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If you can't find an Air Warlock, a Summon Elemental Forces circle will work too, you'll just need a summoner to make it.

Actually, the ideal is probably a summoner... they have a lot better durations for their magics (though they have problems in that everything needs to be affixed to the deck).

As mentioned, however, an air elemental can do all sorts of things. One of those is simply its range of air magic... creating winds at a specified vector to speed the ship along.

octopus70 wrote: any of the books have sailing or water combat magic items?

The PF books that cover most sea is the Adventures on the High Seas book. Also you may want to look into Rifts Underseas for some future and tech ideas- just find a way to "dumb it down" for a fantasy setting.

octopus70 wrote: also what are caravels priced at?

Caravels can run anywhere between 550,000 and 750,000 for a cheap old but seaworthy ship. for brand new it costs around 1.2-1.8 million gold. Mighty expensive, but a cheaper way would be....privateering, or piracy.

octopus70 wrote: what would value sails that added a speed bonus of 10-25% any probable natural ways to achieve this? maybe rare oil coating, thin polished metal alloy, skinned and preserved/enchanted sea creature or monster stitched and stretched over the hull.

So far (to my knowledge) there has been nothing to add bonuses to sails for speed. Other than magic from casters (Warlocks, Summoners, Mages, maybe Witches) to speed up travel and also provide some offensive/defensive combat.

octopus70 wrote: I also like the idea some modern ships are doing by deploying a giant kite to help pull the ship, I think they did it in waterworld.

Never seen Waterworld....but as the kite does sound like a good idea, there also may be some problems with that. of course during a storm it will have to be brought down, and because it hangs so high in the sky there is the possability that it could attract unwanted visitors (pirates, large birds, and oh...dragons).

Apollyon7 wrote: You could always cast Weightlessness so the whole boat weighed a lot less and would be easier to be blown by the wind. Not sure about the buoyancy aspect though.

While it is a general good idea lets take a look at the Caravel which can weigh anywhere between 20-160 tons (depending if it is fitted as a merchent vessel or a warship). The spell Weightlessness would decrease weight by 100lbs per level...so a level 10 mage would decrease wieght by 1 ton. Helps a little but I would say increases speed of a light ship maybe by 1 (+1 to speed). Now if on a Lay Line, then it may increase more- but be careful because if a ship's weight were decreased tooo much then it may just be picked up by strong winds, blowing a ship off course.
Still a good idea though, just tricky to expertise.

Entiago wrote:While it is a general good idea lets take a look at the Caravel which can weigh anywhere between 20-160 tons (depending if it is fitted as a merchent vessel or a warship). The spell Weightlessness would decrease weight by 100lbs per level...so a level 10 mage would decrease wieght by 1 ton. Helps a little but I would say increases speed of a light ship maybe by 1 (+1 to speed). Now if on a Lay Line, then it may increase more- but be careful because if a ship's weight were decreased tooo much then it may just be picked up by strong winds, blowing a ship off course.
Still a good idea though, just tricky to expertise.

Actually, a 10th level caster would only decrease the weight of the ship by half a ton... 1000 pounds.

You Europeans and your silly decimal-based weights.

Mark Hall wrote:

Entiago wrote:While it is a general good idea lets take a look at the Caravel which can weigh anywhere between 20-160 tons (depending if it is fitted as a merchent vessel or a warship). The spell Weightlessness would decrease weight by 100lbs per level...so a level 10 mage would decrease wieght by 1 ton. Helps a little but I would say increases speed of a light ship maybe by 1 (+1 to speed). Now if on a Lay Line, then it may increase more- but be careful because if a ship's weight were decreased tooo much then it may just be picked up by strong winds, blowing a ship off course.
Still a good idea though, just tricky to expertise.

Actually, a 10th level caster would only decrease the weight of the ship by half a ton... 1000 pounds.

You Europeans and your silly decimal-based weights.

well......i was never good with math. that and spelling.....both probably my worst subjects in school.

One way to get a move on is too....Row..Row, it makes the BOAT GO!! I think a list of magic ropes,sails,ect would be a good thing for Fantasy.

octopus70 wrote:thanks for all the info Entiago, I am amazed at the cost of the ships. Im gonna allow a magic sail +20% speed but will make it difficult to acquire, over 1 million and only in 1-2 place in he western empire.

Mark hall, can you tell me how a summoner would be better to make a ship go faster? would they summon demons with air magic?

A summoner can summon an elemental, or use the Summon Elemental Forces circle to ensure good weather so long as he remains in the circle. Provided everything is affixed to the deck, you've got a good way of keeping good sailing... and it can be done by a 2nd level summoner, as opposed to needing a high-level warlock. If you get a 4th level summoner, he can hve both a minor air elemental and a Summon Elemental Forces circle handy.

Mark Hall wrote:

octopus70 wrote:thanks for all the info Entiago, I am amazed at the cost of the ships. Im gonna allow a magic sail +20% speed but will make it difficult to acquire, over 1 million and only in 1-2 place in he western empire.

Mark hall, can you tell me how a summoner would be better to make a ship go faster? would they summon demons with air magic?

A summoner can summon an elemental, or use the Summon Elemental Forces circle to ensure good weather so long as he remains in the circle. Provided everything is affixed to the deck, you've got a good way of keeping good sailing... and it can be done by a 2nd level summoner, as opposed to needing a high-level warlock. If you get a 4th level summoner, he can hve both a minor air elemental and a Summon Elemental Forces circle handy.

