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I use the SAMSON suits. Or Flying Titan PA (as "low-stocked" as Archie may be, you can still get these as they are the oldest and longest run PA from Archie; thus they have a large number base). Or old-style SAMAS suits (the Coalition can get as trigger-happy as they like; if they're seeing these, they're fighting them whether THEY like it or not).

Really, what else is there? That being said, every once in a while imports like the Jager or some Japanese model become available, and with Naruni's re-birth in Merctown their stuff is back on the market. As for "commonality" for the uncommon, German imports are the most available, then stolen CS and FQ armours, then some Russian stuff, Japanese suits, and finally Naruni. A point to note though on Naruni products; they are unavailable outside of Merctown, but in Merctown they are virtually unlimited.

'Least that's how I'd run it. As for Northern Gun stuff being bugged; well, rumors are rumors; can't put stock in them and you can't ignore them either. Just use what you've got.

Side note; Knock-offs. Replica models and knock-offs are another alternative. Chipwell is vitually non-existent in the games I run (they exist, and you can buy their stuff. But why?).

Um, if I recall correctly, nobody on earth even knows that Japan exists. I seriously doubt any Japanese gear would be available anywhere but Japan.

My group tends to avoid power armors for some reason. The few times that I've actually had someone play a character that could use one, we've only seen the following power armors:
-Glitterboy (Was a GB pilot)
-SAMAS (He was coalition)
-NEMA Silver Eagle (Found it in a hidden cache)
-Samson (If there's a rumor that they're bugged, just get some crazy Operator to look the whole thing over to ensure that it's "clean")

SkyeFyre wrote:Um, if I recall correctly, nobody on earth even knows that Japan exists. I seriously doubt any Japanese gear would be available anywhere but Japan.

People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

Besides...
Line Walkers and such are the types of people who discover these places; they travel the Ley-Lines and explore new areas. To say that no one has line-walked to Japan is to say the Sun revolves around the Earth; it simply isn't true. That and Japan is quite the old book and clearly needs an update.

While the mixing of the two might not happen too often, stuff from around the world does make a journey from one side to the other every once in a while.

It's been a while since I've gone through MercTown, but don't they have a Triax Dealer there too? Or am I mixing stuff up in my head again?


Daniel Stoker

Dog_O_War wrote:

SkyeFyre wrote:Um, if I recall correctly, nobody on earth even knows that Japan exists. I seriously doubt any Japanese gear would be available anywhere but Japan.

People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

Besides...
Line Walkers and such are the types of people who discover these places; they travel the Ley-Lines and explore new areas. To say that no one has line-walked to Japan is to say the Sun revolves around the Earth; it simply isn't true. That and Japan is quite the old book and clearly needs an update.

While the mixing of the two might not happen too often, stuff from around the world does make a journey from one side to the other every once in a while.

True, but how reliable are those atlases anymore? Most people would think, look at that little island, probably hundreds of feet below the ocean now.

Yes it's true that line walkers and the such travel around a lot, so why is the extreme west coat still a complete mystery? It's on the same continent. The fact is, the world is still very much in the dark. Sure, the book might need an update, but until we see an update... what we have is canon, and according to the book... nobody knows they exist.

Sure, but there's nothing canon saying so.

SkyeFyre wrote:

Dog_O_War wrote:

SkyeFyre wrote:Um, if I recall correctly, nobody on earth even knows that Japan exists. I seriously doubt any Japanese gear would be available anywhere but Japan.

People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

Besides...
Line Walkers and such are the types of people who discover these places; they travel the Ley-Lines and explore new areas. To say that no one has line-walked to Japan is to say the Sun revolves around the Earth; it simply isn't true. That and Japan is quite the old book and clearly needs an update.

While the mixing of the two might not happen too often, stuff from around the world does make a journey from one side to the other every once in a while.

True, but how reliable are those atlases anymore? Most people would think, look at that little island, probably hundreds of feet below the ocean now.

Yes it's true that line walkers and the such travel around a lot, so why is the extreme west coat still a complete mystery? It's on the same continent. The fact is, the world is still very much in the dark. Sure, the book might need an update, but until we see an update... what we have is canon, and according to the book... nobody knows they exist.

Why would they think that? All the maps in the books are exact copies of maps we have today (actually slightly out-dated since ours today shows new land mass in the arctic ocean). If the tides had risen we'd know all about it as the great lakes would be massive and the Saint Lawrence wouldn't be a seaway, it'd be an actual sea.

