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Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:24 am**

Ever have the following happen to you? The group is enjoying the game and trying to figure things out; when an observer walks up to the table, and after a few, makes a comment that helps the players figure something out. I have seen this, personally, several times.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:07 pm**

I don't permit observers. If you attend my game, you play. I even had a four students in a college level communications course that wanted to observe our group process that I made play. I've done it to girlfriends, parents, and counseling professionals too.

My pet peeve is players that can see my plot hooks and deliberately undermine them rather than play the game that they ostensibly signed up to play. I had a guy hand over a greater rune weapon to the authorities, in contrary to his character's alignment, because he knew I'd use it as a plot device later on. I wanted to murder him.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:20 pm**

i keep track of the xp and since i award xp in private i penalize "schmuckiness" and for the watcher problem just say loudly "no xp will be awarded this session due to divine intervention."

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:10 pm**

The only real pet peeve I have as a GM... speaking in and out of character. I know it sounds nitpicky but I can't stand it when a player looks up and says "My character tells the blacksmith he wants to buy a new sword." or "My character shouts 'Die evil scum!" or "My character says..." well you get the idea by now, I hope. I really don't get annoyed enough to penalize anybody too badly for this little peeve of mine, but I really try to encourage role playing a lot with it. Remember, while you're playing the game, you ARE your character... if you want to say something to someone, just say it! If you're talking to another PC, look to the other player, address them by the character name and just say it. If you're talking to an NPC, just look at me (or whoever the GM happens to be) and talk. Now of course, if you're saying something outside of game dialogue, please specify you're out of character and say what you've got to say. Otherwise, as far as I'm concerned, if you're saying it, your character is doing the talking.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:27 pm**

"have you seen my smokes......hey can i get a cigarette?" a tall cityrat with a mohawk and piercings offers up a cigarette from his bionic lefthand "menthol ok?" love it.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:33 pm**

I have not been able to get my new group to take to the in character/out of character dialogue thing yet. It is kind of a peeve of mine.

As for observers, I don't allow them most of the time. If someone wants to sit in and observe (usually to figure out if they want to play) they are informed they are not to interfere.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:56 pm**

I dont really have peeves but I have seen both those mentioned.

If I had one it would be plot/scenario killers from meta-gaming. "why dont you do this to solve the problem" from a player whose character isnt in the room.

shut up Mr. Meta-player!

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:40 pm**

Where are you guys at that you have "Observers?" Play somewhere else... My only issue is messy character sheets/poor record keeping. example. I know they have 75,000 credits. They know they have 75,000 credits. Their sheet says 1,500 credits and a snow cone because they haven't updated it in 16 sessions of play. So guess what happens when they get to the shop... They have 1,500 credits and a damp pocket.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:45 pm**

MaxxSterling wrote:Where are you guys at that you have "Observers?" Play somewhere else... My only issue is messy character sheets/poor record keeping. example. I know they have 75,000 credits. They know they have 75,000 credits. Their sheet says 1,500 credits and a snow cone because they haven't updated it in 16 sessions of play. So guess what happens when they get to the shop... They have 1,500 credits and a damp pocket.

I have never seen this happen before. In all the groups I've played with, most everybody has been almost neurotic about not just keeping track of the character's personal inventory, but also recording information about things that might be useful to go back for in the future.

Personally, as a player, I always kept track of inventory in a seperate notebook since it changed so often that it would totally ruin the character sheet if I actually wrote it there.

--flatline

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:45 pm**

MaxxSterling wrote:Where are you guys at that you have "Observers?" Play somewhere else... My only issue is messy character sheets/poor record keeping. example. I know they have 75,000 credits. They know they have 75,000 credits. Their sheet says 1,500 credits and a snow cone because they haven't updated it in 16 sessions of play. So guess what happens when they get to the shop... They have 1,500 credits and a damp pocket.

You assume some people have another place to play.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:10 pm**

Anyone ever get to the point as a GM where you throw up your hands and go; "I'm done. I physically can not do any more pre-wrting of material since the rest I've done to this point is 99% unused?"
Just wonderin'...

