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Couldn't for the life of me remember my old login. So New name. Vision was my old tag, Connor's the name met a bunch of you guys at the first open house.

If you've seen resident evil, then you've seen what will be in my game.

I need some help fleshing it out. Just the rooms. So far the complex is massive with about 10,000 living area's between 500-1600 sq feet per, it's the other stuff I need.

I need basically a list of what you would need to support 40,000 people or more. Think of an underground vault like fallout. The entire campaign will take place down here so I need interesting rooms to fill the gaps.

Ideas?

Nomadic wrote:Couldn't for the life of me remember my old login. So New name. Vision was my old tag, Connor's the name met a bunch of you guys at the first open house.

If you've seen resident evil, then you've seen what will be in my game.

I need some help fleshing it out. Just the rooms. So far the complex is massive with about 10,000 living area's between 500-1600 sq feet per, it's the other stuff I need.

I need basically a list of what you would need to support 40,000 people or more. Think of an underground vault like fallout. The entire campaign will take place down here so I need interesting rooms to fill the gaps.

Ideas?

VAULT-DWELLER!

Heh, cool idea.....actually totally awesome. Consider yerself ripped-off.

Now for the help;

AIR! FOOD! WATER! HEAT! LIGHT! WASTE DISPOSAL!
These are what are neccessary to survive.
First and Foremost: Power. You will need a power source to keep things in this underground ark running. I'd go with an advanced, unduplicate-able fusion system - this could survive (or so you say) the entire length of the dark ages of Rifts. This provides power for everything and covers off light.


Secondly you need food. Tanks - mighty vats of algae that can be recombinated into artificial foods, much like how soy is used to make many dietary substitutions today (like soy-milk). This can also be supplimented with small "fields" or rows of pipe used to grow vegetables (you can use any vegetable you want - tomatoes, potatos, carrots, broccoli, etc... with the justification that genetic engineering has made them grow with excellent resiliency). These pipe fields can be stacked on top of each other; some hanging above others to save on space.

Meat (if any) will be a major privilage to have - most likely chicken (as they can survive best in cramped quarters). As for the "hows" of getting this underground grow-op working, you will be using recycled water with enhancers added to keep it energized with the proper minerals and bacterias. This covers food.


Next is water! And not a moment too soon! This is the easiest to account for; it is piped in from deep underground, where the precious liquid is still pure. It helps with the recycling of the growth water - as new stuff is piped in, the grow water is then cleaned and used for drinking, shower, and toilets. The advantage of pulling in deep water brings us to the next point, but so far this covers water.


The next part is heat. Underground water is very warm, and it would not be a new idea in the golden age of Rifts to use thermal heat to warm a building; we're beginning to do this now. If you've ever heard of infloor heating, tubes run your water through the complex, heating all locations efficiently as you only need a central heat source - well, in the case of an entire complex, you'll probably have several "way-stations" that the water passes through to be re-heated. This covers heat.


Then comes air. Thee most vital, you can survive indefinately without light, a month without food, days without water, hours without heat, but only minute(s - depending on your lung copacity) without air. Hidden in natural cave-complexes would be massive fans, heavily protected with grate after metal grate. This pulls in air, which would go through a complex filtration system; this system also pushes out air, as once breathed it is generally no good to us. A bit of it will be cycled through the grow-farm, but this is simply to ensure the plants themselves can breathe. This covers air.


Finally, what's all this poop doing here?! Yes, the most filthy, yet exceptionally vital (I place this ones' importance above air, myself) waste disposal. You will not believe how much crap us humans throw away - or in this case, "leave lying around", a-hem. How is this done? Simple plumbing, an incincerator, and an air vent not connected to the same cave we suck air in from. Most likely this waste is just burnt off using the reactor - simple to explain, maintain, and manage. Done - now I can get my mind out of the gutter of waste disposal.


This should cover all your basics. Each of these will need a substancial amount of room - not neccesarily in the main complex, but it needs to be accessable via ducts and maintenance passages so that it can be maintained.

If you have any other questions and such, just ask. Now, where did I put that G.E.C.K.....

First and Foremost: Power. You will need a power source to keep things in this underground ark running. I'd go with an advanced, unduplicate-able fusion system - this could survive (or so you say) the entire length of the dark ages of Rifts. This provides power for everything and covers off light.

also covers, at least in part, heat. fusion generates lots of heat, and parts of the cooling system can be redirected to heat the complex.

generally though, if it's an underground complex it'll be a stable 60-70 degrees without additional AC, like caves.

Meat (if any) will be a major privilage to have - most likely chicken (as they can survive best in cramped quarters). As for the "hows" of getting this underground grow-op working, you will be using recycled water with enhancers added to keep it energized with the proper minerals and bacterias. This covers food.

shrimp. tanks of shrimp. shrimp can be eaten on it's own, or processed with Tofu and other protein sources (beans?) to make imitation meat of any kind oyu have flavors for. you can even duplicate some of the texture. chickens are nasty, filthy animals to raise, i don't think they'd be a good idea for people in an enclosed space. shrimp just require aquariums..
likewise they'd raise fish. same principles as shrimp, just not as big of a yeild.