Cactuscat wrote:I think the west coast is unexplored because something weird is going on with the Rockies that actually prevents travel across them. That and the fact that they've somehow become taller than ever in the last 300 years.

And I'll bet there's probably plenty of military real estate out west waiting for people with know-how to fix everything up and get it running again. Well, except for the areas that are radioactive fields of glass-lined craters... But still, I'm sure some tank factory or something survived somewhere out there.

I figure there's no word on what's out there due to a deific event (re: palladium is lazy and is now near 15 years back-dated in what books it will release). But besides that, Nevada should have some very nice beach front. California would be a sea of souls. Seattle a city of the dead. Vancouver would be a secret pirate-nation, battling it out on the pacific. Hawaii a land of tribals ruled over by an angry volcano-god. Perhaps housing a giant gorilla or two as well. Hell, there's probably an extra island.

But we'll never actually know; I figure KS will die before we actually see a book on it (given the current track-record of Palladiums' release schedule).


All that said, I'll just use my imagination to "populate" it with a Rifts horror setting. Nothing beats fear and adrenaline.

K20A2_S wrote:Now the true question is since the CS now has this technology...........How long before the CS can put force fields on their Samas's? year or two, decade, never?

I am unaware the CS had Force Field Technologies .. when did they get this ?

If they do indeed have them .. they are HUGELY upgraded in terms of militarisitic abilities ..

it's something from unrevised SB1 that was forgotten when CWC came out. personally, i'd chalk it up to "forcefields proved too difficult for coalition factories to produce in any real quantity or quality" and that the CS shelved the idea to focus on technologies they could intergrate easier, like the NGR's improved armor formulas.

as for putting thme on SAMAS, probably not, even the NGR hasn't done that sort of thing. the Ulti-max is 12 feet tall, and is really more of a small robot. i'd say the NGR's forcefields have a minimum size limit that would prevent them from being fitted on a SAMAS sized suit. though fitting one onto a UAR or IAR series bot would probably be doable, if the CS can actually make them.

glitterboy2098 wrote:it's something that was forgotten when CWC came out. personally, i'd chalk it up to "forcefields proved too difficult for coalition factories to produce in any real quantity or quality" and that the CS shelved the idea to focus on technologies they could intergrate easier, like the NGR's improved armor formulas.

Well that would explain the rumored "left out of CWC " theory ..

Sourcebook 1 is where it was stated ? I'll have to reread the section on the Ulti-Max then I guess ..

Be back later then I guess haha

I've never cared for the Ultimax myself, unless using it in a defensive role. Offensively I'd prefer a Skull Smasher, Hellfire or even a Enforcer. Add SAMAS into the mix as needed.

Don't forget customized and rebuilt suits of PA. I'm there are tons of re-done SAMAS suits out there that have little to no resemblance to the CS standard.

Lenwen wrote:

glitterboy2098 wrote:it's something that was forgotten when CWC came out. personally, i'd chalk it up to "forcefields proved too difficult for coalition factories to produce in any real quantity or quality" and that the CS shelved the idea to focus on technologies they could intergrate easier, like the NGR's improved armor formulas.

Well that would explain the rumored "left out of CWC " theory ..

Sourcebook 1 is where it was stated ? I'll have to reread the section on the Ulti-Max then I guess ..

Be back later then I guess haha

pg 41, Unrevised Source Book 1. (i don't think the Ulti-max appears in revised SB1)
remeber unrevised SB1 is set in 102PA (it's said on pg 11)

from pg 41:

"Chi-Town has purchased 24 to add to its own mechanized forces, against tolkeen, and another 12 to be field tested in the western wastelands."

and then in the next paragraph:
"The X-1000 Ulti-Max is so devastating that Chi-Town is considering outlawing its sale to independant, non-CS purchasers. The Fear is that in the wrong hands the X-1000 could present a serious threat to the security of the Coalition states. the Decision to ban the unit fro mthe general market is pending, but likely to pass (this will not please the new republic). The Emperor had even considered purchasing a division of the robots for the Coalition States, but has decided to wait and try to develop their own Super-Armor rather than become dependant on a powerful foriegn nation"

i've underlined the important part. the CS considered buying a division. while i don't know how many are in a division, treating the Ulti-max like a modern tank would give us between 560 and 1400 units*

but they didn't buy them, they chose to see if they could build a similar unit of their own. and CWC shows us that apparently in 3 years they could.


