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I have a problem with the cyber knights. According to the books Cyber knights can sense an opponent even when the opponent is only using a vibro-sword.

Excuse me? We're talking about a cyber knight here, not a psi-tech. How the heck is a CK going to get bonuses against anyone simply because they are using a vibro-blade instead of a magic sword? Or even a club? This makes no sense to me what-so-ever, and in my opinion makes the CK a broken munchkin class!!
Energy rifles: Ok
Borgs: Ok
power armor: Ok

but a vibro-blade or neural mace??? What the heck????

Since most of them have sixth sense anyways, just think of it as a extension of their psionic sensitive powers.

it is because they can detect the Energy powering the blade or neuro mace methinks its been awhile since I looked at the CK and I don't know of the possiible changes they made from SOT 4 to RUE since I don't have RUE.

Temporalmage wrote:I have a problem with the cyber knights. According to the books Cyber knights can sense an opponent even when the opponent is only using a vibro-sword.

Excuse me? We're talking about a cyber knight here, not a psi-tech. How the heck is a CK going to get bonuses against anyone simply because they are using a vibro-blade instead of a magic sword? Or even a club? This makes no sense to me what-so-ever, and in my opinion makes the CK a broken munchkin class!!
Energy rifles: Ok
Borgs: Ok
power armor: Ok

but a vibro-blade or neural mace??? What the heck????

Sure it's kind of a gimpy power, but a vibro-blade probably has as much technology inside it as an energy rifle. If you're okay with if vs. one type of high-tech weapon, why does another "break" it for you?

Talavar wrote:

Temporalmage wrote:I have a problem with the cyber knights. According to the books Cyber knights can sense an opponent even when the opponent is only using a vibro-sword.

Excuse me? We're talking about a cyber knight here, not a psi-tech. How the heck is a CK going to get bonuses against anyone simply because they are using a vibro-blade instead of a magic sword? Or even a club? This makes no sense to me what-so-ever, and in my opinion makes the CK a broken munchkin class!!
Energy rifles: Ok
Borgs: Ok
power armor: Ok

but a vibro-blade or neural mace??? What the heck????

Sure it's kind of a gimpy power, but a vibro-blade probably has as much technology inside it as an energy rifle. If you're okay with if vs. one type of high-tech weapon, why does another "break" it for you?

My thoughts exactly.

Marcethus wrote:

Talavar wrote:

Temporalmage wrote:I have a problem with the cyber knights. According to the books Cyber knights can sense an opponent even when the opponent is only using a vibro-sword.

Excuse me? We're talking about a cyber knight here, not a psi-tech. How the heck is a CK going to get bonuses against anyone simply because they are using a vibro-blade instead of a magic sword? Or even a club? This makes no sense to me what-so-ever, and in my opinion makes the CK a broken munchkin class!!
Energy rifles: Ok
Borgs: Ok
power armor: Ok

but a vibro-blade or neural mace??? What the heck????

Sure it's kind of a gimpy power, but a vibro-blade probably has as much technology inside it as an energy rifle. If you're okay with if vs. one type of high-tech weapon, why does another "break" it for you?

My thoughts exactly.

The only reason vibro-blades exist is to give peaple a melee weapon that can do md, without everyone having a magic sword. Think about it, that's why Palladium has been so reluctant to even say how long a charge vibro-weapons have, or how long the batteries last. Without vibro-weapons as a fairly cheap md capable weapon, you couldn't have any hth combat with most characters. And only those few with a psi-weapon or magic weapon could do any damage with HTH in an md world. Even power houses like the crazies and juicers would become reletivly wimpy without em. Or you'd see the entire world change to everyone having magical weapons, and the mistique and rareness of em would be non-existant. But with the CK's powers including vibro-weapons they are pretty much garrantied the ability to use thier anti-tech powers in almost every combat. Heck most psycics and mages, and even some supernatural creatures use vibro weapons. Like I said before, it's too much. Against guns and such I see the CK as palladiums version of the jedi, and thats a little over the top, but fine. But to include an item that every starting character gets is stupid. You might as well say they get thier powers against anyone with opposable thumbs, or suddenly EVERY NPC you run the CK against has a psi-sword or magic weapon, which is BS.

If you don't like the way it is, try making a slight alteration to the flavor of the power: Instead of sensing the tech itself, you are sensing the mental intent of using technology against the CK. Something in the mindset catches the CK's psychic attention.

The whole anti-tech powers are broken to begin with, but they'd make even less sense if they worked on everything but vibro-blades.

Temporalmage wrote:The only reason vibro-blades exist is to give peaple a melee weapon that can do md, without everyone having a magic sword. Think about it, that's why Palladium has been so reluctant to even say how long a charge vibro-weapons have, or how long the batteries last. Without vibro-weapons as a fairly cheap md capable weapon, you couldn't have any hth combat with most characters. And only those few with a psi-weapon or magic weapon could do any damage with HTH in an md world. Even power houses like the crazies and juicers would become reletivly wimpy without em. Or you'd see the entire world change to everyone having magical weapons, and the mistique and rareness of em would be non-existant. But with the CK's powers including vibro-weapons they are pretty much garrantied the ability to use thier anti-tech powers in almost every combat. Heck most psycics and mages, and even some supernatural creatures use vibro weapons. Like I said before, it's too much. Against guns and such I see the CK as palladiums version of the jedi, and thats a little over the top, but fine. But to include an item that every starting character gets is stupid. You might as well say they get thier powers against anyone with opposable thumbs, or suddenly EVERY NPC you run the CK against has a psi-sword or magic weapon, which is BS.