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:20 pm**

DhAkael wrote:Anyone ever get to the point as a GM where you throw up your hands and go; "I'm done. I physically can not do any more pre-wrting of material since the rest I've done to this point is 99% unused?"
Just wonderin'...

Why would a GM do significant planning before the PC's goals were clear?

--flatline

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:35 pm**

I personally get annoyed with players who have to question everything you as the GM says on a ruling. Had one player that did this constantly. It's okay to question if there is a definite realm of disagreement, but to constantly question every little thing gets on my nerves. Fortunately that player is no longer in our group. They were annoying everyone else as well.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:36 pm**

my gm kit. a random monster sheet i use the heroes unlimited book(rogue mutants) and the original rifts book supernatural predator and creature tables for this(random rift beastie) a rough draft of my goal(save princess,steal this item,kill monsters etc.) an important npc list, a map of the battle field(city, wharehouse or tunnels etc) and lots of ice coffee. i use freeform and spin as i go. ok the players are wasting my monsters so i will add an additional d6 or two to the numbers appearing. as a gm my rule has always been dont plan improvise. and of course have fun. ok my players are getting wasted by the "boss" nothing wrong with a squad of soldiers arriving at just the right time. or damn everybody died.......lets just have them wakeup in a hospital after a few week coma.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:54 pm**

flatline wrote:
DhAkael wrote:Anyone ever get to the point as a GM where you throw up your hands and go; "I'm done. I physically can not do any more pre-wrting of material since the rest I've done to this point is 99% unused?"
Just wonderin'...

Why would a GM do significant planning before the PC's goals were clear?

--flatline

Flatline... if you've ever read my previous posts...ANY OF THEM, you'd know I don't pre-script.
ever.
I'm talking "material".
Locations.
Toys.
OCC / RCC's.
You know "STUFF".
Prescripting is for amateurs.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:33 pm**

Players who can't be bothered to remember important setting details from one game to the next. In every game i've had players who won't remember either where the party is, what their goal is, who the badguy is, or where they're going to and why, if not multiple of those.

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:57 pm**

when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:01 pm**

say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?

Posted: **Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:19 pm**

cell phones texting and the ever irritating, "sorry, what did you say?" after a texting rush of one of my players

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:00 am**

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?

1st it requires the player actually know the rules.
2nd it requires the player to know exactly how I interpret said rule.
3rd it requires the player to be respectful about the quote.

I have only ever encountered 3 players in 35 years that met all 3.

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:17 am**

Damian Magecraft wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?
1st it requires the player actually know the rules.
2nd it requires the player to know exactly how I interpret said rule.
3rd it requires the player to be respectful about the quote.

I have only ever encountered 3 players in 35 years that met all 3.

I don't understand #3. What does it mean "to be respectful about the quote"?

--flatline

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:22 am**

Damian Magecraft wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?
1st it requires the player actually know the rules.
2nd it requires the player to know exactly how I interpret said rule.
3rd it requires the player to be respectful about the quote.

I have only ever encountered 3 players in 35 years that met all 3.

You've had quite a run of bad luck then. Most of my players remember the rules as well or better than I do.

my only issue is 2: isn't it sort of on the GM to actually let players know their house rules/interpreations so they can make plans according to their players capabilities? if I form a plan around x interpretation, it's kind of annoying when the GM lets the water get hot then springs "Oh, I don't use that rule". well thanks for letting me know BEFORE I got surrounded...

of course, that's a player pet peeve

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:00 am**

Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Damian Magecraft wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?
1st it requires the player actually know the rules.
2nd it requires the player to know exactly how I interpret said rule.
3rd it requires the player to be respectful about the quote.

I have only ever encountered 3 players in 35 years that met all 3.

You've had quite a run of bad luck then. Most of my players remember the rules as well or better than I do.

my only issue is 2: isn't it sort of on the GM to actually let players know their house rules/interpreations so they can make plans according to their players capabilities? if I form a plan around x interpretation, it's kind of annoying when the GM lets the water get hot then springs "Oh, I don't use that rule". well thanks for letting me know BEFORE I got surrounded...
i prefer to gm for the absolute stongest player character that a person can come up with, in this genre some times you have to bend the rules a little.
of course, that's a player pet peeve

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:11 am**

I don't have a problem with observers, especially since i GM my games at the local game store, plus its a rare occasion when someone asks what game we're playing...