*best i can find, a tank regiment is 70 tanks, there are 2-5 regiments per brigade, and 4 brigades to the division.

I think its great that PB advances the political story line to include stuff like the Ultimax getting bought up by the CS or having Triax gear choked out of North America.

That being said, if somebody were to play a new character, Id still let them have what ever starting bot they really wanted...just be prepared to live with the consequences. If that player takes his USA SAMAS into Chi-Town for a little R&R...Id say he deserves to die.

Id like to point out that most of Rifts Earth is primarily RURAL. Even CS controlled territory is void of dense population. That means that running into a random CS patrol, even in a CS occupied state, is actually fairly nill. Even in Chi Town proper the CS has a hard time policing the burbs of all the illegal stuff. There are D-bees, mages, and all sorts of illegal gear in the burbs, and thats in Prosek's back door.

To answer the original question, I personally allow any gear from RUE, SB1:R, and the Mercenary Books as starting bots and PA for RPA type characters. Once the game starts, all the rare stuff would be hard to find.

Zerebus wrote:Yeah, it's not like they could all flee to Char, deep in the Dinosaur Swamp, and start up the Southern Gun robot and power armor company....



........

.....

...

Hmmmm....

I see that I'm not the only one that has had this idea.

I'm planning on having Triax still maintaining a presence on the NA continent secretly. They have to know that it is tremendously profitable over here. I'
m sticking with the Mercenary book still being canon for my games.

My position - the Player Characters are supposed to be extraordinary heroes - so I have no problem with them having some extraordinary gear, provided it's not disruptive to the game.

Afterall, independant Glitter Boys are supposed to be rarer than rare, but there's a class in the main book that automatically starts off with one in brand new condition.

Jefffar wrote:My position - the Player Characters are supposed to be extraordinary heroes - so I have no problem with them having some extraordinary gear, provided it's not disruptive to the game.

Afterall, independant Glitter Boys are supposed to be rarer than rare, but there's a class in the main book that automatically starts off with one in brand new condition.

Wise words.....
a little TOO wise.....
You're reading our thoughts, aren't you?!

Misfit KotLD wrote:

Dog_O_War wrote:People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

Knowing it's there and having a practical, reliable way there and back are another matter.

That's why they're so rare in the NA market. Maybe a suit a year from Japan or Russia shows up in Merctown and often will go for double.

Jmacq1 wrote:

Dog_O_War wrote:That's why they're so rare in the NA market. Maybe a suit a year from Japan or Russia shows up in Merctown and often will go for double.

Probably more, as I'd wager the ultra-rare items that make it to MercTown are probably sold at auction instead of just given a straight price and sold...unless they were a special order for a preferred buyer.

That's what I was inferring. But if you're going to find rare stuff, besides Atlantis Merctown is the place to look.

Dog_O_War wrote:People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

I'm sure some people do know it's there, but no one knows that there is anything actually left on the islands and that it isn't some monster infested hellhole that's really far away with possibly limited value to rediscovering while there are more 'important' things going on.


Daniel Stoker

Cactuscat wrote:

Daniel Stoker wrote:

Dog_O_War wrote:People haven't reverted to "the Earth is flat and if we sail too far, we'll fall of the edge!". I'm sure someone in NA has an old atlas.

I'm sure some people do know it's there, but no one knows that there is anything actually left on the islands and that it isn't some monster infested hellhole that's really far away with possibly limited value to rediscovering while there are more 'important' things going on.


Daniel Stoker

I think that's a good point that is very easy to lose sight of from an adventurer's perspective. Most of the people on the planet have absolutely no interest in anything that goes on in the outside world. It's hard enough for common folks to survive day by day in their own neck of the woods, so they aren't going to waste time and energy pondering whether or not anyone in Japan survived the coming of the Rifts (likewise, I doubt the Japanese spend much time wondering what's up in America).

Even places like the CS and the NGR are so wrapped up in their wars and dealings with local issues that they can't waste the effort to focus on discovery and exploration for their own sake.

It's one of the things that sets adventurers apart from everyone else: the need to know. But it's unreasonable to assume everyone else thinks that way, too.