Then comes air. Thee most vital, you can survive indefinately without light, a month without food, days without water, hours without heat, but only minute(s - depending on your lung copacity) without air. Hidden in natural cave-complexes would be massive fans, heavily protected with grate after metal grate. This pulls in air, which would go through a complex filtration system; this system also pushes out air, as once breathed it is generally no good to us. A bit of it will be cycled through the grow-farm, but this is simply to ensure the plants themselves can breathe. This covers air.

no need to rely on outside air. combining the algea tanks and the farms, and you can easily keep the Oxygen levels at sustainable levels. in ap inch, you can crack water to extract the o2. remember, plants turn CO2 into O2. algea is your main source of O2 here. also your main facility to recycle solid and liquid wastes. just keep those tanks seperate from the algea tanks used to make food.

i'd recommend taking a gander at this page. it's for space travel, but thats what your postuating here. a completely self-contained enviroment, much a like a spaceship or space station.

Other things to consider -

1. Police Department. Someone needs to keep order. Which also brings up the question of what to do with criminals.

2. Fire Department and EMS service. Need to take care of those emergencies. Perhaps a large central hospital and then a number of dual fire station/medical clinics.

3. Entertainment. Movie theaters, bars, sports, etc

4. Education. Sounds like a hi-tech facility, so stands to reason you have something in place to educate the next generation of engineer's.

5. Government. Who's in charge here?

What tech level are we talking here? Is this something from 2008 or from a scientifically advanced time such as Star Trek with food replicators?

Replicators would solve a lot of supply issues.

If you don't want to cheese and use replicators, then everyone else seems to have covered everything I can think of.

Everyone above has done a pretty good job of covering things, so I'll just address a few other points.

Depending on length of isolation (Are we talking a matter of months or generations?), you may need fabrication capabilities for basic items such as tools, parts, clothing, etc. Otherwise, you're going to need a massive store of such items. If I were designing the facility, it would at least have a basic machine-shop for small-scale fabrication and major mechanical repairs.

A central command and control facility of course would be necessary to monitor and coordinate the functions of the complex. Include a communications network that could be as simple as echo tubes for OLD facilities or as complex as a dedicated high-speed computer network and multimedia communications capabilities for more modern to futuristic bunkers.

Something that has been overlooked so far has been transportation. If the facility is going to be as big as you are giving stats for, having some kind of integrated transportation network might be in order. Either you are going to have to go pretty far down, or spread pretty far out to house those numbers and all the required infrastructure. Obviously, if you go vertical you can simply use a large number of elevators. On the other hand, if you spread out you'll probably want to go with something like a mag-lev or other light-rail system (which would keep it in-line with a Resident Evil styled facility). Alternatively, I guess you could have 2-6 person electric vehicles the size of golf carts (or maybe even larger trams) and transportation tunnels set aside for them.

Anyway, if I come up with anything else I'll be sure to post it.

Man... I could so organize this stuff into a points-based creation system ala Ninjas & Superspies.

e_wolf wrote:

Warwolf wrote:Man... I could so organize this stuff into a points-based creation system ala Ninjas & Superspies.

Do it! It would be helpful for everyone.

Unfortunately, I've got enough projects on my plate right now. Not the least of which is developing a creation system and rule-set for a different subject that has yet to be fully and effectively tackled. Maybe in my spare time I'll see what I can do on this front, perhaps submitting it as a Rifter article. For now, though, you guys will have to rely on this thread.

Although... the gears are turning now... this won't be good for my concentration...

Back from the depths I summon thee!!!! Thank you eveyone for your help I had completly forgotten I had posted on here, and you guys have some great idea's. School got in the way and I haven't been able to work on it but now I'm free and want to keep this project alive. I'm even thinking of getting ahold of KS and seeing if we can do some RacconCityish Source for it.

Um...you need ways to expand the living space...as people will...reproduce. Which could be cool as you can get into underground dangers...and maybe come in cotact with another Vault...you could have vault wars.

Also...you could have cryo sleep units that people leap frog though time thus needing less resouces.

But another thing I can see is huge room dedicated to housing data storage...which would need to be kept cool justfying a huge fan in the vent system....ok probably not but fighting catwalks above huge fans are just cool any how.

Ah population. It's Difficult to type out without a picture, but basicly it's controlled.
This is being done from the Child In Question. IE This needs to happen in order for them to be born.

Mother has a Brother, Father has a Sister. keep this in mind. Mother and father are not related. Sister and Brother are not related. So there are a Total of 4 children in this example. But it really should be 8. Sisters-Brother, and Brothers-sister, but I think you should get the point.

GrandMother-Mother's Side Has to die for a Female to be Born.
GrandFather-Father's Side Has to die for a Male to be Born.
GrnadFather-Brothers Side has to die for His Male to be Born.
GrandMother-Sister side has to die for her female to be born.

Should I go further or do you see how this works?

I'll post a image to Help later.

Nomadic wrote:Ah population. It's Difficult to type out without a picture, but basicly it's controlled.
This is being done from the Child In Question. IE This needs to happen in order for them to be born.

Mother has a Brother, Father has a Sister. keep this in mind. Mother and father are not related. Sister and Brother are not related. So there are a Total of 4 children in this example. But it really should be 8. Sisters-Brother, and Brothers-sister, but I think you should get the point.

GrandMother-Mother's Side Has to die for a Female to be Born.
GrandFather-Father's Side Has to die for a Male to be Born.
GrnadFather-Brothers Side has to die for His Male to be Born.
GrandMother-Sister side has to die for her female to be born.

Should I go further or do you see how this works?

I'll post a image to Help later.

No I get it...though a image would be cool...
As long as you have a answeared for population growth rather it is control or expansion. It needs to be considered.

A PG rendition of the basic concept http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0970411/

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Robot or Golem laborers would reduce the air requirements. Either by not requiring an increased population for laborers or by not using more air while performing strenuous exercise.