What he said. Any 1st level summoner can make the Summon Elemental Forces circle, and ensure that you sail the ship at it's absolute maximum speed(you know, the one that always requires ideal conditions ). A 2nd level summoner could bring that minor air elemental along as well, or a 4th level summoner could bring a major air elemental.

Starmage21 wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:

octopus70 wrote:thanks for all the info Entiago, I am amazed at the cost of the ships. Im gonna allow a magic sail +20% speed but will make it difficult to acquire, over 1 million and only in 1-2 place in he western empire.

Mark hall, can you tell me how a summoner would be better to make a ship go faster? would they summon demons with air magic?

A summoner can summon an elemental, or use the Summon Elemental Forces circle to ensure good weather so long as he remains in the circle. Provided everything is affixed to the deck, you've got a good way of keeping good sailing... and it can be done by a 2nd level summoner, as opposed to needing a high-level warlock. If you get a 4th level summoner, he can hve both a minor air elemental and a Summon Elemental Forces circle handy.

What he said. Any 1st level summoner can make the Summon Elemental Forces circle, and ensure that you sail the ship at it's absolute maximum speed(you know, the one that always requires ideal conditions ). A 2nd level summoner could bring that minor air elemental along as well, or a 4th level summoner could bring a major air elemental.

Actually, a 1st level summoner cannot, by the PFRPG. He can't control the Elemental Forces he summons.

Mark Hall wrote:

Starmage21 wrote:

Mark Hall wrote:

octopus70 wrote:thanks for all the info Entiago, I am amazed at the cost of the ships. Im gonna allow a magic sail +20% speed but will make it difficult to acquire, over 1 million and only in 1-2 place in he western empire.

Mark hall, can you tell me how a summoner would be better to make a ship go faster? would they summon demons with air magic?

A summoner can summon an elemental, or use the Summon Elemental Forces circle to ensure good weather so long as he remains in the circle. Provided everything is affixed to the deck, you've got a good way of keeping good sailing... and it can be done by a 2nd level summoner, as opposed to needing a high-level warlock. If you get a 4th level summoner, he can hve both a minor air elemental and a Summon Elemental Forces circle handy.

What he said. Any 1st level summoner can make the Summon Elemental Forces circle, and ensure that you sail the ship at it's absolute maximum speed(you know, the one that always requires ideal conditions ). A 2nd level summoner could bring that minor air elemental along as well, or a 4th level summoner could bring a major air elemental.

Actually, a 1st level summoner cannot, by the PFRPG. He can't control the Elemental Forces he summons.

Ahh. I didnt know the Elemental Forces counted as creatures. Here I thought they were just spells.
/sarcasm

**edit**(damn enter button)
Has the Summon Elemental Forces circle always existed, or is it possible that the "restricted to power circles and protection circles because he cant control creatures" is an antiquated hold-over from when there werent circles that granted spells?

Summon Elemental Forces is on page 117 of PFRPG 1st edition, 10th printing. It is listed as neither a lesser or greater summoning; the cost and complexity of the circle imply that it should be a major summoning (same cost as Angels). I downgrade it to a minor summoning because it has less directed will, just wildness. Since it is not excepted from the requirements, that seemed a reasonable compromise.

Air warlocks seem like they would be best in chase situations where speed is required. They would also be good to have around when the wind dies down or is coming from the wrong direction. They can get the ship moving until (hopefully) the natural wind picks up and takes over. If not, then with a little rest, they can continue the journey.

Summoners require lots of preparation time but they can keep the ship moving faster for longer periods of time. Some crews may not be entirely comfortable with the forces a summoner usually deals with.

In terms of a magic method, i would consider an enchantment similar to the environmental tent (p258 main book). you could have an alchemist enchant the boat or sails to ensure that the area surrounding the boat was always 'good weather' for sailing. it would have to be super expensive to purchase/repair and have some downsides though...perhaps it only works for 8 hours a day, or the speed of the ship is limited to x (x=average sailing speed) and even if the winds would permit faster travel, the enchantment keeps you going at the average speed. of course you would also be at the mercy of the water (in a storm you will be surrounded by 'good weather' but the ocean could still be throwing the boat around and waves coming over the sides etc).

as everyone else is saying, most of the books imply that a 'properly staffed' ship in this world will have a warlock or some other magic user on board.

t0m wrote:In terms of a magic method, i would consider an enchantment similar to the environmental tent (p258 main book). you could have an alchemist enchant the boat or sails to ensure that the area surrounding the boat was always 'good weather' for sailing. it would have to be super expensive to purchase/repair and have some downsides though...perhaps it only works for 8 hours a day, or the speed of the ship is limited to x (x=average sailing speed) and even if the winds would permit faster travel, the enchantment keeps you going at the average speed. of course you would also be at the mercy of the water (in a storm you will be surrounded by 'good weather' but the ocean could still be throwing the boat around and waves coming over the sides etc).

as everyone else is saying, most of the books imply that a 'properly staffed' ship in this world will have a warlock or some other magic user on board.

Makes sense, given that the number of people it takes to staff even a medium sized ship that it would be the best economic choice to employ magic. It would place a huge demand on Air/Water combo Warlocks I'm sure.