You guys are missing something here though; someone will be curious. And someone that is curious will also have the means to sate that curiocity. Not all that are curious will have the means, but a few will. I mean, if people weren't curious about anything, rogue-scholars and rogue-scientists wouldn't exist. But they do. Even the average citizen day-dreams of life outside their current reality; far-away places, life without war, before the cataclysm, etc...

Even those people that lack the curiocity to explore hear stories, as no man (or nation) is an island. While it may not be common knowledge, it is certainly acceptable for rumours that other nations survived; they have a prime exemple in the NGR, and vice-versa in the CS.

Dog_O_War wrote:You guys are missing something here though; someone will be curious. And someone that is curious will also have the means to sate that curiocity. Not all that are curious will have the means, but a few will. I mean, if people weren't curious about anything, rogue-scholars and rogue-scientists wouldn't exist. But they do. Even the average citizen day-dreams of life outside their current reality; far-away places, life without war, before the cataclysm, etc...

Even those people that lack the curiocity to explore hear stories, as no man (or nation) is an island. While it may not be common knowledge, it is certainly acceptable for rumours that other nations survived; they have a prime exemple in the NGR, and vice-versa in the CS.

Oh I'm sure a few will, but look at how dangerous travel is in Rifts, so maybe a few have been curious AND had the means to explore, it doesn't mean they made it back to tell anyone though. The odds of anyone knowing that there is anything there seem rather slim at best to me let alone knowing of tech that Japan has to go and buy.


Daniel Stoker

Cactuscat wrote:

Zerebus wrote:Just noticed another update in the revised Sourcebook One, this time to the NG Mobile Hunter Gun. Effectively, there's a "oops" written into the description of the "crotch gun", saying that the designers never intended the weapon to hold any phalic significance.

Robot designers really need to be more mindful of where they put guns and such on their designs. I still cringe every time I see the illustration of the Kittani T-Rex 'bot...

You mean the wild bukkake dinosaurs?

Rifts Underseas and rifter 14 and Juicer uprising, all three have black market produced power armor.

if you have trouble finding rifter 14, mail me a self addressed and stamped envelope as I have three.

that is all.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:I've never cared for the Ultimax myself, unless using it in a defensive role. Offensively I'd prefer a Skull Smasher, Hellfire or even a Enforcer. Add SAMAS into the mix as needed.

Seconded. I have always found the Ultimax main gun underpowered. Considering how large the gun is it should be doing at least 2D6x10. All that it has going for it is the forcefield and the mini-missle launchers and that it looks intimidating.

Zerebus wrote:IIRC, the Ultimax also has quite a decent strike bonus going for it between the sensor bonuses and the rail gun's laser targeting.

It does I believe, but the damage is comparable to a Wilk's 457 Laser Pulse Rifle. How many juicer's can I outfilt with that rifle riding nuke powered hovercycles and will have better mobility for the cost of a single Ulti-Max? The lack of mobility just kills any interest in this for me.

The other thing that always bugged me about the Ulti-Max is that's it's true power is in the mini-missile launchers. If you don't have a good resupply of them, the robot is only powerful for the first fight.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:

Zerebus wrote:IIRC, the Ultimax also has quite a decent strike bonus going for it between the sensor bonuses and the rail gun's laser targeting.

It does I believe, but the damage is comparable to a Wilk's 457 Laser Pulse Rifle. How many juicer's can I outfilt with that rifle riding nuke powered hovercycles and will have better mobility for the cost of a single Ulti-Max? The lack of mobility just kills any interest in this for me.

Hrm, well... that depends... what's the cost of a Juicer conversion? Who's going to give up the rest of their life to become this Juicer. Lets say the guy was already a Juicer. Are you going to find a whole group of them you can outfit? Are they your buddies, or are you going to need to pay them to go riding around for you.

Also, those guys are going to be shooting wild while on their hovercycles unless they've got the combat driving skills. The Ulti-Max has bonuses, has firepower, armor, and if need be, the missiles to blow the crap out of whatever is coming at it.

Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

and you could get a long lived Sampson pilot for the price of your juicers.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

Good points, I don't have the books where it outlines the conversion cost so those were actual questions... thanks

Yeah I agree for the most part that costs are out of whack for things, I just like trying to defend the opposite side so that everything gets covered.

