh, you hurt me you hurt me deep....


SO much for my munchkin gunfighter...sob...


I was hoping for a Gunfighter armed with an NE75H Shoulder cannon wil plus whatever to strike. He wait a min. they start with 6 WP of choice, no reason they couldn't take sharpshooting as a couple of those WP's. Yea my munchkin is back on, giddy up. New west books here I come...

Greyaxe wrote:

asajosh wrote:<grumblingly gets up off the couch, lurching toward bathroom, cursing bob's name for making me move>

DBoNA page 142
Available O.C.C.s: None; a Malvoren does not get to choose an OCC and must instead rely on RCC skills and natural abilities.

Bad Josh, you hurt me you hurt me deep....


SO much for my munchkin gunfighter...sob...


I was hoping for a Gunfighter armed with an NE75H Shoulder cannon wil plus whatever to strike. He wait a min. they start with 6 WP of choice, no reason they couldn't take sharpshooting as a couple of those WP's. Yea my munchkin is back on, giddy up. New west books here I come...

*sigh* And the hijacking begins...

Warwolf wrote:

Greyaxe wrote:

asajosh wrote:<grumblingly gets up off the couch, lurching toward bathroom, cursing bob's name for making me move>

DBoNA page 142
Available O.C.C.s: None; a Malvoren does not get to choose an OCC and must instead rely on RCC skills and natural abilities.

Bad Josh, you hurt me you hurt me deep....


SO much for my munchkin gunfighter...sob...


I was hoping for a Gunfighter armed with an NE75H Shoulder cannon wil plus whatever to strike. He wait a min. they start with 6 WP of choice, no reason they couldn't take sharpshooting as a couple of those WP's. Yea my munchkin is back on, giddy up. New west books here I come...

*sigh* And the hijacking begins...

At least it is related Hijacking, how to make a munchkin from a malvoren.

I think the character will be really cool. Ill post my experience if the GM approves it.

Hmm, how to make a Malvoren Munchkin...
Forced bio-wizard augment comes to mind, for the MDC conversion and a few choice symbiotes.

bob the desolate one wrote:heres one from the munchkin master!
a malvoren bounty hunters ship is crippled and strays into the charlzon system captured by the tarlok and put through genetic experimentation and turned into a malvoren bio freak

skraypers pg 81
any race put through tarlok genetic experimentation can be turned into a bio freak if they survive

If they survive, THEN comes the force bio-wizardry right? RIGHT?!

asajosh wrote:

bob the desolate one wrote:heres one from the munchkin master!
a malvoren bounty hunters ship is crippled and strays into the charlzon system captured by the tarlok and put through genetic experimentation and turned into a malvoren bio freak

skraypers pg 81
any race put through tarlok genetic experimentation can be turned into a bio freak if they survive

If they survive, THEN comes the force bio-wizardry right? RIGHT?!

I wonder if they can learn magic as well following the bio wizardry.

Sorry axe, they dislike and distrust magic, won't enve use a TW weapon in a life or death situation. Thats why I was thinking the bio-wiz augmentation would have to be forced.

I suppose an absur life node would be cool.

Sheesh, why are you going to all these extremes?

For one, they can just hop into a suit of power armor and pilot it at 6 levels higher with the elite combat skill for that Power Armor.


For the most part that kind of insane firepower wouldn't be needed, but you can instead just Fire-Link a handful of weapons melded to the Malvoren. For a simple example, use a shoulder ion cannon(3d6md), a forearm ion cannon(3d6md), and say a heavy plasma cannon(1d6x10). Tada, 16d6 MD from a single attack.

Thats using a bunch of weak weapons, I don't remember if it says you can only link one weapon to your hand/arm either. You could just meld to three rifles and blast away.


The other thing it doesn't specify is a limit on how much of the Malvoren must remain organic; whats to stop you from ripping out the brains and internal organs from a Russian Shocktrooper and taking over his heavy frame, or at least the legs and torso leaving the arms free to meld to a gang of weapons.

Im not going to any extremes, it was a joke, hence the little smiley devils hehe.
And I don't think that say a slave malvoren who had some bio-wiz work done would necessarily turn into a suicide case. They may get sad and depressed (the rarity of other Malvoren on rifts Earth would make it pretty unlikely that the augment would be hunted down in any organized fashion), but suicide is pretty extreme. They do have a healing factor so whats to stop a malvoren modified against his will from say, cutting the symbiote out and hoping not to die before he can regen?
I've said it before and I'll say it again: This is my first time running a Malvoren and I'm sticking to the write-up as closely as I can to see how they work. Starting him out later this morning as a matter of fact, so you'll have a report here later today.