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:37 am**

say652 wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
Damian Magecraft wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?
1st it requires the player actually know the rules.
2nd it requires the player to know exactly how I interpret said rule.
3rd it requires the player to be respectful about the quote.

I have only ever encountered 3 players in 35 years that met all 3.

You've had quite a run of bad luck then. Most of my players remember the rules as well or better than I do.

my only issue is 2: isn't it sort of on the GM to actually let players know their house rules/interpreations so they can make plans according to their players capabilities? if I form a plan around x interpretation, it's kind of annoying when the GM lets the water get hot then springs "Oh, I don't use that rule". well thanks for letting me know BEFORE I got surrounded...
i prefer to gm for the absolute stongest player character that a person can come up with, in this genre some times you have to bend the rules a little.
of course, that's a player pet peeve

Err, did you just quote without saying anything?

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:43 am**

as a gm i cater to the most powerful characters my pc's can come up with. "shut up yo, and take 5d6 damage from the magical sword you didnt dodge and i dont care if your immune to metal....IT'S MAGIC YO !"

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:59 am**

I used to have a player, he was a nice guy but wow was he set in his ways, that quoted rules and expected all rules to be as printed in the book.

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:16 am**

DhAkael wrote:Anyone ever get to the point as a GM where you throw up your hands and go; "I'm done. I physically can not do any more pre-wrting of material since the rest I've done to this point is 99% unused?"
Just wonderin'...

Been there.

Posted: **Thu Feb 28, 2013 9:35 am**

The Dark Elf wrote:I dont really have peeves but I have seen both those mentioned.

If I had one it would be plot/scenario killers from meta-gaming. "why dont you do this to solve the problem" from a player whose character isnt in the room.

shut up Mr. Meta-player!

Sorry. It's really hard to keep schtum - please dock me experience points next time.

Of course, sometimes I am simply helping and encouraging the inexperienced players to grow in ability by thinking about things that they might not have considered before!

Serves me right for picking a naive inexperienced character to play and leaving the newbies to be the group leaders!

Posted: **Fri Mar 01, 2013 7:32 am**

Lucky wrote:
Nekira Sudacne wrote:
say652 wrote:when players quote rules. "get your &%!* and git yo"

What's wrong with quoting rules?

My biggest house rule is that the GM has final say on the rules. I've got no problem with players helping to clarify, but if I have to manipulate or suspend the rules in the books in order to maintain storyline or session continuity, I expect no argument.

That's not a houserule, that's Rule 0!

Posted: **Fri Mar 01, 2013 8:28 am**

1) Palladium book layout. I just don't understand it.
2) Players who don't showup, cancel at the last minute
3) That one player who can't take anything seriously
4) Players who pervert alignments to the point of meaninglessness

Posted: **Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:58 am**

KillWatch wrote:2) Players who don't showup, cancel at the last minute
3) That one player who can't take anything seriously

I have had to deal with both of these. They really do get annoying after a while.

Posted: **Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:30 pm**

when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

Posted: **Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:14 pm**

Amen say. Had that once I believe.

Posted: **Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:16 pm**

SittingBull wrote:Amen say. Had that once I believe.

Hence the development of the "Get your $&!# and Git!"house rule.

Posted: **Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:28 pm**

say652 wrote:when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

"Because I know something you don't know. Now shut up!"

I've never actually said that during a gaming session, but that would be my response in that scenario.

--flatline

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:57 am**

that problem is solved by not worrying about whether or not they die. I don't like fudging in favor of the NPCs or the players.

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:47 pm**

running a twelfth adventure and a chiang ku disguised itself as a tattoo man. "why isnt he dead, they only have like 150mdc at 15th level, your cheating"......add whiny comment.

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:48 pm**

say652 wrote:when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

That is why always tell them they don't know everything. That's why I am the GM and they are not. :-D

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:30 pm**

One of my biggest pet peeves is when my cat claws my carpet.