I just see getting an Ulti-Max as being more convenient, an intimidating factor, and generally I see giant robots as being more as excellent heavy armor and support than a fight ender. Although if I had a few deadboys aiming rifles (or even heavy weapons) at me, I'd almost be tempted to try and take em, but put an enforcer in front of me... and I'm running like mad.

Even though the stats don't always go the best, I've never had a problem with players thinking they were a waste. I don't know if my players are just more laid back or what, but whenever I throw in a power armor, or giant robot, EVERYBODY takes notice. They could have hordes coming after them... but that big robot scares them.

I guess it just goes to how you role play. Think about it, in real life... you could buy a case of pop for like $5 that gives you 4.26L, but you could buy 2-3 2L bottles for like $0.99 each. You can say they're charging for the cans, which they probably are... but this very crude example is just supposed to show you that things just don't always make sense, even in real life.

(Yes those are actual prices around here)

SkyeFyre wrote:

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

Good points, I don't have the books where it outlines the conversion cost so those were actual questions... thanks

Yeah I agree for the most part that costs are out of whack for things, I just like trying to defend the opposite side so that everything gets covered.

I just see getting an Ulti-Max as being more convenient, an intimidating factor, and generally I see giant robots as being more as excellent heavy armor and support than a fight ender. Although if I had a few deadboys aiming rifles (or even heavy weapons) at me, I'd almost be tempted to try and take em, but put an enforcer in front of me... and I'm running like mad.

Even though the stats don't always go the best, I've never had a problem with players thinking they were a waste. I don't know if my players are just more laid back or what, but whenever I throw in a power armor, or giant robot, EVERYBODY takes notice. They could have hordes coming after them... but that big robot scares them.

I guess it just goes to how you role play. Think about it, in real life... you could buy a case of pop for like $5 that gives you 4.26L, but you could buy 2-3 2L bottles for like $0.99 each. You can say they're charging for the cans, which they probably are... but this very crude example is just supposed to show you that things just don't always make sense, even in real life.

(Yes those are actual prices around here)

To show even further how things do not add up in the real world check out the price of Deisel vrs regular gas ...

Deisel = Natural byproduct created after creating gas ... Deisel skims off the top layers of the Gas after they refine in .. There is no refining done to create Deisel ...

Yet Deisel as of late is even MORE expensive then the Gas ....

Not trying to hijack the thread by any means just thought this would be a great fit as for the whole jacked up thing ...especially about the world just dont make sence some times ...

SkyeFyre wrote:
Good points, I don't have the books where it outlines the conversion cost so those were actual questions... thanks

Yeah I agree for the most part that costs are out of whack for things, I just like trying to defend the opposite side so that everything gets covered.

I just see getting an Ulti-Max as being more convenient, an intimidating factor, and generally I see giant robots as being more as excellent heavy armor and support than a fight ender. Although if I had a few deadboys aiming rifles (or even heavy weapons) at me, I'd almost be tempted to try and take em, but put an enforcer in front of me... and I'm running like mad.

Even though the stats don't always go the best, I've never had a problem with players thinking they were a waste. I don't know if my players are just more laid back or what, but whenever I throw in a power armor, or giant robot, EVERYBODY takes notice. They could have hordes coming after them... but that big robot scares them.

No problem. There's more than one thing whacky about Rifts anyway.

Oh yeah and the Enforcer rocks! Been using that since 1990 and the players either cheer for it when it's on their side of get a look of horror when it's not. They have never beaten one yet. I think that's one reason we've had a CS campaign for years and years now.

2 factors contribute to the price of an item - the cost to bring it to market, and the price peopel are willing to pay for an item.

It is incredibly expensive to bring an Ultimax to market, thus increasing the price the seller must ask for to make a profit - but the slly mercs of North America are so impressed by the Triax brand name that they pay probably 3 to 4 times what the importer wants for them easily.

rat_bastard wrote:

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

and you could get a long lived Sampson pilot for the price of your juicers.

The CS doesn't use Sampson's.

Sarael wrote:Have you ever seen what a Glitter Boy with an NE FF can do?

Sure have, died in one melee round. (Serious)

Guy was real cocky, didn't do any information gathering, had some kinda crappy rolls, and picked a fight with an Ulti-Max. Sure the Ulti-Max was pretty crippled by the end, but those missile launchers are devastating.

Not to mention that a Glitterboy is rare enough, nevermind also getting it outfitted with a Naruni Force Field.