Ran my malvoren today.
In public he wears full body armor (melded with it). so he appears to be a strange robot or FCB. That's generally the way he wants to keep it.
Got a couple magic users in the party, so he's a little stand-offish with them. Not hostile just curt and professional. One of them is friendly enough (principled) and the other is a bit of a nuicence (Fairy Bot D-Bee who keeps fliting around me, trying to see "how I work"). Stun blaster in the hands have convinced him to keep his distance.
The biggest personality confilct with me and the party (im aberrant) came when we had to cut down a horde of SDC hostiles (we are mercs employed by Kingsdale). Well as we burned thru the SDC humans (Dopplegangers from nightlands), their human counterparts started re-appearing from the nightlands. Well as a player I know whats going on, but my Malvoern is totally ignorant of magic and dislikes it. So when he sees another group of humans identical to the ones hes mowing down suddenly start appearing around him, he takes them as hostile (no sense evil or any other means to see they are not hostile), so he burns almost all of them down. Gets dirty looks and remarks from the other PCs. Oh well, they looked like targets to me. Thats not an understatement, they seriously looked like a threat to the Malvoren. Oh well, no real harm done. I tried to appologize to the survivors (3 out of 20) by giving them a cred chip with my entire fortune on it (250k credits). What else can I do? Can't raise the dead... not like I did it for fun or took any joy in it. Can't teach a hammer to feel sorry for nails!

Other then that, Malvoern's are walking gun platforms, as expected. More of a tool of war then a soldier. I think he can be a fun character. In combat he's top notch, but has some social problems, hehe

obtusehobbit wrote:The malvoren is like most non magic sdc characters on rifts earth. It is all a matter of there equipment. While the malvoren is an expert when it comes to using the equipment without good equipment the character is just as bad off as any other.

If he should lose his gear then its time for quick thinking! The ability to bond with a full suit of armor costs only a little PPE, takes little time, and has a long duration. Essentially, the only way to force him outta his armor is to kill him, then the point of losing it is moot

bob the desolate one wrote:

asajosh wrote:

obtusehobbit wrote:The malvoren is like most non magic sdc characters on rifts earth. It is all a matter of there equipment. While the malvoren is an expert when it comes to using the equipment without good equipment the character is just as bad off as any other.

If he should lose his gear then its time for quick thinking! The ability to bond with a full suit of armor costs only a little PPE, takes little time, and has a long duration. Essentially, the only way to force him outta his armor is to kill him, then the point of losing it is moot

only way to get them out of their armor is to kill them
dont they poop?

No one on rift poops that is why they have sucha short lifespan.

Well, yes, they are mortal beings so they need to breathe, eat, sleep, etc. This is one of the reasons he requests private quarters during "in-town" time. I'm working on a way around this complication.

Removable crotch plate!

Not in battle Silly Man!

bob the desolate one wrote: i dont think it would but if they were really tech laden then it might have negative or unwanted side effects from the biowizardys magical properties

The subject of such an experiment would surely be a slave. Which means at some point he was kidnapped (unless born into slavery). In the case of the Malvoren, this almost certainly means it was defeated in combat but not killed. Thus, the Malvoren in question would be forced to drop their equipment (knocked out, psionically or magically forced, etc). Therefore, armor/gear in the bio-wiz bathtub is not a problem.

Hmmm, Evil Brak has a point. Don't want your guns deciding to turn around and shoot at you. A Partially lobotomized and bio-wiz rebuilt Malvoren would make a cool Gunnery Computer

Evil_Brak wrote:One more interesting question thought what happens when a Gene Splicer gets it's hands on one.

Hmmm... Extra set of arms? Tail? Wings? Correct that crappy natural vision? Ceartainly the addition of more body parts should mean being able to add more gear right? hehe "Monster Malvoren"

Evil_Brak wrote:Let's not forget juicer like benefits and improved psionics maybe telemechanic possesion. (I may have my next major villain. )

Now if he started giving the Weapon linking ability to other critters that could be cool to.

Now that gives you the possibility of a gene splicer making the equivalent of a borg.

Ooh speaking of Juicers and Telemechanics...
Ran my Malvoren for chapter 2 this saturday past. My party and I had a conflict with 2 mega juicers and a titan. Getting into close quarters with one of the megas I thought it might be fun to use telemechanic possesion to over ride his drug harness and dump its contentes into his bloodstream all at once... it accelerated his burnout to seconds... essentially he exploded... muahaha! Used it again to turn the titan's harness off, but he got shot in the head before I had a chance to see what happens...