They could have used something else other than a Vibro-Weapon. Mono-Molecular MD Material would be just as cool. Or heck, something like an Energy Sword (too star warsish I know).

But giving something a battery pulls away from the fun factor. You figure it is powered up on downtime. Probably charged in some relatively easy fashion. Pretty much how in Star Wars a lightsaber never goes out of power.

(Maybe veering slightly off topic) One of the ideas I kicked around to get rid of the anti tech powers was to give the CK Intuitive Combat at no cost and always active. Then give them an auto dodge (not just vs tech) on par w/ HtH: Commando. I figure w/ all that training it's not so far fetched that they can dodge around at least as well as a CS Special Forces soldier. BAAM problem solved. This was more in the interest of me as a GM not having to keep track of who was taking what penalties against the CK. I didn't actually play test this one, but the thought occured to me.

Tiree wrote:They could have used something else other than a Vibro-Weapon. Mono-Molecular MD Material would be just as cool. Or heck, something like an Energy Sword (too star warsish I know).

But giving something a battery pulls away from the fun factor. You figure it is powered up on downtime. Probably charged in some relatively easy fashion. Pretty much how in Star Wars a lightsaber never goes out of power.

Technically a lightsabre can run out of power, it just takes a while.

AlanGunhouse wrote:Technically a lightsabre can run out of power, it just takes a while.

Maybe in the extended universe, but how often in the movies do we see Luke or Obi-wan waiting around for their lightsabers to recharge? Same deal with vibro-weapons - the characters recharge them between play sessions.

Yeah, I remember in Splinter of the Mind's Eye, where Luke was recharging his lightsabre by draining the power pack from a blaster into the energy cell...

I wish they had mono blades in rifts earth available to cs troopers

its not a strech in tech. The oni have similar blades in three galaxies and it has been a staple iof sci fi for quite some time

A blade as or close to sharp as a monoclue no sn strenght required just so sharp it cuts though practically anything

also palladium is inconcsistent on wjy stuff does md damage the xixtic melee weapons are not magic in of them selves yet they do md even if wielded by a normal person

Most of the Xiticix weapons are a strange alien resin created by them or a TK weapon. As far as on topic goes, I would say that unless the Virbo weapon is powered up, aka drawn then they couldn't detect it. Energy rifles and such well the way to do that is that they aren't detected if the e-clip isn't in them and ready to use. Much like Robotech and the way the Invid detected active Protoculture.

AlanGunhouse wrote:Technically a lightsabre can run out of power, it just takes a while.

And a good Jedi would never let themselves be caught in a situation where their lightsaber wasn't charged. They probably throw it in a charger anytime their in their personal vehicle, anytime they're meditating/sleeping, etc.

And we have video evidence of a lightsaber running out of power. Remember, Vader used off-brand batteries and his lightsaber failed in his epic battle with the Energizer Bunny.

Maybe we'll get another "order" in a future book. Kind of like the Knights of the Rose and Madhaven.

true but I do love how some of the answers to the questio was just to give them more powers

my group found out the easy way to get rid of mystic knights nerve gas alweays on hand to deal with them

oh lonely CS trooper
out in the cold
camped out in the western front
fighting in the magic zone
powers not
yet limited in skills
woe to thee oh trooper
ye that has presumably squandered his life
learning not skills nor weir
fight on brave trooper fight on
for as you fall another tyrooper shall replace
you my stalwart CS trooper

Max™ wrote:I don't want more power, I want flavor.

I'd be happy if it made sense!

"I know our order goes out and slays demons, vampires, and monsters from the Rifts. I know that our Leader, Lord Coake, the first true Cyber Knight is from the world of Palladium, where technology does not exist. But Lord Coake once nicked himself with an electric razor, so now the entire order can sense tech and defeat it no problem. For as Lord Coake says "the Pink Energizer Bunny and all his kind are the ultimate evil and must be destroyed!!!"."

I don't think the answer is to give cyber-knights more powers, but alternate powers - like an MOS. You could have an anti-tech cyber-knight MOS, an anti-magic cyber-knight MOS, and an anti-demon MOS.

Max™ wrote:I don't want more power, I want flavor.

<CHOMP> Tastes great and more powerful

Just a thought on the Vibro blade power issue.
I thought they were powered by an e-clip.
Thought I readthat some where, or maybe I just smoked some cheap crack from Parkdale Toronto

at the very least mystic knights need to have the 1/100 energy portection of cyber knights as opposed to thier current complete immunity from energy

You can come up with scenarios were they are completly immune to damage as they are.

Cyber Knights were probably my favorite class in the original game. Of course, then cme all these sourcebooks and Worldbooks...