On the topic of Samsons... the deadliest PA I've ever had in my game was a Samson. Player had two of those Naruni shoulder cannons mounted permanently to the shoulders, and the biggest force field generator he could get. (Character was level 12, played him for years, had the money and I figured he had earned his right to this awesome suit). I'm glad he did it, because when him and the group went up against the Mechanoids and more specifically, the assault on the Spider Fortress... it's the one thing that kept him alive.

Dustin Fireblade wrote:I've never cared for the Ultimax myself, unless using it in a defensive role. Offensively I'd prefer a Skull Smasher, Hellfire or even a Enforcer. Add SAMAS into the mix as needed.

The Ultimax is good because if they don't get through the force field, you don't have to fix any damage.

/Sub

Dustin Fireblade wrote:

rat_bastard wrote:

Dustin Fireblade wrote:Cost to become a Juicer - anywhere from 50,000 credits (where its legal and readily available) to over 400,000 credits (like the CS where its not so legal or available). According to pg 19 of JU. A nuke-powered hoverbike goes for what around 800,000? Add a few mini-missile pods for another 100,000? Excellent point about the Combat Drving skill, but I would be surprised if a Juicer didn't have that skill.


According to the info in the CS Juicer in JU, it costs the CS 250,000 credits to fully ready, train, outfit, etc a single Juicer.

Cost of Ulti-Max is 22 million credits according to Revised SB1. And known to sell for 2 or 3 times that.

Yeah, the CS could have created two entire Divisions of juicer's with those 144 Ulti-Max they bought.

and you could get a long lived Sampson pilot for the price of your juicers.

The CS doesn't use Sampson's.

I was talking about your 950,000 credit independent juicers, not your mass produced CS Juicers.

Subjugator wrote:

Dustin Fireblade wrote:I've never cared for the Ultimax myself, unless using it in a defensive role. Offensively I'd prefer a Skull Smasher, Hellfire or even a Enforcer. Add SAMAS into the mix as needed.

The Ultimax is good because if they don't get through the force field, you don't have to fix any damage.

/Sub

Yeah a couple of shots from just about any rail gun burst, or a few pulse shots from a Wilks 457 and it's done. At the rate of which its restored, it again goes back to being better defensively than offensively.

rat_bastard wrote:

Dustin Fireblade wrote:

rat_bastard wrote:
and you could get a long lived Sampson pilot for the price of your juicers.

The CS doesn't use Sampson's.

I was talking about your 950,000 credit independent juicers, not your mass produced CS Juicers.

I know. Just felt like goofing off a bit.

Zerebus wrote:What's a RPA-based merc team supposed to do in Rifts North America? Where do YOU get your gear?

Simple..ignore what Kevin Siembiada has written for the meta plot.
Simple and easy, and guess what?..it's every GM's perogative to do JUST that if something the author / writer has done makes NO DAMN SENSE!
-ahem-
Repeat after me (until you are blue in the face); The final ruling on any canon / non-canon source, rule, plot point or argument is the province of the GM.
Period.
Dot.
The end.

Seriously; who cares what Kevin has set up in HIS mind?; a GM can and should alter the universe to HIS taste and let the players like it or lump it. Otherwise you may as well just have pre-made scripts and hang the dice, story telling and
role-play, cuz after all...you'd just be in a linear 1st. gen computer RPG with no deviation.

Chello!

DhAkael wrote:Simple..ignore what Kevin Siembiada has written for the meta plot.
Simple and easy, and guess what?..it's every GM's perogative to do JUST that if something the author / writer has done makes NO DAMN SENSE!

And in any conversation I
ve ever had with Kevin, he says the same thing. It's your game...PB just throws stuff out there for us to buy and use.

Tony

Lord_Dalgard wrote:Chello!

DhAkael wrote:Simple..ignore what Kevin Siembiada has written for the meta plot.
Simple and easy, and guess what?..it's every GM's perogative to do JUST that if something the author / writer has done makes NO DAMN SENSE!

And in any conversation I
ve ever had with Kevin, he says the same thing. It's your game...PB just throws stuff out there for us to buy and use.

Tony

Thank you
You're a bit more respectful of the man-him-self, but the sentiment is the same.
Heck, if the author / writer / C.E.O. says to change stuff around as needed, maybe some of the people in here should start paying attention to that little sound-bite. Instead of bemoaning that "the books says I can't do this..."
Again, thank you.