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:14 pm**

say652 wrote:running a twelfth adventure and a chiang ku disguised itself as a tattoo man. "why isnt he dead, they only have like 150mdc at 15th level, your cheating"......add whiny comment.

This is what always bugs me (same with my old GM) he had to politely remind the other players that even though we find these creatures, weapons, PA, etc. in handy to use books, it's not like they have them lying around in game for people to reference whenever they wanted to look something up.

Although this did spawn a campaign of it's own. My character started keeping journals on all the things he encountered (this was a Chaos Earth game). I may not know the demons MDC amount but my journal said things like - it took 7 shots from my laser rifle to kill him or appears to have a weakness to (fill in the blank).

It actually became a fun little side project for my player, so somewhere down the road I guess their would be books detailing all that and I just totally contradicted my own point :lol:

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:22 pm**

DhAkael wrote:Anyone ever get to the point as a GM where you throw up your hands and go; "I'm done. I physically can not do any more pre-wrting of material since the rest I've done to this point is 99% unused?"
Just wonderin'...

One of the GM's I play with freely admits that he doesn't care where the PC's go before plot hooks are distributed. He moves the plot hook if you don't wander into the bar he originally intended you to see it at. It works, and is a rather simple solution to PC's that are hard to direct, like myself.

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:01 pm**

I do that as well. I also tend to escalate the threat of ignored plot-hooks. If the players don't bite the first time around the situation gets more and more dire until they finally do something about it. Valuable NPCs get killed, powerful items are acquired by the bad-guys, etc.

Posted: **Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:19 pm**

Some of my pet peeves are when players don't do anything until you serve it up on a plate for them saying HEY DUMB DUMB GO THIS WAY! It's happened to me a few times.

Posted: **Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:35 am**

I don't worry about it. I let the players roam where they will. I let events unfold as they would if they don't get involved. villages get sacked, bad guys get away, or sometimes they don't and get caught without the players help. I let players follow the wrong idea, chase red herrings, explore dead ends. And then when they are done and still have no clue I might throw something organic in

Posted: **Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:33 pm**

Bill wrote:I do that as well. I also tend to escalate the threat of ignored plot-hooks. If the players don't bite the first time around the situation gets more and more dire until they finally do something about it. Valuable NPCs get killed, powerful items are acquired by the bad-guys, etc.

Me too. I normally get to the point where the players are fully aware of what the story plot hook is but are free to continue with whatever antics they are currently doing but the main story doesnt progress until the visit the next stage of the story (unless these new antics spiral into a new story themselves , which does happen).

It's kinda like playing a video game RPG but going back to previous towns or grinding a couple of levels etc.

Posted: **Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:19 pm**

flatline wrote:
say652 wrote:when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

"Because I know something you don't know. Now shut up!"

I've never actually said that during a gaming session, but that would be my response in that scenario.

--flatline

I usually just shrug, smile, and say, "Good question!"

Posted: **Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:50 pm**

Killer Cyborg wrote:
flatline wrote:
say652 wrote:when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

"Because I know something you don't know. Now shut up!"

I've never actually said that during a gaming session, but that would be my response in that scenario.

--flatline

I usually just shrug, smile, and say, "Good question!"

That's much nicer than what I wrote. If it ever comes up, I'll use that instead.

--flatline

Posted: **Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:51 pm**

flatline wrote:
Killer Cyborg wrote:
flatline wrote:
say652 wrote:when a player calculates the "level"of the monsters and roughly determines its "hitpoints" and keeps telling you how much total damage said monster has taken and keeps asking why its not dead.

"Because I know something you don't know. Now shut up!"

I've never actually said that during a gaming session, but that would be my response in that scenario.

--flatline

I usually just shrug, smile, and say, "Good question!"

That's much nicer than what I wrote. If it ever comes up, I'll use that instead.

--flatline

Similar to what my old GM's GM used to say to someone in their group,
"Why indeed?"

Posted: **Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:35 pm**

I would have the creature itself, laugh and smile and taunt the player characters- "Ha! Did you think I would be killed so easily?!"

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